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View Full Version : never mind Shaman, WTF is this Aramusha? the bringer of fast light death



kbvlcvfkhgc
11-21-2017, 06:08 PM
I see everyone complaining about the Shaman and no doubt they are yet more cancer introduced to the mix but the Aramusha is on another level, WTF is this infinite light spam of death? i can neither react to it, dodge it or block it, i'm literally helpless, stun spammed into oblivion, lying on the floor dead thinking what the hell just happened? its the S1 PK light spam on steroids, I've killed a good few Aramusha's that look like their still learning the Character but iv'e started meeting some that seem to have this guy figured out and have this stun-spam vortex of fast light death down,

i just don't know? they are sooooo fricking fast i simply just don't have the reactions to deal with them, worrying times, any tips would be appreciated

i'm on PS4

David_gorda
11-21-2017, 06:13 PM
Yeah the lightspam is a problem on ps4, its not to bad against noob aramushas but the ones that use feints aswell are a real nightmare. Stupid Class IMO, shaman is better designed but more op atm.

Strikes91.
11-21-2017, 07:36 PM
Got no problems against shamans but the chain on aramushas gave me brain cancer

DoctorMcBatman
11-21-2017, 07:47 PM
Got no problems against shamans but the chain on aramushas gave me brain cancer

Same.

UbiInsulin
11-21-2017, 07:55 PM
Hey guys, we've definitely seen a few threads on this topic and have let the team know that some players feel Aramusha + light spam is becoming an issue. Thanks for letting us know your thoughts on him!

HumoLoco
11-21-2017, 09:02 PM
Got no problems against shaman and aramusha but gang bang the one who cant do 1v1 or most of them run away from me until they get help.

Omegaweapon1371
11-21-2017, 09:07 PM
I will agree the lights are really fast and kinda hard to react too. Yes you can somehow block it. but its kinda hard. Not only that but the Rock steady Feat along side with it. makes it stupid hard to punish. I can understand a Conq or a Heavy Class having it. But not a Lighting fast runner guy like this one.

KotoKuraken
11-21-2017, 09:12 PM
No offense, but it seems like while you solved the zone flicker, you created a character made up of entirely light flickers
https://j.gifs.com/yrwlgg.gif

Mighty_Mackerel
11-21-2017, 09:18 PM
Yeah I agree, I'm on PS4 as well and I swear every attack in his light chain is like the first strike in a PK zone attack... it is NIGH un-reactable.

Oupyz
11-21-2017, 10:31 PM
if people think shaman is op , they don't know the aramusha yet , wait till more people figure him out =))

lol
he is basically an assassin killer

Ackturi
11-21-2017, 10:41 PM
No offense, but it seems like while you solved the zone flicker, you created a character made up of entirely light flickers
https://j.gifs.com/yrwlgg.gif

don't know if this is a troll post or just hating the soft-feints.... IF they nerf the light combo, then aramusha will have nothing going for him...

Oupyz
11-21-2017, 10:46 PM
u change how guardstance on assassins work , u give them normal guard to deal with aramusha

Knight_Raime
11-21-2017, 10:48 PM
No offense, but it seems like while you solved the zone flicker, you created a character made up of entirely light flickers
https://j.gifs.com/yrwlgg.gif

So 2 things. First is that particular gif is him going from one side heavy to the opposite side heavy. So this is not a "light flicker."
Second is flicker is more about unclearness. In the clip you show there is a full animation of going from one side to another. Where as say an Orochi flicker looked like a light attack and then half way into the zone animation without any sort of visual tell.

In order to have a "light flicker" like you're complaining about you'd have to have a light attack animation that looks like it's in 2 places at once both animation wise and indicator wise.

Omegaweapon1371
11-21-2017, 10:58 PM
I am not even sure how true this is "since I don't play a type of class". But some of my friends who play this alot aswell, Mention depending on the class he can chain you to death with no way to block..I have seen it. but never had it happen to me. and I honestly doubt that my friends are that bad cus there is a easy way to get out of his attack. Still. I really hope ubi takes the Rock Steady perk off of him. It's Really stupid. And add more time for the lights so we can react to it a bit easier... you know unless they can give us 60 FPS on Ps4.
Then I'll be fine.

