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MessirePhilippe
06-16-2019, 10:16 PM
Hi everyone, it is possible to make the zone attack ,the charged punch and the kick of the Incredibilis boii a feint ? I think is a good add for fight with it , thank you for reading ,have a nice day/night ^^

Fallfuturer
06-17-2019, 12:21 AM
i agree

Siegfried-Z
06-17-2019, 12:45 AM
-Ability to feint his zone is needed, but it has to come with a dmg nerf.

-About the charged punch feintable, i dont know. It has to be done very very well if we dont want Cent just become another Warden but with higher punish... 1st then his punch stun and stam drain should be highly nerf and the charge punch should not knock down anymore but guarantee a 25dmg heavy. Then why not.

-Imo the kick is fine as he is. Not the best opener but you can avoid to be punish by your opponent even if he Dodge it by readind it and choose to chain with the heavy that you feint or not.

Cent need to be able to feint his UB too, with of course the remooval of the knock down.

Wen cant allow Cent to feint his bash and UB without nerfing him on his Stun, stam drain and punish dmg.

He needs his chains, versability and mix up to be improved overall but then imo he should only be able to knock down with his charged heavy. Not anymore on his UB and on wallsplat.

Jazz117Volkov
06-17-2019, 01:59 AM
Zone feint would be useful.

His punch needs to be 500 ms to be useful, at 700 it's a dead move. I also think his knockdown should be axed altogether. Make his charged punch do 20 dmg and stun. That would make his pin combo 50 damage (instead of 65) and twice as fast. Let him do the unblockable off a charged punch, so your mix-up would be on a stunned opponent...could be useful.

Let his kick wallsplat again and make it guaranteed off a throw. That would make his max haymaker punish about 90 dmg, instead of 130.

FlyinBeef
06-17-2019, 07:24 AM
-About the charged punch feintable, i dont know. It has to be done very very well if we dont want Cent just become another Warden but with higher punish... 1st then his punch stun and stam drain should be highly nerf and the charge punch should not knock down anymore but guarantee a 25dmg heavy. Then why not.
We already have Hitokiri with same playstyle when you charge and cancel moves and she as heavy hero with good defence has 30dmg. Of course we need to reduce stamina drain, but damage is fine, it is 35dmg when Warden have 40, it will be still punishable for gb if you read correctly. Also we can delete his big uninterraptable gank (Ubi will do that, because they want to see ganks like with HL) like with Raider, LB and Shugoki, it will be cool for Centurion too, because he won't take himself under control for 2-3 heavies in team fight and anti-gank, just for one.

-Imo the kick is fine as he is. Not the best opener but you can avoid to be punish by your opponent even if he Dodge it by readind it and choose to chain with the heavy that you feint or not.
The kick is bad, yeah you can use it against no dodge-attacks heroes, but what to do with others? And why you need a kick, when you have 600ms chargable heavies with soft-feint to gb which is much cooler thing to start chains? Making kick 500ms? No, bad idea. I think we need to delete the kick from neutral and make it guaranteed after knee and throw, also return wallstun, it will be like cool thing if wall isn't close to you. To start chains we can give Cent unblockable heavy from neutral, or give him nothing, because 600ms chargable heavies with soft-feint to gb are already good to start chains and much better than many openers.

Siegfried-Z
06-17-2019, 09:50 AM
We already have Hitokiri with same playstyle when you charge and cancel moves and she as heavy hero with good defence has 30dmg. Of course we need to reduce stamina drain, but damage is fine, it is 35dmg when Warden have 40, it will be still punishable for gb if you read correctly. Also we can delete his big uninterraptable gank (Ubi will do that, because they want to see ganks like with HL) like with Raider, LB and Shugoki, it will be cool for Centurion too, because he won't take himself under control for 2-3 heavies in team fight and anti-gank, just for one.

The kick is bad, yeah you can use it against no dodge-attacks heroes, but what to do with others? And why you need a kick, when you have 600ms chargable heavies with soft-feint to gb which is much cooler thing to start chains? Making kick 500ms? No, bad idea. I think we need to delete the kick from neutral and make it guaranteed after knee and throw, also return wallstun, it will be like cool thing if wall isn't close to you. To start chains we can give Cent unblockable heavy from neutral, or give him nothing, because 600ms chargable heavies with soft-feint to gb are already good to start chains and much better than many openers.

Again not all heroes have to be the same.
If we follow this logic then we better settle the same dmg numbers for all heroes..

