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View Full Version : The Main Reasons Why For Honor is a Poorly Balanced Game



dinosaurlicker
08-03-2018, 10:51 PM
I had hopes. I always thought this game had potential. But first it was revenge builds and the turtle met. Then it was OP new heroes. And now the game (for ps4) has degraded even further into a spam fest in which the victors of each fight are whoever can spam unblockables and 400 ms light attacks faster.

This is going to be a rant-styled constructive criticism argument.

So Shaman was released in november along with the Aramusha. Shaman was the best character in the game and was considered broken op because she had literally everything, while Aramusha was the most dog**** hero and considered one of the bottom two heroes in the game. 8 months later, Shaman is untouched (except for bugfixes) and Aramushaís actual problems have yet to be remedied. Aramusha is completely shutdown by blocking and still has no unblockables except for his ****ty nerfed raider zone. He has low damage. His combos and ďmixupsĒ (lul) are predictable. He has the worst full block stance in the game. The devs did buff him substantially, but he still has these same problems. Nothing has changed. Iíve suggested rework options and so have others, but still nothing. Shaman still has everything in the game and ridiculous mechanics that her moveset doesnít need just to tac on more power.

My point? The devs donít know what theyíre doing. They have the right ideas and know what they need to change (I think?) but refuse to and instead come out with mainly cosmetics. Theyíve reworked characters, and they were right in doing this, but they executed these reworks poorly. Conqueror is still the same exact shield bash spam but better and overtuned. Kensei was overtuned and given too many options. Berserker was WAY overtuned and given too much. Peacekeeper was nerfed to dog**** with her rework, getting huge damage nerfs but no better ways to deal damage and still had a useless bleed. Orochi became the noobkiller once again, and was just sped up with more options but is still completely shutdown by blocking (like aramusha, except orochi is much better). Warden became broken with his 500 ms 20+ damage lights, top unblockable, enhanced speed and tracking shoulderbash vortex, while still remaining braindead. Valkyrie was dog**** for a year and when they finally buffed her, sheís broken. Valk is the only hero who gets a 50/50 off of heavy STARTUP. She doesnít need to do anything and she gets a 50/50 with hardly any startup which leads to a combo filled with 400 ms light attacks (incredibly fast, near impossible to parry on console) and another unblockable which guarantees big damage and allows her to continue her combo. And she is the only static guard hero with 400 ms OPENING light attacks from every direction. Plus she has the fastest dodge attacks in the game which are now unpunishable on block. Fair right? The devs canít get a single rework correct. The closest rework to being balanced was kensei and still kensei is op.

The devs want every hero to be as good as shaman. The problem? This level of strength makes the game nooby and all about RNG 50/50, fast light combos, and unpunishable unblockables. Itís stupid. The character closest to being at the perfect strength level in the game is nobushi. Whoever designed her and came up with her buffs deserves props. She isnít broken and unkillable but has the ability to deal with most things if played correctly. The devs should have made everyone like her. But instead they set the standard at a godly broken character and now this is why the game is so spammy and unfun. Sure, needed to break turtle meta. But did you really need to give everyone either an unlimited number of options or a single extremely overtuned mechanic? Nobushi has options, but not so many that half of them feel like theyíre unneeded. Who thought ďhey letís set the standard at a broken character with everythingĒ? Itís ridiculous. Itís been a year and the devs still donít know what theyíre doing. Chip damage at 40% and giving people a heavy for avoiding fast neutral unblockables would have killed the turtle meta with no need for reworks. Now there are still heroes with nothing and no chance and some that just dominate with unblockable spam and 400 ms light attack spam.

The main problem is the devs. All underlying problems are created by them. I love the concept lf the game and love that the devs truly care about it and want to make it better, but theyíre doing it in the wrong way.

Another problem I have with balance right now is the side dash normalization. They should have made the lowest possible side dash recovery 600ms, but SOME of the heroes should have kept their 500ms recovery, like aramusha and PK. The normalization created a HUGE problem for me as an Aramusha player, and this is the fact that I CANNOT punish many of the unblockables even if I dodge them. For example, conqís shield bash. Iíll dodge it and then try to gb, but he can counter. Iíll try to light, he can block. NOTHING SHOULD BE UNPUNISHABLE FOR ANY HERO, EVER. HAVENíT WE ALREADY GONE THROUGH THE TURTLE META WHEN PEOPLE SPAMMED UNPUNISHABLE MOVES ONLY UNTIL THEY WON? HAVE WE NOT LEARNED OUR LESSON HERE DEVS? Back to my example, against Conqueror, with heroes that have no side dash attack, I can only punish the soft feint into bash, and even then I have to 50/50 guess to get any damage in because he can throw a light attack. You have to guess about whether heíll stand still for gb or throw a light for parry, if you choose wrong, you get 0 damage for avoiding it. Having to guess a 50/50 to punish something youíve already avoided should NEVER be a thing, and neither should completely unpunishable moves. Itís the same with nobushiís kick. And shinobiís kick. Etc. Once you dodge an unblockable bash from any hero, you should get to punish it with a HEAVY all the time. All 400 and 500ms unblockable bashes should have HIGH *** RECOVERY TIME.

Unblockables should be put on every hero, but be very punishable and also very risky in certain scenarios. Orochi is a pretty strong hero donít get me wrong, but against good blockers he is very hard to use.

