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iimskillz
01-28-2009, 08:19 PM
I think they should bring back a classic remake for the x-box 360. What about Rainbow Six Black Arrow mixed in with Counter Terror? But please make it just like Rainbow Six Vegas 1. That means no sprint. Just don't make it like call of duty4. I loved the CAFE on Rainbow Six Black Arrow, and the classic AIRPORT. Good map on those games. So that is my IDEA. Please Post Replies.

iimskillz
01-28-2009, 08:19 PM
I think they should bring back a classic remake for the x-box 360. What about Rainbow Six Black Arrow mixed in with Counter Terror? But please make it just like Rainbow Six Vegas 1. That means no sprint. Just don't make it like call of duty4. I loved the CAFE on Rainbow Six Black Arrow, and the classic AIRPORT. Good map on those games. So that is my IDEA. Please Post Replies.

Conkerz_BFD
01-28-2009, 08:22 PM
Yeah great idea, they should really take all those maps and do a RBV1 style(not RSV2). Oh and I think I've played against you b4, you're with all the iim guys right? Like iim psyokitic? You guys are damn good.

D---Fingers
01-29-2009, 12:19 PM
if they bring back Black arrow, but "make it like Vegas 1" it wouldnt be black arrow. it would just be ANOTHER #$^%ing Vegas (probably give you all the Vegas series glitches for free too). the last thing i'd want to see.

the 2 games share almost nothing in common, except for the linear-style single player levels. the gameplay itself is nothing alike. black arrow gameplay in MP is more similar (in some ways) to Vegas 2 high stakes than anything else.

ASDF_Russell
01-29-2009, 04:49 PM
Whoa, this forum is still alive.

ANYWAY, I think the high stakes aspect of Vegas 2 v1.03 should remain, but have some elements of Vegas 1 still in place (otherwise the game just won't sell, a series that has notoriously deteriorated into arcadey-style gameplay won't suddenly become a retail hit among hardcore tactical gamers like you and I)

Here's a post that I made in the GRAW 2 forums that I find very relevant to the discussion at hand. If you read through it entirely, you can see how BOTH the tactical AND the casual gamer can both enjoy a game like Rainbow Six or Ghost Recon.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted here (http://forums.ubi.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/3291043913/m/9181097527?r=8541017627#8541017627)


Well, here's what I propose: You know how in Rainbow Six Vegas 2, there were three difficulty modes, "Casual" "Normal" and "REALISTIC"? Both casual and hardcore players would have a win-win when it comes to the singleplayer campaign.

It didn’t work out so well in Vegas 2, but maybe Ubisoft can learn from this and implement a difficulty design setup that appeals to ALL types of gamers.

The following proposition is designed so that hardcore / realistic gamers will like the hardest difficulty, whereas your casual gamer will like going with the easiest difficulty. Everyone will be able to enjoy the game their own way. NORMAL difficulty will be a happy medium for someone casual who wants to try “stepping up the difficulty”. And NORMAL difficulty will also be a happy medium for hardcore gamers who want to take a break from ultra-realism that REALISTIC difficulty offers, but the hardcore gamers will still find SOME level of realism to make NORMAL difficulty just as enjoyable as REALISTIC.

Allow me to explain: REALISTIC DIFFICULTY:
<LI> No regenerating health. Period.
<LI> Health is linear and cannot be healed until the end of each mission.
<LI> Player can ONLY heal at the end of each mission, NOT during a mission. I'm sure the player will have some time in-between missions to be taken to a full-equipped medic station with more than just first aid.
<LI> Depending on where you were hit determines how fast/slow you will heal, and again, only in-between missions, not during one. Hit in the upper thigh once? Probably quicker to heal than to be hit in the thigh 3 times (where you would've been seriously limping around like in Raven Shield or SWAT 4). Shot in the shoulder? Probably going to take three missions worth to fully heal. Compared to getting shot in the left arm, you would have a better chance of healing quicker from getting shot in the left arm than in the right shoulder (shoulders really determine your pain tolerance when holding a weapon that generates recoil when fired)
<LI> Weapon recoil is hard as hell to control, like in Raven Shield. Fire in short controlled bursts, though you’ll probably have to resort to single shots like in GRAW 2 PC (which was very realistic, considering other factors like fatigue, distance, weight of gear carried, all of which effectively affected your ability to control weapon recoil)
<LI> Enemies have same recoil negatives that you have too. When they fire, they can't just spray and pray and magically hit you with every bullet (*COUGH* RAINBOW SIX VEGAS 2 WHICH CLAIMS TO BE REALISTIC ON "realistic" DIFFICULTY)
<LI> When a teammate gets shot to death, you can't magically heal him. Just like in GRAW 2 PC.
<LI>If a teammate is seriously wounded (i.e. “incapacitated” or just struggling to live because blood keeps stemming out, then you can drag him to a non-hostile area and stabilize him. Chance of successful stabilization is about 60%. Military will come to pick him up at the end of mission. Your teammate will not be guaranteed to heal fully by next mission.


