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codeseven7
09-10-2005, 07:35 PM
Who kicks **** in PF, Nvidia or ATI? Take a look for yourself, and thats using the old 77.72 nvidia driver, the 'Oleg (gimme that friggin water=3) Special' for 4.01 should prove even better! Check it out.

"Like IL-2 Sturmovik, Pacific Fighters uses OpenGL by default, so NVIDIA based solutions are overall superior to the RADEON X850/X800, having a better driver for that API. You can just note the GeForce 6600 outperforming the RADEON X700 PRO and almost overtaking the RADEON X800 XL!"

"As for ATI based cards, they are still rather far behind the GeForce 6 and 7 solutions, so RADEON X850/X800-based devices won€t suit you if Pacific Fighters is among your favorite games." Ouch!

For it's next card, I'd like to see ATI push the envelope even higher than Nvidia has and keep this battle going!


http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/video/display/2005-17gpu_29.html

codeseven

Dutch60
09-10-2005, 11:50 PM
My almost one year old 6800 Ultra SLI set is not doing do badly. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif
Just look at the friggin water=3
http://home.planet.nl/~elzer033/screens/42.jpg
Common nVidia or Oleg please FIX it ASAP
No more missing textures please please please please ...

codeseven7
09-11-2005, 12:10 AM
Man, I love that figgin water!

Kapteeni
09-11-2005, 02:12 AM
I think that water=3 looks like oil or some weird plastic think. I prefer number 2. (What i really want is better landscape and infantry units.)

ytareh
09-11-2005, 03:36 AM
Dutch that is a stunning screenshot but is game playable at that quality?What sort of pc have you?I have AMD 3500 (939),Gig OCZ Platinum Rev2 RAM and X800XT PE.I reckon I might just be able to get that sort of quality but playable ?-Not really...even with few planes.And while I do think that screenshot is lovely I agree with Kapteeni that sometimes the Uber H20 does look very dark at least for Pacific .I even find it hard to judge height over it sometimes!

ytareh
09-11-2005, 03:39 AM
Ultra SLi...Is that like those two in one card systems?TWO 6800 Ultras!!!???Man no wonder that looks so good!But remember many say IL2/PF is more CPU limited....

ytareh
09-11-2005, 03:40 AM
OK Ive just saw your signature Dutch...thats a serious pc!I assume you have no problems with your fps!!!

Dutch60
09-11-2005, 05:28 AM
Originally posted by ytareh:
Dutch that is a stunning screenshot but is game playable at that quality?What sort of pc have you?I have AMD 3500 (939),Gig OCZ Platinum Rev2 RAM and X800XT PE.I reckon I might just be able to get that sort of quality but playable ?-Not really...even with few planes.And while I do think that screenshot is lovely I agree with Kapteeni that sometimes the Uber H20 does look very dark at least for Pacific .I even find it hard to judge height over it sometimes!

Hi ytareh,

Yes it's playable my average FPS is 30 at 1600x1200x32 4xAA 8xAF

I am sorry for you but with your current ATI X800XT PE card you can not never ever get these waves these are Shader 3.0 only.
Maybe the ATI R520 when it does will finally be released could do this.
But then you will need TWO R520 cards and that one we are also still waiting for from ATI the famous still not released ATI SLI called Crossfire.

Dutch60
09-11-2005, 05:31 AM
Originally posted by Kapteeni:
I think that water=3 looks like oil or some weird plastic think. I prefer number 2. (What i really want is better landscape and infantry units.)

Hi Kapteeni,

What you can not see in the screenshot above is the fact that these waves are moving you should see it I promise you that you will love it.

VVaFFenPanZZeR
09-11-2005, 06:25 AM
Dutch I experience the same game play as u, as I went and blew a wade on my pc, it is stunning, I can take a bomb run with fighters from the allied side, and also the axis, and clash them together, whilst playing as a fighter, and its smooth as hell, all settings full blown perfect, I honestly get a chubby......


Question??? How do u post a screenshot here, do u convert the image to somthing else??

EiZ0N
09-11-2005, 08:34 AM
I have an x800 XT card.

Those benchmarks really do show it getting it's **** kicked all over the place.

I've always preffered Nvidia but I bought an ATI card recently and, well, it's good but I love Pacific Fighters so I wish I had nvidia card.

Anyway, seeing as ATI cards get beaten so hard using openGL, will I get better results using DirectX? Anyone?

Thanks

Dutch60
09-11-2005, 11:03 AM
Originally posted by EiZ0N:
I have an x800 XT card.

Those benchmarks really do show it getting it's **** kicked all over the place.

I've always preffered Nvidia but I bought an ATI card recently and, well, it's good but I love Pacific Fighters so I wish I had nvidia card.

Anyway, seeing as ATI cards get beaten so hard using openGL, will I get better results using DirectX? Anyone?

