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View Full Version : Counter Guard Break on the Warlord



Malyngo
09-11-2017, 07:55 AM
I think this is seriously broken!

I just wanted to practice my parrying and started advanced practice.
The first thing is practicing Counter Guard Break (press "X" when you see the shield icon, you know the drill.

I couldn't get any counter guard break off, only when I anticipated it and pressed the button basically the moment the shield showed up or a moment earlier even.
Tried with the Warden afterwards, CGB is working as I expect it on that one, just press the button when the guard break is in progress (when you see the shield)

Please, please fix this! Warlord currently is wide open to getting Guard broken!

kweassa1
09-11-2017, 08:10 AM
I think this is seriously broken!

I just wanted to practice my parrying and started advanced practice.
The first thing is practicing Counter Guard Break (press "X" when you see the shield icon, you know the drill.

I couldn't get any counter guard break off, only when I anticipated it and pressed the button basically the moment the shield showed up or a moment earlier even.
Tried with the Warden afterwards, CGB is working as I expect it on that one, just press the button when the guard break is in progress (when you see the shield)

Please, please fix this! Warlord currently is wide open to getting Guard broken!


I hate being the guy who constantly breaks so many bubbles and becomes so hated and despised.... but in all honesty, it's not the Warlord....there's nothing wrong with Warlord CGB to fix. The fact of the matter is, you simply need more practice and experience.


CGB is something which reflex and experience determines the outcome. You need to be patient and keep practicing until it comes naturally.

Malyngo
09-11-2017, 09:04 AM
It is true, I suck at CGB.

BUT I have tried in the Advanced Tutorial, where all the opponent does is Guard Breaking, and all you do is CGB.
I tried with the Warden. And I can consistantly CGB with that one in this environment. Because all I have to do is wait for the shield icon to appear on the screen, press "X", CGB done.
WIth the Warlord, it is a total different matter. I wait for the shield to appear, press "X", no CGB.

At least the Warden and the Warlord are behaving totally different for CGB. On the Warlord, you have to know that your opponent will GB, and press the button at the same time.

Malyngo
09-11-2017, 06:53 PM
So I looked into this some more.
Tried different things. The trick for the Warlord is: I have to release the guard mode button prior to pressing X.
I tried a few other Heroes, PK, Highlander, Raider, Kensei, Conqueror. They behave the same, so it is NOT a Warlord issue. I was wrong about that, my apologies.

But this is different for the Warden: For him, I can just keep the Guard Mode button depressed, and just have to hit X.

Is this how it is supposed to be? That CGB for Warden is easier?

I made a short video, not sure if this can get my point across, especially since I messed up the CGB on the Warlord sometimes even when releasing the Guard mode button.


https://youtu.be/p4D7a67tyAc

Sometimes, the CGB didn't work on the Warlord, but it seemed it was then done after the stun duration.

Is this intended, that it is easier with Warden to CGB?

Malyngo
09-11-2017, 06:56 PM
Also, I am pretty certain that before the last patch, CGB was working for other heroes just the way it is working for Warden.

Antonioj26
09-11-2017, 07:15 PM
You are clearly hitting guard break before it connects to you in every failed attempt you've shown. This has nothing to do with the character, that's all you friend.

Malyngo
09-11-2017, 07:31 PM
Please try it yourself: Go into Advanced training. One time with Warden, one time with Warlord (or PK, or Raider, ...)

Then tell me you do not see what I have described: With Warden, you can just hold Guard Mode button and hit X in the right moment. With Warlord, you have to first let go of Guard mode.

I have tried many, many times. I consistantly can pull off CGB with Warden, just pressing X. Keeping Guard Mode depressed.
WIth any other Hero I tried, I have to first let go of Guard mode. I NEVER could pull it of while keeping Guard mode depressed, while I can do it consitantly on the Warden.

You guys are driving me insane.

Anyone, do you see this? Warden is easier to CGB? Or is this just my setup? Something on my computer, or me using a XBox One controller on PC.

Antonioj26
09-11-2017, 07:39 PM
Please try it yourself: Go into Advanced training. One time with Warden, one time with Warlord (or PK, or Raider, ...)

Then tell me you do not see what I have described: With Warden, you can just hold Guard Mode button and hit X in the right moment. With Warlord, you have to first let go of Guard mode.