35dmg would be far too much dmg for a moove that knock you down with stun, stam drain and allow external hit on a 4v4 perspective (even if it became interruptible).

Either the dmg should be reduced by 25 or then it should not knock down.

The kick just work Times to Times. As i said thats for sure not the best opener. But is it a reason to remoove it ? Dont think so.
The idea to give him back the kick after a throw is Nice but as it is something Ubi decided to remoove i am not sure we gonna see this happen.

FlyinBeef
06-17-2019, 12:49 PM
Again not all heroes have to be the same.
If we follow this logic then we better settle the same dmg numbers for all heroes..

35dmg would be far too much dmg for a moove that knock you down with stun, stam drain and allow external hit on a 4v4 perspective (even if it became interruptible).

Either the dmg should be reduced by 25 or then it should not knock down.

The kick just work Times to Times. As i said thats for sure not the best opener. But is it a reason to remoove it ? Dont think so.
The idea to give him back the kick after a throw is Nice but as it is something Ubi decided to remoove i am not sure we gonna see this happen.
I know that not all heroes have to be the same, but with 25dmg it will be just weak offence, it will be mindgame most likely not in your favor, undue risk. Cent must have strong offensive tools, just look in the tier list, we have criterias like offence, safety, defence, punishes and health, it is main things that make characters strong/weak, Cent can't has strong defence (damn, he even have no dodge-attacks), really big punishes or big health pool, so to make him strong we can only give him very strong and relativly safety offence. I want him at least A-Tier, I want him be equal to BP, and can compete with Zerk/Warden. He must be strong in 1v1, even be S-Tier it will be fair, because he will never be meta pick in 4v4.

It won't be uninterruptable stun, it will be 35dmg from Centurion and one heavy from ally, then opponent will have 80-90% dmg resist or gank just interrupts, in both situations opponent can activate revenge. And I said that we can reduce stamina drain to not absurd numbers. It will be simple gank like Raider, HL, Warden or Hitokiri, almost same damage and just little big bigger stamina drain, is HL's grab far too much in 4v4? I don't think it is, so why Centurion's will be? Also, he have no dodge-attacks, no range and bad hitboxes on most attacks, he can't be a good teamfighter by definition, he can't be a midder, he can't be very good anti-ganker, his the only and main role will be gank so it must be strong and easy acceptable.

Kick works times to times? What? It is completly, c-o-m-p-l-e-t-e-l-y reactable, even on console (as I know you play on console), people miss it never, n-e-v-e-r, never. never, never, nobody be baited to gb, it is impossible to miss it. It isn't "not the best opener", it isn't opener at all. If we keep it it will be rudiment, completly useless part of moveset. We can make it faster, but I don't think you and other people want another neutral 500ms bash in this game so the best idea is to remove it, leave it only after throw/knee.
He already have kick after throw, but it doesn't stun and it can be dodged (as I know after throw it was dodgable always). I just want to make it like with Shaman's throw and headbutt.

Siegfried-Z
06-17-2019, 01:03 PM
I know that not all heroes have to be the same, but with 25dmg it will be just weak offence, it will be mindgame most likely not in your favor, undue risk. Cent must have strong offensive tools, just look in the tier list, we have criterias like offence, safety, defence, punishes and health, it is main things that make characters strong/weak, Cent can't has strong defence (damn, he even have no dodge-attacks), really big punishes or big health pool, so to make him strong we can only give him very strong and relativly safety offence. I want him at least A-Tier, I want him be equal to BP, and can compete with Zerk/Warden. He must be strong in 1v1, even be S-Tier it will be fair, because he will never be meta pick in 4v4.

It won't be uninterruptable stun, it will be 35dmg from Centurion and one heavy from ally, then opponent will have 80-90% dmg resist or gank just interrupts, in both situations opponent can activate revenge. And I said that we can reduce stamina drain to not absurd numbers. It will be simple gank like Raider, HL, Warden or Hitokiri, almost same damage and just little big bigger stamina drain, is it far too much in 4v4? I don't think it is, especialy for Centurion. He have no dodge-attacks, no range and bad hitboxes on most attacks, he can't be a good teamfighter by definition, he can't be a midder, he can't be very good anti-ganker, his the only and main role will be gank so it must be strong and easy acceptable.