And I agree the Shamon isn't OP The only Move I think could slightly be changed is her Move when she charges at you with an R2 it seems really hard to react to it and if you do block it. You can't really do anything. I've had some people kinda spam that move on me. and I honestly have trouble finding out which way she is going to hit you. With the shinobi . You can see his hand and that is a tell. But with the Shamon I can't find a tell.

toninhocaganera
11-21-2017, 11:01 PM
I have a question, what has the person who developed this Aramusha got in his head? this game always impresses with a new Cancer

Knight_Raime
11-21-2017, 11:02 PM
I am not even sure how true this is "since I don't play a type of class". But some of my friends who play this alot aswell, Mention depending on the class he can chain you to death with no way to block..I have seen it. but never had it happen to me. and I honestly doubt that my friends are that bad cus there is a easy way to get out of his attack. Still. I really hope ubi takes the Rock Steady perk off of him. It's Really stupid. And add more time for the lights so we can react to it a bit easier... you know unless they can give us 60 FPS on Ps4.
Then I'll be fine.

And I agree the Shamon isn't OP The only Move I think could slightly be changed is her Move when she charges at you with an R2 it seems really hard to react to it and if you do block it. You can't really do anything. I've had some people kinda spam that move on me. and I honestly have trouble finding out which way she is going to hit you. With the shinobi . You can see his hand and that is a tell. But with the Shamon I can't find a tell.

it's 100% blockable even on console with reflex guard. Video proof was put up on the competitive reddit a few days ago. It's just naturally harder on console due to a lower fps. But even then that wouldn't be so bad if we actually had some lag comp. With the lack of lag comp it makes timings on things vary which makes people struggle more. The devs are currently working on a new lag comp system though.

Knight_Raime
11-21-2017, 11:05 PM
I am not even sure how true this is "since I don't play a type of class". But some of my friends who play this alot aswell, Mention depending on the class he can chain you to death with no way to block..I have seen it. but never had it happen to me. and I honestly doubt that my friends are that bad cus there is a easy way to get out of his attack. Still. I really hope ubi takes the Rock Steady perk off of him. It's Really stupid. And add more time for the lights so we can react to it a bit easier... you know unless they can give us 60 FPS on Ps4.
Then I'll be fine.

And I agree the Shamon isn't OP The only Move I think could slightly be changed is her Move when she charges at you with an R2 it seems really hard to react to it and if you do block it. You can't really do anything. I've had some people kinda spam that move on me. and I honestly have trouble finding out which way she is going to hit you. With the shinobi . You can see his hand and that is a tell. But with the Shamon I can't find a tell.

it's 100% blockable even on console with reflex guard. Video proof was put up on the competitive reddit a few days ago. It's just naturally harder on console due to a lower fps. But even then that wouldn't be so bad if we actually had some lag comp. With the lack of lag comp it makes timings on things vary which makes people struggle more. The devs are currently working on a new lag comp system though.

CandleInTheDark
11-21-2017, 11:08 PM
The only Move I think could slightly be changed is her Move when she charges at you with an R2 it seems really hard to react to it and if you do block it. You can't really do anything. I've had some people kinda spam that move on me. and I honestly have trouble finding out which way she is going to hit you. With the shinobi . You can see his hand and that is a tell. But with the Shamon I can't find a tell.

I haven't had anyone aim that at me but it is weird that there isn't an indication outside of which way the arm moves because from my side of the screen in activating the moves, there are red lines kind of like a claw swipe telling me which way it is going. Not saying you are wrong, just I am surprised that if I throw the move at you, I get more indication than you do.

Omegaweapon1371
11-21-2017, 11:22 PM
@ Knight_Raime Thanks for telling me that. I could block it, But some of my friends with the reflex guard said they coulden't do it. I never play anyone with one of them guards so I have never had a problem going for the block/parry.

@ CandleInTheDark I might just not have had enough practise protecting my self from that attack, But When I tested them both out in Trainning and practise modes. I coulden't see anything that would help me know which way she is going to attack from. But is starting to happen alot more now in any game mode Shamons are just running at me with the R2 Then backing off Repeat and I find it very hard to react to. I can sometimes get the block, But Since it is a heavy. It puts you in the Staggering motion for a few secs. And that is enough time for them to back dash and get ready for another Leap of R2 Death.