I have tried many, many times. I consistantly can pull off CGB with Warden, just pressing X. Keeping Guard Mode depressed.
WIth any other Hero I tried, I have to first let go of Guard mode. I NEVER could pull it of while keeping Guard mode depressed, while I can do it consitantly on the Warden.

You guys are driving me insane.

Anyone, do you see this? Warden is easier to CGB? Or is this just my setup? Something on my computer, or me using a XBox One controller on PC.

I don't need to try this, I play both characters and I've never needed to let go of guard to cgb. Like I said, you are clearly hitting by too early when you are playing warlord in the video you've shown, it's in your head.

Malyngo
09-11-2017, 08:05 PM
I am sorry, you are correct. I now managed to get off some CGB with the Warlord while keeping the Guard mode depressed.
So yes, the part about having to let go of that button was in my head (probably because it was then automatically pressing that button later).

BUT I have to press the button on the end of the GB (well, just like you said, my apologies).
Then again with the Warden I can press that button right at the start, right after the shield icon is shown, before it connects (just like the frelling tooltip says).
Doing a CGB with the Warden is much easier.

Is this intended?

Antonioj26
09-11-2017, 08:18 PM
I am sorry, you are correct. I now managed to get off some CGB with the Warlord while keeping the Guard mode depressed.
So yes, the part about having to let go of that button was in my head (probably because it was then automatically pressing that button later).

BUT I have to press the button on the end of the GB (well, just like you said, my apologies).
Then again with the Warden I can press that button right at the start, right after the shield icon is shown, before it connects (just like the frelling tooltip says).
Doing a CGB with the Warden is much easier.

Is this intended?

It's cool, man. I honestly don't think it's different and it's just in your head. Even in the video it shows you are waiting every time for the gb to connect and have the right timing

Malyngo
09-11-2017, 08:20 PM
Just found a video talking about the Guard break changes in 1.03:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oWdt_Mz2Sq0
I quote:

Basically you can push it at any time, so as soon as you see that red guard break symbol show up, push the button, and you'll make sure the interrupt hits. So there is no trick to the timing now.
What I am seeing now is that the Warden is showing the behaviour from patch 1.03, but the other Heroes do not.
Now, was that patch reverted back, and the Warden has been forgotten, or is there a regression for all the Heroes, except Warden?

Antonioj26
09-11-2017, 08:50 PM
Just found a video talking about the Guard break changes in 1.03:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oWdt_Mz2Sq0
I quote:

What I am seeing now is that the Warden is showing the behaviour from patch 1.03, but the other Heroes do not.
Now, was that patch reverted back, and the Warden has been forgotten, or is there a regression for all the Heroes, except Warden?

Your video isn't showing any irregular behavior with gb. With warden you can see that you are timing it correctly, with warlord you are not. It's that simple.

Malyngo
09-11-2017, 09:02 PM
Really, I am absolutely sure that the timing on Warden is easier to do than on any other Hero. I just did the tutorial for 2 minutes with the Warden. From beginning to end, I was consistently doing the CGB.
With the Warlord, it is really, really hard for me to do that.
But I rest my case now. **** this.

Antonioj26
09-11-2017, 09:05 PM
Just found a video talking about the Guard break changes in 1.03:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oWdt_Mz2Sq0
I quote:

What I am seeing now is that the Warden is showing the behaviour from patch 1.03, but the other Heroes do not.
Now, was that patch reverted back, and the Warden has been forgotten, or is there a regression for all the Heroes, except Warden?


Really, I am absolutely sure that the timing on Warden is easier to do than on any other Hero. I just did the tutorial for 2 minutes with the Warden. From beginning to end, I was consistently doing the CGB.
With the Warlord, it is really, really hard for me to do that.
But I rest my case now. **** this.

If it's easier you haven't shown any proof to that, in fact you have just shown what you've been doing wrong for warlord and what you've been doing right for warden. Your inputs are showing that you are mistiming it.

Malyngo
09-11-2017, 09:05 PM
Ubi doesn't really know what to do with CGB, either. 1.03 changed it so that the timing is much easier. In 1.05 the patch notes say:

Updated Guardbreak Tutorial text for more clarity on Counter Guardbreak.