Thanks

Hi EiZON,

Sorry for this and I promise I will shout this only once because it was stated so many times before. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/51.gif

1. YOU CAN NOT EVER NEVER RUN PERFECT MODE USING DIRECT-X THIS IS ONLY OPEN-GL http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/53.gif

2. ATI CAN DO OPEN-GL PERFECT MODE BUT NOT WATER=3 THIS IS SHADER 3.0 AND FOR NOW ONLY FOR NVIDIA FLYER BOYS http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/53.gif

Again sorry for shouting. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/35.gif

VVaFFenPanZZeR
09-11-2005, 11:25 AM
Dutch u didnt explain how u got ur ss to link, I cant for some reason, even view my screenshots, how r u guys doing it???

EiZ0N
09-11-2005, 12:00 PM
Thanks Dutch, I had read that before but didn't have an ATI card at the time so didn't really take it in.

major_setback
09-11-2005, 12:24 PM
Originally posted by VVaFFenPanZZeR:
Dutch u didnt explain how u got ur ss to link, I cant for some reason, even view my screenshots, how r u guys doing it???

Problems upploading screenshots?

You (unfortunately) have to put them on an image hosting site such as Photobucket:

http://www.photobucket.com/

When you've got your image on the Photobucket site copy the URL adress from the appropriate space next to your image (this will become clear once you've upploaded the image)...then when replying to a post on a forum click on the 'display image' icon at the top of the message window. Paste the URL adress (only this) in the space provded and then click 'OK'

By the way, please post many shots of water=3. I can't use these settings, but love looking at the shots. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

VVaFFenPanZZeR
09-11-2005, 12:46 PM
I know how to post a image, what I dont know how to do, is view a screenshot, when I goto open the ss it says that theres no program to view it. ??????

Dutch60
09-11-2005, 01:02 PM
Originally posted by major_setback:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by VVaFFenPanZZeR:
Dutch u didnt explain how u got ur ss to link, I cant for some reason, even view my screenshots, how r u guys doing it???

Problems upploading screenshots?

You (unfortunately) have to put them on an image hosting site such as Photobucket:

http://www.photobucket.com/

When you've got your image on the Photobucket site copy the URL adress from the appropriate space next to your image (this will become clear once you've upploaded the image)...then when replying to a post on a forum click on the 'display image' icon at the top of the message window. Paste the URL adress (only this) in the space provded and then click 'OK'

By the way, please post many shots of water=3. I can't use these settings, but love looking at the shots. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

OK you want some more, so lets blow up this thread here are some more Water=3 screenshots. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/blink.gif

Average FPS = 30

1600x1200x32 4xAA 8xAF

HardwareShaders=1
ForceShaders1x=0

Shadows=2
Specular=2
SpecularLight=2
DiffuseLight=2
DynamicalLights=1
MeshDetail=2
VisibilityDistance=3

Sky=2
Forest=2
Water=3
Effects=1
LandShading=3
LandDetails=2

VideoSetupId=17

http://home.planet.nl/~elzer033/screens/30.jpg
http://home.planet.nl/~elzer033/screens/31.jpg
http://home.planet.nl/~elzer033/screens/32.jpg
http://home.planet.nl/~elzer033/screens/33.jpg
http://home.planet.nl/~elzer033/screens/34.jpg
http://home.planet.nl/~elzer033/screens/35.jpg
http://home.planet.nl/~elzer033/screens/36.jpg
http://home.planet.nl/~elzer033/screens/40.jpg
http://home.planet.nl/~elzer033/screens/41.jpg
http://home.planet.nl/~elzer033/screens/42.jpg
http://home.planet.nl/~elzer033/screens/43.jpg
http://home.planet.nl/~elzer033/screens/44.jpg
Hope you like them? http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_cool.gif

major_setback
09-11-2005, 01:25 PM
Originally posted by VVaFFenPanZZeR:
I know how to post a image, what I dont know how to do, is view a screenshot, when I goto open the ss it says that theres no program to view it. ??????

They are saved in the main FB/PF directory as Tga. files, windows does not recognize them!
Try opening them in Photoshop and then saving as another file type (Tiff, jpeg, bmp. etc.) then you can browse them in windows. If you don't have Photoshop you can download 'Irfan View' free of charge. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif


Available here:

http://www.irfanview.com/

http://www.irfanview.com/main_download_engl.htm

major_setback
09-11-2005, 01:33 PM
Thanks for the amazing screenshots! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

VMF-214_HaVoK
09-11-2005, 03:00 PM
Amazing screens Dutch. I would love to see an FPS count on those. I plan on getting myself a eVGA 7800GT end of Sept. Going with SLI mobo so I can hopefully get another one in the early spring.

