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TuSkiLLd
04-30-2018, 03:28 AM
That vortex is complete BS a tracking uninterrptable that also Dazes and takes stamina, and don't forget knocks you down where he can inflict 50+ damage is the worst game design for a character ever. Please Ubi for the love of God fix. Plis

Pretty sure with the current state this free weekend is going to be a blast for new players

Kelson27
04-30-2018, 04:41 AM
To be fair to cent players... most of the time you can walk all over them. They need a buff.


However... 4v4, standing in a corridor hugging those walls... couldnít agree more. Cut scenes and disables need to stop being pushed into the game, they are awful designs. This game is more than just 1v1 and it feels like that wasnít even a consideration with these plays.

CptMatsumaru
04-30-2018, 09:33 AM
Hey,

I hated the centurion exactly like you.
But since I play him myself, I've actually noticed how many disadvantages he has.
I admit, in direct attack and when he hits, he makes dmg. That's true.
But he is so immobile. He does not even have any dodge attacks. His attack is felt to be very predictable.
Play the Centurio for a while yourself. You will notice so quickly where his weak points are.
And I think that almost every second hero can, if no one hangs him, cut out huge combos. Let the Highlander, Raider, Berzerker or Shaman start to steal without blocking. The Dmg is just as high.

I just say: Get to know your enemy and you will find the solution.

DrinkinMyStella
04-30-2018, 10:30 AM
Cent is only an animal if he can get you into a GB, gone of the days when a cent can stun lock you and spam heavies. Cents now have to rely on quick reactions, use parry punish and bait a lot into a GB because without getting a GB he can only rely on kicks and lights and the occasional heavy. He can use soft feint into GB but its much more predictable now as you can't delay it for too long. As long as your quick with the CGB and can block and dodge at the right time then he is no match and is B tier, he can be S-tier if you allow him to but against the majority of players he's not that great (rep13cent)

EvoX.
04-30-2018, 03:13 PM
''Vortex'' he says. Cute.

GayForShugoki
04-30-2018, 03:19 PM
Cent is only an animal if he can get you into a GB, gone of the days when a cent can stun lock you and spam heavies. Cents now have to rely on quick reactions, use parry punish and bait a lot into a GB because without getting a GB he can only rely on kicks and lights and the occasional heavy. He can use soft feint into GB but its much more predictable now as you can't delay it for too long. As long as your quick with the CGB and can block and dodge at the right time then he is no match and is B tier, he can be S-tier if you allow him to but against the majority of players he's not that great (rep13cent)

I agree, but the second he hits that GB, you're dead. He will stunlock you, know you down, then stab you for 70% of your life. The only time I have beaten a Centurian was when he messed up and I, a Nobushi, just poked him to death. Even then, I only killed him due to a lucky parry because he messed up his combo, I assume. The instant he hits that first GB, your screen will be perma white and you'll just keep eharing the same crap voer and voer until you die.

He may not be strong, but his design is absolutely anti-fun.

DrinkinMyStella
04-30-2018, 03:57 PM
I agree, but the second he hits that GB, you're dead. He will stunlock you, know you down, then stab you for 70% of your life. The only time I have beaten a Centurian was when he messed up and I, a Nobushi, just poked him to death. Even then, I only killed him due to a lucky parry because he messed up his combo, I assume. The instant he hits that first GB, your screen will be perma white and you'll just keep eharing the same crap voer and voer until you die.

He may not be strong, but his design is absolutely anti-fun.

back when cent was new and the first 3months of his existence was when he could drain 100% of health in one wall splatting combo. GB throw into wall then punch but do not charge the punch then you get a free heavy of the wall then charge a heavy and soft feint into GB because most will try to dodge then throw back into wall and repeat until dead. so when people still moan about him now I just laugh thinking thank god he wasn't still the way he was in season 2 and 3

Specialkha
04-30-2018, 04:08 PM
It is not because he was worse to fight against before that he is ok now, just saying.

Knight_Raime
04-30-2018, 04:09 PM
Vortex?
okay. You've no idea what you're talking about.

TacticalMirror6
04-30-2018, 05:19 PM
I got tired of him ... Now ill be deleting the game. I dont have exactly a hard time with centurion, considering i play amarusha, but the lack of attention ubisoft is giving this game isn't enough. I guess this game is at its loss. Recently me and 4 other friens started playing again and long hours but since the 27th even tho the vortex was fixed... We still decided to all stop playing. Maybe by letting it die , a new one will arrive in a couple of years or maybe make a new place or new concept. This is just not worth it anymore.

Vakris_One
04-30-2018, 05:40 PM
Am I the only one that finds the irony between the OP's name and their Centurion complaint funny?

Card1acArrest
04-30-2018, 06:48 PM
yes

HappeningShrimp
04-30-2018, 08:32 PM
back when cent was new and the first 3months of his existence was when he could drain 100% of health in one wall splatting combo. GB throw into wall then punch but do not charge the punch then you get a free heavy of the wall then charge a heavy and soft feint into GB because most will try to dodge then throw back into wall and repeat until dead. so when people still moan about him now I just laugh thinking thank god he wasn't still the way he was in season 2 and 3

The problem with Cent even now though is the potential punish for one mistake costs the majority of heroes half their HP. Which is possible for a lot of heroes but that only applies to an OOS punish while your opponent is on the ground. Cent doesn't need an OOS punish to do a ridiculous amount of damage. I'm not saying he's really hard to counter, but no character should be able to that over one mistake.

TuSkiLLd
04-30-2018, 10:15 PM
im not sure which direction they are going in with the balacing(i.e 1v1 or 4v4s) but i can tell you that if you want to bring back life to this game it will definitely depend on 4v4 which everyone wants to play with their friends in the beginning, and with the current state of the unblockables,wall stuns, and perma screen white. characters like centurion in domination it wont happen. 1v1 has a lot more space which you can dodge and wait for him to attack but if he ganks you with that "VORTEX" yes you are dead

Alustar.
04-30-2018, 11:14 PM
Am I the only one that finds the irony between the OP's name and their Centurion complaint funny?

I thought the same exact thing! Even considered paying it, myself, but decided is probably get jumped on for trolling. So glad you did though. :P

Alustar.
04-30-2018, 11:22 PM
im not sure which direction they are going in with the balacing(i.e 1v1 or 4v4s) but i can tell you that if you want to bring back life to this game it will definitely depend on 4v4 which everyone wants to play with their friends in the beginning, and with the current state of the unblockables,wall stuns, and perma screen white. characters like centurion in domination it wont happen. 1v1 has a lot more space which you can dodge and wait for him to attack but if he ganks you with that "VORTEX" yes you are dead

As a player who plays 4s regularly, you are so off base with this.
First off, Centurion is no where near the power house he used to be 2 seasons ago. He is also no more difficult in group fights than any other hero. Every group fight is about positioning, I can think of three heroes right now off the top of my head that give me more trouble than most Centurion. Valkyrie, Shugoki, and Raider can be more hazardous in a good group. Also what vortex? I've never heard of Centurion having anything choose to that.. O think maybe you'd benefit from going and picking him up and practicing his moves so you can recognize them easier.

Kelson27
04-30-2018, 11:30 PM
The OP doesnít need to have the for honour dictionary on hand to get his point across without the dismissive response. Cent is not a great design for this game. 1v1 he isnít great and 4v4 heís an awful fit. I honestly think cent needs a rework from the ground up.

OP is also 100% right regarding new players and the free weekend. Put a decent cent player in with any of them and welcome them to what will seem like the most frustrating character on the planet.

We.the.North
04-30-2018, 11:42 PM
The OP doesn’t need to have the for honour dictionary on hand to get his point across without the dismissive response.

This. Dont be a troll and thank you Kelson.


1v1 he isn’t great and 4v4 he’s an awful fit.

This right here is the reason so many players argued for well over dozens of pages of posts in season 2 and that argument is still going on right now in season 5.

People playing Centurion in 1v1 will say everything he does is easily counterable and they are right. In 1v1, Centurion is on the weak side of the meta.

People playing against Centurion in 4v4 will say he's able to "close a gank" faster and easier than any other character in the game with that unblockable pin knockdown combo. They are also right.


I honestly think cent needs a rework from the ground up.

Centurion is weak in 1v1 and overpowered / annoying in 4v4. He indeed needs a complete rework. You can't have a hero that's polarized like that, he'll never be balanced in both modes.

It is also the case with most other heroes ... some shine more in duels, some shine more in 4v4. But with Centurion, the difference between modes is HUGE.

Alustar.
04-30-2018, 11:53 PM
The OP doesnít need to have the for honour dictionary on hand to get his point across without the dismissive response. Cent is not a great design for this game. 1v1 he isnít great and 4v4 heís an awful fit. I honestly think cent needs a rework from the ground up.

OP is also 100% right regarding new players and the free weekend. Put a decent cent player in with any of them and welcome them to what will seem like the most frustrating character on the planet.