CandleInTheDark
11-21-2017, 11:35 PM
@ Knight_Raime Thanks for telling me that. I could block it, But some of my friends with the reflex guard said they coulden't do it. I never play anyone with one of them guards so I have never had a problem going for the block/parry.

@ CandleInTheDark I might just not have had enough practise protecting my self from that attack, But When I tested them both out in Trainning and practise modes. I coulden't see anything that would help me know which way she is going to attack from. But is starting to happen alot more now in any game mode Shamons are just running at me with the R2 Then backing off Repeat and I find it very hard to react to. I can sometimes get the block, But Since it is a heavy. It puts you in the Staggering motion for a few secs. And that is enough time for them to back dash and get ready for another Leap of R2 Death.

Fault is on me, having tested it since, that indication comes a lot later than I thought, pretty much on hit. The indication you see comes from which way she is swinging her arm, , but with the speed,I do agree that some indication wouldn't be a bad thing, I also have no idea when your hud indicator pops up with the arrow.

It is a scary move all in all because the next heavy is a chain finisher which then opens up bleed for her. If anything your opponents aren't using it to its capability.

Bl4zingk
11-21-2017, 11:45 PM
it's 100% blockable even on console with reflex guard. Video proof was put up on the competitive reddit a few days ago. It's just naturally harder on console due to a lower fps. But even then that wouldn't be so bad if we actually had some lag comp. With the lack of lag comp it makes timings on things vary which makes people struggle more. The devs are currently working on a new lag comp system though.

It's not blockable all of the time for me. There are times where while im in his light spam i can stop it by throwing my guard up. But other times i can't react to anything.. I'm literally stuck in it. I try to block (charater wont block) try to parry (character won't parry) try to dodge out (character won't dodge out). It doesn't happen all the time but it does happen though and it's stupid.

Knight_Raime
11-21-2017, 11:59 PM
@ Knight_Raime Thanks for telling me that. I could block it, But some of my friends with the reflex guard said they coulden't do it. I never play anyone with one of them guards so I have never had a problem going for the block/parry.

@ CandleInTheDark I might just not have had enough practise protecting my self from that attack, But When I tested them both out in Trainning and practise modes. I coulden't see anything that would help me know which way she is going to attack from. But is starting to happen alot more now in any game mode Shamons are just running at me with the R2 Then backing off Repeat and I find it very hard to react to. I can sometimes get the block, But Since it is a heavy. It puts you in the Staggering motion for a few secs. And that is enough time for them to back dash and get ready for another Leap of R2 Death.

I almost exclusively play reflex guard heros. I don't struggle hard with aramusha unless the match is having some lag issues throwing off the timing for attacks.

Knight_Raime
11-22-2017, 12:04 AM
It's not blockable all of the time for me. There are times where while im in his light spam i can stop it by throwing my guard up. But other times i can't react to anything.. I'm literally stuck in it. I try to block (charater wont block) try to parry (character won't parry) try to dodge out (character won't dodge out). It doesn't happen all the time but it does happen though and it's stupid.

Yeah there are times when I struggle with it as well. usually it's due to a poor quality connection though. I understand people's frustration. But I don't think it deserves a nerf. Maybe if he's still hard to deal with after they add in their lag comp system. But not before.

Herbstlicht
11-22-2017, 12:16 AM
Try to train against the Aramusha bot at first. Even on PS4 everything but the top light in combo is reactible. He is fast, but so are PK, Orochi top light or zone etc.
In Dominion though without timesnap or lag compensation it can get ugly.
But honestly, even Kensei dodge attacks can become instant teleport attacks if the connection is bad enough.

What works for me with Orochi btw is dodging, getting some nice deflects or a side dodge light together with some initiative.
On Highlander I enjoy crushing counter. But only works when I can read my opponent.

Having played Aramusha quiet a but myself though, I think he is rather manageable. In my opinion, as long as the connection is good, he is behind shaman, gladiator and shinobi. At least on a higher skill level.


Anyway, to help with patterns.
If Aramusha goes for the same direction 2x, it will end his combo in a heavy or he goes into a soft feint. If he is on a side, he has to go top. Possible to parry, but very hard. I only block this. If he is top already, he needs to go to a side. Here you can already try a dodge or wait for the indicator to appear. Aramusha is fast, so you might not dodge in time. However, as an assassin, you aren't unlikely to get a deflect out of this. As Orochi, do not go for hurricane blast. You can get hit 2 times during the windup.

