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MAGNAROK-YT
01-26-2019, 05:30 PM
The new wu lin faction has ruined this game. I cant ****ing do ****, cuz everytime i move i get hit. And when i timed the block, it just went through. So wtf, devs. This game dont make any sense anymore

Anaxandridass
01-26-2019, 11:22 PM
What you want dude .. this game have so much problems one is ubisoft and that bald guy talking about balance and doing totaly **** and second are testers ... maybe change testers for this game and some balance come . 90 % players in this game are players who only SPAM op atacks and what do ubisoft ? nothing ...

UbiInsulin
01-27-2019, 12:27 AM
The new wu lin faction has ruined this game. I cant ****ing do ****, cuz everytime i move i get hit. And when i timed the block, it just went through. So wtf, devs. This game dont make any sense anymore

Feel free to make any specific suggestions as to how you'd like this done. I've let the team know that some are uncomfortable with the speed of their light attacks, but as a general rule I need specific info about specific moves that individual heroes have in order to give effective feedback.

UbiInsulin
01-27-2019, 12:27 AM
The new wu lin faction has ruined this game. I cant ****ing do ****, cuz everytime i move i get hit. And when i timed the block, it just went through. So wtf, devs. This game dont make any sense anymore

Feel free to make any specific suggestions as to how you'd like this done. I've let the team know that some are uncomfortable with the speed of their light attacks, but as a general rule I need specific info about specific moves that individual heroes have in order to give effective feedback.

Szalej.
01-27-2019, 01:18 AM
Feel free to make any specific suggestions as to how you'd like this done. I've let the team know that some are uncomfortable with the speed of their light attacks, but as a general rule I need specific info about specific moves that individual heroes have in order to give effective feedback.

Tiandi zone fast as peacekeeper zone / shaoling side lights looking twice faster than any other side lights?/ Tiandi palm strike dodgeable on PREDICTION, which is 600 ms same as nobu kick. JJ 500 ms lights for 18 damage and his endless stamina. His every second heavy unblockable zone with a range and tracking higher than anything the game ever offer. Everybody except specific players like to see any nerfs in these aspects. Entire wu lin is supperior against most of heroes right now. There are only more people giving up the game only because they are tired of this "non existing" spam that wu lin brough to us. Reddit and this forum offer quite a few threads why its so.

FlyinBeef
01-27-2019, 11:31 AM
The new wu lin faction has ruined this game. I cant ****ing do ****, cuz everytime i move i get hit. And when i timed the block, it just went through. So wtf, devs. This game dont make any sense anymore
Lol, Wu Lin are normal, they just strong, if you want to nerf them let's nerf Warden, Conq and Berserker first, if we talking about JJ and 4v4 let's nerf Nobu and Shaman and also Zerker, let's nerf everyone, it will be good old turtle meta, apparently this game you want? So let's stop crying and git gud, cause For Honor isn't game for relaxing, For Honor is skill dependment game. Complain about fast attacks it is like complain about fast attacks in Mortal Kombat.

FlyinBeef
01-27-2019, 11:43 AM
Tiandi zone fast as peacekeeper zone / shaoling side lights looking twice faster than any other side lights?/ Tiandi palm strike dodgeable on PREDICTION, which is 600 ms same as nobu kick. JJ 500 ms lights for 18 damage and his endless stamina. His every second heavy unblockable zone with a range and tracking higher than anything the game ever offer. Everybody except specific players like to see any nerfs in these aspects. Entire wu lin is supperior against most of heroes right now. There are only more people giving up the game only because they are tired of this "non existing" spam that wu lin brough to us. Reddit and this forum offer quite a few threads why its so.
You can launch Sony Vegas and check timings or look at the table from independent people, Tiandi's zone and Shaolin's lights ate 500ms, like most light/zone attacks in this game, if you aren't slowpoke (FH isn't a game for slowpokes) it is easy to parry or deflect.
Tiandi's palm strike is 600ms like Gladiator's toestab, for most characters it is free damage for dodge attack (cause hyper-armor on heavy appears too late).
JJ's 500ms delay lights is easy to parry (without lies, even on PS4 with 30FPS). Endeless stamina? Do you know why he have this stance, HP and punishes? Or you forgot that he have no operners and on 50/50 moves, all can be countered ealisy without roll.
It is stupid to nerf Wu Lin to trash state, the best strategy in buffing other heroes, for example new Shugoki's rework will make him very strong and all weak character need such thing, then Wu Lin will become ordinary, like other strong heroes.

FlyinBeef
01-27-2019, 11:45 AM
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1wwr17AtTDFU3BZY_81axLVMKdHdNZuV0wGOb589VKgc/edit#gid=0

The.All.Father
01-27-2019, 12:09 PM
Lol, Wu Lin are normal, they just strong, if you want to nerf them let's nerf Warden, Conq and Berserker first, if we talking about JJ and 4v4 let's nerf Nobu and Shaman and also Zerker, let's nerf everyone, it will be good old turtle meta, apparently this game you want? So let's stop crying and git gud, cause For Honor isn't game for relaxing, For Honor is skill dependment game. Complain about fast attacks it is like complain about fast attacks in Mortal Kombat.

