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XyZspineZyX
06-19-2003, 02:02 PM
i've been playing il2 and fb for about 1 and half years, and il2 was my first pc sim. now i want to try some new tastes, so what is the second best ww2 flight sim? thx in advance, oh btw, fb is real good /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-tongue.gif

XyZspineZyX
06-19-2003, 02:02 PM
i've been playing il2 and fb for about 1 and half years, and il2 was my first pc sim. now i want to try some new tastes, so what is the second best ww2 flight sim? thx in advance, oh btw, fb is real good /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-tongue.gif

XyZspineZyX
06-19-2003, 02:12 PM
hmmm... i think CFS2,3 is probabaly second best. I recomend getting CFS 2 because its set in the pacific theater, its inexpensive and there is a large mod community already out for it. Although CFS3 has better graphics you will find yourself banging your head against the wall trying to get it to work. once you get it working, there is a good game to be played there. but i Highly reccomend CFS2 because its set in the pacific theater

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XyZspineZyX
06-19-2003, 03:41 PM
FB is the best sim
IL2 is the second best

any other sim doesn't come close,
but it is all a matter of opinion
if you aren't that fussed about planes FM's then CFS 3 looks real good and there's plenty of american/english planes to fly

My opinion is that FB an IL2 (as with most who own the games) are head and shoulders above any other sim

XyZspineZyX
06-19-2003, 03:44 PM
CFS2 Pacific theater is good, but I like Red Baron 2. The WW1 sim was extremely fun for me as I had just collected and read about 6 WW1 aviation books at the time. Afterall, that's where it all started...right?




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XyZspineZyX
06-19-2003, 03:44 PM
CFS-2 has some redeeming features. Graphically, it is comparable to original IL-2. I liked that with CFS-1 and CFS-2 you could work some of the instrument panel controls with your mouse including a separate window for throttle/carb sliders. The CFS series are definately Windows-based games, with pull-down menus and new windows you can close or minimize.

On the plus side, the three CFS games enjoy a huge modding community, and you can take the basic game and easily mod it to something completely different. However, the caveat to that is that skins and mods vary in quality. Overall CFS-2 has some bugs that can be annoying to a veteran IL-2 player. Ask around first if you're considering CFS-2, but expect a lot of knee jerk "Micro$oft blows!" type of responses. I'd recommend asking at the SimHQ CFS2 or CFS3 forum boards for balanced reviews.

CFS-3 is a step forward graphically for the CFS series, but kind of a step back for gameplay at the same time. If you're able to run the large FB maps then CFS-3 should be at least playable. CFS-3 feels more arcadish, however, than even CFS-2 and that can be disappointing to veteran IL-2 enthusiasts. The over-the-top special effects make it fun though, especially if you use Ghost Pony and Nibbio's effects packs. Just don't take the game too seriously and you'll be alright. ;-)

If you enjoy flying the He111 or TB-3, or even Stuka in FB, you might want to consider "B-17: The Mighty Eighth." B-17 is part sim, part role-playing game. The sim part is a fairly thorough study on the B-17 and its various crew positions. If you're serious about 'flying' a multi-engined aircraft through a mission of several hundred miles and worrying about things like fuel transfer and prop pitch and navigation and operating the Norden bombsight, then this might be a good choice for you. Imagine Flight Simulator 2000 where you fly a DC-10 armed with bombs and machine guns and you have enemies trying to kill you. Unfortunately, B-17 isn't much of an online game. Also, while it has flyable fighters there isn't any kind of fighter campaign so the fighters are kind of a novelty. On the other hand, the 'game' requires you to keep your virtual crew(s) trained and happy throughout the campaign, which is kind of different from other combat flight sims.

XyZspineZyX
06-19-2003, 03:55 PM
CFS2 does have farely good graphics, but I don't think they're quite as good as IL-2's. Not to mention the abysmal friendly AI.