That same thing can be said about any character used by a competent player vs a noob. Since when do we have to cater to players who don't know game mechanics? Just because you can squash a fresh player with your chosen hero does not mean he needs a nerf. If that's the case we should just nerf the entire game to cater to new players.

Kelson27
05-01-2018, 12:11 AM
I never said he needs a nerf, I said if anything he needs a buff and a rework.

The problem with cent vs other characters is that most of the time, it feels like you were outplayed and can take it on the chin. Cent feels like a cheap and nasty ďso what happened?Ē moment, and in 4v4 that moment turns into ďso I couldnít respond and everyone can hit me?Ē. Itís pretty telling that most deaths to cent end with a leap of free damage, thatís just not a fun fight. I donít disagree that a good player will pick apart a new player regardless, happens all the time. But cent doesnít play the same rules.

Dane520123
05-01-2018, 02:46 AM
Lol Alustar put you guys in check, give up you lost. Itís not our problem youíre to lazy to practice with a hero for a bit to learn their moves. And the fact you Accused Centurion of having a VOrtEX just proves 100% you have absolutely 0 idea of what the hell youíre talking about.

TuSkiLLd
05-01-2018, 04:20 AM
Thanks for the cheer leading response, should I use the term "spam", "loop"," continuous combo chain". In any case the fact that 4v4 has changed into this because of the influx of unblockables and Dazes in rapid succession like Centurion. Getting more people to play will be difficult. I didn't say cater to a player base which idk they might need to do since free weekends must mean they are trying to get more people. Just rework either the mode Or tone down the excessive unblockable spam. Unless the current player base likes sitting in que with bots and the same old players all the time. Teaming up with friends is what the current state of video games are at. improve 4v4 modes=more players

That's all I have to say.

Playing_Mantis
05-01-2018, 08:37 AM
I agree, the cent is not the most amazing hero but his punish is just too high. his parry timings are actually one of the hardest in the game so u can't really say he's simple to beat. his stamina and damage punish is a bit much to me. i feel like vs most all other characters i have room for 1-2 mistakes... cent.. 1 mistake can be your death. not a good hero to have in the game vs new players. noob stomper, and with the amount of cent players I'm sure this free weekend will be a blast for them!!!!!! dear god don't give him a dodge attack! then he will truly be broken. he's way too good vs newer players and not so hard vs top tier.. so he's in a weird bad place. id like to see his defense way up and his punish way down. this might actually balance him out a bit. this way new players can make 1-2 mistakes without getting wrecked and he would have more hp to counter this...not sure..just an idea.

DrinkinMyStella
05-01-2018, 09:28 AM
You have to remember that what comes with perks must have some downfall so although he is amazing in someways he also has disadvantages. That fact that he has no dodge attack means that if you play aggressive against a cent rather than guarded up then your overwhelm him and he will make mistakes, his low health pool means that 2 mistakes = death, his charged attacks are slow enough to prepare for parry, his kick is slow and predictable with slow recovery. I play super aggressive against a cent and 9 out of 10 times the cent will get overwhelmed and start making silly mistakes.

IAmOddGirl
05-01-2018, 09:58 AM
Any punish should be a nightmare, makes you play better. Don't make a mistake or strive to make very few if any at least. Isn't that how fighting games are? I know against top tier players in like Mortal Kombat you make 1 mistake in a corner and thats the game for you..ur gonna get combo'd until you died from full health 9 out of 10 times. I love that. You get your A** beat until you get better.

Alustar.
05-01-2018, 10:28 AM
I never said he needs a nerf, I said if anything he needs a buff and a rework.

The problem with cent vs other characters is that most of the time, it feels like you were outplayed and can take it on the chin. Cent feels like a cheap and nasty ďso what happened?Ē moment, and in 4v4 that moment turns into ďso I couldnít respond and everyone can hit me?Ē. Itís pretty telling that most deaths to cent end with a leap of free damage, thatís just not a fun fight. I donít disagree that a good player will pick apart a new player regardless, happens all the time. But cent doesnít play the same rules.