GIT FCKING GUD. Skill dependent game? So what skill is needed to use shaolin lights :)? This is the skill of what the most noobs talk about when they say git gud. I agree that the worst heroes need reworks and they should be far stronger, but don't talk about skill when there is absolutely no skill needed in clicking left mouse button when u wanna land a light (a 400 ms one for example [sic!] or perform a bash). The thing is simple. U can make even stronger heroes, giving them all the abilities, but FOR FCKS SAKE, u cannot leave the old ones with nothing. Saying that Raider is good in 4v4 and thats why he won't be touched ?! This prooves that balancing team is highly incompetent and they don't know how to fix it. It means that decisive people are the ones, who don't know what they are doing. And please, nowadays winners are spammers, not skilled fighters (ofc u can be a master lvl at reactions and predictions then not, but how many are there?).

MAGNAROK-YT
01-27-2019, 05:00 PM
U see guys? Its time for U to git gud and stop using Wu lin the noob faction.

Vakris_One
01-27-2019, 06:01 PM
This thread is top kek 😂

FlyinBeef
01-28-2019, 07:24 AM
GIT FCKING GUD. Skill dependent game? So what skill is needed to use shaolin lights :)? This is the skill of what the most noobs talk about when they say git gud. I agree that the worst heroes need reworks and they should be far stronger, but don't talk about skill when there is absolutely no skill needed in clicking left mouse button when u wanna land a light (a 400 ms one for example [sic!] or perform a bash). The thing is simple. U can make even stronger heroes, giving them all the abilities, but FOR FCKS SAKE, u cannot leave the old ones with nothing. Saying that Raider is good in 4v4 and thats why he won't be touched ?! This prooves that balancing team is highly incompetent and they don't know how to fix it. It means that decisive people are the ones, who don't know what they are doing. And please, nowadays winners are spammers, not skilled fighters (ofc u can be a master lvl at reactions and predictions then not, but how many are there?).

I partly agree with you that many heroes almost do not require skill in mid lvl duels, but MAGNAROK-YT complain about such simple things that everyone who plays this game should be able to do.

guest-4xn53EA8
01-28-2019, 07:46 AM
Feel free to make any specific suggestions as to how you'd like this done. I've let the team know that some are uncomfortable with the speed of their light attacks, but as a general rule I need specific info about specific moves that individual heroes have in order to give effective feedback.

Just look at your "data" and you will notice how broken they are. You don't need us to come here and tell you how to fix it. You have your data, so use it. I don't think 30 - 0 JJs aren't saying anything to you.

FlyinBeef
01-28-2019, 05:17 PM
Just look at your "data" and you will notice how broken they are. You don't need us to come here and tell you how to fix it. You have your data, so use it. I don't think 30 - 0 JJs aren't saying anything to you.
It is wrong to nerf something, relying only on data. JJ's 30 - 0 happen not because JJ is very OP, but because people don't know how to fight against him (and it doesn't need special reaction), when players can't parry unblockables, parry 500ms delayed lights, don't know about unclock tech, don't know about saves or properly ganking and just feeding revenge then of course JJ will have 30 - 0. The opinion of such casual players cannot be taken into account in order to somehow balance the heroes.

pretoastedwaffl
01-28-2019, 05:32 PM
I cannot lie the wu lin are just annoying characters who do tend to light spam. A few changes/nerfs to the characters would be nice as they are a bit too good on console. Hopefully the devs will be thinking about nerfing some heros after the win matrix is released

MrB3NX
01-28-2019, 06:27 PM
Feel free to make any specific suggestions as to how you'd like this done. I've let the team know that some are uncomfortable with the speed of their light attacks, but as a general rule I need specific info about specific moves that individual heroes have in order to give effective feedback.

we can't block Nuxia even if we try parry

when we dodge she jumps so fast and repeat the nonsense over and over

all of the Wu Lin are good and well designed except for an unskillful disgusting noob cancer called Nuxia

please do something because i'm tired of quitting early every time i face her .

Vakris_One
01-28-2019, 07:24 PM
we can't block Nuxia even if we try parry

when we dodge she jumps so fast and repeat the nonsense over and over

all of the Wu Lin are good and well designed except for an unskillful disgusting noob cancer called Nuxia

please do something because i'm tired of quitting early every time i face her .
You tend to use the term "we" a lot when you mean to say "I". Nuxia is widely acknowledged by the majority of the community as being the weakest of the Wu Lin. Rage quitting upon losing a fight to a Nuxia is on you to be frank. You find her annoying to fight and that's fine. But asking for a nerf to a hero just because that hero annoys you and makes you rage is not how you get the devs to take your request seriously.

If you spent more time fighting her instead of sitting out 15 minute quit penalties maybe you'd discover how to deal with her effectively?

UbiInsulin
01-28-2019, 08:01 PM
Just look at your "data" and you will notice how broken they are. You don't need us to come here and tell you how to fix it. You have your data, so use it. I don't think 30 - 0 JJs aren't saying anything to you.