As long as he only spams his combo without feints, it goes up side up side ad infinitum.
And there are players that seem to block my every move. Whereas I, when using Orochi feel way better utilizing my dodges.


Besides, I guess we arrived at a point where 400 ms attacks are the new fast. PK zone. Highlander side offensive lights. Aramusha top light. Shaman bleed light and pounce.

We.the.North
11-22-2017, 02:23 AM
it's 100% blockable even on console with reflex guard. Video proof was put up on the competitive reddit a few days ago.

From talking with the designers and some testers, there is currently an issue on the player's side. Despite the game being P2P, some players experience some latency delay on their actions. Those players have slower reflex guard stance activation even when they are constantly refreshing their block.

As a result, you will have video giving "proof" that the Aramusha is 100% blockable and some video giving "proof" that the Aramusha is 100% stunlock. Both are right.

While I dont think the game should be balanced around people with crappy computer / internet connection, I have to agree it creates a MAJOR source of anger for them to be 100% - 0% against an Aramusha doing nothing but light spam.

And by the way, I am one of those crappy computer / internet guy running at about 30-45 fps on my computer. I know Aramusha pattern and even then, I can't block a single light top attack even when I spam my block stance top.

It's a thing. Should it be fixed ?? I'll leave it to the Dev. But for sure, in its current state, For Honor is NOT an enjoyable game for me right now.

-----------------------------

On another issue ; what the F. is up with Aramusha being nearly unpunishable ?? As a Shinobi, I dare you to try and ranged guardbreak him between 2 attacks. Super easy on other characters, near impossible vs Aramusha.

Cuculis
11-22-2017, 05:07 AM
Im not saying that the Shaman is not a little overpowered. Once you know how to counter a Shaman she is definitely double. On the other hand Aramushas light attack spam is basically not counter-able unless you have a block stance like Warlord or Aramusha himself. Out of the two I would say Aramusha is way more of a overpowered character / issue than the Shaman. You guys really need to start testing your characters out before you just release them. Aramusha is basically the Peacekeeper when she was overpowered via zone attack spam. Thats how fast he hits. And I am surprised you guys didnt look at his timer and it didnt click like "wow his timer is the very similar to the Peacekeepers when she was overpowered we already learned this lesson with the Peacekeeper lets not make the same mistake".

Sneaky-Patches
11-22-2017, 06:02 AM
What console do you play on raime?

Honestly on top of the games issues, I believe there is currently different Levels of input lag between the consoles (I have been testing my PS4, PS4 pro, and tried it on my roommates xbox) I think PS4 pro is absolutely dreadful, way worse than the other two, with Xbox being the best. I wonder if this is a game issue that can be fixed (if this is one of the causes) or a hardware issue.

That said, I have to disagree on it being reactable. I’m a rep 40 shinobi with a high kd, well above average reaction time (career in racing), wired connection, gaming monitor, broadband internet. And aramushas lights are not reactable (shamans jump heavy too amoung others), one of the main reasons is the delay in my inputs to my character changing his guard. I feel if my character actually had 0ms delay between my inputs and him blocking/ parrying on screen, it might be ok, but currently I have played about 5 reps since S4 release, and not once have I reacted to aramudhas lights. Only pre-emptively blocking top (and when aramusha has revenge it’s just 100-0 health as blocking top does not stop the tornado of spam)——

—this also seems to be causing another issue that is absolutely not present when I played on PC. If an enemy (aramusha) feints a heavy, and you went to parry it, saw it was a feint, then quickly feinted yourself, and went to either CGB (if he GB directly after), or went to block another attack, you always seem to lose control of your character and get hit, whereas on PC you can recover in time to keep your defences up. It COULD happen on PC, but the window of vulnerability on console seems triple the size for some reason.

Other issues I see are also this:

—Parrying indicators seem off, I have to parry nearly at the start of the red indicator (even before it shows up with some lights) as opposed to near the end of it (like it was when I played on PC). (Again this is probably due to input lag, I dunno)

—There is something VERY wrong with character stagger times on PS4 pro (maybe other platforms or consoles in general I think). If one light hits you, you get staggered for so long that other lights will hit you before your guard will reappear on screen. (I gave video evidence of highlander sometimes getting a second free hit with Celtic curse on reflex guard users due to this where you can visibly see my guard did not appear. Also if two aramusha are spamming lights, I have actually been stunlocked 100-0 because my guard would not come up on the screen.