Lmfao! What!? Ok dude, exactly what rules are there that Centurion isn't playing by that the rest of the cast is? That is quite possibly the dumbest response you could have used.
Centurion can be blocked/parried, dodged/deflected on every respective attack. He has seen a nerf so hard that he went from being a real threat and an true challenge to fight, either solo or in groups, to being a joke and a shell of his former glory.
I used to really enjoy fighting against Centurion because he made group fights challenging, I had to take into account spacing very heavily as well as manage a real kill order. Now he's about as annoying as a mosquito at a barbecue, yes he can do damage, but swat him right and he's done.
New players are going to get wrecked. It's f*kin PvP for the love of Bob, that's how it works! You can't just pick up a controller after putting a new title on and serially expect that, "I just got this sh!t, but hey I'm amazing at everything so, here I go!" That's asinine. It's called "skill check" for a reason. It IS possible to block/parry multiple hits in a certain window. Parry one strike and you also parry any unblockables coming during that window as well. Learn your timings.

Erhanninja
05-01-2018, 11:05 AM
Any punish should be nightmare? Okay lets do this. For every hero one parry and you are dead. It will make you strive to be better right? Isnt this why they changed parry system to lower punish from one parry? Doesnt it contradict?

Nobody is saying Cent is OP but one mistake shouldnt lead to that much punish like all other characters. You can say pros and cons yeah fine. Most of health gone and put of stamina is bit too much. I can even accept tracking during charged attack but how can he change direction in the air during jump attack? Its against physics let alone a game.

With recent changes IMO game became even more gank festival. Before people were hesitant to let unblockables or charged attacks rip. Now, its everywhere in 4v4 because its minimal risk with massive punish. Not saying they are bad changes but to keep these things in mind.

IAmOddGirl
05-01-2018, 11:30 AM
Any punish should be nightmare? Okay lets do this. For every hero one parry and you are dead. It will make you strive to be better right? Isnt this why they changed parry system to lower punish from one parry? Doesnt it contradict?

Nobody is saying Cent is OP but one mistake shouldnt lead to that much punish like all other characters. You can say pros and cons yeah fine. Most of health gone and put of stamina is bit too much. I can even accept tracking during charged attack but how can he change direction in the air during jump attack? Its against physics let alone a game.

With recent changes IMO game became even more gank festival. Before people were hesitant to let unblockables or charged attacks rip. Now, its everywhere in 4v4 because its minimal risk with massive punish. Not saying they are bad changes but to keep these things in mind.

You must not have been out of stamina vs a really good Nobushi yet. In 4v4 if I'm being ganked just turtle and use lights. Until your revenge pops do not break your defense. Your real damage 1v4 is gonna be slow. However, if you are fighting 4 people alone then you are trickling. Your style can change if the characters on the other team are good match ups for your kit. I generally like to tail a teammate. Also when my squad ganks its all cheese. raider stamped with a nobushi bleed tapping, shaman tackle..when thats finished Centurion jumping heavy. No chance to defend against that if you are alone, and that is your fault for thinking 4v4 was suddenly going to change because you felt the Call of Duty hero rush. Move as a team, right now that is the way 4v4 has to be played for maximum efficient outcome. If after a few minutes you notice the enemy team is just playing to play (not running full deep) then by all means go have some fun. You are not stupid you can look and see how things are going. Don't bash your head against a wall and get angry it didn't give way. Also I just really don't relate to this issue with cents. You know what they can do..just keep calm and turtle them down. All characters can play counter. I stare them right in the face and i will not make an animation committed move unless I see an opening I am sure about. It might be crappy to play like that, but If im alive and he/she isn't I just denied them renown for feats.

Kelson27
05-01-2018, 11:35 AM
Lmfao! What!? Ok dude, exactly what rules are there that Centurion isn't playing by that the rest of the cast is? That is quite possibly the dumbest response you could have used.
Centurion can be blocked/parried, dodged/deflected on every respective attack. He has seen a nerf so hard that he went from being a real threat and an true challenge to fight, either solo or in groups, to being a joke and a shell of his former glory.
I used to really enjoy fighting against Centurion because he made group fights challenging, I had to take into account spacing very heavily as well as manage a real kill order. Now he's about as annoying as a mosquito at a barbecue, yes he can do damage, but swat him right and he's done.
New players are going to get wrecked. It's f*kin PvP for the love of Bob, that's how it works! You can't just pick up a controller after putting a new title on and serially expect that, "I just got this sh!t, but hey I'm amazing at everything so, here I go!" That's asinine. It's called "skill check" for a reason. It IS possible to block/parry multiple hits in a certain window. Parry one strike and you also parry any unblockables coming during that window as well. Learn your timings.

Firstly, calm down.