Early on, the data absolutely flagged JJ as being the one who stood out. Stefan said as much on stream. The other Wu Lin were not remarkable.

But I think I agree with most people in that leaning on "data" in conversations like these doesn't make for an interesting discussion. Plus it doesn't really say a lot about how things feel once you're playing the game.

NHLGoldenKnight
01-28-2019, 09:12 PM
Simple solution would be to look at their damage stats a little bit. My feeling is that JJ and Shaolin could use lower damage, especially their lights. Nuxia and Tiandi I am not sure because I don't see them that often in 4v4.

NHLGoldenKnight
01-28-2019, 09:25 PM
You tend to use the term "we" a lot when you mean to say "I". Nuxia is widely acknowledged by the majority of the community as being the weakest of the Wu Lin. Rage quitting upon losing a fight to a Nuxia is on you to be frank. You find her annoying to fight and that's fine. But asking for a nerf to a hero just because that hero annoys you and makes you rage is not how you get the devs to take your request seriously.

If you spent more time fighting her instead of sitting out 15 minute quit penalties maybe you'd discover how to deal with her effectively?

You are getting ahead of yourself, no matter how rarely I visit this forum. You preach this guy for using "we" to talk about issues but you do exactly the same when you talk in the name of majority when speaking about how Nuxia is the weakest new heroe. How's that ok?

Also, frustration with Nuxia depends on hero you play. I am sure most of you wise guys here that preach 24/7 probably use mostly Kensei, maybe Warden or JJ and Shaolin For someone playing with Lawbringer for instance, you really have to be 2x better player than the one playing Nuxia just to win. She will frustrae you with her stupid lights and punish you for every block of parry of her heavies. For heroes who can't exchange attacks but they depend on block and parry, she is the worst nightmare there is. Only way you can ehave fair chance of winning if both players have same skill is if you play some hero who doesn't rely on block or parry but can actually press her hard with fast attacks. Someone like Orrochi for example, or someone with crazy potential for mind games like Kensei. But heroes like Lawbringer or Warlord are at huge disadvantage except for their health which means less and less in game where attacks are becoming faster and stronger.

FlyinBeef
01-28-2019, 09:26 PM
Simple solution would be to look at their damage stats a little bit. My feeling is that JJ and Shaolin could use lower damage, especially their lights. Nuxia and Tiandi I am not sure because I don't see them that often in 4v4.
Please stop talking about Wu Lin apart from other strong heroes, if we talk about 4v4 let's nerf Shinobi, Berserker and Shaman or Nobushi, if we talk about duel let's nerf Warden, Conq or the same Zerker.

Siegfried-Z
01-29-2019, 01:01 AM
Please stop talking about Wu Lin apart from other strong heroes, if we talk about 4v4 let's nerf Shinobi, Berserker and Shaman or Nobushi, if we talk about duel let's nerf Warden, Conq or the same Zerker.

In one hand you're saying some absurd things like parry Shaolin lights or such fast mooves is so easy and in another you're saying then if we nerf some of the wulins we should nerf Nobushi or Shinobi too ? Did we play the same game ? What's wrong with Nobu for example ? If you have troubles with Nobu or Shino how can you say wulins are nothing spécial ? This is not logic.

Btw i would rather fight a Shaman too or a Warden than a Shaolin.

Same with Zerk, he is strong because of his mix up, not because he spam unreactable things.

I am.on PC now but come from console and i have To say that wulins are just a cancer on Console.
On PC Nuxia and Tiandi are fine.
JJ is toxic in 4v4 because of his abnormal damages, feats and insane AOE.
Shaolin is hard To handle because of his lights which almost requires Sharingan To reads (but i think he is not op, just very strong).
Speed is not the only important things.. yes shaolin lights are 500ms... but then explain me why i can block or parry most others 500ms lights and barrely ever Shaolin or JJ ones ? Because their animation is harder to read than others .

It is important to remain objective. You cant compare 500ms warden lights with Shaolin ones for example.

Vakris_One
01-29-2019, 01:06 AM
You are getting ahead of yourself, no matter how rarely I visit this forum. You preach this guy for using "we" to talk about issues but you do exactly the same when you talk in the name of majority when speaking about how Nuxia is the weakest new heroe. How's that ok?
Except that I'm not talking in the name of other people by simply assuming that a majority of the community has come to a consensus that magically happens to favour my personal feelings. There's a thing called fact checking and research. If you hop over on Reddit or visit the competitive discord you'll find the majority opinion is that Nuxia is considered to be the weakest Wu Lin. This isn't my subjective feelings, this is an objective fact. If the poster I responded to has a source bigger than just 3-4 people he talks with for his claim of "we" then by all means let him present it.



