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trident42
05-14-2006, 08:58 AM
On my latest patrol i was having trouble finding any juicy convoys or anything really worth the trouble sinking. While patroling AM51 i got a ship spotted so i took a look and saw this.

http://i43.photobucket.com/albums/e367/trident42/Binocularsview.jpg

I immediately thought "task force". Unfortuanately the weather is perfect and it just passed midday. I couldn't hold off until night because it was moving to fast but i had the perfect opportunity to get in front and attack. Upon closer inspection of the convoy i saw that the was a beautiful prize in the centre of the convoy.

http://i43.photobucket.com/albums/e367/trident42/Identified.jpg

However there were five escorts, a mixture of V and W and C class destroyers.

I decided i would need to sneak closer to the task forc as i only had one T3 electric left and the rest of my torps were Steam T1s. Not too good for the weather conditions, they would probably spot the bubble trail a mile off. I managed to sneak to within about a thousand metres of the path of the task force and i lay in wait at periscope depth, my excitement gathering at the impending approach of the carrier. When it was a few hundred metres off abeam i raised the scope just above the waterline taking a risk as a destroyer was coming dangerously close to my scope.

http://i43.photobucket.com/albums/e367/trident42/ClosePicofCarrier.jpg

I plotted a quick solution on the notepad and fired off a single steam torp. It didn't take long for the torp to reach its target. Check out the awesome fireworks.

http://i43.photobucket.com/albums/e367/trident42/TorpedoRuncarrier.jpg
http://i43.photobucket.com/albums/e367/trident42/CarrierHit.jpg
http://i43.photobucket.com/albums/e367/trident42/Explodingcarrier2.jpg
http://i43.photobucket.com/albums/e367/trident42/ExplodingCarrier3.jpg

Obviously i must have hit the ammo bunker, you probably could have seen the explosion from 1000 miles away.

However this fantastic success was quickly overshadowed by the fact i had about 3 of the excorts immediately pinging me. I then began to draw odds on me surviving this, however i looked at it the odds never came up good. I also noticed that a couple of avengers were circling and bombing a part of the ocean way away from me, god knows where they came from, the carrier probably.

http://i43.photobucket.com/albums/e367/trident42/Lookingforme.jpg
http://i43.photobucket.com/albums/e367/trident42/DepthCharged.jpg

Of course i didn't survive, i managed to last about a half hour of depth charging before i succumbed to a perfectly placed and weighted depth charge that destroyed me.

I therefore ask for this communities advice on how better to approach this. Would it be better to hang back a few KM and set up a shot with my single electric, out of range of the excorts or fire a salvo, steams and all and hope that it doesn't avoid them.

Anyone have a suggestion?

trident42
05-14-2006, 08:58 AM
On my latest patrol i was having trouble finding any juicy convoys or anything really worth the trouble sinking. While patroling AM51 i got a ship spotted so i took a look and saw this.

http://i43.photobucket.com/albums/e367/trident42/Binocularsview.jpg

I immediately thought "task force". Unfortuanately the weather is perfect and it just passed midday. I couldn't hold off until night because it was moving to fast but i had the perfect opportunity to get in front and attack. Upon closer inspection of the convoy i saw that the was a beautiful prize in the centre of the convoy.

http://i43.photobucket.com/albums/e367/trident42/Identified.jpg

However there were five escorts, a mixture of V and W and C class destroyers.

I decided i would need to sneak closer to the task forc as i only had one T3 electric left and the rest of my torps were Steam T1s. Not too good for the weather conditions, they would probably spot the bubble trail a mile off. I managed to sneak to within about a thousand metres of the path of the task force and i lay in wait at periscope depth, my excitement gathering at the impending approach of the carrier. When it was a few hundred metres off abeam i raised the scope just above the waterline taking a risk as a destroyer was coming dangerously close to my scope.

http://i43.photobucket.com/albums/e367/trident42/ClosePicofCarrier.jpg

I plotted a quick solution on the notepad and fired off a single steam torp. It didn't take long for the torp to reach its target. Check out the awesome fireworks.

http://i43.photobucket.com/albums/e367/trident42/TorpedoRuncarrier.jpg
http://i43.photobucket.com/albums/e367/trident42/CarrierHit.jpg
http://i43.photobucket.com/albums/e367/trident42/Explodingcarrier2.jpg
http://i43.photobucket.com/albums/e367/trident42/ExplodingCarrier3.jpg

Obviously i must have hit the ammo bunker, you probably could have seen the explosion from 1000 miles away.