—People are giving evidence of reflex guard being broken. Not all the time, but there are undeniable instances of guards randomly switching. Many on this forum brushed it off with a “git Gud” until it was actually proven a bug and was placed in the patch notes. I believe there is still an issue, and many here are doing the exact same thing by brushing it off. Not saying you are doing it, but I find this to be counterproductive for no reason.

—Timesnaps removal has also made attacks faster ( provably by mountains of evidence on reddit) and also inconsistent in deflect/ parry windows. I think your location relative to other players geographically exacerbates this issue, and I think many who say “there is no issue” are living in pockets or areas of a high density of For Honor players, and rarely (if ever) experience players on the cusp of what the game deems as acceptable lag. I would probably bet many on this forum saying they have no issue live in these areas (it would be very interesting if people like this could also mention the city they live in, it may shed some light on what is really going on)

— ontop of this, a lot of people still play with a tv with moderate input lag (I don’t, but a friend I just coaxed into getting this game the other day does). If the game can’t at least also factor in a little bit of leeway for at least average input tv lag, it’s not ever going to gain traction. I would bet all this is one of the prime reasons people leave on console.



I think the Devs really need to have a real hard look at all this stuff, maybe even test out the console input lag on all platforms for themselves so they can more accurately gauge what the issue is here. (Even if wired or wireless controllers helps or makes it worse) People seem to be having some wildly different experiences on console, and I wonder if it’s a mix of the distance of players that are matched with geographically (here in Australia it will be further spread out as opposed to England America etc), different consoles running differently or internet and other thing completely out of the players hands entirely.

Knight_Raime
11-22-2017, 06:02 AM
Im not saying that the Shaman is not a little overpowered. Once you know how to counter a Shaman she is definitely double. On the other hand Aramushas light attack spam is basically not counter-able unless you have a block stance like Warlord or Aramusha himself. Out of the two I would say Aramusha is way more of a overpowered character / issue than the Shaman. You guys really need to start testing your characters out before you just release them. Aramusha is basically the Peacekeeper when she was overpowered via zone attack spam. Thats how fast he hits. And I am surprised you guys didnt look at his timer and it didnt click like "wow his timer is the very similar to the Peacekeepers when she was overpowered we already learned this lesson with the Peacekeeper lets not make the same mistake".

Light attack spam is not even a benefit for mid level players and above. The only reason PK lights are still so effective is due to the animations she does. Most attacks in the game are horizontal wide swings. most of hers are quick stabs or jabs with very little telegraphed movement. Even in higher tier player her zone isn't something you can get away with throwing randomly. Not because it'll be parried but because most characters will have their guard resting in that direction.

In fact with Aramusha he's always forced to go top if he's only spamming lights. Which means he's more predictable with "light spam" than PK is. I hate to say it but if you're dying to spam from aramusha it's a player skill issue and not a kit issue.

PDXGorechild
11-22-2017, 09:34 AM
Haven't had a chance to jump on practice and learn his moveset yet, but doesn't the light combo go side > top > side > top and so on?

Generally once I realise they're doing that combo i'll take a side hit and prepare myself to block the top, or go for a parry/deflect if I've had enough caffeine. If he's a feint master the degree of difficulty goes up considerably. Agreeably it's not easy, but aside from this combo he's a bit underwhelming so any alterations to the class should be carefully thought out.

The Shaman is obviously overpowered but I think the fear of Aramashu will diminish quickly as players learn his moveset.

Knight_Raime
11-22-2017, 11:42 AM
What console do you play on raime?

Honestly on top of the games issues, I believe there is currently different Levels of input lag between the consoles (I have been testing my PS4, PS4 pro, and tried it on my roommates xbox) I think PS4 pro is absolutely dreadful, way worse than the other two, with Xbox being the best. I wonder if this is a game issue that can be fixed (if this is one of the causes) or a hardware issue.

That said, I have to disagree on it being reactable. I’m a rep 40 shinobi with a high kd, well above average reaction time (career in racing), wired connection, gaming monitor, broadband internet. And aramushas lights are not reactable (shamans jump heavy too amoung others), one of the main reasons is the delay in my inputs to my character changing his guard. I feel if my character actually had 0ms delay between my inputs and him blocking/ parrying on screen, it might be ok, but currently I have played about 5 reps since S4 release, and not once have I reacted to aramudhas lights. Only pre-emptively blocking top (and when aramusha has revenge it’s just 100-0 health as blocking top does not stop the tornado of spam)——

—this also seems to be causing another issue that is absolutely not present when I played on PC. If an enemy (aramusha) feints a heavy, and you went to parry it, saw it was a feint, then quickly feinted yourself, and went to either CGB (if he GB directly after), or went to block another attack, you always seem to lose control of your character and get hit, whereas on PC you can recover in time to keep your defences up. It COULD happen on PC, but the window of vulnerability on console seems triple the size for some reason.

Other issues I see are also this:

—Parrying indicators seem off, I have to parry nearly at the start of the red indicator (even before it shows up with some lights) as opposed to near the end of it (like it was when I played on PC). (Again this is probably due to input lag, I dunno)

—There is something VERY wrong with character stagger times on PS4 pro (maybe other platforms or consoles in general I think). If one light hits you, you get staggered for so long that other lights will hit you before your guard will reappear on screen. (I gave video evidence of highlander sometimes getting a second free hit with Celtic curse on reflex guard users due to this where you can visibly see my guard did not appear. Also if two aramusha are spamming lights, I have actually been stunlocked 100-0 because my guard would not come up on the screen.

—People are giving evidence of reflex guard being broken. Not all the time, but there are undeniable instances of guards randomly switching. Many on this forum brushed it off with a “git Gud” until it was actually proven a bug and was placed in the patch notes. I believe there is still an issue, and many here are doing the exact same thing by brushing it off. Not saying you are doing it, but I find this to be counterproductive for no reason.

—Timesnaps removal has also made attacks faster ( provably by mountains of evidence on reddit) and also inconsistent in deflect/ parry windows. I think your location relative to other players geographically exacerbates this issue, and I think many who say “there is no issue” are living in pockets or areas of a high density of For Honor players, and rarely (if ever) experience players on the cusp of what the game deems as acceptable lag. I would probably bet many on this forum saying they have no issue live in these areas (it would be very interesting if people like this could also mention the city they live in, it may shed some light on what is really going on)

— ontop of this, a lot of people still play with a tv with moderate input lag (I don’t, but a friend I just coaxed into getting this game the other day does). If the game can’t at least also factor in a little bit of leeway for at least average input tv lag, it’s not ever going to gain traction. I would bet all this is one of the prime reasons people leave on console.



I think the Devs really need to have a real hard look at all this stuff, maybe even test out the console input lag on all platforms for themselves so they can more accurately gauge what the issue is here. (Even if wired or wireless controllers helps or makes it worse) People seem to be having some wildly different experiences on console, and I wonder if it’s a mix of the distance of players that are matched with geographically (here in Australia it will be further spread out as opposed to England America etc), different consoles running differently or internet and other thing completely out of the players hands entirely.

I play on xbox one. Also I live in the dead center of the USA so I really doubt i'm in a pocket of for honor players.
The video evidence that I mentioned was posted from a PS4 pro player. So.

But even if all your supposed issues are true and are frequent enough among a decent portion of the community it still shouldn't dictate the balance of a hero imo. If they open that door they'ed re open seperate balance between platforms. Something they already said they will never do. I'm not saying that it's impossible for hardware/connection related issues could be making it "impossible" to react to.

What I am saying is that i'd rather think that it's just people being well...bad since it's just far more likely. That doesn't mean I don't sympathize with those who are in those fringe cases. I know how different of an experience things are when using a tv and an actual gaming monitor. I switch between the 2.

Devils-_-legacy
11-22-2017, 01:01 PM
Reflex guard is bugged at times I've sent video in of this and I only really play assassins I love deflect but it can be a issue with laggy game or a red Nat opponent

mrmistark
11-22-2017, 02:06 PM
That’s all you alls problems. You’re trying to REACT to the lights when all you have to do is stop the chain to be able to gain the upper hand. If aramusha is on the offensive, you can bet he is going to win. But if he is on the defensive the game is far fetched fo him unless he can gain the momentum again, but you have to play against him aggressively.

The best way to do this? Say he is already in the combo of light spams. His combo MUST go top-> side (either)-> top into a continuation. His chain finisher does huge damage and ends on the same place the previous attack was on: side (again, any 2 sides, it could be R light, LHeavy too) or too. That being said: easiest way to stop the light spams are the following:

Block top. Simple, you’ll always block at least one of the attacks and stop his chain. That also being said, ALWAYS Block for the chain finisher. It does way too much damage to assume they will do a soft feint.

Trade: simple, if you can hit them that ends the combo. Throw out a light, dodge attack (looking at you assassins! He can’t handle dodge attack when trying to chain), utilize hyper armor and distance to your advantage against this guy.


And the biggest one: GB during his light startup for free heavy.

Sneaky-Patches
11-22-2017, 02:25 PM
I play on xbox one. Also I live in the dead center of the USA so I really doubt i'm in a pocket of for honor players.
The video evidence that I mentioned was posted from a PS4 pro player. So.

But even if all your supposed issues are true and are frequent enough among a decent portion of the community it still shouldn't dictate the balance of a hero imo. If they open that door they'ed re open seperate balance between platforms. Something they already said they will never do. I'm not saying that it's impossible for hardware/connection related issues could be making it "impossible" to react to.

What I am saying is that i'd rather think that it's just people being well...bad since it's just far more likely. That doesn't mean I don't sympathize with those who are in those fringe cases. I know how different of an experience things are when using a tv and an actual gaming monitor. I switch between the 2.

Being in the Center of America would be one of the densest population places you could play this game. (That and maybe France or around Central Europe). By pocket I mean areas the size of say, a state, in a first world country where many can afford the luxury of playing games, and where it is popular.

I don’t think all my issues are “supposed” issues, because most are evidently very real, timesnap, buggy guards, population pockets, input lag for tv users. Some is speculation based on my own loose testing of input lag having played this game on PS4 pro, PS4, Xbox one and PC, but most of what I’m mentioning here, is to varying degrees, the cause of complaint and the core of the issue.

I understand that we must essentially draw a line in the sand at some stage, as to where reaction time is at an appropriate amount. Having looked at the bell curve of human reaction times, probably (loose guesstimate) the bottom 5% would unfortunately have to just accept they do not have the reaction time for this game, as below roughly that line it becomes very diminishing returns and the bell curve really trails off. However, if the majority of players are having trouble or simply cannot react to lights, consistently, then it is a problem. Having played 40 reps with Shinobi, I can say hand to my heart, that I have only played against one single person (who played raider like a god, and must’ve lived close by) in that whole time that could block my lights, and even parried one or two. I’m arguing against my own class here, because I know it’s total BS that others have to deal with this. And I don’t think it fits with the notion that only some fringe % can’t block them, or are bad players.

I can only really go off of my experience here. I’m not asking the devs to just slap on a 300ms delay on all lights, but what I think should happen, is all these issues MUST be reassessed when both servers and the new lag compensation is in. I don’t think that’s an unfair ask, and if I happen to be wrong, and I am somehow in some small % of players who can’t react, or in a geographic location that is just a case of “tough luck”, I will be happy to allow evidence to change my opinion and view on this.

Why I’m not putting too much stock into the clip you showed is for this sole reason.(I haven’t seen the clip, can’t find it here, but I assume it’s the one from reddit with the shinobi blocking aramusha?)
—-The shinobi only had to block aramushas “predictable” combo. In other words, if you manage to guess either “left” or “right” as aramushas opening attack to start his chain, you can preemptively just continue to block in the pattern the rest of his combo follows, which is exactly what happened. I have done this exact same thing, not because I could react at all, but because I guessed right and I just followed the predictable pattern because they were an inexperienced aramusha. If it’s an aramusha that feints, I am simply a punching bag.

What I would find to be an appropriate test, if we were being as objective as possible, would be to collect this exact data:

Extrapolate this collected data from all heroes. Find what the % block rate of aramushas opening “left” or “right” light attack from a neutral stance is. Then to be more precise, remove all heroes with a regular guard from the equation (so as to remove any “fluke” blocks by those character because they are able to just leave their guard in the right direction, which would skew the data). To be even more precise, I would collectively take the data ONLY from Gladiator and shinobi players (as they have the smallest guards, which would almost eliminate fluke blocks) and see what the opening light block % is, and also what the opening light parry % is.

Anyway that’s just my thoughts on it, I just want to see this game be more than light spam.

Knight_Raime
11-22-2017, 10:11 PM
Being in the Center of America would be one of the densest population places you could play this game. (That and maybe France or around Central Europe). By pocket I mean areas the size of say, a state, in a first world country where many can afford the luxury of playing games, and where it is popular.

I don’t think all my issues are “supposed” issues, because most are evidently very real, timesnap, buggy guards, population pockets, input lag for tv users. Some is speculation based on my own loose testing of input lag having played this game on PS4 pro, PS4, Xbox one and PC, but most of what I’m mentioning here, is to varying degrees, the cause of complaint and the core of the issue.

I understand that we must essentially draw a line in the sand at some stage, as to where reaction time is at an appropriate amount. Having looked at the bell curve of human reaction times, probably (loose guesstimate) the bottom 5% would unfortunately have to just accept they do not have the reaction time for this game, as below roughly that line it becomes very diminishing returns and the bell curve really trails off. However, if the majority of players are having trouble or simply cannot react to lights, consistently, then it is a problem. Having played 40 reps with Shinobi, I can say hand to my heart, that I have only played against one single person (who played raider like a god, and must’ve lived close by) in that whole time that could block my lights, and even parried one or two. I’m arguing against my own class here, because I know it’s total BS that others have to deal with this. And I don’t think it fits with the notion that only some fringe % can’t block them, or are bad players.

I can only really go off of my experience here. I’m not asking the devs to just slap on a 300ms delay on all lights, but what I think should happen, is all these issues MUST be reassessed when both servers and the new lag compensation is in. I don’t think that’s an unfair ask, and if I happen to be wrong, and I am somehow in some small % of players who can’t react, or in a geographic location that is just a case of “tough luck”, I will be happy to allow evidence to change my opinion and view on this.

Why I’m not putting too much stock into the clip you showed is for this sole reason.(I haven’t seen the clip, can’t find it here, but I assume it’s the one from reddit with the shinobi blocking aramusha?)
—-The shinobi only had to block aramushas “predictable” combo. In other words, if you manage to guess either “left” or “right” as aramushas opening attack to start his chain, you can preemptively just continue to block in the pattern the rest of his combo follows, which is exactly what happened. I have done this exact same thing, not because I could react at all, but because I guessed right and I just followed the predictable pattern because they were an inexperienced aramusha. If it’s an aramusha that feints, I am simply a punching bag.

What I would find to be an appropriate test, if we were being as objective as possible, would be to collect this exact data:

Extrapolate this collected data from all heroes. Find what the % block rate of aramushas opening “left” or “right” light attack from a neutral stance is. Then to be more precise, remove all heroes with a regular guard from the equation (so as to remove any “fluke” blocks by those character because they are able to just leave their guard in the right direction, which would skew the data). To be even more precise, I would collectively take the data ONLY from Gladiator and shinobi players (as they have the smallest guards, which would almost eliminate fluke blocks) and see what the opening light block % is, and also what the opening light parry % is.

Anyway that’s just my thoughts on it, I just want to see this game be more than light spam.

I didn't show any clip in this thread. Merely mentioned a clip was posted on the competitive reddit from ps4 pro player. I don't remember if it's the same clip. But the person had the guy do your standard up down up down light combo after being hit twice. and then he asked his friend to mix it up and he was still able to block most of the time. The guy was in OOS so the combo could continue even if he blocked.

If we're complaining about light spam on Aramusha that's a very predictable pattern. Which you are directly trying to throw out when you mention the clip. You can't have your cake and eat it too. This is what i've been arguing against. If the aramusha is just a light spammer he's going to be predictable and blockable. And if he's harder to block when he's mixing things up that just sounds like his kit is functioning as intended. The last line of your post kind of urks me to a degree because it's over simplifying combat.

Finally after they re add in lag comp if people can actually post proof that "light attack spam" is still strong i'm more than sure the devs would look into it. Though again to be honest I feel like most are just blaming the game rather than accepting their poor reaction times. Or they're misusing the term spam.