Also, frustration with Nuxia depends on hero you play. I am sure most of you wise guys here that preach 24/7 probably use mostly Kensei, maybe Warden or JJ and Shaolin For someone playing with Lawbringer for instance, you really have to be 2x better player than the one playing Nuxia just to win. She will frustrae you with her stupid lights and punish you for every block of parry of her heavies. For heroes who can't exchange attacks but they depend on block and parry, she is the worst nightmare there is. Only way you can ehave fair chance of winning if both players have same skill is if you play some hero who doesn't rely on block or parry but can actually press her hard with fast attacks. Someone like Orrochi for example, or someone with crazy potential for mind games like Kensei. But heroes like Lawbringer or Warlord are at huge disadvantage except for their health which means less and less in game where attacks are becoming faster and stronger.
Nobody is denying you the right to feel frustrated about Nuxia. The point is that you need to be able to seperate your personal feelings from the objective facts about a character if you want to come across with a good argument about how balanced a hero is.

MrB3NX
01-29-2019, 04:34 AM
You tend to use the term "we" a lot when you mean to say "I". Nuxia is widely acknowledged by the majority of the community as being the weakest of the Wu Lin. Rage quitting upon losing a fight to a Nuxia is on you to be frank. You find her annoying to fight and that's fine. But asking for a nerf to a hero just because that hero annoys you and makes you rage is not how you get the devs to take your request seriously.

If you spent more time fighting her instead of sitting out 15 minute quit penalties maybe you'd discover how to deal with her effectively?

No penalty when you leave early baby

i've fought Nuxia more than 50 times i guess

can't block her , she sets a trap and mess me up by spamming the combo each damn time

i have already explained on why she needs to be nerfed

we just want to save ourselves by normally blocking her attacks like other heroes

is that too much to ask ???

i've seen a lot of players complaining about her , not only me .

Vakris_One
01-29-2019, 02:32 PM
No penalty when you leave early baby

i've fought Nuxia more than 50 times i guess

can't block her , she sets a trap and mess me up by spamming the combo each damn time

i have already explained on why she needs to be nerfed

we just want to save ourselves by normally blocking her attacks like other heroes

is that too much to ask ???

i've seen a lot of players complaining about her , not only me .
Fair enough on your reasoning. Everybody has different matchups they find frustrating or hard to deal with irrespective of a character's kit viability. I would suggest getting used to throwing out a light or a GB every time you see Nuxia go for a trap. She doesn't have any unblockables so it's a safe bet to keep in mind to throw a light or GB when you see her indicator go orange.

As for her lights, they could make it so her light finisher is only 400ms from the top like Orochi. That way she won't have 2 omni-directional 400ms lights and would be a bit better to deal with for the average player without really affecting her at higher levels. Her traps need work though because they are a poorly executed mechanic.

We've all seen players complaining about every single character in the roster, even the really weak ones like Centurion, LB and Shugoki. It doesn't necessarilly mean the character in question needs to be nerfed. At best it means the character might need to be looked at and rebalanced, not just nerfed.

MrB3NX
01-29-2019, 02:48 PM
Fair enough on your reasoning. Everybody has different matchups they find frustrating or hard to deal with irrespective of a character's kit viability. I would suggest getting used to throwing out a light or a GB every time you see Nuxia go for a trap. She doesn't have any unblockables so it's a safe bet to keep in mind to throw a light or GB when you see her indicator go orange.

As for her lights, they could make it so her light finisher is only 400ms from the top like Orochi. That way she won't have 2 omni-directional 400ms lights and would be a bit better to deal with for the average player without really affecting her at higher levels. Her traps need work though because they are a poorly executed mechanic.

We've all seen players complaining about every single character in the roster, even the really weak ones like Centurion, LB and Shugoki. It doesn't necessarilly mean the character in question needs to be nerfed. At best it means the character might need to be looked at and rebalanced, not just nerfed.

you know what's funny ?

when i die and watch my teammates , they get victimized by her just like how i died

she doesn't have unblockable but you can't block her traps sooo ???

i tried to light her , didn't work @@

i tried to run for dear life , worked great .

rottmeister
01-29-2019, 03:34 PM
Every hero should be able to punish Nuxia's traps on reaction with a light attack apart from Shugoki I think, but his lights will be sped up the 31st so there won't be a problem.

You're not supposed to block either, that's why she catches you. She catches you when you try to parry, block or deflect (or superior dodge). A light attack when the trap icon shows up is the most effective way of dealing with her (it's basically confirmed damage that you deal to her), moving guard/dodging and then blocking the light is possible too, but risky. You can also predict and heavy or gb before the icon appears but that's extremely risky. Walking backwards/backdodging may work as well (not on her zone attack though), haven't tested that out though. There are quite a lot of ways to counter it, some hero specific I believe. Just don't emote out of it, thanks. You're not supposed to mindlessly try to parry her heavies. If you can get used to her traps and light spam then it's usually a GG.
Not saying I destroy Nuxia's but she isn't that complex to beat. It takes some getting used to. I completely understand people have more issues facing one hero than another. Aramusha may be low tier, but he can destroy me pretty easily and I'm sure other people have their own kind of 'kryptonite" and Nuxia may as well be yours.

