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View Full Version : Topic of discussion: should a bash knock you out of your Parry animation?



CRIMS0NM0NKEY
01-01-2019, 11:39 AM
Please let me know your opinion. I personally enjoy the parry animations and think it is unfair that when being ganked you manage to get off a parry but it gets interrupted by a simple bash. The fact that so many characters have easy accesse to bashes and parry in gank situations is so risky I vote no. In makes both the fighting and the animations less clean and is easy cheese for ALL the characters who have bashes when they gank. If fact I'd go so far as to say they should take damage for attempting a bash during a parry animation. How are you going to get revenge if all your parries get bashed while being ganked? How are you going to survive?

Look at how much damage I took from one gank bash while I'm in my Parry cut scene. Look at how crappy the animation.

bash cancels parry animation ( https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=g4zO44Vsoig)

SangLong524
01-01-2019, 11:44 AM
I don’t like it, neither do i like chain grab. However, i don’t like encouraging airheads to charge into uneven fights heedlessly of the danger.

CRIMS0NM0NKEY
01-01-2019, 12:08 PM
I'm not talking about headlong idiots who jump into a meat grinder gank squad on a point the enemy already controls fully. There are times where one player has to hold a zone or delay a gank squad long enough for his teammates to respawn or wait out for an attempted cavlery charge. All of which it is paramount to get the parries to get revenge for staying power and chipping the enemy down. Bash through Parry breaks the ability to survive ganks which in turn makes ganking more viable then it was now that so many classes have easily accessible bashes.

Halvtand
01-02-2019, 11:38 AM
Thank you for creating a thread about this issue. This is one of the first things I had in mind when I started to write down my list of things that needs fixing in this game. (https://forums.ubi.com/showthread.php/1976999-A-list-of-small-things-that-needs-to-change-in-For-Honor)
What I had in mind then is similar to what you showed in that clip, but also more. Representing the issue with a bash that only guarantees a light may make people not think it's a big deal. All bashes and CCs in this game are guaranteed while the target is locked in parry animation, cent's fully charged punch, Shugs backbreaker, shaman's cannibal lunge, HL's kick or caber toss, Valk's sweep etc.

Here's the thing. Getting hit by bashes in parry animation isn't the real problem here, but it is a symptom of it. The problem is that in order to combat the "def meta" the devs put in all these moves that were meant to force a more aggressive play style and open up defensive players. It's a nice thought, but neither bashes, increased hit stun, chip damage or 400ms lights actually does that (thread coming in future). The only thing they do is exasperate the defending player, locking it down and keeps it unable to do anything. Parry is supposed to be the ultimate defensive move in this game, it not only stops an incoming attack, but also allows you to turn the tide and counter-attack, but now people have figured out that you can punish someone for defending themselves, with a bash or a CC that can bring the guy from full health to death and there is literally nothing the guy can do about it.

Now, if you look at an ongoing match, it may look exciting, attacks, blocks, parries, bashes. It all looks really nice. Playing that fight is a different story. Playing an intense and exciting, blood-pumping and adrenaline-fuelled fight is only a hair's breadth away from playing a boring and predictable one. What's the difference? One thing - feeling like you have some manner of control.
This control used to lie with the defender. I'll gladly admit that. That fact was also partly why I loved playing the old Conq, because he could take an opponent and slow the entire fight down to his level and then beat it with experience. There have been lots of changes since then, most prominently (in that it actually fixed what it was supposed to) the parry-system and skills-perks change. The system isn't perfect, nor heavily favouring attackers now, but it is favouring ganking more than ever. Turtling up used to be the way to survive a gank, or at least stop it for a while. Now you can't even do that as many characters have attacks that are too fast to reliably react to in such a situation, bashes or CCs that guarantees sometimes massive damage or even death.

The problem, as I have explained above is that fights have become boring as the defender in a fight more and more feels left out, not given the defensive tools to cope with the onslaught of offensive tools.
Giving parry-animation immunity to bashes and CCs would only affect the game in ganking situations, would only make the fight a tiny bit more fair and alleviate some of the frustration that the defenders in this game feels. Personally I'd go even further and apply the 70% externas attacker-DMR on all CCs and bashes, but I guess baby steps.