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Frqnt4ager
01-18-2020, 08:11 PM
The track rotation is not working correctly in multiplayer. I think it happens when silver ranked ppl are in the session, but it may also happen when unranked ppl are present as well. Basically what is happening is that there will be tracks that get locked together and never change throughout all 3 rounds. The tracks that cause this are .. "MX and The City", "Canyon Crash", "Lynx World", "Hard Hat Zone" and "Yellowstone Caldera". Sometimes it'll change between the 5 tracks, but then it'll only rotate whatever 3 it chooses for the complete session. This will go on for however many sessions there is someone present to trigger the selection of those 5 tracks.

UBI-Froggard
01-19-2020, 04:30 PM
Hey,

Can you just clarify what you mean by locked together? You are only getting those 5 tracks when playing with someone who is silver ranked and no other tracks?

How many times has this happened to support this theory?

Frqnt4ager
01-19-2020, 04:56 PM
Thanks for the quick response!

I actually found a couple ppl between when I first posted and now. It appears that they did rotate, but only between the 5 tracks. Since there's only 5 tracks it's pulling from there's always a good chance to get the same 3 again.

I think it may be from unranked, but silver looks so close to unranked that they're easy to confuse them for one another if not paying close attention. I want to say it's happened with silver though too.

This issue has been happening since the start of season 4. It's happened way too many times to count ... and my theory is solid, unless it's been fixed today. Feel free to check the diamond leaderboards if you want an idea of how much MP I play. ;)

I won't have much time today to check things out, but will check tomorrow for sure or maybe a lil tonight.

Frqnt4ager
01-20-2020, 01:38 AM
So it's definitely happening with unranked. Was playing against a silver and things were fine until the next session when an unranked player joined us, causing the issue. It happened again with just the unranked in the session.

If it's related to the unranked track selection, then it should be changed to pull tracks from bronze. What happens is that there's usually an unranked person in the lobby and I've had it recycle those tracks for 5 sessions in a row. Probably would've been more, but I was done at that point so didn't hang around to get stuck with them again. I'm sure the lack of diversity has pushed a lot of players away from mp. There was a good number of ppl at the start of the season, but it's almost dead these days. Had hoped they would've fixed it when I first reported it before xmas, but it's been an issue for over a month now and I'm sure many are just done at this point. It gets pretty boring if your stuck playing 5 tracks over and over again.

Rudhelm
01-20-2020, 03:40 PM
This happens on PS4 as well

Frqnt4ager
01-26-2020, 07:09 PM
Had a different type of rotation bug early this morn. I was racing a gold division and we got the choice of "MX and the City", "Red Steel" and "MX and the City. This happened for all 3 rounds and back to back sessions and a couple other times too. https://forums.ubisoft.com/showthread.php/2169155-Unranked-players-shouldn-t-get-Extreme-tracks This shows, not only how long it's been going on, but also that it's happened to others.

edit: Was able to record this, but don't currently have a way of uploading vid. Will figure out a way to upload if support wants to dispute this claim. Easiest way tho will be for the team to play the game first hand.

Frqnt4ager
01-31-2020, 10:25 AM
Has Ubisoft/RedLynx been testing MP with "lqa..." accounts? I ask because I found it odd that the one on Switch has somehow been able to avoid getting paired up with me despite me being in the lobby at the same time (I saw the time change on the LB and it only takes 30 sec to check). I only got paired up with them once or twice, but never again since those first couple times about a week ago and when I was paired up they had another account, same one each time, alongside them that just sat there. Plus, all the lqa accounts set mp scores around the same time between different consoles. Maybe it's just a coincidence, but somehow I don't think so. I'm just wondering because if so, next time don't hide .. race lol. :p

UBI-Froggard
01-31-2020, 11:36 PM
Hey again,

I'll try and find out from the game team to see if it's intended that that it's always using these 5 maps when there's an unranked player. Maybe the maps have been grouped this way to make it easier for new players online to start with? Will let you know what I can find out.

Frqnt4ager
02-01-2020, 04:58 AM
UBI-Froggard,

Thanks a bunch. I really appreciate you checking into this stuff.

Decided to go ahead and take the time to get a youtube channel setup. This way I can just make a proper report from now on and save you guys the trouble of asking for screenshots/vids. Also save me the headache of being asked to prove my claim lol. :)

UBI-Froggard
02-05-2020, 02:27 PM
Hey,

So the info I have received back upon reporting this is that it's not a bug, as multiplayer track rotation takes the MMR of the player that is the host of the MP session, to select the available tracks in the rotation. I have also updated the other thread (https://forums.ubisoft.com/showthread.php/2169155-Unranked-players-shouldn-t-get-Extreme-tracks) you mentioned about what came of that report.

Frqnt4ager
02-05-2020, 03:08 PM
Thank you for checking into this :)

What does MMR stand for? Also wondering .. What determines the host? I've had it happen when someone entered the lobby while I was already there and also when I enter the lobby after them. I feel like the lowest ranked person in the lobby should choose tracks. I always feel bad when it gives us only hards and extremes to choose from when there's ppl in the lobby that are still beginning. They'd at least have a chance to make it thru the tracks if it was always the lowest rank chooses.

UBI-Froggard
02-07-2020, 05:56 PM
MMR is match making rating. The host will be the first player to be in the lobby but I don't know if there's anything that determines who is the host. It could be whoever has been waiting the longest or whoever has the strongest connection (probably a bit of both I would imagine).

Frqnt4ager
02-08-2020, 12:03 AM
Thanks for the info about this!

Hopefully they change it to lowest ranked chooses. It would keep a lot more ppl playing mp if they didn't get stuck with tracks they can't do.

Frqnt4ager
02-08-2020, 01:38 PM
Ok, so I captured some screen shots this morn of the issue. It actually happened twice in a row and with different ppl. I was the first in the lobby, both times, so I guess that's not the determining factor in track selection. The vid shows the track selection for rounds 1, 2 and 3 of the first session along with all 3 tracks (at end of session) for both sessions. Both sessions were with unranked players.


https://youtu.be/DH3UcppLdDQ

Frqnt4ager
02-09-2020, 06:30 PM
This issue may have been addressed at some point yesterday. I've seen some variety against unranked, yesterday afternoon and also today. I'll continue to keep an eye out, but if support is able to verify it's been fixed that would be awesome. :)

edit: Guess it's not fixed. Just had it happen against bronze and then an unranked (1:53pm est)

Frqnt4ager
02-26-2020, 01:01 AM
So this is still happening after the update. I played 3 sessions with absolutely no change in the track selection!! That's 9 rounds with only 3 tracks to choose from! What the hell guys?

One of 2 things need to happen.

1) Fix the issue
2) Completely remove those 5 tracks from the lineup.

Ihateuplaykk
02-26-2020, 09:08 PM
Hopefully the next multiplayer season will fix this? I don't know if it's likely to.

Ubi-Orion
03-04-2020, 09:40 PM
Hey,

So the info I have received back upon reporting this is that it's not a bug, as multiplayer track rotation takes the MMR of the player that is the host of the MP session, to select the available tracks in the rotation. I have also updated the other thread (https://forums.ubisoft.com/showthread.php/2169155-Unranked-players-shouldn-t-get-Extreme-tracks) you mentioned about what came of that report.


Hopefully the next multiplayer season will fix this? I don't know if it's likely to.


So this is still happening after the update. I played 3 sessions with absolutely no change in the track selection!! That's 9 rounds with only 3 tracks to choose from! What the hell guys?

One of 2 things need to happen.

1) Fix the issue
2) Completely remove those 5 tracks from the lineup.

Hey there folks.

Please see the response from Ubi-Froggard above, the track rotation is working as intended and is not a bug/glitch. Thanks.

Frqnt4ager
03-05-2020, 05:10 PM
So your telling me that it's intended for players to only have 3 tracks available?! There's no way that it's working as intended when the list for tracks is way more than 3. I've been getting stuck with nothing but "MX and the City", "Hard Hat Zone" and "Canyon Crash" over n over again, depending on who's in the lobby. It's gotta be something with those tracks and/or how the MMR is setup. Every once in awhile the selection will mix up, and this is going by playing the same person online that's been doing a lot of mp recently, but 90% of the time it's only those 3 tracks since the season ended. I really feel bad for them now, because I'll at least wait till the selection screen, but then back out as soon as I see it's those 3 tracks, because I know that it's the only tracks we'll have, for however many sessions we play and at this point I just can't do it anymore. It's just ridiculous that something as simple as making sure 3 to 5 tracks don't get stuck in a loop isn't being addressed. This is broken and your not going to convince me otherwise, unless the intention is to push ppl away from the game ... in that case, yeah, it's working as intended.

Edit: I just want to mention that this was not happening in season 3. Not once did I have the same tracks over n over again. Something in the December update caused this.

Ubi-Orion
03-09-2020, 08:51 PM
So your telling me that it's intended for players to only have 3 tracks available?! There's no way that it's working as intended when the list for tracks is way more than 3. I've been getting stuck with nothing but "MX and the City", "Hard Hat Zone" and "Canyon Crash" over n over again, depending on who's in the lobby. It's gotta be something with those tracks and/or how the MMR is setup. Every once in awhile the selection will mix up, and this is going by playing the same person online that's been doing a lot of mp recently, but 90% of the time it's only those 3 tracks since the season ended. I really feel bad for them now, because I'll at least wait till the selection screen, but then back out as soon as I see it's those 3 tracks, because I know that it's the only tracks we'll have, for however many sessions we play and at this point I just can't do it anymore. It's just ridiculous that something as simple as making sure 3 to 5 tracks don't get stuck in a loop isn't being addressed. This is broken and your not going to convince me otherwise, unless the intention is to push ppl away from the game ... in that case, yeah, it's working as intended.

Edit: I just want to mention that this was not happening in season 3. Not once did I have the same tracks over n over again. Something in the December update caused this.

Hey there.

I'd be happy to pass your feedback on the current system to the team. However I can confirm it was reported to the development team to clarify the situation as to whether it was a bug or working as intended and we were informed that it is working as intended at present. You've mentioned yourself in this message that encountering the same players playing a lot of MP mixes up the track rotation, this is because they have a higher MMR. The track rotation works off the MMR of the players currently in the lobby so because you're encountering unranked or lower level players more frequently it in turn affects the tracks you have available.

Frqnt4ager
03-10-2020, 11:55 AM
Hey there.

I'd be happy to pass your feedback on the current system to the team. However I can confirm it was reported to the development team to clarify the situation as to whether it was a bug or working as intended and we were informed that it is working as intended at present. You've mentioned yourself in this message that encountering the same players playing a lot of MP mixes up the track rotation, this is because they have a higher MMR. The track rotation works off the MMR of the players currently in the lobby so because you're encountering unranked or lower level players more frequently it in turn affects the tracks you have available.


Thank you for passing it along. I completely understand it's all support can do. Please know that I'm not frustrated with you guys at support about this. I know your job is very scripted and your just stuck in the middle, relaying info back n forth. I'm sorry they're telling you it's working fine when, in fact, it is not.


This issue was not happening during season 3. Not long after the update, back on 12/16/19, I mentioned the problem in the season 4 thread https://forums.ubisoft.com/showthread.php/2166522-Season-4-Expedition-to-the-North-Pole-Updated as well as again, on 12/26/19, in the same thread. I play way more MP than a lot of ppl, so of course I noticed it not behaving correctly and tried to warn them about it as soon as I realized these tracks were getting stuck and not being rotated/randomized. Perhaps I should of just started off mentioning it here in support, but I was being hopeful that the ppl in charge of handling mp, or at least someone on the team, would've read it and made the appropriate changes not long after knowing about it. This was/is not the case and I realize that now. The amount of ppl I've seen in MP has dropped drastically over the course of season 4 and I'm sure this is one of the things, as well as the points situation, that is behind the drop in players.

About my recent observations involving one particular player that has been playing a lot of mp in the month of Feb. Yes, it does change up, but only every once in awhile. Like I said, 90% of the time it's only been those 3-5 tracks we get stuck with. It's really odd to tell you the truth. Like for example, the night after I posted my last comment we had multiple sessions with normal track selection, but then just 2 nights later we only get 1 session with other tracks and then it's back to the same bs tracks for 2 sessions in a row. I know it would've been more sessions, but I'm not playing anymore under these conditions. I'm losing out on being able to race against my friends as well, because they have even less patience with this nonsense than I do and have already said they won't be doing MP until the season actually starts. We don't have private MP on the Switch, so it's not like I can avoid the main lobby and setup somewhere my friends and I can race. I have to brave the lobby as is and hope that, if I even find someone trying to race, they're not going to cause those tracks to loop. The problem is that it's almost impossible to avoid low ranking players in the main lobby and when they're in the lobby it ruins the session for all involved. The only solution right now is to just stop playing and trust me, it's exactly what ppl are doing. It really is a shame that an online game doesn't even have MP working correctly or are taking the steps to make sure they don't lose more players. It seems like all they have to do is tweak the MMR settings and this will be fixed. I just can't understand how things go from not working in season 2, they fix the track rotation at the end of season 2, season 3 tracks work perfectly and then come season 4 it's back to the problems with tracks not rotating again. How did they fix it and then break it again, all while saying things are "working as intended"?

It's almost whatever at this point. They def know it's happening, but I guess just don't care enough to fix it. No amount of frustration from me is going to make this right. It's up to the team to make sure they do the right thing. There won't be many left playing the game tho if things keep going down the path it's currently on. I've already noticed most of the regulars in the lobby are barely around these days, if around at all, and I'm not far behind them if this keeps up.

Ubi-Raziel
03-10-2020, 07:14 PM
I completely appreciate your frustration with this system and at support we do everything we can to make sure the player's voice is heard.

This is not a matter of our dev team not caring. They designed the game so they have a strong understanding of the backend, and they respond to every bug report and every feedback we send. This answer was given with all facts taken into consideration and they believe what you're experiencing to be normal.

For now I don't believe this matchmaking system will change, but we will see what the future holds. Of course if this were to happen it would be very important, and so we'd make sure all players made aware.

I am sorry that this has been a negative experience for you. We'll continue to forward any other feedback we see about this topic.

All the best!

Frqnt4ager
03-11-2020, 03:35 AM
They designed the game so they have a strong understanding of the backend .... and they believe what you're experiencing to be normal.

I know they know the game from a developers perspective. It's why I had hoped this would've been fixed for the newest patch. I know the game too though. I have almost 2400 hrs logged and have played 7750 MP matches. I think that qualifies me for having a strong understanding of the frontend of things. The only thing I can think of is that there is a separate "division" for low ranking players. One that only pulls from a list of 5 tracks, with the recent pull only being from 3 tracks. With all the tracks at their disposal this shouldn't be an issue. It seems like they need to adjust it so that there's more tracks than just those couple for low ranking ppl. To me it seems like an easy fix, but then again I don't know the game from their perspective. This really is messing up the MP experience though and should be addressed before it causes more damage than it already has.

I appreciate you guys taking the time to forward things to the team and trying to help get this worked out.

Ubi-Viral
03-11-2020, 06:28 PM
Thanks for getting back to us and it is amazing that you have racked up so many hours in the game as well as MP matches. I am going to pass along your additional feedback about this to the dev team.

Please do get back in touch should you need anything else at all.

Frqnt4ager
03-17-2020, 11:04 AM
I encountered another 5 track loop late last night. While racing against a friend, who is in gold division, we kept having the same tracks come up over n over again. These 5 tracks were the only ones to come up 4-5 sessions in a row, so that's 12-15 rounds of the same 5 tracks. I'll be taking note of how things are working with all divisions from now on in order to help get this sorted out. This will be updated as I gather more information. If possible, the exact variables used for how tracks are determined would be extremely helpful in trying to figure out what is going on here, because I'm getting the unranked tracks against a silver as I type this. thnx

Looped Track selections

Unranked
-MX and the City
-Hard Hat Zone
-Canyon Crash
-Lynx World
-Yellowstone Caldera

Gold
-I Fell Tower
-Venice Beach 360
-UK Up
-Pripyat
-Seoul Searching

Platinum
-Rally of the Kings
-Seoul Searching
-Siberian Skies
-Ever Everer Everest



edit: I was wondering if it's possible, for either support or the team, to view the MP data. Like, are the matches recorded somehow, as in who was in what lobby and what tracks were selected/played?

Ubi-Raziel
03-17-2020, 10:05 PM
I encountered another 5 track loop late last night. While racing against a friend, who is in gold division, we kept having the same tracks come up over n over again. These 5 tracks were the only ones to come up 4-5 sessions in a row, so that's 12-15 rounds of the same 5 tracks. I'll be taking note of how things are working with all divisions from now on in order to help get this sorted out. This will be updated as I gather more information. If possible, the exact variables used for how tracks are determined would be extremely helpful in trying to figure out what is going on here, because I'm getting the unranked tracks against a silver as I type this. thnx

5 Track selections

Unranked

-MX and the City
-Hard Hat Zone
-Canyon Crash
-Lynx World
-Yellowstone Caldera


Gold

-I Fell Tower
-Venice Beach 360
-UK Up
-Pripyat
-Seoul Searching

edit: I was wondering if it's possible, for either support or the team, to view the MP data. Like, are the matches recorded somehow, as in who was in what lobby and what tracks were selected/played?