What I was saying is that a new player learns the ropes and most classes are gonna play in a certain way befitting their role (assassin, heavy, hybrid etc). Having learnt those basics, Cent, is completely different to all of them, a new player going up against a cent isn’t even going to learn how to respond once they take the particular hit we're all talking about because unlike any other character, you’re simply having a rough ride until it’s over, therefore he doesn't play by the same rules; and before you pop your nut again, it was a metaphor, not literal "rules". e.g. someone that doesn't fit in, a maverick. You get the point.

Like I said, he needs a buff and a rework - because as someone who's played enough I don't consider him a threat, and make damn sure he ain't around long enough in 4v4 because he's problematic with the way he fits into those modes. Apart from your obviously godly self, it doesn't take a lot of thought to see how he's a bad fit - not great 1v1, kinda awful 4v4, and for the most part not fun to fight against when he comes out of nowhere to punch you in the back of the head... or worse, he arrives with his 2 cent mates who all try to punch you in the back of the head for instakill jumping romans damage. Like most every other post has articulated above. You can keep the assumptions and advice, believe it or not others can play this game too. In the context of a new player, cent is a freight train compared to most the cast when you don’t know what to expect, and more than an annoyance otherwise.

Knight_Raime
05-01-2018, 03:38 PM
The problem with Cent even now though is the potential punish for one mistake costs the majority of heroes half their HP. Which is possible for a lot of heroes but that only applies to an OOS punish while your opponent is on the ground. Cent doesn't need an OOS punish to do a ridiculous amount of damage. I'm not saying he's really hard to counter, but no character should be able to that over one mistake.

It's contradictory saying that someone shouldn't be punished that hard on a single mistake but then also acknowledge OOS punishes and being fine with those. Centurion doesn't have a light parry punish compared to all other heros in the game. His punishes only change if a surface is near by or the opponent is OOS. So the fact that he can "sometimes" get 65 damage off of one mess up is perfectly fine. He struggles to do anything beyond raw attacks. and his parries do not give good options in normal circumstances. In order to nerf his overall punishment game he'd have to get a lot better in every other regard. I personally like his current style and wouldn't want that.



The OP doesnít need to have the for honour dictionary on hand to get his point across without the dismissive response. Cent is not a great design for this game. 1v1 he isnít great and 4v4 heís an awful fit. I honestly think cent needs a rework from the ground up.

OP is also 100% right regarding new players and the free weekend. Put a decent cent player in with any of them and welcome them to what will seem like the most frustrating character on the planet.

If the OP wants to be taken seriously by anyone who is very serious about this game then how OP words himself is important. If he's going to throw terms around like vortex incorrectly those people will not give him the time of day because he doesn't know the game on enough of a fundemental level to have a serious discussion with. Just because me or others are dismissing an argument from him doesn't mean we don't acknowledge his feelings. Just means that arguing would be pointless because the guy is legitimately ignorant.

I would say berzerker or shinobi are far worse heros (if we consider the person playing said heros to be experienced/ a veteran) for a new player to fight against. Zerker will ignore everything you do with hyper armor and attack faster than they could react. and shinobi will just dodge everything and bounce around from being up close to out of range getting constant sickle rains on a whiffed hit. imo Centurion is only at his peak of frustration when it comes to people who do know the game well enough but their reaction times are slow as heck or they just for whatever reason can't learn to read an opponents behavior.

As for "centurion being bad for the game/bad design" i'll have to agree to disagree. His execution of being a turtle breaker didn't work. but his current identity that he got on accident of being high risk high reward works rather well with the games fencing feels. I would argue shinobi or aramusha/zerk would be not fit for the game design wise. Shinobi is incredibly mobile in a game where mobility isn't factored in for anyone else. That's broken. And zerk/mushu being combo characters in a game that revolves around single hits maybe 2 before defense kicks in. also doesn't work well.

Vakris_One
05-01-2018, 04:07 PM
Firstly, calm down.

What I was saying is that a new player learns the ropes and most classes are gonna play in a certain way befitting their role (assassin, heavy, hybrid etc). Having learnt those basics, Cent, is completely different to all of them, a new player going up against a cent isnít even going to learn how to respond once they take the particular hit we're all talking about because unlike any other character, youíre simply having a rough ride until itís over, therefore he doesn't play by the same rules; and before you pop your nut again, it was a metaphor, not literal "rules". e.g. someone that doesn't fit in, a maverick. You get the point.

