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View Full Version : Worrying about Berserker Rework.



Trenk2009
01-16-2018, 12:00 AM
I just started to play non stop Berserker up to almost rep 9 now !

I really love the way he plays and feels ! His super armor, his recoverys cancel and startup cancels, etc ...

I really hope you guys didn't change him to much. What he needs is simply an opener to get trough turtle not even trying to parry. But plz don't make it simply easy to utelize and keep his original feeling and complexity !

What I see would be good for him:

1) His zone needs to be able to get followed up by a heavy, not only a light.

2) Once Zerker launches 4 attacks, regardless of if they connected of not, he enters a new state where he "glows" in a dark-red (hyper armor shugoki style).
While in that state, the Zerker zone attack is modified depending on if launched after a heavy or a light.

If the zone is thrown after a light, zerker only spins twice hitting his ennemie with 2 unblockable lights. The speed of the first light is the same as the speed of the base zone and the light coming afterward behave the same and cannot be blocked if the first one isn't. Those 2 lights inflict the same damages as the whole basic zone and are unblockable.
Once this type of zone is thrown, the zerker can continue is chain either with a heavy or a light. Those counts as the second attack of a chain meaning he gets is super armor back instantly and his halfway trough being on his new state again.

If the zone is thrown after a heavy however, zerker throws a punch in front of him stunning and stagerring his opponent for a garanteed side heavy. Stamina-wise, his punch acts the same as a valk heabut, thus meaning that if the punch gets his opponent stamina to 0, he falls, allowing the zerker for a side heavy into top heavy. The punch can't get followed by a light.
If the heavy before the zone connects, the punch is garanteed to connect. If the punch is dodged, zerker is vulnerable to a free gb.
Regardless of if the punch connects or not, zerker is brought back to is neutral state so need 2 stikes to get his super armor back.

When it comes to how those 4 stikes are counted to give Zerker his new state it should be pointed out that: any dodged-soft feint of the zerker and any dodge recovery cancles of the zerker, if then linked with a spin chopped or a head crusher, do NOT reset the counting.
Which means that, for instance:
- A berserker can throw a light, a side heavy, and a top heavy; all 3 out of position, then cancel the recovery from the top heavy with a spin chop or a head crusher that would count as a 4th attack; thus getting him into his new state on that last attack.
- A berserker can also throw 3 attacks of his infinite chain, then soft feint the startup of his 4th attack with a spin chop, and still get in his new state with that attack.


I think that, those changes, would help the berserker getting higher in the tier list by offering him some tools to open-up turtles while still giving him that higly agressive harrasser feeling he's supposed to bring.

Knight_Raime
01-16-2018, 05:52 AM
I don't see zerk being heavily reworked. They're probably just going to give her better mix up options/flexibility. maybe a new move or 2.

MassiveD.
01-16-2018, 10:27 AM
Berserkers flickering side lights that are as fast as PK's zone can f*** right off

PDXGorechild
01-16-2018, 10:41 AM
Berserkers flickering side lights that are as fast as PK's zone can f*** right off

Do you mean his zone attack? Get real.

At the OP - we've been posting stuff for almost a year about Berserker and the general theme is the one you're promoting - Berserker mains love the playstyle of the class but just feel he needs more ways to open turtles up. Hopefully they forums representatives have relayed this to the dev's, as they said they would.

All he needs is a couple of soft feints like Shaman and possibly a melee attack (in the form of the punch he does after GB, was a popular idea). He doesn't need an unblockable or anything else changing majorly.

MassiveD.
01-16-2018, 10:53 AM
Do you mean his zone attack? Get real.

At the OP - we've been posting stuff for almost a year about Berserker and the general theme is the one you're promoting - Berserker mains love the playstyle of the class but just feel he needs more ways to open turtles up. Hopefully they forums representatives have relayed this to the dev's, as they said they would.

All he needs is a couple of soft feints like Shaman and possibly a melee attack (in the form of the punch he does after GB, was a popular idea). He doesn't need an unblockable or anything else changing majorly.

I'm talking about his normal side lights that in combination with reflex guard can be made almost impossible to react to

PDXGorechild
01-16-2018, 11:01 AM
I'm talking about his normal side lights that in combination with reflex guard can be made almost impossible to react to

The 500ms side lights, of which there are no follow up attacks to other than a slower heavy attack?

MassiveD.
01-16-2018, 11:35 AM
The 500ms side lights, of which there are no follow up attacks to other than a slower heavy attack?

You can use reflex guard and lights and nothing else to win the game because of lack of snap, I've seen an influx of bersekers abusing this over and over, not that I have a problem with them personally, but thats all they do these days

PDXGorechild
01-16-2018, 11:40 AM
You can use reflex guard and lights and nothing else to win the game because of lack of snap, I've seen an influx of bersekers abusing this over and over, not that I have a problem with them personally, but thats all they do these days

What do you mean use reflex guard to win the game? It's a defensive mechanic. That's because it's pretty much all they can do. They have no openers so have to rely on getting a light off to start their chain attack.