Herbstlicht
01-29-2019, 04:24 PM
Hm, I really dont think there needs to be done much more then nerfing JJ. Shaolin is fine, he is one of the better assassins, I still think Shaman is superior in 4on4 and berserker overall. Tiandi resets fast. If you are inferior to your opponent and fear to attack when there is an opening, of course, he will crush you because tiandi is sure to get some hits in, many ways to efficiently do so. But actually this is pretty much all the WuLin do - they clearly give you a picture of your offense. Do you have a strategy for attacking? Or do you still rely on turtling? Because turtling is hard against the WuLin. Thus, I feel its mostly players on the medium skill bracket complaining about them. Not saying some of those concerns arent right, but besides JJ, they seem severly overblown. And I really dont get those problems against monks ... yes, top light is fast, is extremely strong vs assassins, but .. hell, just play the game! If you really get lightspammed, react to the first flicker you see, dodge, punish, profit. I mean if you play Noubushi vs one of those heroes, you are in cor a bad ride - or any other c-tier hero - but besides them, you should be fine with a lot of other heroes.

Szalej.
01-29-2019, 04:37 PM
Hm, I really dont think there needs to be done much more then nerfing JJ. Shaolin is fine, he is one of the better assassins, I still think Shaman is superior in 4on4 and berserker overall. Tiandi resets fast. If you are inferior to your opponent and fear to attack when there is an opening, of course, he will crush you because tiandi is sure to get some hits in, many ways to efficiently do so. But actually this is pretty much all the WuLin do - they clearly give you a picture of your offense. Do you have a strategy for attacking? Or do you still rely on turtling? Because turtling is hard against the WuLin. Thus, I feel its mostly players on the medium skill bracket complaining about them. Not saying some of those concerns arent right, but besides JJ, they seem severly overblown. And I really dont get those problems against monks ... yes, top light is fast, is extremely strong vs assassins, but .. hell, just play the game! If you really get lightspammed, react to the first flicker you see, dodge, punish, profit. I mean if you play Noubushi vs one of those heroes, you are in cor a bad ride - or any other c-tier hero - but besides them, you should be fine with a lot of other heroes.

Just a reminder, not everybody has chosen hero with openers, strong mixup mindgames. Ah yeah, mixups doesnt even work on them most of time, they will poke you before you can react to it. Should i put my hero to trash and force myself to play Wu Lin because its easiest choice? Sorry, nope

CRIMS0NM0NKEY
01-29-2019, 10:44 PM
Just a reminder, not everybody has chosen hero with openers, strong mixup mindgames. Ah yeah, mixups doesnt even work on them most of time, they will poke you before you can react to it. Should i put my hero to trash and force myself to play Wu Lin because its easiest choice? Sorry, nope
I think shaolins reflex guard needs to beNerfed. He's not really subseptable to GB and his reflex guard doesn't seem much different than static.

Soldier_of_Dawn
01-30-2019, 12:22 PM
I think shaolins reflex guard needs to beNerfed. He's not really subseptable to GB and his reflex guard doesn't seem much different than static.

I prefer them to remove reflex guard altogether and give everyone the standard one since the heavy heroes and the game, in general, are getting faster.

Psykhozis
01-30-2019, 01:46 PM
the wulin are one of the most balanced heroes.. the most dominion or breach modes i play i see only spammers who cry. ubisoft let the wulin as it is please. im not a wulin player and i find them to be very well balanced.. but people cant sync their parries with jj attacks and just whine.. and dont keep their guards up when fighting nuxias and tiandis.. and get light spammed. and everyone cries about the wulins

C4rmine52
01-30-2019, 02:38 PM
the wulin are one of the most balanced heroes.. the most dominion or breach modes i play i see only spammers who cry. ubisoft let the wulin as it is please. im not a wulin player and i find them to be very well balanced.. but people cant sync their parries with jj attacks and just whine.. and dont keep their guards up when fighting nuxias and tiandis.. and get light spammed. and everyone cries about the wulins

Lol are you being serious right now ??. Troll post move along people. I’m not saying I have a problem with them but Tiandi, Nuxia = light spam, JJ= weird animation, timing and way too high dmg oh and he can light spam to even tho he’s supposed to be a slow hero and he shouldn’t be able to use Sifus pose out of stamina. Monk has his own problems but he’s bearable to me. And I dont know if you’re new to the game ? But light spam is called light spam for a reason... BECAUSE YOU CANT BLOCK IT.

rottmeister
01-30-2019, 03:30 PM
Lol are you being serious right now ??. Troll post move along people. I’m not saying I have a problem with them but Tiandi, Nuxia = light spam, JJ= weird animation, timing and way too high dmg oh and he can light spam to even tho he’s supposed to be a slow hero and he shouldn’t be able to use Sifus pose out of stamina. Monk has his own problems but he’s bearable to me. And I dont know if you’re new to the game ? But light spam is called light spam for a reason... BECAUSE YOU CANT BLOCK IT.

You're calling someone a troll because he says the Wu Lin aren't broken? They aren't though? Light spam can be annoying but it's not a big deal in high level play. Why else are Orochi and Nuxia never placed in S-tier in tier lists? People even say Nuxia is the weakest Wu Lin hero. It seems a bit ironic how you call someone new while complaining about light spam. I don't like it either, but it never is a guaranteed loss.