Kick works times to times? What? It is completly, c-o-m-p-l-e-t-e-l-y reactable, even on console (as I know you play on console), people miss it never, n-e-v-e-r, never. never, never, nobody be baited to gb, it is impossible to miss it. It isn't "not the best opener", it isn't opener at all. If we keep it it will be rudiment, completly useless part of moveset. We can make it faster, but I don't think you and other people want another neutral 500ms bash in this game so the best idea is to remove it, leave it only after throw/knee.
He already have kick after throw, but it doesn't stun and it can be dodged (as I know after throw it was dodgable always). I just want to make it like with Shaman's throw and headbutt.

I am not a fan of this proposal. Because with that Cent would remain the same but slighly better. As you said only a good ganker thanks to big punish.

i would prefer Ubi to makes him a more versatile heroe overall not only arround one feintable bash which remoove half of the opponent life when it works in 4v4.

About the kick, thanks to be "very clear" in your way to word it lol .. but as i said, it works time to time. It is not a strong moove, but every Cent players are still able to get some few dmg with it in every game they do.

It's been a while i didn't play him but i have 9 reps with him and it never happen to me to do a whole 4v4 game without performing the kick at least a few times while i mostly play against opponents between Plat and Master level. I only speak for 4v4 as i Don't play duel at all.
So, no, Cent kick from neutral doesn't deserve to be remooved in my opinion.

FlyinBeef
06-17-2019, 01:17 PM
I am not a fan of this proposal. Because with that Cent would remain the same but slighly better. As you said only a good ganker thanks to big punish.
i would prefer Ubi to makes him a more versatile heroe overall not only arround one feintable bash which remoove half of the opponent life when it works in 4v4.
I just say he need it, I don't say it is the only thing he need and then he will be ok. He need a lot of improvments, maybe additional 5-10hp, better zone, feintable fast unblockables, Warden-like chasing tools, lower recoveries and many many other things AND he need chargable punch, he need strong gank tool, because it is his main role, I just say it is good idea and we can give it to Cent.


About the kick, thanks to be "very clear" in your way to word it lol .. but as i said, it works time to time. It is not a strong moove, but every Cent players are still able to get some few dmg with it in every game they do.

It's been a while i didn't play him but i have 9 reps with him and it never happen to me to do a whole 4v4 game without performing the kick at least a few times while i mostly play against opponents between Plat and Master level. I only speak for 4v4 as i Don't play duel at all.
So, no, Cent kick from neutral doesn't deserve to be remooved in my opinion.
Maybe in 4v4 it works (but even in 4v4 good players, at least on PC, dodge it perfectly even when they don't look) if you hit from the behind or with dodge+target swap in teamfight. Maybe we can keep it, but it need changes, I mind make another 500ms bash, so the only way we can keep it is make it chargable, it is of course subjective, but I don't really like such idea, I would like that Cent have fast unblockable from neutral instead of it.

Siegfried-Z
06-17-2019, 04:00 PM
Well i know you just want to improve offense, we all do.
But, no offense but most of your proposals, ideas include the following :
-huge dmg or punish
-pretty fast mooves (400ms)
-guessing game mix up

I talk about many others of your ideas on others thread. This is always "too much".

Fast feintable neutral UB, low recovery, warden chasing tool etc ..

We can just agree to disagree and everyone can have his own opinion but in mine, your version of the game would be too close to a Tekken or MK bis with only S+ tier heroes = a smashing buttons game.

And i really dont want that for FH.

UbiInsulin
06-17-2019, 06:35 PM
Thanks very much for the detailed discussion on OP's suggestions, everyone. I'll be monitoring this thread.

FlyinBeef
06-17-2019, 06:39 PM
Well i know you just want to improve offense, we all do.
But, no offense but most of your proposals, ideas include the following :
-huge dmg or punish
-pretty fast mooves (400ms)
-guessing game mix up

I talk about many others of your ideas on others thread. This is always "too much".

Fast feintable neutral UB, low recovery, warden chasing tool etc ..

We can just agree to disagree and everyone can have his own opinion but in mine, your version of the game would be too close to a Tekken or MK bis with only S+ tier heroes = a smashing buttons game.

And i really dont want that for FH.

You do want to improve offence, right? But you don't like fast moves (400ms) and guessing game mix-ups? Please, tell me another type of offence in this game. Offence which work it is only feintable unblockables or unreactable attacks, that is all, you can't make strong offence without that. Huge damage of punish? And what you want to improve in heroes when you don't like fast attacks, don't like unblockables, don't like punishes, how to make heroes strong without that?