Thank you very much for your continued efforts.

I'll do my best to look into this further for you. I may not be able to give in-depth details of gaming mechanics however I would like to be sure that this is all working as intended, while also answering any questions you have.

Please give me some time and I'll be back when I can :)

Frqnt4ager
03-18-2020, 11:05 AM
Thank you very much for your continued efforts.

I'll do my best to look into this further for you. I may not be able to give in-depth details of gaming mechanics however I would like to be sure that this is all working as intended, while also answering any questions you have.

Please give me some time and I'll be back when I can :)

Thanks a bunch!

Yeah, I'm mostly just inquiring about what piece of data I should be paying attention to. The issue occurs session after session, but only depending on who is in the lobby. I'm thinking the key deciding factor would have to be the global ranking, because the players level and MP score are constantly changing after each session. Global ranking, however, is constant throughout multiple sessions, so I'll start with paying attention to that for now. It's just really weird that it happened with someone being in silver division, but then worked fine a lil later for a different silver division player.

One thing I forgot to mention in the last post was how this is also happening on PS4. It was mentioned on the first page of this thread and also by someone else on reddit a couple days ago. The mention on reddit was from another person who plays MP quite a bit, so they def know what's up with MP gameplay. They said that they've had it happen on PS4, but hardly ever on Xbox. Perhaps there's something in the way tracks are determined that is similar between Switch n PS4, but different in Xbox/pc? For all we know it could be something as silly as having an odd or even number in just the right spot. Whatever the case may be, I'm sure we can get it figured out and help make MP more enjoyable for all players.

Frqnt4ager
03-18-2020, 05:23 PM
Added platinum to the list

Ubi-Raziel
03-21-2020, 02:49 PM
Hello again!

Thank you for keeping this thread up to date :)

I've been in touch with our dev teamand they were able to confirm the following -

- The tracks available are dependant on the current season division of who is the host of the race
- Each division has 25< possible tracks, so you should certainly have more variety

To this day are you still finding yourself limited to around 5 tracks when playing with the same racers?

Frqnt4ager
03-21-2020, 07:33 PM
Thanks for getting back to me with the info. :)

Unfortunately, the tracks are still getting stuck. I, literally, just got done with 2 sessions that were pulling from the "unranked" selection. I've been keeping notes on global ranking and mp division, when doing 1v1, in case that is the culprit (both for when it works correctly n loops). Also, I haven't had a chance to see if anything is going on with diamond division, but I'm starting to think that the "unranked" list applies for unranked, bronze and silver divisions. I'll keep an eye on things and try to see what's up with diamond division tho. Just haven't had a chance to really race against other diamonds yet to see if that division is pulling from limited selection as well ... of course depending on who is in the lobby. The issue has got to be related to more than just the division a person is in. Sometimes everything is fine and then sometimes it's not. Almost 50/50 chance, but it'll stay the same, right or wrong, with the same ppl.

I'd really suggest someone from the team take a day or two and just check out MP on the Switch. It's also where the game crashes the most. There's another bug too that I haven't bothered bringing up, but I guess I will since I just mentioned it. Every once in awhile the player position box will mess up and have 1 or more ppl grayed out, even tho they're still in the session and racing. When this happens the positions are not correctly displayed, because the displayed order of riders becomes frozen for the round, no matter who actually finishes where. I can get a short vid of it if you would like, or even start a new thread for that bug.

Frqnt4ager
04-17-2020, 07:23 AM
This issue is still happening after the latest update.

Frqnt4ager
05-09-2020, 03:41 AM
So I guess this issue is just going to be a thing? It's been over 3 weeks since my last post and it seems like support has basically given up. Honestly, it seems like you guys really don't care about whether or not the game is working correctly.

Ubi-Keo
09-21-2020, 12:33 PM
So I guess this issue is just going to be a thing? It's been over 3 weeks since my last post and it seems like support has basically given up. Honestly, it seems like you guys really don't care about whether or not the game is working correctly.

I do apologise for the late response to your posts.

Due to the high volume of contacts we received in the previous months it took us longer than usual to respond, and as your previous response was from April your post will have been on another page. However as you have replied again it has bumped it to the most recent posts.

Regarding the issues you have mentioned I will pass your feedback on to the Trials Rising team. For the player position issue, could you please provide a video of this.