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XyZspineZyX
10-24-2003, 12:31 PM
I just wanted to ask that does this aircraft have better climb speed than the FW190-series aircrafts? How is this plane diffrent than 190 in acrobatics and in speed?


It would be very nice if Oleg would post info about this plane because they are making it to the addon.


Message Edited on 10/24/0301:42PM by Reozil

XyZspineZyX
10-24-2003, 12:31 PM
I just wanted to ask that does this aircraft have better climb speed than the FW190-series aircrafts? How is this plane diffrent than 190 in acrobatics and in speed?


It would be very nice if Oleg would post info about this plane because they are making it to the addon.


Message Edited on 10/24/0301:42PM by Reozil

XyZspineZyX
10-24-2003, 12:40 PM
to make it short: high alt power-version of the 190

2 things we need in FB:
The 110 and the desert!!!
http://exn.ca/news/images/1999/04/23/19990423-Me110coloursideMAIN.jpg

XyZspineZyX
10-24-2003, 12:41 PM
This one better at all vs 190D, except roll rate and maximal dive speed.


Reozil wrote:
- I just wanted to ask that does this aircraft have
- better climb speed than the FW190-series aircrafts?
- How is this plane diffrent than 190 in acrobatics
- and in speed?
-
-



Oleg Maddox
1C:Maddox Games

XyZspineZyX
10-24-2003, 12:44 PM
Oleg_Maddox wrote:
- This one better at all vs 190D, except roll rate and
- maximal dive speed.
-
-
- Reozil wrote:
-- I just wanted to ask that does this aircraft have
-- better climb speed than the FW190-series aircrafts?
-- How is this plane diffrent than 190 in acrobatics
-- and in speed?
--
--
-
-
-
-
- Oleg Maddox
- 1C:Maddox Games
-
Thanks im really looking forward to see this aircraft in action.. Its nice to see Oleg replying questions like this.

XyZspineZyX
10-24-2003, 03:57 PM
Oleg_Maddox wrote:
- This one better at all vs 190D, except roll rate and
- maximal dive speed.

How much?? Like the As? They can do ~800km/h IAS, while the D-9 can stand 900. Roll rate should be no problem... I expect it to be a third less max. Therefore it gets more lift which grants better climb rate and better turn times (I remember you mentioned 17sec sustained on the deck and 17,6 or so at 1000m, that's really good /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif ). Of course, don't forget that 90rpg MK 108 /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif (+ 2 MG 151/20, up tp 200rpg).

XyZspineZyX
10-24-2003, 04:55 PM
any chance of getting the C version ?

only a few V designated planes (prototypes) were delivered to combat units - and propably only saw minor combat

XyZspineZyX
10-24-2003, 08:22 PM
IIRC Ta 152h-1 is slightly slower than late Fw 190d-9 at deck. It's best at high altitudes with around 750kmh top speed.

When i get home I can post you Fw flugzeugbau docs comparing Ta-152C and H model performances to various other Fw 190 models.

XyZspineZyX
10-24-2003, 08:24 PM
Ta 152C-0 would be faster at low alts tho.

XyZspineZyX
10-24-2003, 08:43 PM
According to the book "Focke-Wulf Fw 190 "Long Nose"
An Illustrated History of the Fw 190 D Series by Dietmar Hermann" the topspeed for the Ta 152H-1 at low altitude was 598km/h. Fast enough I'd say. The D-9 could reach 625-640km/h on the deck, way faster than the D-9 we have in FB.



<center>


http://members.chello.se/unni/rote3.JPG



'When it comes to aircombat, I'd rather be lucky than good any day!'

</center>

XyZspineZyX
10-24-2003, 09:40 PM
An excerpt from this website here:

http://mujweb.atlas.cz/veda/airwar/muzeum/nemecko/fw_190/default.htm

Sorry it‚¬īs in Czech language, but I will translate it for you /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