VVaFFenPanZZeR
09-11-2005, 05:33 PM
TY, I figured it out, that free viewer works awsome.

Heres, my skin for online dogfighting:

http://rogue-cell.com/Pics/VVcorsair.jpg

Bearcat99
09-11-2005, 09:26 PM
That friggin water=3 sure looks friggin great doesnt it...... ?

polak5
09-11-2005, 10:50 PM
nice dutch60 Im jelaous! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_eek.gif

crazyivan1970
09-12-2005, 01:16 AM
Ummm, i just want to point out few things... Visual quality of ATI as far as aircraft and everything else conserned is better then nVidia, it`s not that hard to prove. Water=3, yes...i`ll give it to nVidia. I think it`s a matter of personal preference, i run water=0 because i don`t care how it looks from up high... needless to say that 0,1,2,3 all look the same once you over 1k http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif
Another thing i want to point out for those who`s running water on 2.... don`t. It`s been said 1000 times... water=2 should not be used.
And the last thing... 30 fps average is not really playable... 50 is.. 30... maybe for screenshots.

Yes, i am ATI fanboy X800XT-PE one. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif Happily playing PF at 1600x1200x32 with 4aa, 4af and averaging mid 70s http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

VVaFFenPanZZeR
09-12-2005, 08:12 AM
Its playable for me, I got all my settings cranked up as high as they will go, and it runs smooth as hell, it gets alittle choppy when a navy battle starts up, but I controlled that, so its way off in the distance, but other then that it is awsome, somtimes I get a hard on, and grab it instead of my flight stick.......J/K

Hawggy
09-12-2005, 08:21 AM
When water=3 loox like the water in Silent Hunter 3, wake me up...... *ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ*

Dutch60
09-12-2005, 11:21 AM
Originally posted by crazyivan1970:
Ummm, i just want to point out few things... Visual quality of ATI as far as aircraft and everything else conserned is better then nVidia, it`s not that hard to prove. Water=3, yes...i`ll give it to nVidia. I think it`s a matter of personal preference, i run water=0 because i don`t care how it looks from up high... needless to say that 0,1,2,3 all look the same once you over 1k http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif
Another thing i want to point out for those who`s running water on 2.... don`t. It`s been said 1000 times... water=2 should not be used.
And the last thing... 30 fps average is not really playable... 50 is.. 30... maybe for screenshots.

Yes, i am ATI fanboy X800XT-PE one. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif Happily playing PF at 1600x1200x32 with 4aa, 4af and averaging mid 70s http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Hi Crazy (flyer boy) Yivan (1970).

Then I challenge you to produce some screenshots that look like mine. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/51.gif

And if you can please tell me why in FB+AEP+FP Oleg is using OpenGL that is better on NVIDIA cards and not DirectX that is better is M$ ATI (XBox) DirectX? http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_confused.gif

Now what I would really like to know what is Oleg currently using as main development platform for BOB OpenGL or M$ DirectX? http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_confused.gif

If he is using DirectX 10 then Oleg could release BOB for the M$ ATI XBox-360 and than maybe we will then get better image quality. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/35.gif

I think that Water=2 only looks **** on ATI cards it looks cool on nVidia cards just like Water=3 that only is visible on nVidia cards. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

crazyivan1970
09-12-2005, 11:36 AM
Not a problem Dutch, challenge accepted. Wont be able to duplicate water... but shouldn`t be a problem for anything else. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Dutch60
09-12-2005, 11:47 AM
Originally posted by crazyivan1970:
Not a problem Dutch, challenge accepted. Wont be able to duplicate water... but shouldn`t be a problem for anything else. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Dear Sir Yivan,

A nice M$ ATI (XBox-360) Spitfire shot would be OK, but remember this thread was mainly about Water=3. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/53.gif

But what about the question what Oleg is using for BOB? http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_confused.gif

SeaFireLIV
09-12-2005, 11:51 AM
Originally posted by crazyivan1970:

And the last thing... 30 fps average is not really playable... 50 is.. 30... maybe for screenshots.



30 under what circumstances? In a dogfight with flak? Or just flying along?

In a dogfight, 30fps is perfectly acceptable. I have the 6800GT, but don`t care about fanboism, it`s just the card I happen to choose. Could`ve easily been the XT.

Dutch60
09-12-2005, 12:32 PM
I€m also not a fan boy of any hardware or software supplier.
However I am an Oleg FB+AEP+FP fan boy. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/11.gif

If I guess in one year time BOB from Oleg comes out and it runs best on a M$ ATI Xbox-360 I will buy one the same principle of cores is applicable for the Sony nVidia P$/3.

But I prefer the fasted PC money can buy alto my son will not agree with me on that so he will get a next generation console to play his FPS games and I will buy a new PC with if needed two or four graphics cards and two or more Intel or AMD processors just to get the best ever World War II flight simulation experience ever created by Oleg.

VVaFFenPanZZeR
09-12-2005, 01:22 PM
Yeah I'm a big fan of PF+FB+AEP, look at this ss:

http://rogue-cell.com/PlaneSS/P-47crash.jpg

I got a game called Enigma:Rising Tide, now that is some badass water detail, if Oleg had water like that, He'd be the cats ***.

crazyivan1970
09-12-2005, 03:28 PM
Dear Sir Yivan,

A nice M$ ATI (XBox-360) Spitfire shot would be OK, but remember this thread was mainly about Water=3. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/53.gif

But what about the question what Oleg is using for BOB? http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_confused.gif

I admired water=3 just like everyone else, with one exception, i said that everywhere else image quality is better in ATI http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif It sure does have pretty waves and reflections... but i don`t fly this low to admire them http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

I didn`t answer question about BOB because i am not sure what they are going to use http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

codeseven7
09-12-2005, 04:16 PM
Lets not forget this thread,

http://forums.ubi.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/49310655/m/2531042843

As far as the water=3/SM 3.0, ATI vs Nvidia thing goes, Dutch's water=3 pic's (again, friggin awesome!) are taken using his two 6800 Ultra's in SLI. Isn't it true the 7800's cant render water=3 in PF yet? If so, since even one 7800GTX outperforms two 6800 Ultra's all the way up until 1600x1200 4xAA 16xAF, water=3 using a 7800 should be outstanding! (once that bug, among others for Nvidia users, gets fixed, that is).

codeseven7
09-12-2005, 04:26 PM
Dutch, are all those the maximium settings in PF?

HardwareShaders=1
ForceShaders1x=0

Shadows=2
Specular=2
SpecularLight=2
DiffuseLight=2
DynamicalLights=1
MeshDetail=2
VisibilityDistance=3

Sky=2
Forest=2
Water=3
Effects=1
LandShading=3
LandDetails=2

VideoSetupId=17

EiZ0N
09-12-2005, 06:18 PM
M$ ATI (XBox-360)
wow, you are one HELL of a fanboy.

crazyivan1970
09-12-2005, 07:21 PM
http://tinypic.com/dnotxc.jpg

http://tinypic.com/dnou1v.jpg

http://tinypic.com/dnou43.jpg


Just a few... i could play with weather and such... size reduced to 1024x768

Note...water=0 from above looks pretty darn good IMO http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Hiriyu
09-12-2005, 07:43 PM
I'll agree with Ivan. I run mostly the same setup, with an X800XT at 1152x864, 6xAA/16xAF, Water=0.

http://home.earthlink.net/~jeremymtc/images/wildcatdamg_17.jpg

In my OPINION (and coincidentally, in the opinions of some of my 6800U/6800GT owning friends' as well) the ATI IQ* is slightly better than what you get with the current Nvidia crop, assuming high-res and AA/AF cranked to the maximum, Water=3 notwithstanding. Water=3 on the NVs sure does look cool though http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

I've owned both ATI and Nvidia product, and I don't feel that I have any special allegiance to one or the other, I just want what will work and work nicely in my budget. Last couple of times around, it's been the ATI stuff for me, and given the current NV driver issues in IL2/FB/AEP/PF, I think I made a good choice in the short term (again, some of my NV owning friends are in total agreement).

At any rate, Dutch, you have definitely earned your bragging rights with that rig. All props to you http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

*Edit - To elaborate on the differences in image quality, look at the differences in edge sharpness and geometric details such as wheel roundness in Dutch's shots versus those in Ivan's and my shots. Don't pay any heed to the weathering details, as these are skin specific.

clayman_52
09-12-2005, 09:07 PM
I'm in the same boat as Ivan and Hiriyu. I ran both flavors for years. Still like both flavors. Last year I went from a 9800XT to a 6800 Ultra and noticed some 'things' missing or off in PF. Then I got into SH III and ran into the UZO thing ... so I went out a couple of months back and got the last high end AGP card I could, an X850XT PE. I'm running , like Ivan, at 1600x1200x32 4AA ... but 8AF and Water=1(P4 3.2, ASUS P4C800-E D, 2GB OCZ 4000 Copper 2-3-3-5, dual 120GB SATA RAID-0, Creative SB Audigy 2 ZS). I'm very pleased as to how it all looks now.

Have to say that Water=3 looks SO sweet ... but then again all I have to do is look at the water in SH III and I can only imagine what the heck Oleg will come up with in BoB ... that will probably run well on both flavors! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

But in reality by then I'll probably build a PCI-E system ... both cards will have 3.0 shaders (God knows what else) and I'll go with what has the least glitches.

Then like now ... I go for overall image quality and what I feel is best to build at the time. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_cool.gif

http://home.comcast.net/~vecchiontf/Wake_L23a.jpg Down from 16x12 to 900 ... I think it held pretty well.

codeseven7
09-12-2005, 09:46 PM
Nice pic's fellas!

partic_3
09-12-2005, 10:20 PM
I agree with Ivan. I went from a 9800Pro to a 6800 ultra and I felt the image quality was better on the 9800. I also hate the perfect water. I think water=3 looks awful, especially with rivers and lakes. I always played water=0 and honestly think it looks better than water=3 but now I am playing in Excellent because of the Nvidia driver issues and I don't miss "perfect" at all!
However, this is only an opinion and, whilst it might seem subversive, I really don't mind if others don't share it.

Dutch60
09-13-2005, 11:57 AM
Originally posted by crazyivan1970:
http://tinypic.com/dnotxc.jpg

http://tinypic.com/dnou1v.jpg

http://tinypic.com/dnou43.jpg


Just a few... i could play with weather and such... size reduced to 1024x768

Note...water=0 from above looks pretty darn good IMO http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Sorry Crazy Ivan but I find these sample screenshots are way to small to be judge as pure quality shots and maybe it€s the resizing that you have done with them but I find them very un sharp in fact the look blurry.

I have an IBM R50p laptop that has a very good ATI video card and when I run FB+AEP+PF on this system at 1280x960x32 No AA and No AF it look just as blurry as your shots taken with your XT850PE.

So fore now I will stick with my nVidia 6800 Ultra SLI set.

Dutch60
09-13-2005, 12:16 PM
Sorry here are some more normal A2G flying then only difference now is I have set ForceShaders1x=1

http://home.planet.nl/~elzer033/screens/50.jpg
http://home.planet.nl/~elzer033/screens/51.jpg
http://home.planet.nl/~elzer033/screens/52.jpg
http://home.planet.nl/~elzer033/screens/53.jpg
http://home.planet.nl/~elzer033/screens/54.jpg

EiZ0N
09-13-2005, 12:45 PM
I'm not really sure how/why you're comparing a setup with one graphics card to a setup with two.

The picture quality differences are nothing short of pedantic, and having two cards costs....twice as much!

Dutch60
09-13-2005, 01:11 PM
Originally posted by EiZ0N:
I'm not really sure how/why you're comparing a setup with one graphics card to a setup with two.

The picture quality differences are nothing short of pedantic, and having two cards costs....twice as much!

Sorry my understanding of the English language is not a hundred percent so please explain the word pedantic

Twice as much is not the point and who cares and lots of flyer boys already own a SLI set!

Every thing here started with this Link (http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/video/display/2005-17gpu_29.html) now please have a good look at the FPS numbers in the high graphics setup.

Dutch60
09-13-2005, 01:22 PM
Originally posted by codeseven7:
Dutch, are all those the maximium settings in PF?

HardwareShaders=1
ForceShaders1x=0

Shadows=2
Specular=2
SpecularLight=2
DiffuseLight=2
DynamicalLights=1
MeshDetail=2
VisibilityDistance=3

Sky=2
Forest=2
Water=3
Effects=1
LandShading=3
LandDetails=2

VideoSetupId=17

I do not exactly know what the maxima are but I know that you can crank up the Forest=3 and the Effects=3 but these are real FPS killers.

EiZ0N
09-13-2005, 04:29 PM
Originally posted by Dutch60:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by EiZ0N:
I'm not really sure how/why you're comparing a setup with one graphics card to a setup with two.

The picture quality differences are nothing short of pedantic, and having two cards costs....twice as much!

Sorry my understanding of the English language is not a hundred percent so please explain the word pedantic

Twice as much is not the point and who cares and lots of flyer boys already own a SLI set!

Every thing here started with this Link (http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/video/display/2005-17gpu_29.html) now please have a good look at the FPS numbers in the high graphics setup. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

By pedantic, I am basically saying that you're arguing over the smallest of things, and image quality, if you ask me, is 'BS', and you wouldn't notice the difference in image quality in the middle of a game, you would only notice by studying and zooming in on screenshots.

As for the link, it actually shows the SLI setup being worse at Pacific Fighters for resolutions up to 1600x1200, where it's a whopping 4FPS faster. That's right, 4 FPS! Really worth buying your card twice for!

crazyivan1970
09-13-2005, 06:13 PM
Not in my rules to post images that will blow layout out of proportion... but just for you.... Notice, water=0 looks better, cleaner from altitude then water=3 http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/mockface.gif
http://www.il2flying.com/images/stories/crazyivan/grab0000.jpg

http://www.il2flying.com/images/stories/crazyivan/spit2.jpg

L33T-Zoolander
09-13-2005, 08:47 PM
I'm running the same Open GL settings as Dutch on my SLI 7800 GTXs.
With the extra muscle, I can force antialiasing to 8xS and anisotropic filtering to 16x.
The set-up looks great and runs as smooth as silk.

Good Hunting,
Zoo

Dutch60
09-14-2005, 11:03 AM
Originally posted by crazyivan1970:
Not in my rules to post images that will blow layout out of proportion... but just for you.... Notice, water=0 looks better, cleaner from altitude then water=3 http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/mockface.gif
http://www.il2flying.com/images/stories/crazyivan/grab0000.jpg

http://www.il2flying.com/images/stories/crazyivan/spit2.jpg

I will admit that now finally after some pushing to submit some real screenshots that you have outdone yourself on the quality of these images.
But now your are stating to sound like a little kid Na Na Na Na My graphics card is better that yours please by al means go and buy an M$ ATI Xbox-360 for the next generation of ATI hardware.
Well let me tell you that in my opinion an nVidia SLI set still looks better.
My bet is that the $ony nVidia P$/3 console will win by a large margin.
But then who cares about consoles I will stick with my PC and the best processor and video card(s) money can buy.

I am still wondering what Oleg is using for BOB OpenGL or DirextX as in nVidia or ATI preferred graphics hardware because that is what it will comedown to when I buy a new computer for BOB and need to select new graphics hardware.

Salute.

My spit look better than yours Na Na Na Na http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/mockface.gif (remember this is just my opinion) http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/icon_twisted.gif
http://home.planet.nl/~elzer033/screens/61.jpg
http://home.planet.nl/~elzer033/screens/62.jpg
http://home.planet.nl/~elzer033/screens/30.jpg

crazyivan1970
09-14-2005, 11:31 AM
I am not starting to sound like anyone my friend. You asked me to prove it, and i think i did. If a little tease upsets you, i`ll take it back http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Dutch60
09-14-2005, 12:01 PM
Originally posted by crazyivan1970:
I am not starting to sound like anyone my friend. You asked me to prove it, and i think i did. If a little tease upsets you, i`ll take it back http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

No offence taken Ivan but it is still my opinion that quality is a very subjective thing and that the cards have basically the same image quality.
The fact remains that what this thread started all about is that a single 7800GTX or a dual 7800GTX or 6800 Ultra SLI set wins by a long way in the FPS department.
XBitLabs test link (http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/video/display/2005-17gpu_29.html)
http://www.xbitlabs.com/images/video/2005-17gpu/pacific_candy.gif

codeseven7
09-14-2005, 12:44 PM
Dutch, I do believe Ivans Spit pics are very nice, but in my opinion, those first two pic's of the Spit over water in your last post were spectacular.

That article does show a clear FPS winner, but 'visual quality' is a whole different show. However, with the frame hit that water=3 imposes, once the 7800's are enabled to display water=3 in PF, then that FPS gap should narrow considerably.

Also, I think it's obvious now that what one person thinks are great visuals, another might think are poor, it is indeed personal taste. FPS is shown as a numerical number thats hard to argue with (provided the same settings are being compared) but visual quality is very subjective since its decided in each individuals minds eye.

Dexmeister
09-14-2005, 12:54 PM
Can anyone help me post a photographic picture of my post-patch pixels? I want to get into the fray, large! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

CuteQA
09-14-2005, 02:37 PM
Can we have some 109 Screenshots too http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/11.gif

arcadeace
09-14-2005, 03:20 PM
I think if anyone is looking for a simple upgrade from mid-level vid cards, and is primarily interested in PF/FB performance, chose the 6800GT. FireingSquad€s comparison showed similar results. NV has good OGL and outdoes ATI in this game; compare the 6800GT with X800XL.



Originally posted by Dutch60:
I will admit that now finally after some pushing to submit some real screenshots that you have outdone yourself on the quality of these images.
But now your are stating to sound like a little kid Na Na Na Na My graphics card is better that yours please by al means go and buy an M$ ATI Xbox-360 for the next generation of ATI hardware.
Well let me tell you that in my opinion an nVidia SLI set still looks better.
My bet is that the $ony nVidia P$/3 console will win by a large margin.
But then who cares about consoles I will stick with my PC and the best processor and video card(s) money can buy.


Dutch you started out with an interesting review but you're not one to talk about fanboyism m8. You're ego is head first into this one http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

crazyivan1970
09-14-2005, 03:25 PM
Hold on... let me get this right...according to this chart... X850XT-PE is somewhat in pair with...ummm 6600GT??? http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

I am done here. Cheers mate.

arcadeace
09-14-2005, 04:01 PM
Actually its not roughly on par, the X850XT is soundly beat on the chart posted. Take a look at FireingSquad€s too http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif But it looks like you€ve misunderstood, it€s the 6800GT not 6600GT http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

crazyivan1970
09-14-2005, 04:04 PM
Oh no ace, X850XT-PE is slightly...very slightly... better and only at 1600x1200 http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

What is the world coming to hehe.