No one said JJ is supposed to be slow, yes he's a heavy, but that doesn't mean he has to be slow per se. That's just a stereotype that comes with heavy characters. That doesn't mean he should be able to spam lights either.

None of them can reliably get "free" damage or are "easy mode". BP and pre nerf Tiandi both can safely 100-0 an OOS opponent. It seems weird to me how people are being attacked over saying the Wu Lin are fine or saying BP needs to be looked at. Not saying these are facts. But for real his OOS pressure needs to be looked at.

Knight_Raime
01-30-2019, 03:41 PM
Lol are you being serious right now ??. Troll post move along people. I’m not saying I have a problem with them but Tiandi, Nuxia = light spam, JJ= weird animation, timing and way too high dmg oh and he can light spam to even tho he’s supposed to be a slow hero and he shouldn’t be able to use Sifus pose out of stamina. Monk has his own problems but he’s bearable to me. And I dont know if you’re new to the game ? But light spam is called light spam for a reason... BECAUSE YOU CANT BLOCK IT.

Light spam is not a thing. Developers put their foot down on this awhile back. Their data does not support it as a viable tactic. So if you (and I mean the royal you) can't handle someone spamming the same thing over and over it's on the player not the hero nor the game. JJ's "animation" problem was fixed. People who still struggle to block a follow up light are people who struggle to block follow up lights in general.

Each wu-lin hero does indeed have issues. Just none of which you mentioned.

Tiandi doesn't have a reliable way to get into his chip damage thus his offense isn't noteworthy. JJ doesn't have an offense because both mix ups he has are incredibly easy to counter on reaction. Nuxia's traps are reactable and thus her entire kit collapses on itself because it's gimmick doesn't work. Shaolin can be turtled when fighting standard guard heros.

Siegfried-Z
01-30-2019, 03:58 PM
the wulin are one of the most balanced heroes.. the most dominion or breach modes i play i see only spammers who cry. ubisoft let the wulin as it is please. im not a wulin player and i find them to be very well balanced.. but people cant sync their parries with jj attacks and just whine.. and dont keep their guards up when fighting nuxias and tiandis.. and get light spammed. and everyone cries about the wulins

Let's split things correctly.

Most justified Wulins complain are JJ in 4v4 and Shaolin lights.
PC speaking, Almost nobody complain about Nuxia or Tiandi.

That being said let's look at your critics and advices.

People does not trouble at parry JJ UB. They have trouble with him because in group fights his AOE is really insane, it's the same problem than with Raider zone but even worst. Also because, even after the fix, his lights look faster than 500ms. Add to that his very strong support feats and his DMG which are, for a reason we don't know FAR above others.. You got you're 4v4 toxic guy.

Shaolin issue is mostly because of his light animation which are incredibly hard to read despite being 500ms.

You say people didn't keep guard on top and then get light spam against Nuxia and Tiandi but first, this advice is for fighting a Shaolin as his top light is 400ms from neutral. Not something which help agaisnt the two others.

To sum it up, people mostly troubles with JJ in 4v4 (not in 1v1 as his mix up, in a duel case is avoidable) and about Shaolin lights.

In my opinion only JJ dmg should be nerfed. Others are fine even if fighting a shaolin is hard.

C4rmine52
01-30-2019, 05:08 PM
All the wulin need a nerf simple as that.

Knight_Raime
01-30-2019, 05:32 PM
All the wulin need a nerf simple as that.

Unfortunately saying "no your wrong deal with it" doesn't actually counter any points being brought to the table. Try again?

FlyinBeef
01-30-2019, 06:22 PM
In one hand you're saying some absurd things like parry Shaolin lights or such fast mooves is so easy and in another you're saying then if we nerf some of the wulins we should nerf Nobushi or Shinobi too ? Did we play the same game ? What's wrong with Nobu for example ? If you have troubles with Nobu or Shino how can you say wulins are nothing spécial ? This is not logic.

Btw i would rather fight a Shaman too or a Warden than a Shaolin.

Same with Zerk, he is strong because of his mix up, not because he spam unreactable things.

I am.on PC now but come from console and i have To say that wulins are just a cancer on Console.
On PC Nuxia and Tiandi are fine.
JJ is toxic in 4v4 because of his abnormal damages, feats and insane AOE.
Shaolin is hard To handle because of his lights which almost requires Sharingan To reads (but i think he is not op, just very strong).
Speed is not the only important things.. yes shaolin lights are 500ms... but then explain me why i can block or parry most others 500ms lights and barrely ever Shaolin or JJ ones ? Because their animation is harder to read than others .

It is important to remain objective. You cant compare 500ms warden lights with Shaolin ones for example.

Can you read? I specifically focused on a particular modes. Some people complain about JJ in 4v4 (FOUR VS FOUR, this mode), but Nobushi is Tier S too, Shinobi is top Tier A with his ganks and mobility. People shout "Nerf JJ, 4v4 OP", forgetting he isn't the only one who is strong, moreover most of them didn't see strong JJs, they just can't parry simple things and complain, instead of getting a little better.

And Zerker strong not because of his mix-ups, mix-ups is the cover that hides 400ms lights, also his mix-ups are easy, just heavy+light with some feints, even without unblockables, I played him, I know what I am talking about, he is brainless character like all Wu Lin, but stronger.

You forgot to mention, that Zerker, Orochi, Conq, Shinobi and Kensei in a varying degree are cancer on console too.
And yeah, it is your problem that you can't spend 5 minutes in training to learn animations, As for me, I parrying JJ's delayed lights even on consoles. And yes, I can agree that Monk's lights are more difficult to parry, but that doesn't mean they are unreactable.

rottmeister
01-30-2019, 07:21 PM
All the wulin need a nerf simple as that.

https://i.redd.it/wiga0fsqors11.png

ChampionRuby50g
01-30-2019, 10:12 PM
Can you read? I specifically focused on a particular modes. Some people complain about JJ in 4v4 (FOUR VS FOUR, this mode), but Nobushi is Tier S too, Shinobi is top Tier A with his ganks and mobility. People shout "Nerf JJ, 4v4 OP", forgetting he isn't the only one who is strong, moreover most of them didn't see strong JJs, they just can't parry simple things and complain, instead of getting a little better.

And Zerker strong not because of his mix-ups, mix-ups is the cover that hides 400ms lights, also his mix-ups are easy, just heavy+light with some feints, even without unblockables, I played him, I know what I am talking about, he is brainless character like all Wu Lin, but stronger.

You forgot to mention, that Zerker, Orochi, Conq, Shinobi and Kensei in a varying degree are cancer on console too.
And yeah, it is your problem that you can't spend 5 minutes in training to learn animations, As for me, I parrying JJ's delayed lights even on consoles. And yes, I can agree that Monk's lights are more difficult to parry, but that doesn't mean they are unreactable.

Nobushi in S tier? What crack have you been smoking? I’m not so sure that you can really so confidently parry JJ lights when you list Orochi having a varying degree of cancer. If you can parry lights so well, why would Orochi ever be a problem? To think Orochi and even Kensei are a cancer just shows you maybe don’t really know what you’re on about.

Siegfried-Z
01-30-2019, 11:03 PM
Can you read? I specifically focused on a particular modes. Some people complain about JJ in 4v4 (FOUR VS FOUR, this mode), but Nobushi is Tier S too, Shinobi is top Tier A with his ganks and mobility. People shout "Nerf JJ, 4v4 OP", forgetting he isn't the only one who is strong, moreover most of them didn't see strong JJs, they just can't parry simple things and complain, instead of getting a little better.

And Zerker strong not because of his mix-ups, mix-ups is the cover that hides 400ms lights, also his mix-ups are easy, just heavy+light with some feints, even without unblockables, I played him, I know what I am talking about, he is brainless character like all Wu Lin, but stronger.

You forgot to mention, that Zerker, Orochi, Conq, Shinobi and Kensei in a varying degree are cancer on console too.
And yeah, it is your problem that you can't spend 5 minutes in training to learn animations, As for me, I parrying JJ's delayed lights even on consoles. And yes, I can agree that Monk's lights are more difficult to parry, but that doesn't mean they are unreactable.

Can you read please ?
I didn't say you where talking about 4v4 or not .. I am the one who talk about 4v4 when time come To explain why JJ is hard To handle in this mode.

What i am saying is that you're claiming things which are not logic or show how you lack some expérience in the game.

Like Ruby said before me, you cant say "parry Shaolin and JJ delayed lights on console, meh that's so easy man i do it one hand down" And in another hand say why should we nerf JJ for example while we have others cancer as ... Nobushi, Shinobi, Kensei .. Roch ?? 😅

About zerk, thanks i know about his mixup.. I have 156reps in the game and my best friend is rep60 zerk. But i prefer a char which have 400ms light on a feint mix up than from neutral or just in a light chain. You talk about brainless.. To me a spammy chain is more brainless than any mixup, doesn't matter how strong it is.

And please dont talk about the Arena.. everyone know there is a huge différence between Arena in a pvp match.

But To end it, please explain me how Nobushi is S tier from someone which is apparently one of the top GM player ... ? Good luck

CRIMS0NM0NKEY
01-30-2019, 11:17 PM
I prefer them to remove reflex guard altogether and give everyone the standard one since the heavy heroes and the game, in general, are getting faster.
Id rather they allow slowed the game and give everyone reflex guard. But my point is shaolins offense is too good and his defense is to good even for a new hero. At least JJ has gb openings and easy to parry heavies on console. He also burns through stamina. Nuxia has low health and and her reflex guard gives her good exposure when she isn't spamming.
Shaolin needs either his defense lowered or his offence on console. I can rekt a level 3 bot and parry many attacks in practice but as soon as latency gets involved it's a whole nother ball game.

Knight_Raime
01-31-2019, 03:04 PM
Id rather they allow down the game and give everyone reflex guard. But my point is shaolins offense is too good and his defense is to good even for a new hero. At least JJ has gb openings and easy to parry heavies on console. He also burns through stamina. Nuxia has low health and and her reflex guard gives her good exposure when she isn't spamming.
Shaolin needs either his defense lowered or his offence on console. I can rekt a level 3 bot and parry many attacks in practice but as soon as latency gets involved it's a whole nother ball game.

lol what. He has a reflex guard and nothing to deal with unblockables or bashed based mix ups when he's in qi stance. His defense is poor.