Jak vzpom√¬*n√° Unteroffizier Julius Berliner: "Prvn√¬* Ta 152 H jsme dostali v Luckau/Alteno, kdyz jsme je p√¬łedt√¬*m museli kr√°tkżm letem p√¬łepravit ze z√°vodu v Chotžbuzi. n√°slednž jsem prov√°džli na tžchto letounech cvi√¬®n√© lety, avsak sou√¬®asnž jsem na Dor√°ch-9 prov√°džli bojov√© akce na vżchodž. Mezi obžma typy letadel existovaly zna√¬®n√© rozd√¬*ly. Dora-9 byla dob√¬łe zkonstruovanżm silnżm strojem, kterż mohl prov√°džt vesker√© opera√¬®n√¬* lety, zat√¬*mco Ta 152 byl zna√¬®nž jemnžjs√¬*, nechal se √¬ł√¬*dit jako kluz√°k. Mžl vżjime√¬®n√© letov√© vlastnosti zvl√°stž ve vžts√¬*ch vżsk√°ch. To bylo pro n√°s nžco √¬ļplnž nov√©ho. Ze zkusebn√¬*ho st√¬łediska v Rechlinu jsme obdrzeli instrukce pro pouz√¬*v√°n√¬* Ta 152. P√¬łikazovaly n√°m nap√¬ł√¬*klad nep√¬łekra√¬®ovat ve st√¬łemhlav√©m letu rychlost 800 km/h, ale uk√°zalo se, ze dokonce ani rychlosti zna√¬®nž p√¬łesahuj√¬*c√¬* 1 000 km/h nebyly pro konstrukci draku nebezpe√¬®n√©. Je t√¬łeba podtrhnout, ze i ve vżsk√°ch kolem 12 000 m byl Ta 152 velmi obratnż. Stoupavost√¬* zna√¬®nž p√¬łevysoval vsechny ostatn√¬* letouny".

An English traslation here:

As Unteroffizier Julius Berliner recalls: ,,We got the first Ta152H in Luckau/Alteno where we had to ferry them by a short fligh from a factory in Cottbuz. Following that we started some test flights on these planes while still flying operationally on Doras in the East. Dora was a very well constructed strong machine, capable of any operational flight while Ta152 was much finer and could be flown as if it was a glider. It had an exceptional flight characteristics, particularly in high altitudes. This was something totally new for us. Test center in Rechlin gave us instructions regarding the use of Ta152. For example we were forbidden to exceed speeds of 800km/h in a dive, but it turned out, that even speeds considerably exceeding 1000km/h vere not dangerous for the construction. It must be also stressed, that even at altitudes of about 12000m the Ta152 was very manoeuverable. Also it‚¬īs climbrate was considerably better than other plane‚¬īs."

So I think the dive speed should be somewhere around 1000km/h for the Ta152...in the least...

That makes me also think if the safe 800km/h limit for Dora and A versions of Fw190 is not too low. These planes are also known to have their specified critical airspeed set to 800 but as we can see, specified critical airspeed does not mean that the plane brakes apart at 820...I would guess any sane designer would set it at least some 100km/h lower than he believes the breakage would actually happen...so something like 950km/h would be nice for Doras and A series too...it would be quite a nice gift as this breaking point is quite a crutial part of tactics with these birds...


Another interesting stuff here at the same page:

Bžhem souboje mohl P-51 prov√°džt velmi ostr√© obraty a ihned zah√°jit palbu ze svżch palubn√¬*ch zbran√¬*. Prvn√¬* obrat a zat√°√¬®ka o 360‚? ve vodorovn√© rovinž trval Ta 152 d√©le nez americk√©mu P-51, ale n√°sleduj√¬*c√¬* zat√°√¬®ky mžly √¬®√¬*m d√°l mens√¬* pr—mžr a pilot—m, kte√¬ł√¬* p√¬łe√¬®kali prvn√¬* √¬ļtok Mustangu, se vzdy da√¬łilo vyman√©vrovat ho bžhem n√°sleduj√¬*c√¬*ch obrat—. V lednu 1945 se to povedlo mnoha mżm koleg—m ze Stabsschwarmu. Prov√°džt tak ostr√© zat√°√¬®ky umoz√¬≤ovala vrtule se sirokżmi listy a motor Junkers Jumo 213 s velkżm vżkonem. M—ze to zn√¬*t nepravdžpodobnž, ale da√¬łilo se mi prov√°džt zat√°√¬®ky se zvratem na z√°da ve vżsce nžkolika metr— nad nas√¬*m mate√¬łskżm letistžm Stendal. To by na letounu Fw 190 bylo √¬ļplnž nemozn√©. P√¬łi cvi√¬®n√©m letu jsem prov√°džl pikov√°n√¬* z vżsky 7 000 m p√¬łi dosazen√¬* rychlosti 1 000 km/h a bezpe√¬®nž jsem vyvedl stroj ve vżsce 600 m a pot√© bez stisknut√¬* plynov√© p√°ky jsem se znovu vznesl do 7 000 m".