NORMAL DIFFICULTY:
<LI> Regenerating health is allowed, but with certain restrictions. See below points.
<LI> Health is based on FIVE HEALTH thresholds like in Far Cry 2. Health may be healed any time AND during a mission like in Far Cry 2.
<LI> Player can heal any time during a mission, and also in-between missions. However, player can only heal to certain thresholds. For example, if player is shot and his health goes half way into the FOURTH bar, health will only regenerate to the END of the fourth bar and will NOT regenerate into the fifth bar (effeictively preventing player from healing to full health)
<LI> Doesn’t matter where you were hit on the body, at the end of each mission, all your health is restored, unless you were seriously limping around with ONE to TWO bars of threshold health. Then you can only regenerate to THREE or FOUR for the next mission.
<LI> Weapon recoil is much more lenient, like in Far Cry 2. You can’t hold down the trigger, spray and pray and hope to kill the bad guy 25 metres from you. You have to fire in short, controlled bursts. Fire in single shots to get the best stability, but it’s not an epic requirement to do well on Normal difficulty.
<LI> Enemies have same recoil negatives as you do. They can’t spray and pray and hope to hit you, but they can fire in short controlled bursts like they do in Realistic difficulty, but on NORMAL difficulty (this one), then they will miss more often to be more lenient on the player. (Game design choice if Ubisoft wants to implement this)
<LI> When a teammate gets shot to death, they’re dead. You can’t magically heal them.
<LI> If a teammate is seriously wounded (i.e. “incapacitated” or just struggling to live because blood keeps stemming out, then you can drag him to a non-hostile area and stabilize him. Chance of successful stabilization is about 90%. Military will come to pick him up at the end of mission. He will heal to full health by the start of the next mission.


CASUAL DIFFICULTY:
<LI> FULL regenerating health capability, and health regenerates very quickly any time.
<LI> straight up linear health. Shot down to 20% health? Wait a while and you’ll slowly regenerate to 100% health.
<LI>Player can heal any time during a mission, and also in-between missions.
<LI> Who cares where the player is shot, this is Casual difficulty. Player will heal quickly no matter where he was shot. Same with teammates. (see 3 points down)
<LI> Recoil is VERY VERY lenient. You could get away with holding down the trigger for 4 – 5 shots before you gotta start thinking of firing in controlled bursts. Remember, this is CASUAL difficulty, trying to cater to the casual audience.
<LI> Enemies have worse recoil than you. They try to spray and pray, they won’t hit you. When they wise up and try to fire in short controlled bursts or even single shots, they will hit you, but since you have regenerating health, you could just hide and wait for your health to hit 100% again.
<LI> Teammate got shot to death? No, teammates can’t die on Casual difficulty. ? Just walk up to him, drag him away to a safe location, stabilize him (100% chance of being able to stabilize fallen guy). Inject a magic syringe (e.g. Far Cry 2 or Rainbow Six Vegas 2). Leave them for 2 minutes, and they’ll get up and be fine and dandy.
<LI> Teammate seriously wounded? Oh well. They can regenerate to full health if they take cover and wait a few moments. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

ILDUCE924
01-30-2009, 03:08 PM
Yeah Idk if I like those ideas, not regenerating health at all for a whole mission might get annoying, it's different in MP or TH...non-regen health actually makes it more challenging but in single player with the BS AI makes it impossible...

iL0VEbooty
01-31-2009, 12:16 AM
Yeah... how does it make sense to not regenerate for multiple missions. Then you keep starting out messed up because you are already going into battle messed up. Plus, in a realistic setting, since you talk about medics, why would someone send a wounded person into battle.

GSG_9_Rage
01-31-2009, 09:56 AM
You wouldn't send in someone who was wounded into battle. That's why it's called a team. Replace the person with another member of the team. Contrary to what Ubisoft wants you to believe, there are more than three members of Rainbow.

WhiteKnight77
01-31-2009, 10:16 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by iL0VEbooty:
Yeah... how does it make sense to not regenerate for multiple missions. Then you keep starting out messed up because you are already going into battle messed up. Plus, in a realistic setting, since you talk about medics, why would someone send a wounded person into battle. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Rainbow Six, as it was originally released had a team of about 20 team members to choose from to use on missions (typically 8 members). They all suffered from fatigue which usually went away after a couple of days.

If wounded, a team member would take weeks to heal (real world time) and it was best not to use said team member until they were healthy again.

If a team member was killed, they stayed dead for the rest of the campaign/missions. They did not magically reappear for the next mission.

This was an innovative feature of the R6/RS games and one really cared about their operatives and did everything they could to keep them from getting killed. Many gamers tended to become the characters they played as especially in MP.

ILDUCE924
01-31-2009, 11:47 AM
Yeah I like that system a lot more than the dip sh*ts they stick you with in this one and of course there is only two of them and I can't tell you how many times I've heard "I cannot comply" when I tell them to do something, the AI is complete garbage and I would kill Jung and Logan if I could because they are completely useless if I wouldn't lose the game once I did so, they are either not taking cover and being picked off both at the same time so I can't get one of the dopes to heal the other one, and realistic is basically impossible without playing co-op, they need to bring back 4 player co-op or I will be sooooo ****ed...and the choosing your own character thing would be the best option and should be easy to implement since they had it in the old games...