However this fantastic success was quickly overshadowed by the fact i had about 3 of the excorts immediately pinging me. I then began to draw odds on me surviving this, however i looked at it the odds never came up good. I also noticed that a couple of avengers were circling and bombing a part of the ocean way away from me, god knows where they came from, the carrier probably.

http://i43.photobucket.com/albums/e367/trident42/Lookingforme.jpg
http://i43.photobucket.com/albums/e367/trident42/DepthCharged.jpg

Of course i didn't survive, i managed to last about a half hour of depth charging before i succumbed to a perfectly placed and weighted depth charge that destroyed me.

I therefore ask for this communities advice on how better to approach this. Would it be better to hang back a few KM and set up a shot with my single electric, out of range of the excorts or fire a salvo, steams and all and hope that it doesn't avoid them.

Anyone have a suggestion?

lecek
05-14-2006, 10:00 AM
You are in a type VII (B or C?) and you are only 97 meters deep 12 minutes after the attack.

Par in a VII after twelve minutes from periscope deapth is 130+ meters. With the flank manuvers you did at 1255, you should have been down to 200 meters by then. In a VIIB you should gone down and crowded 220 meters. +20 if you are in a VIIC.

This raises the question. Are you in shallow water?

VikingGrandad
05-14-2006, 10:03 AM
The first time I attacked a hunter-killer group (Bogue escort carrier and destroyers) I was in my trusty IX-B.

I figured that I could reliably sink the Bogue with 2 torps at a range of 4km from its projected course. But, even at 4km, I was concerned that the escorts would guess my position and pursue me. So I made things easier for myself....

Unlike a convoy attack, there was little point trying to attack more than the one prize target - I just needed to launch two torps then get away fast. I realized that if I turned the boat through 180° and launched my two aft torps at a range of 4km, I could then immediately sail away and gain a further 0.4km between me and the enemy (given that the torps are around 10 times faster than my submerged boat at silent running speed).

It worked! I hit the carrier amidships and in the fore magazine and got away without even being detected http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_cool.gif The carrier exploded and sank, then the destroyers swarmed around the area I would have been in if I'd used my bow torps and turned around to escape (which would have taken me closer to the enemy)

The tactic worked fairly reliably for another 2 or 3 hunter groups I've attacked, even in 1945. Obviously you need good visibility (or exceptional hydrophone and manual targetting skills) or you'll have to reverse in closer. But even at closer ranges, you still have a better chance of getting away.

I hope that helps. Maybe try it at a longer range if you're confident enough with your targetting.

Celeon999
05-14-2006, 10:14 AM
Nice hit http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

Celeon still believes in the "beans" theory that says that letting over hundred sailors aboard an big ship eat beans for lunch can create a dangerous amount of highly inflamable bio-gases within the ship.

Then a torp as trigger and BANG !! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/88.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/88.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/35.gif

trident42
05-14-2006, 11:02 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by lecek:
You are in a type VII (B or C?) and you are only 97 meters deep 12 minutes after the attack.

Par in a VII after twelve minutes from periscope deapth is 130+ meters. With the flank manuvers you did at 1255, you should have been down to 200 meters by then. In a VIIB you should gone down and crowded 220 meters. +20 if you are in a VIIC.

This raises the question. Are you in shallow water? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I'm in a VIIC, unfortuanately my boat was damaged in a previous unrelated skirmish with another destroyer, of which i eventually came out on top http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif . I don't know what my percentage hull was because i run IUB and it takes away the Hull percentage display but i was starting to take damage below 100 metres. I agree though i should have pushed it more considering the situation.

Viking Grandad has an interesting tactic, in my VIIC i only have one aft tube though, but it does have TIII loaded. Still it would have to be an exceptional shot to pull it off, i will try it later when the paracetamol takes effect. I have a terrible headache, think i may have had a few too many Warsteiners last night. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

VikingGrandad
05-14-2006, 11:27 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by trident42:
Viking Grandad has an interesting tactic, in my VIIC i only have one aft tube though, but it does have TIII loaded. Still it would have to be an exceptional shot to pull it off, i will try it later when the paracetamol takes effect. I have a terrible headache, think i may have had a few too many Warsteiners last night. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/35.gif I forgot to ask which U-boat you have.

Just once, I sunk a carrier with one torp to the fore magazine (an under keel shot in good weather).