Szalej.
01-31-2019, 04:20 PM
lol what. He has a reflex guard and nothing to deal with unblockables or bashed based mix ups when he's in qi stance. His defense is poor.

Except for his deflect / dodge attack / 400 ms light to interrupt whatever you want / strong mind games and quick feints together with untelegraphed animations

FlyinBeef
01-31-2019, 06:35 PM
Nobushi in S tier? What crack have you been smoking? I’m not so sure that you can really so confidently parry JJ lights when you list Orochi having a varying degree of cancer. If you can parry lights so well, why would Orochi ever be a problem? To think Orochi and even Kensei are a cancer just shows you maybe don’t really know what you’re on about.

Yes man, Nobushi is S Tier in 4v4 modes, she is the best midder and decent team fighter. And yes, Kensei and Orochi are cancer on consoles, Kensei top lights and zone, or third light are very hard to react, on PC of course it is easy parry, but on PS4 it is spammy cancer, not like Zerker, but still.

FlyinBeef
01-31-2019, 06:39 PM
Can you read please ?
I didn't say you where talking about 4v4 or not .. I am the one who talk about 4v4 when time come To explain why JJ is hard To handle in this mode.

What i am saying is that you're claiming things which are not logic or show how you lack some expérience in the game.

Like Ruby said before me, you cant say "parry Shaolin and JJ delayed lights on console, meh that's so easy man i do it one hand down" And in another hand say why should we nerf JJ for example while we have others cancer as ... Nobushi, Shinobi, Kensei .. Roch ?? ��

About zerk, thanks i know about his mixup.. I have 156reps in the game and my best friend is rep60 zerk. But i prefer a char which have 400ms light on a feint mix up than from neutral or just in a light chain. You talk about brainless.. To me a spammy chain is more brainless than any mixup, doesn't matter how strong it is.

And please dont talk about the Arena.. everyone know there is a huge différence between Arena in a pvp match.

But To end it, please explain me how Nobushi is S tier from someone which is apparently one of the top GM player ... ? Good luck
I didn't told that Nobushi or Shinobi are cancer, I even didn't told that JJ is cancer, I told he is strong and nerfing him in the one gamemode he is good is stupid.
I don't care what friends you have, Zerker is brainless cancer and stronger than Wu Lin, he also have 400ms in the combo, like brainless Wu Lin, but his combo is infinite.

Szalej.
01-31-2019, 08:32 PM
I didn't told that Nobushi or Shinobi are cancer, I even didn't told that JJ is cancer, I told he is strong and nerfing him in the one gamemode he is good is stupid.
I don't care what friends you have, Zerker is brainless cancer and stronger than Wu Lin, he also have 400ms in the combo, like brainless Wu Lin, but his combo is infinite.

Just to be clear. Berserker solft feints Heavy into Light is 150 ms confirmed by player experiments and tests. Nobushi middle minion clear and spammable bleed (which works only in straight 4 v 4 otherwise ure dead) are the only things going good for her right now in dominion. S tier in minion clear, b tier duelist. This is how every nobushi main see her at her current state.

Siegfried-Z
01-31-2019, 10:16 PM
I didn't told that Nobushi or Shinobi are cancer, I even didn't told that JJ is cancer, I told he is strong and nerfing him in the one gamemode he is good is stupid.
I don't care what friends you have, Zerker is brainless cancer and stronger than Wu Lin, he also have 400ms in the combo, like brainless Wu Lin, but his combo is infinite.

You're wrong, Zerk lights are 400ms only on his feint, not in combo.
But doesn't matter, there is just no point to discuss with someone who says wulins are fine but Nobushi is S tier… just stay in your dreams.

NinjaRonin85
01-31-2019, 10:25 PM
I hate the Wu Lin the light spam, dodges and screaming make me so angry, I don't even order Chinese food anymore because of all the salt.

CRIMS0NM0NKEY
01-31-2019, 11:11 PM
lol what. He has a reflex guard and nothing to deal with unblockables or bashed based mix ups when he's in qi stance. His defense is poor.
I never said he didn't. Clearly if your saying your statement with "lol" your just trolling.

Ubi Nerf shaolins defense please. Nerf the timing on his reflex guard. He is to safe.

Vakris_One
02-01-2019, 12:16 AM
I never said he didn't. Clearly if your saying your statement with "lol" your just trolling.
"lol" is short for "laugh out loud". It usually means the poster wants to express that they find something incredibly incorrect or out of touch with reality. Calling it trolling is a cop out.



Ubi Nerf shaolins defense please. Nerf the timing on his reflex guard. He is to safe.
Now THAT is way closer to trolling imo.

CRIMS0NM0NKEY
02-01-2019, 01:49 AM
"lol" is short for "laugh out loud". It usually means the poster wants to express that they find something incredibly incorrect or out of touch with reality. Calling it trolling is a cop out.


Now THAT is way closer to trolling imo.
😂