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View Full Version : Vortiger is balanced except 1 thing



The_Wanderer_I
02-05-2019, 01:08 AM
His shield bash light doing 20 damage is a little much. I think toning it down to 15 is more reasonable given that people spam the shield bash

MetalDevil19
02-05-2019, 03:59 AM
His shield bash unbloackable needs to be punishable, period.

Comisari0
02-05-2019, 05:51 AM
balanced? im tired of seeing guys just spamming shield bash + light, one after another. Or turtling as hell using the shield move to throw you.

Tyrjo
02-05-2019, 06:35 AM
The problem with bashes that can't be punished by dodge and GB is that the basher can decide whether or not to input the light. If you miss the bash you don't input the light and you can't be punished by heroes who doesn't have a dodge attack. Super, super, super safe and boring to play against.

Goat_of_Vermund
02-05-2019, 07:48 AM
The problem is, even dodge attacks can't punish this. The damage is fine, the recovery on a miss is not. It should be toned down to at least conqueror recovery level. Or cent level, and on miss, you should commit to a followup in order to receive guardbreak immunity.

pretoastedwaffl
02-05-2019, 09:29 PM
I think this thread is making some good points. I reckon if he could be punished for missing his bash and if he could have his damage toned down from 20 to 15 for bash as well as zone that would be good.

FlyinBeef
02-05-2019, 11:26 PM
Vortiger need such changes:

Nerfs:
Conqueror's bash recovery, because now it is nearly impossible to punish him with dodge attacks and gb.
Conqueror's stamina drain (10 instead of 20).
Light finisher after 500ms bash is 15dmg, it can be special light like Warlord's, basic finisher light, light after heavy soft-feint and after zone can be 20dmg.

Buff:
Conqueror's delay, because now his delay worse the Conqueror's, delayed bash doesn't reach enemy dodged your normal bash.

Fix:
Remove guaranteed bash after light in block, when opponent is OOS.

Ubiflowessence
02-06-2019, 01:55 AM
I've been seeing the community's response on Vortiger's shield bash and will be sharing them, along with this thread to the team for feedback!

As far as toning down his light damage, what do you all think would be the benefits to having it 15 damage as opposed to 20 damage?

mann61299
02-06-2019, 04:01 AM
I've been seeing the community's response on Vortiger's shield bash and will be sharing them, along with this thread to the team for feedback!

As far as toning down his light damage, what do you all think would be the benefits to having it 15 damage as opposed to 20 damage?

The issue isn't the amount of damage from his bash, but rather how safe the bash is. I personally think his bash also has very poor tracking, but seeing as it has such quick recovery, it is abused. Increase recovery time, but find a way to give this heavy knight a move with hyperarmor.

Goat_of_Vermund
02-06-2019, 07:00 AM
I think 20 damage is fine, he is a straightforward harasser. The other basher character, the conqueror has side dodge versions, and the warden has a back version and even feint his for 2 less damage. Kensei gets a 20 damage pommel strike too from hardfeints, and the gladiator zone is 20 damage too. The problem is not the 20 damage (although I think it wouldn't be a problem if it wasn't a chainstarter, and the chainstarter attacks would activate after contact). The problem is his recovery. Not getting a punish on reaction is fine, he has one timing and compared to other bashes, it's not harder to dodge at all. But it should yield at least a dodge attack iif the opponent starts dodging sooner, just like with conqueror.

FlyinBeef
02-06-2019, 08:27 AM
I think 20 damage is fine, he is a straightforward harasser. The other basher character, the conqueror has side dodge versions, and the warden has a back version and even feint his for 2 less damage. Kensei gets a 20 damage pommel strike too from hardfeints, and the gladiator zone is 20 damage too. The problem is not the 20 damage (although I think it wouldn't be a problem if it wasn't a chainstarter, and the chainstarter attacks would activate after contact). The problem is his recovery. Not getting a punish on reaction is fine, he has one timing and compared to other bashes, it's not harder to dodge at all. But it should yield at least a dodge attack iif the opponent starts dodging sooner, just like with conqueror.

I think 20dmg is too high for 500ms bash. Warden have pure mind game bash, which can be also interrupted by a light, Kensei's pommel strike is very long, can be interrupted by gb or light and also it is very risky, Gladiator's zone is 600ms, summary BP's is 600ms too, but Glad's zone have 100ms indicator earlier, it can't delayed and it cost half of a stamina. And the absence of side bashes isn't an excuse, he have Bulwark Counter, it have the same risk as Conqueror's bash, but deal 30dmg instead of 13dmg.

Zombie.Face
02-06-2019, 08:49 AM
i would not go lower than 18. 15 is too low. the shugoki is in more need of a nerf IMO.

matt89connor
02-06-2019, 09:16 AM
need to be punishable with GB always

Dane520123
02-06-2019, 09:24 AM
I think 20dmg is too high for 500ms bash. Warden have pure mind game bash, which can be also interrupted by a light, Kensei's pommel strike is very long, can be interrupted by gb or light and also it is very risky, Gladiator's zone is 600ms, summary BP's is 600ms too, but Glad's zone have 100ms indicator earlier, it can't delayed and it cost half of a stamina. And the absence of side bashes isn't an excuse, he have Bulwark Counter, it have the same risk as Conqueror's bash, but deal 30dmg instead of 13dmg.

His bash has ****ty tracking and can only bash in one direction, it can also be canceled by a light as well. He can keep his 20 Damage. Wardens is a 50/50 that can put put more damage. No idea why youíre comparing Kensei and his pummel strike but okay. You can literally guard break his zone, and easily guard break his bulwark counter, use feint game. Youíve been complaining about BP since his release, heís not that big of a deal outside of his OOS punish which is a bug and being fixed. If youíre getting destroyed by one itís probably because heís just better then you.

Elhantas
02-06-2019, 07:53 PM
Seriously, Vortiger NEEDS to have his recovery timing increased... Just managed to use a Nobu's sidewinder to dodge his bash and counter, only for him to block it... What the ****? Realy?! Isn't this supposed to be a bug at this point? With recovery times that bad he can throw attacks willy nilly with nothing to really worry him...

Edit: Also, Shugo's post rework headbut has the same bad recovery time edit as well. Even if you dodge it, you cant punish him from failing his headbut... Characters without dodge attacks, can pat themselves on the back that they avoided ramming heads and that's it.

Tyrjo
02-07-2019, 07:33 AM
If Vortigers 20 dmg 500ms bash is fine. Then buff Warlords Headbutt to 20dmg and give him the same fast recovery.