As far as FB goes, It won't run too well on a Geforce 3, and it absolutely HATES my Audigy2, but that's water under the bridge. /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif I'm getting a Radeon 9700 pretty soon, and if Oleg and co. ever release that patch, I'll be back in buisiness!

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XyZspineZyX
06-19-2003, 04:10 PM
Of course, I can't let the opportunity to post a nod towards "Jane's WWII Fighters" pass. ;-)

"Jane's WWII Fighters" is a circa 1998 game and has disappeared from even the bargain bins. But for a couple of years it was available for about $10 U.S., and you might be able to find it cheap and used at places like Amazon.com or Half.com.

The flight models aren't as challenging as in IL-2, but the game still provides some fun dogfighting and ground attack. The 3D cockpits 'feel' similar to IL-2's and you experience head shake and G-forces like in IL-2. Time of Day effects are really nicely done; there's no weather FX like rain, lightning or snow though. The default game portrays the Ardennes theater of late 1944 and early 1945 ("Battle of the Bulge") but modders have created alternate terrains and replacement aircraft. There's a whole fansite dedicated to "Jane's WWII Fighters" here: http://ww2fighters.net

Also, another old sim that still has a large following is European Air War. It's also from 1998 but I believe it is still stocked in bargain bins. The graphics of EAW aren't quite as pretty as even its contemporaries, but the 'less is better' philosophy works for EAW as it allows huge formations and dogfights and a map of nearly all of Western Europe to fly over. The modding community has opened up several full theaters including Pacific and North African ... I think Eastern Front and Spanish Civil War are available also. More info at SimHQ boards for starters.

XyZspineZyX
06-19-2003, 09:09 PM
Black.Six wrote:
- FB is the best sim
- IL2 is the second best
-
- any other sim doesn't come close,
- but it is all a matter of opinion
- if you aren't that fussed about planes FM's then CFS
- 3 looks real good and there's plenty of
- american/english planes to fly
-
- My opinion is that FB an IL2 (as with most who own
- the games) are head and shoulders above any other
- sim


My sentiments exactly...although i would ive CFS2 the nod over CFS3.

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Tully__
06-19-2003, 09:15 PM
I'd suggest European Air War or CFS2 for WW2 era sims.

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XyZspineZyX
06-20-2003, 12:14 AM
Sick of FB and IL-2!? Impossibble!

Thunderbolt56 wrote:
"CFS2 Pacific theater is good, but I like Red Baron 2. The WW1 sim was extremely fun"

Absolutely!
CFS2 and 3 are good games, but a favorite game of mine is RB 2! It's graphics aren't the best around, but it's definitely a good game.

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XyZspineZyX
06-20-2003, 12:22 AM
JT_Skycat wrote:
- CFS-2 has some redeeming features. Graphically, it
- is comparable to original IL-2. I liked that with
- CFS-1 and CFS-2 you could work some of the
- instrument panel controls with your mouse including
- a separate window for throttle/carb sliders. The CFS
- series are definately Windows-based games, with
- pull-down menus and new windows you can close or
- minimize.
-
- On the plus side, the three CFS games enjoy a huge
- modding community, and you can take the basic game
- and easily mod it to something completely different.
- However, the caveat to that is that skins and mods
- vary in quality. Overall CFS-2 has some bugs that
- can be annoying to a veteran IL-2 player. Ask around
- first if you're considering CFS-2, but expect a lot
- of knee jerk "Micro$oft blows!" type of responses.
- I'd recommend asking at the SimHQ CFS2 or CFS3 forum
- boards for balanced reviews.
-
- CFS-3 is a step forward graphically for the CFS
- series, but kind of a step back for gameplay at the
- same time. If you're able to run the large FB maps
- then CFS-3 should be at least playable. CFS-3 feels
- more arcadish, however, than even CFS-2 and that can
- be disappointing to veteran IL-2 enthusiasts. The
- over-the-top special effects make it fun though,
- especially if you use Ghost Pony and Nibbio's
- effects packs. Just don't take the game too
- seriously and you'll be alright. ;-)

Skycat, I'm going to have to ask you to leave... such well-reasoned and thought out statements are not welcome here! /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

Just joking! Great advice!