To someone who didn't drink any Warsteiners last night, "too many Warsteiners" sounds very appealing!! I could just drink "too many" right now http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-tongue.gif

lecek
05-14-2006, 01:33 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by trident42:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by lecek:
You are in a type VII (B or C?) and you are only 97 meters deep 12 minutes after the attack.

Par in a VII after twelve minutes from periscope deapth is 130+ meters. With the flank manuvers you did at 1255, you should have been down to 200 meters by then. In a VIIB you should gone down and crowded 220 meters. +20 if you are in a VIIC.

This raises the question. Are you in shallow water? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I'm in a VIIC, unfortuanately my boat was damaged in a previous unrelated skirmish with another destroyer, of which i eventually came out on top http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif . I don't know what my percentage hull was because i run IUB and it takes away the Hull percentage display but i was starting to take damage below 100 metres. I agree though i should have pushed it more considering the situation.

Viking Grandad has an interesting tactic, in my VIIC i only have one aft tube though, but it does have TIII loaded. Still it would have to be an exceptional shot to pull it off, i will try it later when the paracetamol takes effect. I have a terrible headache, think i may have had a few too many Warsteiners last night. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Eww taking damage at 100 meters.

No you shouldn't have pushed it. You had to find a way to dodge them at that depth.

Once you start taking damage at a depth you have only a short time before you die. This is because as you take damage you lower you max dive depth, which means you take more damage etc.

If you were already that badly damaged that 100 meters gives you damage then you would have been better off not trying to take on a taskforce.

Regarding the one shot out the aft tube. You don't need to sink the carrier, just slow it down or stop it. Eventually the rest of the AI taskforce will leave it behind.

I don't know where the engine room is on that thing though. In the RL ones I think it was aft since they were just converted T2's. But I don't know if they are still aft after the conversion or if the Dev Team got it right.

StgShultz
05-14-2006, 02:03 PM
Nice pics, so really juicy targets do exist.

rls669
05-14-2006, 02:20 PM
I would've used the TIII electric. I find that there's a huge difference in escort behaviour vs. attacking with steam torps. I'm in mid 1943 now and if I fire a single steam torp the escorts all converge on my location. If I use electrics they come in slow and dumb. Most of the time they don't even weave, making it easy to pick them off.

I just blundered right into the middle of a convoy in heavy fog -- I had to surface to charge batteries, when I submerged again there were contacts everywhere heading straight for me. I sat in one spot firing electrics fore and aft and the escorts had no idea where I was.

trident42
05-14-2006, 04:18 PM
Ha, I sank that Bogue but good.

I tried again but this time i stopped around 3000m away from the carrier and fired my TIII electric. I immediately turned around and put some more distance between me and the escorts, thankfully it was a long time before the torpedo reached its target. I hit it bang in the middle but there was no huge explosion this time, instead i crippled it. I just backed off and hit it again with two more steam torps form over 5000m away, it was easy with the carrier crippled and boom! One less bogue.

The escorts sure were pissed, but i was way too far away, they never even got close. Result!! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_cool.gif

Bucketlung
05-14-2006, 04:51 PM
Excellent. Most Excellent.

JU88
05-14-2006, 05:23 PM
Nice IX trick you got there VikingGrandad, though I guess this wont work if you discover the HK group moving at 21 knots at visual range, by the time you've swung your IX around 180 degrees submerged at silent speed- that HK group will be docked in port somewhere while its crew get trashed at the local pub.

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/35.gif

VikingGrandad
05-14-2006, 05:56 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by JU88:
Nice IX trick you got there VikingGrandad, though I guess this wont work if you discover the HK group moving at 21 knots at visual range, by the time you've swung your IX around 180 degrees submerged at silent speed- that HK group will be docked in port somewhere while its crew get trashed at the local pub.

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/35.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Well, depending on the distances and speeds involved, you don't necessarily have to swing the IX around 180&deg; to make the manoeuvre work... If there is time, you might be able to get into a good aft-torpedo attack position by continuing your 'standard' interception course and crossing over the carrier's projected course. Because you won't use up any time doing a big slow turn, you might just get far enough to attack and escape http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Of course you have to consider the positions of the escorts, particular if there are any on the 'wings', which often are asymmetrically positioned. Just do whatever keeps your boat moving away from the escorts (with minimal turning) and launch those rear torps at the longest possible range.

At 21kts and at closer ranges, if I couldn't use my aft torps with a good chance of evasion I would most likely decline to attack the carrier altogether (and head on over to AM53 or BF15 to pick up some consolation prizes http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif )

PS - thanks again for the gfx card recommendation. It's superb and the new system runs very sweetly http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif