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View Full Version : Serious P-51 thread (be nice) Looking for data.



XyZspineZyX
06-17-2003, 01:14 AM
My question is about the performance of a P-51 that has
run through most of it's fuel. The data says a P-51D carries
45% of it's max take off weight as fuel and ammo. It is
obvious such a huge load has adverse effect on performance.

My point is, how much is the improvment as fuel is used?

Could it climb and turn with Luftwaffe aircraft with most
of the fuel burned off?

Since it seems that the P-51 was capable of dealing with
the best the Luftwaffe and Imperial Japanese Navy and Army
had to offer, there must be something the P-51 did very well.

It was very fast and very maneuverable, although not a
super turning machine, it was very nimble, especially
at high speeds.

The raw numbers seem to say the p-51 had a slight disadvantage
in power to weight when at minimum fuel but was areodynamicly
superior.

Was that enough to make up for the power to weight ratio?

Please keep it civil!

Mr.

XyZspineZyX
06-17-2003, 01:14 AM
My question is about the performance of a P-51 that has
run through most of it's fuel. The data says a P-51D carries
45% of it's max take off weight as fuel and ammo. It is
obvious such a huge load has adverse effect on performance.

My point is, how much is the improvment as fuel is used?

Could it climb and turn with Luftwaffe aircraft with most
of the fuel burned off?

Since it seems that the P-51 was capable of dealing with
the best the Luftwaffe and Imperial Japanese Navy and Army
had to offer, there must be something the P-51 did very well.

It was very fast and very maneuverable, although not a
super turning machine, it was very nimble, especially
at high speeds.

The raw numbers seem to say the p-51 had a slight disadvantage
in power to weight when at minimum fuel but was areodynamicly
superior.

Was that enough to make up for the power to weight ratio?

Please keep it civil!

Mr.

XyZspineZyX
06-17-2003, 01:19 AM
If you are out of fuel and ammo and engaged with bandits then you better hope you got something up your sleeve no matter what you are flying http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

XyZspineZyX
06-17-2003, 01:22 AM
P-51s were notoriuous for being unstable with a full load particularly in the tak behind the pilot which changed the planee center of gravity. Most pilots used to use up thios tank first to eliminate that problem. It would be nice if multiple fuel tanks were modeled into FB.

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XyZspineZyX
06-17-2003, 01:37 AM
One point, i did not mean 'out of fuel and ammo'.

I meant minimum fuel and average or full ammo.

Mr.
WTE_Galway wrote:
- If you are out of fuel and ammo and engaged with
- bandits then you better hope you got something up
- your sleeve no matter what you are flying http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif
-
-

XyZspineZyX
06-17-2003, 02:00 AM
Bearcat99 wrote:
- P-51s were notoriuous for being unstable with a full
- load particularly in the tak behind the pilot which
- changed the planee center of gravity.

So...a shot behind the pilot should make him go up like a Roman candle?

Just askin'...../i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

<img src=http://www.johnsonsmith.com/images/p1039.jpg>

Eeeeeeeeeee.......

XyZspineZyX
06-17-2003, 02:01 AM
What makes you Awesome....Mister.?

Da Buzz
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Only the spirit of attack, born in a brave heart, will bring success to any fighter aircraft, no matter how highly developed it may be.... Adolf Galland
<center>

http://www.huntress.com/images/MichaelHaberlin.jpg

XyZspineZyX
06-17-2003, 02:04 AM
We'll see.... I dont know for sure...you know everything is so different with these FMs and DMs. I have only flown P-51s in CFS, Warbirds, Fighter Ace and Aces High. In FA & AH I wasnt flying against anybody. I just DLd the SW so I could check out the FMs. It will be an adventure for all of us.

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XyZspineZyX
06-17-2003, 02:21 AM
Well, it could already out-turn the Fw-190A and D. At normal loaded weight, it was only slightly inferior to the Bf-109 in turn. But the P-51 had great combat flaps and using them it could easily turn with the Bf-109. As fuel burns off, especially from the fuselage tank, power to weight ratio and wing loading only get better improving stability and manueverability that much more.

Waiting for Huck and Isegrim to pop in to tell you how inferior the P-51 was to anything with a black cross on it and that its combat record was nothing more than a lie. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Regards,

SkyChimp

http://pages.prodigy.net/4parks/_uimages/japsig.jpg



Message Edited on 06/17/0305:23AM by SkyChimp

XyZspineZyX
06-17-2003, 04:22 AM
The P-51's of the 8th AF took off from England and flew many miles before having a real chance of meeting the enemy.

By the time they were in position with the bombers they had burned off as much fuel as possible from the fuselage tank. Once about half had been used the center of gravity was far enough forward for normal flight.

How much the Mustangs burned depended on the length of the flight. The longest missions required as much fuel to be stored internally as possible, and the Ponies went to external as soon as 1/2 of the fuselage tank was burned. That way as much internal as possible was available after jettisoning the externals.

Shorter missions the Mustangs burned all the fuselage tank first if the wing tanks were enough to get them home.

The idea that Mustangs went into combat with full fuselage tanks, and were crippled by all the gas probably happened, rarely, if they were bounced very early in the flight.

Remember, the US planes escorted in relays, Groups taking only a portion of the route. Planning how to best utilize all the fuel available to the P-51's, to ensure the least amount of internal fuel carried during the combat portion of the flight, was not a difficult thing.

Brit P-51's, and some US Mustangs stationed on the continent often flew with no fuel in the fuselage tank. In fact, AFAIK, Brit P-51's had no fuselage tank at all.

HayateAce
11-01-2005, 11:58 AM
Mustang is a dog in IL2.

robban75
11-01-2005, 12:03 PM
This thread is more than 2 years old! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/blink.gif

Waldo.Pepper
11-01-2005, 12:31 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Since it seems that the P-51 was capable of dealing with
the best the Luftwaffe and Imperial Japanese Navy and Army
had to offer, there must be something the P-51 did very well. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>


For about the millionth time...its not the MACHINE it's the MAN.

These debates are worthless.

HayateAce
11-01-2005, 02:21 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by robban75:
This thread is more than 2 years old! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/blink.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I know, we have put up with a dog for over 2 years. C'mon Microsoft, please come out with a competing SIM to replace this russian game.

Badsight.
11-01-2005, 02:28 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by HayateAce:
Mustang is a dog in IL2. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>your a perfect match for it then http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

msalama
11-01-2005, 02:33 PM
Oh my. Call a wahmbulance, soon!!!

faustnik
11-01-2005, 02:44 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by HayateAce:

I know, we have put up with a dog for over 2 years. C'mon Microsoft, please come out with a competing SIM to replace this russian game. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

What the ...???

Silly clown to angry clown? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/354.gif