Fast feintable neutral UB - of course I mean not 500ms neutral UB, fast compared with Hito and Shugo, it can be 900-1000ms 30-35dmg unblockable, BP's stance unblockable or Raider's neutral zone "too much"?
Low recovery - in your opinion it is ok when somebody can gb Centurion for second heavy?
Warden chasing tool - I said Wardenlike, not exactly 500ms with such range, just really good chasing ability, maybe 600ms, for you idk, but for me it is stupid, when you can't catch f***ing HL or Shugoki for Centurion even if you jump from one foot distance.

I don't want every hero be S-Tier, but it is better to make strong hero and nerf him to A-Tier for example (like with Raider and BP) if it is too strong than make garbage and wait years remaining second rework. I saw how it happen, with Kensei, with Orochi, with PK, with Valk, with Tiandi and even Monk, with Shugoki, they are garbage now, they are B/C-Tier in all gamemodes, outclassed but Zerkers, BPs, Raiders, JJs and LBs and I don't want such situation for my roman boi. I want him strong, I want him equal to other strong heroes in all gamemodes, I don't want that he will be trash after few seasons, moreover on release. I am sorry that my opinion does not coincide with the opinion of the majority of players, I am sorry that I want to give people the opportunity not to feel deprived and give them the opportunity to play on their favorite character, without looking on the more powerful hero with more interesting and working moveset. It is just stupid "I don't want Tekken", BUT THIS GAME IS ALREADY TEKKEN! We have 10 S/A-Tier heroes in every gamemode, why do you ignore them? Why do you try to make heroes worse then them? What it will change? We can just let people play on character they want. If you won't make Centurion strong, people will play BP or Zerk, people will always find strong hero and play on him, your attempts to make bad rework won't change number of players who play on strong heroes.

MessirePhilippe
06-17-2019, 06:54 PM
Thanks very much for the detailed discussion on OP's suggestions, everyone. I'll be monitoring this thread.

Thank you! I hope the devs can do something good and balanced if possible fast for the CentBoii ^^

EvoX.
06-17-2019, 07:10 PM
Lmao, imagine thinking Legion's Kick is fine as it is...

Siegfried-Z
06-17-2019, 07:53 PM
You do want to improve offence, right? But you don't like fast moves (400ms) and guessing game mix-ups? Please, tell me another type of offence in this game. Offence which work it is only feintable unblockables or unreactable attacks, that is all, you can't make strong offence without that. Huge damage of punish? And what you want to improve in heroes when you don't like fast attacks, don't like unblockables, don't like punishes, how to make heroes strong without that?

Fast feintable neutral UB - of course I mean not 500ms neutral UB, fast compared with Hito and Shugo, it can be 900-1000ms 30-35dmg unblockable, BP's stance unblockable or Raider's neutral zone "too much"?
Low recovery - in your opinion it is ok when somebody can gb Centurion for second heavy?
Warden chasing tool - I said Wardenlike, not exactly 500ms with such range, just really good chasing ability, maybe 600ms, for you idk, but for me it is stupid, when you can't catch f***ing HL or Shugoki for Centurion even if you jump from one foot distance.

I don't want every hero be S-Tier, but it is better to make strong hero and nerf him to A-Tier for example (like with Raider and BP) if it is too strong than make garbage and wait years remaining second rework. I saw how it happen, with Kensei, with Orochi, with PK, with Valk, with Tiandi and even Monk, with Shugoki, they are garbage now, they are B/C-Tier in all gamemodes, outclassed but Zerkers, BPs, Raiders, JJs and LBs and I don't want such situation for my roman boi. I want him strong, I want him equal to other strong heroes in all gamemodes, I don't want that he will be trash after few seasons, moreover on release. I am sorry that my opinion does not coincide with the opinion of the majority of players, I am sorry that I want to give people the opportunity not to feel deprived and give them the opportunity to play on their favorite character, without looking on the more powerful hero with more interesting and working moveset. It is just stupid "I don't want Tekken", BUT THIS GAME IS ALREADY TEKKEN! We have 10 S/A-Tier heroes in every gamemode, why do you ignore them? Why do you try to make heroes worse then them? What it will change? We can just let people play on character they want. If you won't make Centurion strong, people will play BP or Zerk, people will always find strong hero and play on him, your attempts to make bad rework won't change number of players who play on strong heroes.