EiZ0N
09-14-2005, 04:39 PM
Dutch your fanboyism is ridiculous, and this whole M$ ATI-Xbox 360 **** is the most childish stuff I've ever heard from someone old enough to buy their video card twice for a framerate boost of 4FPS.

And the bragging is quite ridiculous, you started out posting some nice screenshots and it was cool, but now you're going about saying "nah nah my computer is better", well nobody cares that much mate, don't be such a child about it.

Really.

clayman_52
09-14-2005, 04:49 PM
Ivans has a point. I can vouch for that ... if you read my post I have both a 6800 Ultra and an X850XT PE running on identical Intel 3.2 systems. It out-performs my 6800 sys ... (and this is just a side note) it's cooling sys vents out the back of the case. Talk about OC and a cool ambient temp inside the case.

I feel (as do others) that the ATI system has a much better image ... and no issues in PF or SH III nor others.

And this is getting nuts ... as stated by others we're comparing apples to oranges. We might as well be comparing the X1800 to the 7800? http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Stanger_361st
09-14-2005, 08:22 PM
http://home.carolina.rr.com/squad/Ati.gif

Dutch60
09-15-2005, 09:37 AM
Originally posted by EiZ0N:
Dutch your fanboyism is ridiculous, and this whole M$ ATI-Xbox 360 **** is the most childish stuff I've ever heard from someone old enough to buy their video card twice for a framerate boost of 4FPS.

And the bragging is quite ridiculous, you started out posting some nice screenshots and it was cool, but now you're going about saying "nah nah my computer is better", well nobody cares that much mate, don't be such a child about it.

Really.

Sorry EiZON normally I would not react to this kind of acquisitions but if you read this thread in the right sequence you can see that this all started out as you say like it started with a link (http://www.xbitlabs.com/images/video/2005-17gpu/pacific_candy.gif) the a good XBitLab test that favored some nVidia card then I posted some (I think) nice nVidia screenshots now if you skip down to the first reaction by the Ivan (form moderator) you can already see that he stated and I will latterly quote him that €visual quality of ATI as far as aircraft and everything else concerned is better then nVidia€ so please tell me who started this visual quality argument thing while I was only happily posting screenshots of a graphics card set who came in second in this XBitLab test.
To again use Ivan his words €œWhat is the world coming to hehe.€

http://home.carolina.rr.com/squad/Ati.gif

Tromplamort
09-15-2005, 04:53 PM
I left a 9800pro for a 6800GT. Exept the frame rate increase the reason of my choice was the possibility of water=3, not only for eye candy aspect but for the accordance of the sea-aspect with the weather. With my 9800pro flying above the sea in a storm looked liked flying over a calm lake in an air storm. With water=3 flying over the sea in a storm is more realistic as we have (too little) waves (I didn't said it was really realistic)....

But for sure this game a a beauty:
http://www.tromplamort.france-simulation.com/Screenshots/IL2M_W050831_201822_C05083120182284.jpg
http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif
http://www.tromplamort.france-simulation.com/P-51-B/P51B-Tromp2.jpg

http://www.tromplamort.france-simulation.com/P-51-B/P51B-Tromp1.jpg

james_ander
09-16-2005, 04:59 AM
Quite honestly, I don't see a clear image quality winner looking at these screenshots. I have always wondered how much truth there is to the old saw that ATI has betterimage quality. These screenshots give me the impression that IQ must be quite subjective. (BTW, I don't care much about Water=3)

Just so you know where I'm coming from, I recently bought a new rig with an EVGA 7800GTX. Haven't assembled yet. I would have preferred to buy an ATI card, mostly because what I've heard about IQ and AA and because I have been happy with my 9800pro. Your screenshots actually reassure me that I won't be disappointed with the 7800GTX.

My problem with ATI is not being able to get their cards when I have been looking for one. I held off buying a 6800GT while I waited for ages for the X800XT to be somewhere around MSRP. I eventually gave up.

I also waited as long as I could for the release of the r520 series. I got tired of ATI yanking our chains with rumors, partial specs and meaningless 3d mark scores. If they had come out with some real specs and benches I could have at least decided for myself if their cards were worth waiting for. Of course I will consider them in the future, but they have missed my business twice now.

I think the way they are going about getting out the r520 is not winning them any new fans or helping them keep old ones.