Developer comments: The Guard Break Interrupt tutorial had a hint saying “Interrupt enemy Guard Breaks by pressing [input] when they start”. The “when they start portion” was confusing people. In order to be more accurate, that text will now change to “when the enemy connects”.

In my video (which I did TODAY) the text says "Guardbreak interrupt "X" at the start of the Guard Break"
So they changed it back again.

**** you, UBI.

Antonioj26
09-11-2017, 09:13 PM
Ubi doesn't really know what to do with CGB, either. 1.03 changed it so that the timing is much easier. In 1.05 the patch notes say:


In my video (which I did TODAY) the text says "Guardbreak interrupt "X" at the start of the Guard Break"
So they changed it back again.

**** you, UBI.

Yeah they did get that wrong still no difference between the characters though.

S0Mi_xD
09-12-2017, 04:37 AM
It is easy explained.

You are more comfortable/confident (subconscious) with warden, and thats why you are hitting cgb better with him, with the warlord, you can see, that your fist attempt was WAY to early - and that's because you are fixed in your mind with the thought that warlords cgb is different.

I had this case with some heroes until I managed to be more relaxed with them.

The mindset makes a huge difference.

Malyngo
09-12-2017, 07:19 AM
In this video, i slowed one of the successfull CGB down. I press the button, before it connects:

https://youtu.be/rrDAhEc1hjA
The following 2 minutes are just me doing CGB over and over.

I never was able to do that with Warlord. My mindset ist: Press the button as fast as I can with Warden.
With the Warlord, I have to make a mental effort to wait a little, until it connects (which leads to animations sometimes where the character already goes into "omg, I am guard broken", only to recover with CGB)

Another video with the Warlord, no slowdown, just doing 90 secs of CGB:

https://youtu.be/DPjrFu9GBi4
Anyway, I am done with this. I send a bug report to UBI, they probably will dismiss it. So we can stop this right here. It is just me, I am being stupid.

Camemberto
09-12-2017, 07:43 AM
I have to agree with Malyngo!

some of the inputs for the warlord looked EXACTLY like the inputs on the warden, still it the warlord didn't CGB where the warden did. It did look like your inputs were perfect, still you couldn't CGB, it did look odd indeed and I'm pretty sure, it's not your fault.
Malyngo, I don't know your editing skills or software available, but could you put the two videos right next to each other and compare the two inputs frame by frame, with the enemy starting their GB at the exact same time? (frame)

If you are able to do this and DO find evidence of the CGB being broken, please make another thread, because this NEEDS attention! How often have they changed the fcking CGB by now and how the hell am I supposed to know, when to press the button, if even Ubisoft doesn't know?!

Antonioj26
09-12-2017, 12:31 PM
I have to agree with Malyngo!

some of the inputs for the warlord looked EXACTLY like the inputs on the warden, still it the warlord didn't CGB where the warden did. It did look like your inputs were perfect, still you couldn't CGB, it did look odd indeed and I'm pretty sure, it's not your fault.
Malyngo, I don't know your editing skills or software available, but could you put the two videos right next to each other and compare the two inputs frame by frame, with the enemy starting their GB at the exact same time? (frame)

If you are able to do this and DO find evidence of the CGB being broken, please make another thread, because this NEEDS attention! How often have they changed the fcking CGB by now and how the hell am I supposed to know, when to press the button, if even Ubisoft doesn't know?!

How are you both watching these videos and still coming to that conclusion? He's clearly inputting X before it connects with warlord, you can actually see the gb startup animation for the warlord a few times.

Vakris_One
09-12-2017, 12:56 PM
I agree with Antonioj26. It's clear to see from your video that you are doing it correctly with Warden but you miss-time it with Warlord.

Like S0mi said, you seem to be sub-conciously more relaxed with Warden and more tense with Warlord thus you are making mistakes in the CGB timing with Warlord. You just need to let yourself feel as comfortable with Warlord as you are with Warden.

Antonioj26
09-12-2017, 12:56 PM
Alright, I tried it for myself and you are right. I apologize, I was focusing too much on the fact that you are clearly doing it too early on warlord but didn't notice you were doing the same with warden. Guess I'm so used to just waiting for it to connect that I've never noticed it while playing warden.

Antonioj26
09-12-2017, 12:58 PM
I agree with Antonioj26. It's clear to see from your video that you are doing it correctly with Warden but you miss-time it with Warlord.