Translation here:

"...During a fight a P-51 could perform very sharp turns and immediatelly commence fire. The first horizontal 360‚? turn took longer to Ta152 than to American P-51, but following turns were smaller and smaller in diameter and pilots, who survived the first Mustang attack were always able to outmaneuver it in folowing turns. Many of my colleagues from Stabsschwarm had managed to do this during January of 1945. A propeller with a wide blades and Jumo 213 engine were the key to performing such a sharp turns. It may sound incredible, but I was able to perform turns and Split S manoeuvers in couple metres above our home base in Stendal. That would be impossible in other Fw190 types. While on a training flight I dived from 7000m and after reaching the speed of 1000km/h I safely leveled at 600m and without touching the throttle I soared back to 7000m again."

I am looking forward to seeing this happen in FB /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

XyZspineZyX
10-24-2003, 09:49 PM
sounds great!

http://www.endlager.net/fis/pix/banners/fis_banner_07.gif


She turned me into a newt, but I got better.

XyZspineZyX
10-25-2003, 12:37 AM
sweeet- a pony puncher /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif , cant wait to try this bad *** out now /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

XyZspineZyX
10-25-2003, 05:42 AM
]http://www.jg51.de/JG-51Web/flugzeugfotos/Ta%20152%20JG%20301.jpg (http://www.jg51.de/JG-51Web/flugzeugfotos/Ta%20152%20JG%20301.jpg[/img)

http://town.surfside.fl.us/images/P-51mustang.jpg

XyZspineZyX
10-25-2003, 10:15 AM
CSL_Kocour wrote:
Test center
- in Rechlin gave us instructions regarding the use of
- Ta152. For example we were forbidden to exceed
- speeds of 800km/h in a dive, but it turned out, that
- even speeds considerably exceeding 1000km/h vere not
- dangerous for the construction. It must be also
- stressed, that even at altitudes of about 12000m the
- Ta152 was very manoeuverable. Also it‚¬īs climbrate
- was considerably better than other plane‚¬īs."

Is this from a credible source? I sure hope so!!!!/i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif


A propeller with a wide blades and Jumo 213
- engine were the key to performing such a sharp
- turns. It may sound incredible, but I was able to
- perform turns and Split S manoeuvers in couple
- metres above our home base in Stendal. That would be
- impossible in other Fw190 types. While on a training
- flight I dived from 7000m and after reaching the
- speed of 1000km/h I safely leveled at 600m and
- without touching the throttle I soared back to 7000m
- again."

Sounds almost too good to be true! But if it is, it must be modelled in FB!/i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif



<center>


http://members.chello.se/unni/rote3.JPG



'When it comes to aircombat, I'd rather be lucky than good any day!'

</center>

XyZspineZyX
10-25-2003, 12:59 PM
Sound barrier was limit for 190A and 190D divespeeds. US and german tests confirm this. In tests conducted by Kurt Tank 190A-9 and A-7 were test dived to 955kmh TAS and pulled up with good amount of G without any damage to airframe.

I posted Kurt Tanks dive test here earlier. Maybe someone has scan of US dive test for 190A-5 and can post it here too?

XyZspineZyX
10-25-2003, 09:31 PM
Kurt Tank was attacked by a group of P-51s in the early days of the TA 152. All he had to do was to throttle up and he outclimbed all of the P-51s.

To quote from the book World War 2 Combat Aircraft, "The Ta 152H's outstanding performance was personally tested by the designer himself. In December 1944, while flying between Lagenhagen and Cottbus at the controls of one of the first aircraft, Kurt Tank was intercepted by a pair of P-51 Mustangs. His tactics for escape were extremely simple. Pulling out on the throttle to the full, he literally left the enemy fighters behind, and there was nothing they could do to pursue him."
I think that just about says it all.

Thanks Oleg for modeling this bird.

Will the cockpit view of the TA-152 be similiar to the FW 190 or completely different? I'm not sure if they were similiar in real life or different(this is not a question about the FW 190 view so everybody don't freakout).

I'm looking forward to the add on Oleg, thanks.




Message Edited on 10/25/0308:40PM by IV_JG51_Swine

XyZspineZyX
10-26-2003, 03:00 AM
if you think oleg will make this plane historical.. you are on LSD this plane historical will blast anything from the sky with ease (if the player is worth a damn) if he does make this plane correct, look for it to be the new Hurricane->La7/A9 EVERYBODY will be flying it.. which is a bad thing because I am a FW driver always. theres no way that oleg is going to give germany justice.. ill bet a 100 dollars paypal that the Ta152 when/if it comes out will be undermodeled please anybody,,, please bet me

XyZspineZyX
10-26-2003, 04:16 AM
- Thanks Oleg for modeling this bird.
-
- Will the cockpit view of the TA-152 be similiar to
- the FW 190 or completely different? I'm not sure if
- they were similiar in real life or different(this is
- not a question about the FW 190 view so everybody
- don't freakout).
-
- I'm looking forward to the add on Oleg, thanks.


