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View Full Version : Can't seem to throw a yo-yo... Help?

FI.Snaphoo
08-18-2004, 10:21 PM
Any tips on how to successfully perform a yo-yo to someone who isn't sure if they are barrel rolling correctly? Well, the snaphoo "barrel roll" seems to be fairly efficient at doing what the big dogs barrel roll does, I just don't know if it's correct.

But, back to the yo-yo, I'm not sure how to actually successfully perform that, especially in a "combat" situation. I know that generally it is used to bleed speed so that you don't overshoot an opponent, or so that an opponent might overshoot you if the situation was right for such a maneuvre. But, that's about all I know. Is it basically half or a quarter of a barrel roll? But, coming back down before you actually get inverted?

Any tips would be greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance.

FI.Snaphoo
08-18-2004, 10:21 PM
Any tips on how to successfully perform a yo-yo to someone who isn't sure if they are barrel rolling correctly? Well, the snaphoo "barrel roll" seems to be fairly efficient at doing what the big dogs barrel roll does, I just don't know if it's correct.

But, back to the yo-yo, I'm not sure how to actually successfully perform that, especially in a "combat" situation. I know that generally it is used to bleed speed so that you don't overshoot an opponent, or so that an opponent might overshoot you if the situation was right for such a maneuvre. But, that's about all I know. Is it basically half or a quarter of a barrel roll? But, coming back down before you actually get inverted?

Any tips would be greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance.

Fehler
08-18-2004, 11:36 PM
A high yo-yo is simply a short climb and then a short dive. If you can imagine a straight line of some distance, a high yo-yo simply adds distance that it would take to get from one imaginary point to another (Straight line being the shortest distance between two points)

This is important when you have more energy than your enemy. You dont want to lose all that energy slowing down to take a shot, you simply pull up roll over, and dive back down on him. Repeat as necessary until he is dead.

A low yo-yo is for when you want to let gravity add some extra energy to your plane. If your target flys straight, but he is at a distance too far to shoot effectively, you can dive a little to build up energy and zoom climb into him to pull a lead shot. This maneuver is used when you are at an equal energy state with your enemy, but remember at the end of the move, you will probably be back to an equal energy state with your enemy, and if he turns or rolls faster than you he will counter your attack. Make you shots count!

For both maneuvers, the rolling scissors is the best defense, and if he is a good pilot, you will recognize this immediately. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

http://webpages.charter.net/cuda70/FehlerSig.gif
http://webpages.charter.net/cuda70/9JG54.html

karost
08-19-2004, 12:19 AM
Hi,snaphoo

same as Fehler's advise, if you hunting someone and your speed is faster then coner speed and you opponent make hard turn break so you use hi-yoyo is a solution.

you can see my trak apply hi-yoyo to hunt p-39, as you know my 109G6 is very bad for horizontal turn , and every p-39 know how to shoot 109G6 by use a batter turn and I not play with that.
109G6 hi-yoyo with blind sport deflection (http://www.allthaiproperties.com/bmax/fb/track/hi_yoyo_blind_deflection.ntrk)

but make sure onone behind your 6 ok http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif
S!

FI.Snaphoo
08-19-2004, 06:40 AM
Thanks guys! I'll try that as soon as I get back into the game...

Zayets
08-19-2004, 06:47 AM
Yo-Yo's are not performed only on a straight line. You can also bank to perform one , especially if the oppoenent will try to break.You do a high yoyo turning his direction,gaining altitude which you should transform it in speed when you are at the same level with the oppoenent.

Zayets out

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v399/Zayets/sigP47.jpg

Gnomie
11-18-2008, 05:05 AM
I went grave-digging and found this old thread. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Lately I've been practicing my high yo-yo against enemy bombers flying in a straight line. And I just can't figure out what angles I should use when attacking. Here's a sketch:

http://img217.imageshack.us/img217/5936/asdfdk9.png (http://imageshack.us)
http://img217.imageshack.us/img217/asdfdk9.png/1/w574.png (http://g.imageshack.us/img217/asdfdk9.png/1/)

I know that when firing, I shouldn't be using the elevators, so I'll need to be able to visually observe the target when coming in so that I can make adjustments before I'm within range. But my problem is that my wing will often block my view, so that I can't see properly.

So: could anyone share a .ntrk replay showing how you do it? http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif I'd much appreciate that. Doesn't matter for me what plane you use -- I just want to learn the basics and work from there.

Pigeon_
11-18-2008, 06:01 AM
Look for the yo-yo manouvre in the pilot guide in my signature.

Gnomie
11-18-2008, 06:11 AM
I know, that's where I got the illustration. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif It says that coming in from the 8 (or 4) o'clock is good, but it doesn't say anything about the vertical angle. I'm just having problems finding a good approach where my wing/cockpit doesn't block the view too much. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif I think the best way to learn would be to watch someone do it.

M_Gunz
11-18-2008, 06:47 AM
Yoyo is not for bleeding speed. If you are slowing down then you are doing it wrong.
The yoyo is for flying a longer path at higher speed than the target so you stay behind
while going faster. You want that. It gives you more options in gaining height or in
extending or other response to change in situation. As long as he is slower you have

Keep rolling your plane as you yoyo to keep the target in sight but don't forget to watch
around you in glances at times. Don't get fixated. If you have a wingman friend it is
even better.

Jex_TE
11-18-2008, 08:36 AM
In the pic above, imagine the red arrow as the bomber. As it flies along, you are pouncing down on it and then pulling up. As you are doing this, and as you loose site (which btw is one of the dnagers associated with the high yo-yo - loss of site on the target for a few seconds), you'll have to rely on your spatial awareness - i.e. the mental picture you keep when you loose site on an object.

Hookecho
11-20-2008, 11:50 AM
an easy way to think of a yo-yo is this: You are using the vertical while the opponent is using the horizontal.

Say your diving on a bogey, you have an Alt and Speed advantage (thus you have a larger E bank account) from say 30 degrees off to the left (his left) and just before your in gun range, the bogey sees you and pulls a hard left break.

Ok, at this point in time you have 3 options.
1. follow the bogey in a hard left turn and most likely overshoot and allow him to turn back into you.

2. extend and escape and set up a better shot

3. use the vertical to counter his hard left break and keep the better E position (above him) and force him to bleed E in the turn.

What I do in this situation is unload the G, pull high (not a hard pull) and pivot my canopy to him (almost inverted at the top) to see what he does, and when it feels right continue your roll over the top and back down to him, and see what he does now, you still should have a Alt advantage and maintained a larger E potential to counter his next move or if he's tumbleweed at that point, push from Lag to Lead and drill him.

To counter a yo-yo, what i find that works is when the bogey behind you yo-yos, wait until he comes over the top and is nose low, then you unload your turn, pull nose high and force the over shoot by angles, extend and re-evaluate.

You can also use the yo-yo to just counter a much nimbler A/C in a similar E state as your plane. If he can rate his nose +10 degees /sec. better than you (just pulling numbers out the air here) then if both planes remain in the turn, the bogey will come all the way around to your six and shoot you, so what do you do? You can do a high side yo-yo (pull nose high slightly while rolling outside of the turn over the top and cuttign him off at the bottom. Or do a low side yo-yo where you dive under him, then pull up into him while rolling inverted over the top.

...God this is hard to explain without using my hands....

Not sure if any of that helped.....YMMV

Gnomie
11-22-2008, 04:22 AM
Thank you for your descriptions and help, people. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif I'll do some practicing and see if I can get the hang of it.

Still, if anyone has a replay showing how it's done I'd appreciate it.