Then you have Aramusha who canít even open with lights because of guard switch delay lol. Heís one of three heroes in the game who still have some completely unwinnable duel matchups (of course any hero can win against any other hero with a huge player skill gap, but I mean closer skill levels). You will never win Aramusha vs Conqueror, Aramusha vs Warden, etc. Sometimes even though I was diamond before shaman came out by using old kensei, I lose to silver players because their hero is so good and unpunishable. So I believe every hero should have unblockables, but balanced so they are all JUST AS PUNISHABLE IF NOT MORE THAN THE REWARD THEY GIVE, AND NOT JUST A ďhey if I spam this I winĒ type of move. NO neutral bashes should be faster than 500ms.

Until the problems Iíve written about are solved, this game will remain unbalanced. Itís going into a horrible direction of unblockable spam and RNG, but if the changes Iíve spoken about are made, then this game can be great. If this is well recieved, Iíll list out each and every change I would make to each hero to make it balanced. The state of the game is ****ty and cancerous right now, and itís up to we the community to speak out and encourage the devs to make GOOD choices and GOOD changes.

Knight_Raime
08-03-2018, 11:29 PM
I stopped when you said shaman was the best character in the game. She never was. She has the most usable kit in the game meaning all of her kit could be used at all levels of skill.
But she was and still is kept in check by the fact that her damage profile isn't great outside of bite and all of her mix ups if read right give everyone a guard break at least and other heros get even better punishes. Simply put she's easily hard punished.

Peace keeper was the raining champion as the best hero in the game until she was "reworked." Now it's berzerker in duels.

dinosaurlicker
08-03-2018, 11:56 PM
Lol Shaman was ****ing broken and was legit copy pasted pk but buffed so idk wtf you mean pk was better than her. And if you donít read the whole thing donít bother replying

Knight_Raime
08-04-2018, 12:36 AM
Lol Shaman was ****ing broken and was legit copy pasted pk but buffed so idk wtf you mean pk was better than her. And if you don’t read the whole thing don’t bother replying

No. her tracking was the only issue she had when she launched and that was fixed right away.
If you don't understand why pk was ever better then you don't get the game on a deep level.
I'd suggest you read into it if you want people to take your views with a little more credibility.

Neon_WiDoW
08-04-2018, 12:50 AM
I stopped when he just kept on meantioning Aramusha and not even shugoki.
Shugoki has so many things wrong but not a single meantion here lol.

RexXZ347
08-04-2018, 04:15 AM
I agree, aramusha just needs a buff/rework. Other characters need little effort to win but aramusha needs extra effort to win. Until the devs wake up to reality and work with competence, thia game's balance is always non existent.

TontonPanda
08-22-2018, 02:01 PM
Lol people here are so narrow minded... you give a very nice description of how deep the problem in this game is and they debate about shaman how broken or not she is....

Well i can tell you are totaly right, the problem in this game is that the DEVS are not versus fighting game designers, AT ALL. They have some "cool ideas", the game look cool, the movements are great, they had some good idea some things... but they have no clue about what is balancing in a versus fighting game, they are focused on creating new content but that's not what keep people playing on the long run.

Today, you have to put asside more than 50% of the avalaible characters if you want to feel on a equal step with you opponent. Aramusha, Shugoki, cent, LB, nobushi, PK, raider... all of them are have such a poor moveset comapred to others, low punish dmg, but highly punishable moves...

The basic to do in a versus fighting game is to respect a simple rule "high risk high reward, low risk low reward". And this rule isnt respected at all... And what a surprise, Conq is at a strong 60% win rate, because he cannot be punished after dodging it's shieldbash : he is the perfect illustration of that pb.

An other basic rule is to give every character a wide and shared base of moveset. With that, you avoid giving too many moves to on char and not enough to an other. You can always change the speed or the impact of each move, but having it available for all make instantly the game fairer . Here i'm talkin about unblocable opener, side dodge actions, soft feint, granted heavy after wallsplat (for some char it sometimes DOESNT WORK,... fixe this!).... these should be basic move !


Ty for reading and plz do smthg, i feel bored now because of this unfairness i might just leave the game

I also saw how the futur character will be, with their super wide range of possibiliies, and what is discribed will be all the more true, and every old char will be so bad compared to them!

dinosaurlicker
08-22-2018, 08:09 PM
No. her tracking was the only issue she had when she launched and that was fixed right away.
If you don't understand why pk was ever better then you don't get the game on a deep level.
I'd suggest you read into it if you want people to take your views with a little more credibility.

Loool because PK did too much damage? She was still a joke against turtles... and you could always just block. Even on console it was simple. Yea, she was strong, but literally just block to the right and react to her lights and it was easy. Shaman had unblockables and 400 ms attacks, plus her damage has never even been that bad. Donít say ďunderstand if you want people to take your views more seriouslyĒ because clearly you just submit to mob mentality and donít come up with your own ideas.

And to the person who cried that I never mentioned shugoki, did you even read this? The reason I used Aramusha was because he is a DLC hero. They released him on **** tier despite the fact that he was released with a god. Goki is ****, and I never said he wasnít btw, but you canít expect EVERY SINGLE THREAD complaining about why the game is bad to have goki involved. Heís literally just a bad joke, itís common knowledge. And I can guarantee you his buff will come in late November early December at the EARLIEST