MassiveD.
01-16-2018, 11:56 AM
What do you mean use reflex guard to win the game? It's a defensive mechanic. That's because it's pretty much all they can do. They have no openers so have to rely on getting a light off to start their chain attack.

Sigh, you don't even know what I'm referring to

PDXGorechild
01-16-2018, 12:59 PM
Sigh, you don't even know what I'm referring to

No, I don't, The Berserker has a 500ms light attack on the side. 600ms on the top. No light combo at all. I suppose a Berserker, if he was inclined, could just spin his guard around and alternate sides hitting singular light attacks. The top is too slow and often parried outside of dance of the paired blades. This is a pretty awful tactic though as they do 17 damage each hit...

MassiveD.
01-16-2018, 01:16 PM
No, I don't, The Berserker has a 500ms light attack on the side. 600ms on the top. No light combo at all. I suppose a Berserker, if he was inclined, could just spin his guard around and alternate sides hitting singular light attacks. The top is too slow and often parried outside of dance of the paired blades. This is a pretty awful tactic though as they do 17 damage each hit...

You can mask direction of attack using reflex guard, stop talking if you have no idea what you are talking about

PDXGorechild
01-16-2018, 01:30 PM
If you're getting beat by Berserkers who are killing you with singular, low damage light attacks from 100 > 0, masked or not, I think the fault may be yours.

MassiveD.
01-16-2018, 01:48 PM
If you're getting beat by Berserkers who are killing you with singular, low damage light attacks from 100 > 0, masked or not, I think the fault may be yours.

Again, first learn what is being talked about, then offer your opinion. That will save you from looking like a windowlicker in public, gl

Trenk2009
01-16-2018, 03:35 PM
Again, first learn what is being talked about, then offer your opinion. That will save you from looking like a windowlicker in public, gl

Honestly your being the dumb one here.

Every assassin "mask" their guard, you need to simply react to the indicator.
When you play a reular blocking hero, you rarely stay 3 hours in a single stance before attacking, you switch then attack. There's not difference here.
If you can't block basic zerker lights you are the issue. There's no flickering what so ever.

MassiveD.
01-16-2018, 03:54 PM
Honestly your being the dumb one here.

Every assassin "mask" their guard, you need to simply react to the indicator.
When you play a reular blocking hero, you rarely stay 3 hours in a single stance before attacking, you switch then attack. There's not difference here.
If you can't block basic zerker lights you are the issue. There's no flickering what so ever.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lSQkKn5O58Q


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h_uNd1GMjNs


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5PUqoHDk8lw

And that's why with reflex guard masking and time snap removal in combination, some light attacks are nearly unreactable, berserker is peaking at below 350 MS indicator on his side lights.

Him and PK

PDXGorechild
01-16-2018, 04:19 PM
Again, first learn what is being talked about, then offer your opinion. That will save you from looking like a windowlicker in public, gl

I know exactly what's being talked about, no thanks to you and your lack of ability to explain yourself clearly.

Assassins spin their guard around constantly, most non-assassins do it too. As Trenk2009 said, you just look for the indicator and don't pay much attention to it. Sure you could just spin your guard around and spam light attacks, all assassins can, most classes can, but Berserker is a terrible class to do this with due to him having no light chain attack. I play against plenty of good players who can block my lights consistently and some even parry my lights out of the blue.

So I stand by my statement, if you're getting beat by Berserkers who switch their guard around and only hit you with singular lights, perhaps you need to pick another game, as you are honestly the first person I have ever heard complaining about Berserker light attacks.

MassiveD.
01-16-2018, 04:49 PM
I know exactly what's being talked about, no thanks to you and your lack of ability to explain yourself clearly.

Assassins spin their guard around constantly, most non-assassins do it too. As Trenk2009 said, you just look for the indicator and don't pay much attention to it. Sure you could just spin your guard around and spam light attacks, all assassins can, most classes can, but Berserker is a terrible class to do this with due to him having no light chain attack. I play against plenty of good players who can block my lights consistently and some even parry my lights out of the blue.

So I stand by my statement, if you're getting beat by Berserkers who switch their guard around and only hit you with singular lights, perhaps you need to pick another game, as you are honestly the first person I have ever heard complaining about Berserker light attacks.

*facepalm* please stop embarrassing yourself and read my above post.




https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lSQkKn5O58Q


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h_uNd1GMjNs


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5PUqoHDk8lw

And that's why with reflex guard masking and time snap removal in combination, some light attacks are nearly unreactable, berserker is peaking at below 350 MS indicator on his side lights.

Him and PK




Also look at this (unrelated video)



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hJkQh_-6lWg

You cannot see which direction gladiator is going to attack because of the reflex guard, indicator only appears when the attack is already flying at you.

Combine this with time snap removal and you get 350ms and below normal light attacks that you can't even see coming before it is too late.

This is not exclusive to berserker, however berserker and PK can abuse this the most right now