Looks pretty similar to me:

http://www.il2sturmovik-fr.com/the_game/screenshots/Ta-152H-1_01.jpg



--AKD

http://www.flyingpug.com/pugline2.jpg

XyZspineZyX
10-26-2003, 09:53 AM
http://www.saunalahti.fi/meheko/translated-fwchart.jpg

XyZspineZyX
10-26-2003, 10:58 AM
Looking at the date on the chart posted above, it must be mentioned that later war Fw 190D's and Ta 152's had even higher topspeeds because all gaps in the engine cowling was filled with rubber, increasing topspeed by 17km/h. If these refinements weren't done in the assembly lines they were made in the field.

A speedchart from 03/01/45, shows new topspeeds.

Here are some of the low alt speeds with the sealed cowling joints..

Fw 190D-9....622km/h
Fw 190D-12...604km/h
Fw 190D-12...613km/h(with Jumo 213EB)
Ta 152H-1....598km/h
Ta 152H-1....603km/h(with Jumo 213EB)

<center>


http://members.chello.se/unni/rote3.JPG



'When it comes to aircombat, I'd rather be lucky than good any day!'

</center>

XyZspineZyX
10-26-2003, 02:54 PM
robban75 wrote:
- Looking at the date on the chart posted above, it
- must be mentioned that later war Fw 190D's and Ta
- 152's had even higher topspeeds because all gaps in
- the engine cowling was filled with rubber,
- increasing topspeed by 17km/h. If these refinements
- weren't done in the assembly lines they were made in
- the field.
-
- A speedchart from 03/01/45, shows new topspeeds.
-
- Here are some of the low alt speeds with the sealed
- cowling joints..
-
- Fw 190D-9....622km/h
- Fw 190D-12...604km/h
- Fw 190D-12...613km/h(with Jumo 213EB)
- Ta 152H-1....598km/h
- Ta 152H-1....603km/h(with Jumo 213EB)
-



Well, I guess we'll never have such speed down low, since we would outrun both La-7 and Yak-9U.

This can't be true in the VVS world of FB :lol:

XyZspineZyX
10-26-2003, 05:20 PM
robban75 wrote:
-- Looking at the date on the chart posted above, it
-- must be mentioned that later war Fw 190D's and Ta
-- 152's had even higher topspeeds because all gaps in
-- the engine cowling was filled with rubber,
-- increasing topspeed by 17km/h. If these refinements
-- weren't done in the assembly lines they were made in
-- the field.
--
-- A speedchart from 03/01/45, shows new topspeeds.
--
-- Here are some of the low alt speeds with the sealed
-- cowling joints..
--
-- Fw 190D-9....622km/h
-- Fw 190D-12...604km/h
-- Fw 190D-12...613km/h(with Jumo 213EB)
-- Ta 152H-1....598km/h
-- Ta 152H-1....603km/h(with Jumo 213EB)


And here are speeds at best altitude...

http://www.saunalahti.fi/meheko/Finalproductionspeed.jpg






Message Edited on 10/26/0304:27PM by ladoga

XyZspineZyX
10-26-2003, 06:51 PM
What is a definition of a Top Speed? How long can such a speed be maintained? I think this has to be sorted first.

Once you have a proof that for example Ta152H1 was able to maintain a speed of 600km/h TAS at Sea Level (0-500m) for 30 minutes with such and such radiator settings, there is no way around it...

And Ladoga, please, can you repost the Kurt Tank‚¬īs dive tests here? Or send them to my e-mail? I PMd you. Thank you.

XyZspineZyX
10-26-2003, 10:35 PM
After sealing the cowling joints the Ta 152H-1 could (using MW50) reach a topspeed of 749km/h at 9500m, and with GM-1(G√¬∂ring mixture) 760km/h at 12500m.

Source, Focke-Wulfe Ta 152: The Story of the Luftwaffe's Late-War, High-Altitude Fighter
by Dietmar Harmann.

<center>


http://members.chello.se/unni/rote3.JPG



'When it comes to aircombat, I'd rather be lucky than good any day!'

</center>

XyZspineZyX
10-26-2003, 10:48 PM
CSL_Kocour wrote:
- What is a definition of a Top Speed? How long can
- such a speed be maintained? I think this has to be
- sorted first.

Topspeeds on German fighters are normaly using maximum boost. MW50 and GM-1 were the primary boosting choices. On the early D-9's before MW50 was avaliable, an equipment set could be installed(Rustsatz) that could raise the boost pressure. This increased engine output by 150H.P. The same boosting was done on the Ta 152H-0's. All these boost systems make it kind of hard to establish exact topspeeds. But comparing the dates on speedcharts helps alot.

- Once you have a proof that for example Ta152H1 was
- able to maintain a speed of 600km/h TAS at Sea Level
- (0-500m) for 30 minutes with such and such radiator
- settings, there is no way around it...


Although there were enough MW50 to last over 30 minutes, it could only be used in 10 minute intervals. The engine then had to cool down for about 2 minutes until boost could be applied again. But it doesn't take 30 minutes to reach the topspeed at sealevel, giving plenty of time to escape, as your persuer will probably overheat aswell! /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif



<center>


http://members.chello.se/unni/rote3.JPG



'When it comes to aircombat, I'd rather be lucky than good any day!'

</center>

XyZspineZyX
10-26-2003, 11:06 PM
By the way, how good a climber was the Ta 152H? According to the pilots that flew it, it climbed better than the Fw 190D-9. And the D-9 could climb at 22.5m/sec!

The Ta 152H was a new shape in the sky and III/JG 301 were on one occasion attacked by a group of Bf 109's. No losses were incured as the superior climbing and agility of the Ta 152 H allowed them to evade all of the "attackers". Now the 109 was a startling climber, in which leagu can we put the Ta 152?

<center>


http://members.chello.se/unni/rote3.JPG



'When it comes to aircombat, I'd rather be lucky than good any day!'

</center>

XyZspineZyX
10-27-2003, 08:21 AM
For example we were forbidden to exceed speeds of 800km/h in a dive, but it turned out, that even speeds considerably exceeding 1000km/h vere not dangerous for the construction.

Thats just why i like german built machines they always can do better than the factory says!

XyZspineZyX
10-27-2003, 08:30 AM
gwalker99 wrote:
- why you getting your hopes up? you really think oleg
- is going to make the plane REALLY what it was? I
- bet you 100 US dollars --can pay via paypal--- that
- the plane is undermodeled when it comes out.. wanna
- bet ? heheh
-
-
it is propably is going to be undemodelled, but at least we know the truth!!

XyZspineZyX
10-27-2003, 03:12 PM
maybe I am wrong but it seems at least that the whole Target reticule is above the BAR but maybe I am too much an optimist...



Visit:
www.hell-hounds.de (http://www.hell-hounds.de)

----------------------------------------
Disclaimer:
No forward view was obscured during the creation of this post...
----------------------------------------

XyZspineZyX
10-27-2003, 09:13 PM
CSL_Kocour wrote:
- And Ladoga, please, can you repost the Kurt Tank‚¬īs
- dive tests here? Or send them to my e-mail? I PMd
- you. Thank you.

Here's only caption that i have handy (Kurt Tank-Focke Wulf's Designer and Test Pilot, Wolfgang Wagner, ISBN 0-7643-0644-8)
http://www.saunalahti.fi/meheko/190dive.jpg


I've seen scan of US dive test of 190A-5. MB someone has it or knows some link to it?

ZG77_Nagual
10-27-2003, 09:32 PM
Oleg - awhile back said Gunsight issue was corrected in ta152H

http://pws.chartermi.net/~cmorey/pics/whiner.jpg


Message Edited on 10/27/0304:10PM by ZG77_Nagual

XyZspineZyX
10-27-2003, 09:34 PM
ZG77_Nagual wrote:
- Gunsight issue was corrected in ta152H
-

Care to explain how, please.

http://www.thundercycle.com/photos/dropdead2.gif



"Only a dead 'chamber pot' is a good 'chamber pot'!"

XyZspineZyX
10-28-2003, 09:02 AM
The Ta-152 used a slightly different gunsight than that used on the 190 line, while allowed the sight to pe placed higher in the cockpit and closer to the armoured glass.

Basically, it didn't have that shade sticking way out in front of it, so they could almost butt it up against the windscreen.