This game is already Tekken ? Only unreactable things are viable ? There is no point to discuss with you if this is what you think .

I like heroe balanced arround viable but fair things, let me explain you the difference with your state of mind :

-You want most lights at 400ms (unreactable mostly). I prefer 500ms lights and only a few 400ms exception.

-I am ok with punish. But not insane one like you promote.

-I am of course for more mix up in the game. But mix up doesnt mean by définition gessing game like you want.

I am.not going to point out all your points cuz tbh i dont have the energy for that as your vision of the game is pretty well known here as : please makes all heroes with 400ms lights, gessing game UB/bash and huge dmg.

It is your opinion and i can respect that.
I only say that you should play DBZ or Tekken if this is what you like and i really hope FH will.never become like that.


Lmao, imagine thinking Legion's Kick is fine as it is...

No one said this. Please dont read between the lines

FlyinBeef
06-17-2019, 10:08 PM
Only unreactable things are viable ? There is no point to discuss with you if this is what you think.
Yeah, only unreactable things are viable offence, it isn't even lights, unblockables for example, in general, everything what makes you guessing.

-You want most lights at 400ms (unreactable mostly).
I don't want most lights 400ms, I never said that, I just give heroes offence, somebody attack with heavy unblockables, somebody attack with bashes (fast bashes or long feintable), somebody attack with simple lights, or mixed, it is just 3 big types of offence in the For Honor. In my suggestions I give 400ms lights only for heroes who are, in my opinion, supposed to be fast.

-I am ok with punish. But not insane one like you promote.
In all my suggestions I promote only adequate numbers, 42dmg for PK is much? Look at Kensei, Warden and HL for example with their 40dmg, yeah, their punishes insane and OP. 35dmg for feintable punch? Warden, Hito and HL have something like that or bigger, but I don't see HL in the 4v4 S-Tier.

-I am of course for more mix up in the game. But mix up doesnt mean by définition gessing game like you want.
Like with heroes who supposed to be fast I give guessing UB's for heroes who have moves and foundation for it, like Cent, or like HL for example, or Kensei, or Shugoki, not to everybody. I didn't designed Centurion, I didn't give him this chargable punch, you want to keep his kick, I want to keep his punch and make it work.

No one said this. Please dont read between the lines

-Imo the kick is fine as he is.
No one?

i really hope FH will.never become like that.
Man, slowly, but surely it is going to be like that, you may don't like it, but developers will add these big numbers, 400ms lights and feintable bashes and we both understand it.

Siegfried-Z
06-19-2019, 03:22 PM
You do want to improve offence, right? But you don't like fast moves (400ms) and guessing game mix-ups? Please, tell me another type of offence in this game. Offence which work it is only feintable unblockables or unreactable attacks, that is all, you can't make strong offence without that. Huge damage of punish? And what you want to improve in heroes when you don't like fast attacks, don't like unblockables, don't like punishes, how to make heroes strong without that?

Fast feintable neutral UB - of course I mean not 500ms neutral UB, fast compared with Hito and Shugo, it can be 900-1000ms 30-35dmg unblockable, BP's stance unblockable or Raider's neutral zone "too much"?
Low recovery - in your opinion it is ok when somebody can gb Centurion for second heavy?
Warden chasing tool - I said Wardenlike, not exactly 500ms with such range, just really good chasing ability, maybe 600ms, for you idk, but for me it is stupid, when you can't catch f***ing HL or Shugoki for Centurion even if you jump from one foot distance.

I don't want every hero be S-Tier, but it is better to make strong hero and nerf him to A-Tier for example (like with Raider and BP) if it is too strong than make garbage and wait years remaining second rework. I saw how it happen, with Kensei, with Orochi, with PK, with Valk, with Tiandi and even Monk, with Shugoki, they are garbage now, they are B/C-Tier in all gamemodes, outclassed but Zerkers, BPs, Raiders, JJs and LBs and I don't want such situation for my roman boi. I want him strong, I want him equal to other strong heroes in all gamemodes, I don't want that he will be trash after few seasons, moreover on release. I am sorry that my opinion does not coincide with the opinion of the majority of players, I am sorry that I want to give people the opportunity not to feel deprived and give them the opportunity to play on their favorite character, without looking on the more powerful hero with more interesting and working moveset. It is just stupid "I don't want Tekken", BUT THIS GAME IS ALREADY TEKKEN! We have 10 S/A-Tier heroes in every gamemode, why do you ignore them? Why do you try to make heroes worse then them? What it will change? We can just let people play on character they want. If you won't make Centurion strong, people will play BP or Zerk, people will always find strong hero and play on him, your attempts to make bad rework won't change number of players who play on strong heroes.