Like I said, he needs a buff and a rework - because as someone who's played enough I don't consider him a threat, and make damn sure he ain't around long enough in 4v4 because he's problematic with the way he fits into those modes. Apart from your obviously godly self, it doesn't take a lot of thought to see how he's a bad fit - not great 1v1, kinda awful 4v4, and for the most part not fun to fight against when he comes out of nowhere to punch you in the back of the head... or worse, he arrives with his 2 cent mates who all try to punch you in the back of the head for instakill jumping romans damage. Like most every other post has articulated above. You can keep the assumptions and advice, believe it or not others can play this game too. In the context of a new player, cent is a freight train compared to most the cast when you donít know what to expect, and more than an annoyance otherwise.
In all fairness most characters are freight trains for a new player. Kensei, Highlander, Aramusha even Shugoki and Valkyrie can be an oppressive nightmare for new players. I don't think it should mean that every character who can stomp noobies should be made weaker because then we'd be nerfing 90% of the roster.

Centy McCentface was designed to be a playground bully, to throw the opponent around and generally man handle them. Much like a playground bully though once he steps out of the playground and into the mean streets (i.e. moves up from seal clubbing inexperienced players) he gets his arse handed to him by people he cannot bully around. It's a very flawed design to base a character around because it ensures this character will either be kept in B-tier on purpose or become a really unfun and nasty character for most people to fight like he was in Season 2. Either they redesign him or they keep him forcibly in the lower tier of heroes. The devs have really put themselves into a corner with Centurion.

Kelson27
05-01-2018, 11:34 PM
Iím not saying any of them are perfect, should be nerfed or that newcomers donít need to learn how to play, but I am saying cent in particular (especially 4v4) is built around disabling the player and all of his damage comes from a single mistake - the rest of the cast you can respond for the most part. Thereís also disabling a player and getting free damage in a duel compared to disabling a player in 4v4, where if he ever connects thatís likely the end due to other players also getting in on that free damage. itís a pretty big advantage if heís coming from off screen, he had to go fast if youíre ever outnumbered.

Youíre right, devs have definitely cornered themselves with this guy. I actually like the play style for him, I just donít know how they work him out across everything for honour has to offer... without doing what they did and nerfing him into the ground. Now heís still a pain, but not hard to deal with.

Kelson27
05-02-2018, 12:13 AM
If the OP wants to be taken seriously by anyone who is very serious about this game then how OP words himself is important. If he's going to throw terms around like vortex incorrectly those people will not give him the time of day because he doesn't know the game on enough of a fundemental level to have a serious discussion with. Just because me or others are dismissing an argument from him doesn't mean we don't acknowledge his feelings. Just means that arguing would be pointless because the guy is legitimately ignorant.

I would say berzerker or shinobi are far worse heros (if we consider the person playing said heros to be experienced/ a veteran) for a new player to fight against. Zerker will ignore everything you do with hyper armor and attack faster than they could react. and shinobi will just dodge everything and bounce around from being up close to out of range getting constant sickle rains on a whiffed hit. imo Centurion is only at his peak of frustration when it comes to people who do know the game well enough but their reaction times are slow as heck or they just for whatever reason can't learn to read an opponents behavior.

As for "centurion being bad for the game/bad design" i'll have to agree to disagree. His execution of being a turtle breaker didn't work. but his current identity that he got on accident of being high risk high reward works rather well with the games fencing feels. I would argue shinobi or aramusha/zerk would be not fit for the game design wise. Shinobi is incredibly mobile in a game where mobility isn't factored in for anyone else. That's broken. And zerk/mushu being combo characters in a game that revolves around single hits maybe 2 before defense kicks in. also doesn't work well.

Common courtesy shouldnít be conditional. Besides, youíre still here discussing it anyway right? So what the problem with having respect for others.

Iím with you on some of the other characters too, I actually like a lot of these characters but hyper armour and the newer characters/reworks are a step above/outside the original cast by a long shot - shinobi was a hell of a handful when he first came out and still sticks out like a sore thumb. Given how much he stands out kudos to the devs that he also isnít a complete mess.

Cent is bad for what he brings to 4v4 more than anything else, my only problem with him is that he takes you out the match - which is a personal hate for most moves that remove control away from the player, he just does it with a tonne of damage and stamina in tow. Iíve got all my fingers and toes crossed for the orochi rework (hopefully in 2 days!) because more and more Iím hitting a wall, thereís just no options compared to these new classes. 1-2 hits is all I got! On a side note I jumped into arena last night to see what the preset move set was for him. Incredibly depressing for it to only have one, and that was storm rush into top lights... god iíd like to be able to mix it up a lil and not have every opponent immediately just guard top. Anyway Iím way off topic now, just my 2 cents 😋