Harry Voyager

http://groups.msn.com/_Secure/0YQDLAswcqmIpvWP9dLzZVayPXOmo6IJ16aURujNfs4dDETH84 Q6eIkCbWQemjqF6O8ZfvzlsvUUauJyy9GYnKM6!o3fu!kBnWVh BgMt3q2T3BUQ8yjBBqECLxFaqXVV5U2kWiSIlq1s6VoaVvRqBy Q/Avatar%202%20500x500%20[final).jpg?dc=4675409848259594077

XyZspineZyX
10-28-2003, 01:31 PM
Ah Harry, I though I would be told that the famous Fw "bar" is no longer there./i/smilies/16x16_smiley-sad.gif /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-sad.gif

I fail to see how the lack of the sunshade will improve the view, though.



http://www.thundercycle.com/photos/dropdead2.gif



"Only a dead 'chamber pot' is a good 'chamber pot'!"

XyZspineZyX
10-28-2003, 02:24 PM
johann_thor wrote:
- any chance of getting the C version ?
-
- only a few V designated planes (prototypes) were
- delivered to combat units - and propably only saw
- minor combat
-
-

They saw combat with JG301,as previously said, but in limited numbers. The problem is that the 152 can easily be confound with a Dora, exeption made of his wings. Ifan allied pilot encoutered a 152, he surely took it for a Dora.

There's a very good book on the 152, edited by Schiffer Military Books. I'll give you later the combat reports from the JG301. I remembered a pilot with 12 victories on his 152. But I need to confirm.



http://www.lesskinsajosse.france-simulation.com/vrac/ambiorixwarlordimi.gif


"Laissez les √ľber-planes √ la VVS! La Luftwaffe, elle, √ les √ľber-pilots!"


Mon site web: http://users.skynet.be/warlordimi/

XyZspineZyX
10-28-2003, 05:58 PM
MiloMorai wrote:
- Ah Harry, I though I would be told that the famous
- Fw "bar" is no longer there.<img
-- I fail to see how the lack of the sunshade will
- improve the view, though.

- "Only a dead 'chamber pot' is a good 'chamber pot'!"


hi,
this is also a point of creative future design...and the willing of a fix in running game...

anyway: we will see...

remember:
1)a correct design of a windscreen scope or mounting without glass is one fact...

2)a correct pilots and gunsight view through a armored thick proof glass (most important in pc combatsims) another fact ..and a long story of misunderstanding by many designers...

state of the art in combatsims..at Maddox in near future/..?
is also a question in advanced modelling pilots view 'near to real things' if possible at pc displays.......

designers have to look more to restorations of warbirds..and pilots cockpit views in real...



...just follow my wingman...
http://www.ss.iij4u.or.jp/~jime/images/Me109G6Anim/messer04LAN2.wmv
http://www.roedelmodell.de/original/Me109/me109-4s.jpg

XyZspineZyX
10-29-2003, 11:52 AM
so to sum it up we will receive a TA-152 with a higher revi and will still stick with the crap Cockpits for the Fw190s right ?

http://www.hell-hounds.de/sigs/gotcha.jpg


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Disclaimer:
No forward view was obscured during the creation of this post...
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XyZspineZyX
10-30-2003, 12:05 PM
JaBo_HH--Gotcha wrote:
- so to sum it up we will receive a TA-152 with a
- higher revi and will still stick with the crap
- Cockpits for the Fw190s right ?
-


Yes /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-sad.gif

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XyZspineZyX
10-30-2003, 12:47 PM
Excuse but wasn't it the case that in the original "YOU ALL IS WRONG"-thread this same oleg stated that he based the cockpit on the TA-152 because the cockpit was all the same and now he changes one without changing the other ?

interesting...

http://www.hell-hounds.de/sigs/gotcha.jpg

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Disclaimer:
No forward view was obscured during the creation of this post...
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XyZspineZyX
10-31-2003, 01:00 PM
So we will see this aircraft in addon wich is going to cost money, but how much?

XyZspineZyX
11-01-2003, 11:17 AM
Sounds like a fun plane... Will it have a constant speed propeller?

XyZspineZyX
11-01-2003, 11:47 AM
JaBo_HH--Gotcha wrote:
- so to sum it up we will receive a TA-152 with a
- higher revi and will still stick with the crap
- Cockpits for the Fw190s right ?
-
http://www.hell-hounds.de/sigs/gotcha.jpg

Quote of a Quote:

"crap Cockpits for the Fw190s right ?"

