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CptMatsumaru
03-18-2018, 11:17 AM
In advance: I have read another post concerning the console.
I would be glad about your experience with the PC version.

Classify the heroes as follows:


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Tier categories (listed first means higher in the respective tier)
S: Heroes that have a strong moveset with little to no weaknesses. Has a good match up against all other heroes.

A: Heroes that have a strong moveset with one or two weaknesses. Has a good match up against most other heroes.

B: Heroes that have an good moveset with a few weaknesses. Has a good match up against some heroes, weak against others.

C: Heroes that have a below average moveset. Has a weak match up against some heroes, average against others.

D: Heroes that have a mediocre moveset. Has a weak match up against almost all other heroes.
++


PC duel tier list - My opinion.


S: Centurion, gladiator, warlord (Kensei in Test your metall)

A: Shinobi, Aramusha, Shugoki, Warden

B: Raider, Lawbringer, Shaman, Peacekeeper, Valkyrie

C: Conqueror, Nobushi, Orochi, Highlander

D: Kensei(player), Berserker



Maybe you should mention, with which character you classify these opponents.

I've had this experience with the following heroes: Valkyr and Raider


What is your opinion (PC version)

BarbeQMichael
03-18-2018, 11:25 AM
Kensei and conq are way higher now after reworks, both solid A. And PK is still the S++ she has always been, even the last stats show her winning more duels than the 2nd best hero in the game (shaman) by large margin

CptMatsumaru
03-18-2018, 11:30 AM
Kensei and conq are way higher now after reworks, both solid A. And PK is still the S++ she has always been, even the last stats show her winning more duels than the 2nd best hero in the game (shaman) by large margin

In general, I find Kensei really strong. Especially in group fights.
In test your metal, I even found the Kensei the strongest. He never did the same.
But if you know what's coming (mostly dodgehit), it's easy in my opinion.

Conqueror, if there are no cliffs nearby, he can be forced with a little patience as a raider to his knees.

With Valkyr, Peacekeeper keeps a good distance. But I understand very well what you mean. The little tick can heat up quite well.

Baturai
03-18-2018, 11:31 AM
S Shaman
+A Glad Berserker
- A Pk Conq Nobushi Aramusha Highlander
+B Centurion Lawbringer Kensei Shinobi Warlord
-B Raider Warden Shukogi
+C Valk Orochi
-C Ubisoft at work

Jarl.Felix
03-18-2018, 04:41 PM
S: Shaman, PK, Gladiator
A: Berserker, Kensei, Warden, Aramusha
B: Conq, Highlander, Shinobi, Nobushi, Warlord, Lawbringer
C: Centurion,Raider,Orochi, Shugoki
D: Valkyre,

Hormly
03-18-2018, 04:45 PM
Warlord hasn't been top tier for a loooong time
He can still survive though with solid playing

EvoX.
03-18-2018, 05:10 PM
Is this a list of your personal varying difficulty with the heroes? Because it's really not even close to being true in the competitive sense. Centurion S-tier, PK B-tier, Warden A-tier, Conqueror C-tier is how a beginner would rank them, no offense meant.

This is more or less how it goes for Duels when it comes to the best FH players using them:

S: PK (the best hero), Gladiator, Conqueror
A: Shaman, Kensei, Berzerker, Warlord, Nobushi
B: Shinobi, Raider, Highlander, Orochi, Aramusha
C: Centurion, Warden, Shugoki, Lawbringer
D: Valkyrie

I really hope Valkyrie's rework comes soon.

CptMatsumaru
03-18-2018, 06:11 PM
Is this a list of your personal varying difficulty with the heroes? Because it's really not even close to being true in the competitive sense. Centurion S-tier, PK B-tier, Warden A-tier, Conqueror C-tier is how a beginner would rank them, no offense meant.

This is more or less how it goes for Duels when it comes to the best FH players using them:

S: PK (the best hero), Gladiator, Conqueror
A: Shaman, Kensei, Berzerker, Warlord, Nobushi
B: Shinobi, Raider, Highlander, Orochi, Aramusha
C: Centurion, Warden, Shugoki, Lawbringer
D: Valkyrie

I really hope Valkyrie's rework comes soon.

These are my experiences.
I'm sorry that they are different from yours.

Charmzzz
03-20-2018, 10:19 AM
Kensei and conq are way higher now after reworks, both solid A. And PK is still the S++ she has always been, even the last stats show her winning more duels than the 2nd best hero in the game (shaman) by large margin

Uhm, no:

https://forhonor.ubisoft.com/game/en-gb/news-community/detail.aspx?c=tcm:154-320343-16&ct=tcm:154-76770-32

Season 4 Data, PK did not change until now. You consider 2% a "large margin"? Yes, PK has the best Winrate overall, but it is "only" 58%. That's not like you would win every match because you picked PK. ;)

The lowest Winrates are on Highlander and Kensei, both got buffed in S5. Their winrates are probably up now, closely to 50% hopefully. So the "big" unbalance in this game ranges from ~50-58%. Not that big winrate range you thought, eh? ;)

BarbeQMichael
03-20-2018, 11:58 AM
Uhm, no:

https://forhonor.ubisoft.com/game/en-gb/news-community/detail.aspx?c=tcm:154-320343-16&ct=tcm:154-76770-32

Season 4 Data, PK did not change until now. You consider 2% a "large margin"? Yes, PK has the best Winrate overall, but it is "only" 58%. That's not like you would win every match because you picked PK. ;)

The lowest Winrates are on Highlander and Kensei, both got buffed in S5. Their winrates are probably up now, closely to 50% hopefully. So the "big" unbalance in this game ranges from ~50-58%. Not that big winrate range you thought, eh? ;)

Obviously 58% is not 100%, even pk's lose now and then. That is significant difference though when you start analyzing the stats. It is also not 2%, but 2 percentage units.

If we take your dispersion ranges of 50-58 (impossible, if someone is better i.e. >50%, someone is always worse so the minimum can't be 50% but anyway), an increase from 6 (shaman's 56) to 8 (pk 58) is 33% increase in effectiveness. That is huge gap.

From what I know from multiplayer games with different playable characters, cars, tanks, guns whatever chassis they use, 50% wr is the main goal to ensure healthy gameplay. Differences up to 48-52 are acceptable altough they show that someone is more powerful than the other. When you deepen the gap, it is clear something needs to be done.


Not sure if you are familiar how statistics work, but yeah, winrate ranges are far too big.

Charmzzz
03-20-2018, 12:58 PM
I know that is way too high, but not like OP in the meaning of "unbeatable". Look at the different matchups, some are going pretty bad for PK like facing Lawbringers (3rd in the winrate). And that is pretty old Data before dedicated Servers (for Dominion) and Reworks were in. I bet that PK Winrate is down to maybe 54-55% now in Duels due to the Reworks. Zerker and Kensei are probably very high now, maybe even Highlander.

Also, this shows the Top 2.5% of the players concerning MMR. Does not mean that PK would do better in lower brackets. Still I am in for a "nerf" on the PK Zone as that is the tool which allows her to get this Winrate. Nerf it to 500ms and give her the mixups she had back. Completely in for that!

CptMatsumaru
03-20-2018, 01:33 PM
I know that is way too high, but not like OP in the meaning of "unbeatable". Look at the different matchups, some are going pretty bad for PK like facing Lawbringers (3rd in the winrate). And that is pretty old Data before dedicated Servers (for Dominion) and Reworks were in. I bet that PK Winrate is down to maybe 54-55% now in Duels due to the Reworks. Zerker and Kensei are probably very high now, maybe even Highlander.

Also, this shows the Top 2.5% of the players concerning MMR. Does not mean that PK would do better in lower brackets. Still I am in for a "nerf" on the PK Zone as that is the tool which allows her to get this Winrate. Nerf it to 500ms and give her the mixups she had back. Completely in for that!

This is my opinion:

I find in duels the game is relatively well balanced if you bring a certain talent.
And I think in duel it's less about the heroes, but the players who play them.
PK may be a dangerous beast, but if you master the counters and block, the PK can beat you even with Valkyr.
It may be that in the high league some heroes stand out, but as Charmzzz said: The numbers are relatively small.
I also think that one meets very rarely on the PK. And until you have adjusted to him, usually the duels are already over. As with Valkyr.
So far I met 2 types of PK. The one urges you to grab and sting your kidney and then stay at a distance. the other one dodges, light hits and turtles most of the time.

As I said, my experiences are purely based on the simple duel mode and beta tournament / duel.

i hope, translate works fine. *grin*