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XyZspineZyX
06-20-2003, 12:27 AM
FB is the best sim
IL2 is the second best

any other sim doesn't come close,
but it is all a matter of opinion
if you aren't that fussed about planes FM's then CFS 3 looks real good and there's plenty of american/english planes to fly

My opinion is that FB an IL2 (as with most who own the games) are head and shoulders above any other sim

-----------

If you are looking for FM realism only,

Cfs 1% planes made by the Cfs flight sim community are and have always been the most accurate and realistic handling flight models, still are.

IL-2/FB deserves an honorable mention as the most realistic looking, and most immersive flight sim for high end systems in one box.

I agree on the whole Cfs 3 is a disappointment, much like Cfs 2. But Cfs 3, like Cfs 2 would be a worthy purchase if only for the flight engine itself and the ability to import 1% planes.

I would certainly rather see a little more accuracy paid to the FM's in IL-2/FB. But one has to consider the literally hundreds of people working on the Cfs 1% program compared to the relative few working on FM's in IL-2/FB.

Bottom line is none of them are perfect.





--------------------------------------

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Message Edited on 06/19/0307:40PM by James_Gang

XyZspineZyX
06-20-2003, 12:33 AM
CFS2 isn't so bad if you're willing and able to put in a lot of work on it. The stock planes are garbage, with ridiculous flight and damage models, but there are some very good ones available as freeware, particularly the "1%" aircraft. (Though you need to know how to adjust the cockpit views because for some reason the 1% planes come with some extremely screwy default zooms.)

Some of these are really nice. There is for example a P-47 series by a guy named Krystof Malinowsky that frankly is better than the one in FB in its present form.

And you can get some really excellent high-resolution mesh terrain (better than anything in FB) with authentic WWII airfields and so on. All in all you can bring CFS-2 up to quite a high level of graphic and modeling quality. You just have to pretty much jack the engine up and build a whole new sim around it. There are even tweaks to deal with some of the more irritating flaws, such as the infamous collision bubble.

The downside of all this is that you end up with a big fat wallowing memory hog. All the high-detail models eat up RAM, as does the high-res terrain.

And this is bad, because CFS-2 handles memory far less efficiently than the Il-2 engine. I've tested this myself; two missions with the same number of planes and the same amount of flak etc., and the one on Il-2 ran perfectly and the equivalent on CFS-2 was a slideshow.

That's the basic problem with CFS-2. If you run it stock, it's pretty crude, and if you gussy it up to bring it up to a decent standard, it no longer works very well except on really high-end computer setups.

CFS-3 I haven't tried yet. I intend to, but I'm waiting until there's more third-party stuff available for it.

(Besides, the local Wal-Mart doesn't have it--the only flight sim they've got in stock right now is FB!)

I take it you're only interested in combat sims? FS2002 is a really excellent flight sim, if you're willing to do a bit of work on it, but it's strictly for just flying around. You don't get to kill anybody. Although I once did an unintentional taran with a Dassault Falcon executive jet on an AI 747 over Heathrow....

XyZspineZyX
06-21-2003, 04:52 AM
~S~

Dats a tuff one. Some are very old and patched dramatically past their orginal release. Some fellas I would trust my life to still swear by European Air War for a ww2 online sim. Way past my time allowed to researh online use http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_frown.gif

I've never been a huge fan of ww2 sim or jets due to airspace required..I like extremely close combat. To that end all we have currently is RedBaron3d which is increasingly hard to enter..all aces and a 3rd party push to combat cheats online. In its hayday it was what all flightsims should strive for in MMP usage..anyone could enter a server easily and get direction via chat to guide them to squads or just online commands or etiquite(sp chk). I currently look for another sim to go over and above what RB was and still is but fear I may never no matter how much I spend searching.

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XyZspineZyX
06-21-2003, 05:29 AM
FB is not only the best but second and third best as well.

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