Yep, I bet that just the sort of comment that really makes OM p***ed at guys like you /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-sad.gif

You are obviously so blinded by that frickin' bar that you fail to appreciate what else is there.

"As weaponry, both were good, but in far different ways from each other. In a nutshell, I describe it this way: if the FW 190 was a sabre, the 109 was a florett, or foil, like that used in the precision art of fencing." - Gunther Rall

XyZspineZyX
11-01-2003, 01:28 PM
- "crap Cockpits for the Fw190s right ?"
-
- Yep, I bet that just the sort of comment that really
- makes OM p***ed at guys like you /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-sad.gif

LOl boy ! it's my opinion ! You want to say I have keep quiet because the GODFATHER wont talk ?
Seriously. I had a good discussion in another Thread with oleg and he was even doing ironic jokes. So what ?
I guess he's mature enough to see when somebody is doing that too.
You'Re happy with the sim. So be it. I like it but I would love it if....

ok ?

BUt don't do flaming here now. If you want to settle this send it via UBI !
Happy hunting ... http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

http://www.hell-hounds.de/sigs/gotcha.jpg

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Disclaimer:
No forward view was obscured during the creation of this post...
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XyZspineZyX
11-01-2003, 01:34 PM
well I'm delighted with the current D9 and feel this "bar thing" was blown out of all proportion,leaving only a negative result..so I expect I'll be delighted with the Ta's



<img src=http://www.luftwaffepics.com/LCBW/FW190-D9-29_small.jpg>
"yeah whatever"

XyZspineZyX
11-01-2003, 04:14 PM
Just came back from playing The History Channel Battle of Britain.. I love the W√ľrger there.. perfect forward view. .) I have a dream.. And the dream is to someday fly with perfect W√ľrger in FB..

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XyZspineZyX
11-01-2003, 11:14 PM
The pilots that flew the Ta 152H had no doubt about it being the best piston engine fighter to grace the skies during the second world war. It's performance and manouverability put every other fighter in Luftwaffe service to shame. Many pilots prefered it to the Me 262, sure it was 100km/h slower but its awesome climb and acceleration more than made up for this.

Some nice model photos./i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

http://www.pmcn.de/Ta152.1.jpg


http://www.pmcn.de/Ta152.2.jpg




<center>


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'When it comes to aircombat, I'd rather be lucky than good any day!'

</center>

XyZspineZyX
11-03-2003, 08:14 AM
Thanks for the cool photos!

XyZspineZyX
11-03-2003, 08:16 AM
So did the germans use lesser octane fuel? and how much there were octannes in Russian/American/German fuel.

XyZspineZyX
11-03-2003, 02:09 PM
I believe the Germans used 87 octane fuel, but I'm not sure. The Americans and British used 100 octane.

<center>


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'When it comes to aircombat, I'd rather be lucky than good any day!'

</center>

XyZspineZyX
11-03-2003, 02:31 PM
robban75 wrote:
- I believe the Germans used 87 octane fuel, but I'm
- not sure. The Americans and British used 100 octane.
-
-

German 87 was not equivelent American 87. It was of higher PN than that. Sorry can't give the equivelent PN.


http://www.thundercycle.com/photos/dropdead2.gif



"Only a dead 'chamber pot' is a good 'chamber pot'!"

XyZspineZyX
11-03-2003, 02:36 PM
The Jumo 213E of the Ta-152 H-1 used 87 Octane.

"As weaponry, both were good, but in far different ways from each other. In a nutshell, I describe it this way: if the FW 190 was a sabre, the 109 was a florett, or foil, like that used in the precision art of fencing." - Gunther Rall

XyZspineZyX
11-04-2003, 04:18 PM
So basicly germans used worse gasoline.


NegativeGee wrote:
- The Jumo 213E of the Ta-152 H-1 used 87 Octane.
-
- "As weaponry, both were good, but in far different
- ways from each other. In a nutshell, I describe it
- this way: if the FW 190 was a sabre, the 109 was a
- florett, or foil, like that used in the precision
- art of fencing." - Gunther Rall

XyZspineZyX
11-04-2003, 05:00 PM
Reozil wrote:
- So basicly germans used worse gasoline.

Ermmm..... you got it in one /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-tongue.gif

On a more serious note, some of their aero-engines used higher octane fuel (DB601N on the Bf-109 F-1/2 used 96 or 100 octane, cannot remember which) but as the war wore 87 seemed to be the standard.