Yeah, only unreactable things are viable offence, it isn't even lights, unblockables for example, in general, everything what makes you guessing.

I don't want most lights 400ms, I never said that, I just give heroes offence, somebody attack with heavy unblockables, somebody attack with bashes (fast bashes or long feintable), somebody attack with simple lights, or mixed, it is just 3 big types of offence in the For Honor. In my suggestions I give 400ms lights only for heroes who are, in my opinion, supposed to be fast.

In all my suggestions I promote only adequate numbers, 42dmg for PK is much? Look at Kensei, Warden and HL for example with their 40dmg, yeah, their punishes insane and OP. 35dmg for feintable punch? Warden, Hito and HL have something like that or bigger, but I don't see HL in the 4v4 S-Tier.

Like with heroes who supposed to be fast I give guessing UB's for heroes who have moves and foundation for it, like Cent, or like HL for example, or Kensei, or Shugoki, not to everybody. I didn't designed Centurion, I didn't give him this chargable punch, you want to keep his kick, I want to keep his punch and make it work.


No one?

Man, slowly, but surely it is going to be like that, you may don't like it, but developers will add these big numbers, 400ms lights and feintable bashes and we both understand it.

I am not against UB, 400ms lights etc. I would not play the game if i would.
I am for a Smart use of these tools. And overall (not speaking for Cent right now) your proposals always have a "too much" aspect.

Its important to be able to find a good middle ground where heroes are viable without being broken.
If the team would have follow your suggestions we would have been very often in the same situation as the recent Raider rework = a mess.

I disagree the devs want to rework heroes in this way. The only really stupid rework they've made in this way being Raider (insane punish, a lot of strong tools and no down side).

About the kick please dont pick a few words out of their context this is pointless.
I said many Times the kick is weak. You know it.
My words meant the kick should not be feintable if Cent got many others buffs and should not be remooved from his kit. Because it has some situational very usefull moment for Cent to get it from neutral.

FlyinBeef
06-19-2019, 03:53 PM
ts important to be able to find a good middle ground where heroes are viable without being broken.
If the team would have follow your suggestions we would have been very often in the same situation as the recent Raider rework = a mess.

I disagree the devs want to rework heroes in this way. The only really stupid rework they've made in this way being Raider (insane punish, a lot of strong tools and no down side).
Developers said that they wasn't sure will Raider have problems with opening opponents or not, he had no problem with it, so they nerfed him (yeah, it must be faster, but it is better than make trash and make people waiting another rework for years). I think it is the best way to balance characters, because if character is bad after rework it is much harder to give him something (because it can cause new problems) than cut something off if he is too strong. I know that on console Raider is the best hero, but it is problem of consoles, not of Raider. On PC his is almost ok now (only stamina pressure nerf is needed), he is as strong as he should be, good middle ground.

Siegfried-Z
06-19-2019, 05:29 PM
Developers said that they wasn't sure will Raider have problems with opening opponents or not, he had no problem with it, so they nerfed him (yeah, it must be faster, but it is better than make trash and make people waiting another rework for years). I think it is the best way to balance characters, because if character is bad after rework it is much harder to give him something (because it can cause new problems) than cut something off if he is too strong. I know that on console Raider is the best hero, but it is problem of consoles, not of Raider. On PC his is almost ok now (only stamina pressure nerf is needed), he is as strong as he should be, good middle ground.

I would say the best would be to release a heroe as close as this middle ground from scratch.
Anyone with a little FH knowledges should have known Raiders buff were too strong and then adjust it before release.

For example Imo the dmg buff wasnt needed at all. I was even pretty sure his 50dmg chained zone was going to be nerf :/
So far they tend to do like : better kit for less dmg. But with Raider they did : better kit for more dmg...

Despite playing on console i always try to think about both platforms while making my post. So i am not involving console in the problem right now. Anyway i am already able to deal with the new Raider if the opponent is not too good.

Atm Raider should receive a dmg nerf. They should revert the unecessary dmg buff they give him because with all the others changes he became viable in 1v1 but too strong in 4v4.
His 4v4 efficiency is absolutly insane right now. You can be pretty sure he is going to sit at the top of the next win matrix.