Here are my specs by the way:

CM Stacker case
Enermax Whisper 2 535 watt PSU
AMD 4000+ San Diego
DFI Lanparty UT SLI-DR motherboard
1G Crucial PC3200 (gotta upgrade that)
1 EVGA 7800 GTX
Samsung 160 GB SATA 150 HD

Hope to get it running soon.

james_ander
09-16-2005, 07:16 AM
Also, I find a lot of variation in benchmarks between 1 review and another, especially with flight sims. For example: Firing Squad shows a big performance gain in LOMAC going from a x850xt to a 7800GTX. Xbit labs shows a much smaller gain and claims they cannot get it to run higher than 30fps on any resolution. I actually think 30 fps for LOMAC maxed out is quite good. Anyway, I never rely on 1 review when comparing cards. I wish Sim HQ would bench the 7800GTX

james_ander
09-16-2005, 07:57 AM
I spoke too soon. Here are some r520 benches. Looks like nV and ATI are pretty close on this one.

http://www.hardwareanalysis.com/content/article/1813.1/

KGr.HH-Sunburst
09-16-2005, 08:21 AM
ATI is still the way to go for me simply because they are cheaper in the Netherlands
i own a X800XL OC'ed to XT speeds and im very happy, i play everything maxed out on perfect
1280x960 4xAA 4xAF forest=3 water=1 with 50-60fps
which is more then enough for me
so please keep your SLI uber machines which cost 600 euros more for a few frames and some extra waves
i also could get a 6800GT but between the cheapest 6800GT and X800XL there is 50" while i play alot of other games too and when i looked at the benchmarks of different games the X800XL was the better card http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

arcadeace
09-16-2005, 08:36 AM
Yikes. Heads up James. Better drivers should improve it but I am surprised.

james_ander
09-16-2005, 11:18 AM
Yikes. Heads up James. Better drivers should improve it but I am surprised.


Surprised in what way?

ReligiousZealot
09-16-2005, 11:43 AM
I run a single Nvidia 7800 GTX OC and I can tell you it's a huge step up from the 9600 I was using (well, considering the 9600 was AGP and my 7800 is a PCI, I got a new computer in the process).

This a is a little off topic but...
Holy ****! clayman_52 what..where...wha!? Please tell me what that is in your sig, that looks so sweet...is that from PF?

codeseven7
09-16-2005, 12:32 PM
Originally posted by james_ander:
I spoke too soon. Here are some r520 benches. Looks like nV and ATI are pretty close on this one.

http://www.hardwareanalysis.com/content/article/1813.1/ '


ATI's newest,baddest, long awaited monster card, the X1800 is here!



"So what does the R520 architecture bring to the table exactly? For starters it is not the 32-pipeline architecture it has been rumored to be, it is half that, offering just 16-pipelines, which is less than NVIDIA€s G70 architecture that has 24."

"Overall it looks like the Radeon X1800 XT is good match for the GeForce 7800GTX, although in most games the GTX clearly takes the lead."

"However it will now be a tough sell, the MSRP is around $599 for the Radeon X1800 XT, which is up to $150 more expensive than the GeForce 7800GTX which is faster overall. Same applies to the Radeon X1800 Pro, which will retail at $449, you can buy a GeForce 7800GTX for that amount of money, which honestly hands the Radeon X1800 Pro its own behind."


Uh, ya, that settles it, my 7800 is staying right where it is. As far as comparing screenshots at this time, ATI owners better enjoy it while it lasts, because when the graphics fixes for the 7800 are corrected, whether by Nvidia or Oleg himself (Oleg uses an Nvidia card in his own rig, so rest asurred any Nvidia problems will be fixed http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif) there will be no need for comparison shots till the next round of cards come out.

BigBoy01
09-16-2005, 12:52 PM
Truly interesting thread gentlemen. Great screenies. One curious thing to my eyes http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/53.gif the spectacular water = 3 shots have something not quite right. The deep blue to black color of the water and the light reflections off of them look more like a clear skied, sunrise/sunset situation, yet the skies appear very light, like hazy mid day. But hey, that's probably my eyes. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/53.gif

I've see those Xbit charts before, not much difference between single versus SLI 7800's.

I'm getting ready to upgrade my AMD box and all this is actually very helpful to me.

Kapteeni
09-18-2005, 01:53 AM
Originally posted by Tromplamort:
I left a 9800pro for a 6800GT. Exept the frame rate increase the reason of my choice was the possibility of water=3, not only for eye candy aspect but for the accordance of the sea-aspect with the weather. With my 9800pro flying above the sea in a storm looked liked flying over a calm lake in an air storm. With water=3 flying over the sea in a storm is more realistic as we have (too little) waves (I didn't said it was really realistic)....

But for sure this game a a beauty:
http://www.tromplamort.france-simulation.com/Screenshots/IL2M_W050831_201822_C05083120182284.jpg
http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif
http://www.tromplamort.france-simulation.com/P-51-B/P51B-Tromp2.jpg

http://www.tromplamort.france-simulation.com/P-51-B/P51B-Tromp1.jpg
Well! Does that really looks like water... Its still oil to me