"As weaponry, both were good, but in far different ways from each other. In a nutshell, I describe it this way: if the FW 190 was a sabre, the 109 was a florett, or foil, like that used in the precision art of fencing." - Gunther Rall

XyZspineZyX
11-04-2003, 05:12 PM
NegativeGee wrote:
- Reozil wrote:
-- So basicly germans used worse gasoline.
-
- Ermmm..... you got it in one


You 2 don't read very well./i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif Because of the composition of German gasoline, C3 and B4 fuel was equivelant, or almost so, to the corresponding American PN rating.



http://www.thundercycle.com/photos/dropdead2.gif



"Only a dead 'chamber pot' is a good 'chamber pot'!"

XyZspineZyX
11-05-2003, 03:37 PM
MiloMorai wrote:
-
- NegativeGee wrote:
-- Reozil wrote:
--- So basicly germans used worse gasoline.
--
-- Ermmm..... you got it in one
-
-
- You 2 don't read very well./i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif Because of the composition of
- German gasoline, C3 and B4 fuel was equivelant, or
- almost so, to the corresponding American PN rating.
-
-
-
-
<img
- src="http://www.thundercycle.com/photos/dropdead2.
- gif">
-
-
-
- "Only a dead 'chamber pot' is a good 'chamber pot'!"
May i ask what is your source where you got this info?
if it is a website please but URL in this thread so i can see for myself.

XyZspineZyX
11-05-2003, 05:18 PM
Reozil wrote:
-
- MiloMorai wrote:
--
-- NegativeGee wrote:
--- Reozil wrote:
---- So basicly germans used worse gasoline.
---
--- Ermmm..... you got it in one
--
--
-- You 2 don't read very well./i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif Because of the composition of
-- German gasoline, C3 and B4 fuel was equivelant, or
-- almost so, to the corresponding American PN rating.
--
--
--
--
- <img
-- src="http://www.thundercycle.com/photos/dropdead2.
-- gif">
--
--
--
-- "Only a dead 'chamber pot' is a good 'chamber pot'!"
- May i ask what is your source where you got this
- info?
- if it is a website please but URL in this thread so
- i can see for myself.
-

Milo is right here. In terms of Octane rating the C3 and B4 fuels do compare to US types. Off course, Octane is only a rating of spontaneous ignition under pressure.


But not 100% right. As the war progressed, the quality of the raw material Luftwaffe aviation fuel was made from (ie. crude oil, Hydrogenation materials- coals) declined, with a subsequent decrease in fuel quality. If you see late war photos of Luftwaffe aircraft, you can sometimes see the extremely heavy exhaust staining such fuel caused.

"You 2 don't read very well"

Oh and of course, being right is no reason to be rude /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

"As weaponry, both were good, but in far different ways from each other. In a nutshell, I describe it this way: if the FW 190 was a sabre, the 109 was a florett, or foil, like that used in the precision art of fencing." - Gunther Rall

Message Edited on 11/05/0311:04PM by NegativeGee

XyZspineZyX
11-05-2003, 09:21 PM
Another thing to point out is that in many cases American pilots said of Doras to be 109s. Generally the American airmen were not known for good enemy aircraft recognition. Some would say even friendly aircraft <G>

Glasses-"I may have four eyes but you only have one wing"

"Kurt Tank is your daddy"

XyZspineZyX
11-06-2003, 04:10 PM
robban75 wrote:
- The pilots that flew the Ta 152H had no doubt about
- it being the best piston engine fighter to grace the
- skies during the second world war. It's performance
- and manouverability put every other fighter in
- Luftwaffe service to shame. Many pilots prefered it
- to the Me 262, sure it was 100km/h slower but its
- awesome climb and acceleration more than made up for
- this.
-
So was it better climber than bf109K4 or Bf109G14 or YAK 3?

XyZspineZyX
11-06-2003, 10:46 PM
Reozil wrote:
- So was it better climber than bf109K4 or Bf109G14 or
- YAK 3?

I don't think it was a better climber than the K-4, not at the lower altitudes anyways. It was up high that the Ta 152H really shined. Loaded weight for the Ta 152H-0 was 4750kg, and it had an initial climbrate of 20m/sec. Thanks to the excellent high alt performance of the Jumo 213E, the climbrate remained high even at altitudes exceeding 10000m.

<center>


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'When it comes to aircombat, I'd rather be lucky than good any day!'

</center>

XyZspineZyX
11-06-2003, 11:05 PM
I happen to like the K4 alot, and hope the new patch makes it easier to fight with lol...

but i cant wait for the 152, i just wanna fly up high and wait to see has the nads to visit