Ps: hijacking alert lol

FlyinBeef
06-19-2019, 08:38 PM
Despite playing on console i always try to think about both platforms while making my post. So i am not involving console in the problem right now. Anyway i am already able to deal with the new Raider if the opponent is not too good.
I will repeat. If you want balance for console, don't balance each hero for them, ask for input deley fix. If developers don't care about consoles, because it is offensive meta they want, will them read and add your suggestions which include such both platform balance? You trying to fix one hero, you trying to fix result of problem, not the problem itself, you need to fix the root of it, but you can't do it without developers and if developers don't want to fix anything will they listen your suggestions?


Atm Raider should receive a dmg nerf. They should revert the unecessary dmg buff they give him because with all the others changes he became viable in 1v1 but too strong in 4v4.
His 4v4 efficiency is absolutly insane right now. You can be pretty sure he is going to sit at the top of the next win matrix.
He isn't too strong in 4v4, Nobu, Shinobi and JJ are still the best. Ok, we can nerf him for the rest of casual players, but I don't think it will change something.

Siegfried-Z
06-19-2019, 10:31 PM
I will repeat. If you want balance for console, don't balance each hero for them, ask for input deley fix. If developers don't care about consoles, because it is offensive meta they want, will them read and add your suggestions which include such both platform balance? You trying to fix one hero, you trying to fix result of problem, not the problem itself, you need to fix the root of it, but you can't do it without developers and if developers don't want to fix anything will they listen your suggestions?


He isn't too strong in 4v4, Nobu, Shinobi and JJ are still the best. Ok, we can nerf him for the rest of casual players, but I don't think it will change something.

You are the one who talk about console here. As i said i wasnt involving it. Again, the best way to think is to think about both Imo.
The devs can decide to do whatever they want to, it is not going to change the fact that i am going to think for both platforms.

This is important that people thinking in different way can be heard. It is not because the devs said their focus is on PC or not that i will start to say ok then **** console.

Plus, what the devs said is they are not going to balance the game differently for each platforms. It doenst mean they dont care about console at all.

Both version of the game are suffering anyway... PC is about turtling when console is about Spam.

Disagree too about these 3 being better than Raider but thats not the topic (and at least Shino and Nobu require some skills).

Vakris_One
06-20-2019, 01:33 AM
Centurion just needs to be updated mechanically in order to fit in with the current version of the game and he'll instantly become a decent hero in my opinion.

- Zone should be feintable at any point. Damage lowered to 20 (from 25).
- Charged heavy should be feintable all the way into the startup of the unblockable portion.
- He should be able to access his uppercut punch after whiffing a heavy.
- His recovery after a kick should be reduced to match that of Lawbringer's shove/Shugoki headbutt so that he is no longer vulnerable to a guardbreak if the opponent dodges the kick on reaction.
- His charged punch knocking down an opponent in revenge should be removed but only if the developers also remove this characteristic from all other similiar moves like Tiandi's kick.
- The CC aspect of his Eagle's Talon punish should become interruptible and only guarrantee a single exterior heavy from a teammate thus conforming to all the other reworked CC ganks in the game such as Shaman bite, Shugoki hug, Raider carry, LB choo choo train, etc.

He honestly doesn't need a lot of work done to him. He just needs to be modernised to the current version of the game.

MessirePhilippe
06-20-2019, 01:50 AM
Centurion just needs to be updated mechanically in order to fit in with the current version of the game and he'll instantly become a decent hero in my opinion.

- Zone should be feintable at any point. Damage lowered to 20 (from 25).
- Charged heavy should be feintable all the way into the startup of the unblockable portion.
- He should be able to access his uppercut punch after whiffing a heavy.
- His recovery after a kick should be reduced to match that of Lawbringer's shove/Shugoki headbutt so that he is no longer vulnerable to a guardbreak if the opponent dodges the kick on reaction.
- His charged punch knocking down an opponent in revenge should be removed but only if the developers also remove this characteristic from all other similiar moves like Tiandi's kick.
- The CC aspect of his Eagle's Talon punish should become interruptible and only guarrantee a single exterior heavy from a teammate thus conforming to all the other reworked CC ganks in the game such as Shaman bite, Shugoki hug, Raider carry, LB choo choo train, etc.

He honestly doesn't need a lot of work done to him. He just needs to be modernised to the current version of the game.

I like some of these ideas👌