Like S0mi said, you seem to be sub-conciously more relaxed with Warden and more tense with Warlord thus you are making mistakes in the CGB timing with Warlord. You just need to let yourself feel as comfortable with Warlord as you are with Warden.

There are a few examples when he's doing the input early on warden and is still getting the cgb. I didn't notice before since he's waiting for it to connect for most of them but there are some that are before it connects. I tested it myself and I'm noticing it too, I don't play on PC though so can't exactly show my inputs the way maylngo has.

Vakris_One
09-12-2017, 01:02 PM
There are a few examples when he's doing the input early on warden and is still getting the cgb. I didn't notice before since he's waiting for it to connect for most of them but there are some that are before it connects. I tested it myself and I'm noticing it too, I don't play on PC though so can't exactly show my inputs the way maylngo has.
Hmm. I've rewatched it but still, in his first video I'm seeing him hit it right on the time the guardbreak hits him with Warden whereas he is slightly too early or slightly too late with Warlord.

Camemberto
09-12-2017, 01:02 PM
How are you both watching these videos and still coming to that conclusion? He's clearly inputting X before it connects with warlord, you can actually see the gb startup animation for the warlord a few times.

He has the exact same timing with the warden. You can clearly see the GB startup animation on the warden as well, still it's a CGB. I will investigate on this as soon as I come home, but from my point of view, Malyngo has a valid point.

EDIT: I just read, you have checked it yourself. Thank you for admitting your mistake, very honorable of you :D

Antonioj26
09-12-2017, 01:06 PM
Hmm. I've rewatched it but still, in his first video I'm seeing him hit it right on the time the guardbreak hits him with Warden whereas he is slightly too early or slightly too late with Warlord.

When you say first video do you mean the one that has warden and warlord at the same time? If so then yeah I think your right, but the one with just warden by himself and it slowed down he's doing it too early but still gets the cgb off

Camemberto
09-12-2017, 01:08 PM
Hmm. I've rewatched it but still, in his first video I'm seeing him hit it right on the time the guardbreak hits him with Warden whereas he is slightly too early or slightly too late with Warlord.

Try it yourself then. Try to CGB with a single button press as soon as the symbol appears and compare the warden with the rest of the cast.

Camemberto
09-12-2017, 01:11 PM
I still encourage anyone here, who has the ability to put these two clips next to each other for a frame by frame comparison, to do so and to bring this to the devs attention!

Vakris_One
09-12-2017, 01:23 PM
Ok, I rewatched the other 2 videos with the slowed down Warden and the 90 seconds of Warlord. I take my words back, Malyngo does have a point. I apologise for not looking at all the videos.

It looks like it's giving the Warlord a lot less leeway with the CGB timing. The bot is literally grabbing his WL while the WL is in the CGB animation when it really should be being counter guard broken at that point. It allows the Warden to CGB this and the Warden is doing the same thing. I'll have to go and try this myself but it really does look like the Warlord is being given less chance of counter guard breaking unless the timing is flawless, and that's not right.

Antonioj26
09-12-2017, 01:41 PM
Ok, I rewatched the other 2 videos with the slowed down Warden and the 90 seconds of Warlord. I take my words back, Malyngo does have a point. I apologise for not looking at all the videos.

It looks like it's giving the Warlord a lot less leeway with the CGB timing. The bot is literally grabbing his WL while the WL is in the CGB animation when it really should be being counter guard broken at that point. It allows the Warden to CGB this and the Warden is doing the same thing. I'll have to go and try this myself but it really does look like the Warlord is being given less chance of counter guard breaking unless the timing is flawless, and that's not right.

I'm thinking it's more something up with warden than it is with warlord. Like I said, I play both characters and I've probably never noticed it before since I have the timing down after the gb connects so I never would have noticed it since it only effects a player attempting the cgb early. Ultimately I don't think this effects the game that much. At a certain point people never miss a cgb that can be teched. This might make a difference in lower levels of play but won't change the outcome of a fight at higher levels. Probably should still be fixed either way.

Malyngo
09-12-2017, 01:58 PM
I admit, the videos aren't that good for getting my point accross, there is just not enough consitancy in my inputs, and I am not really good in video editing. Otherwise, I would pick comparable timings from Warlord and Warden and show them side by side. But those videos I made already have taken me more than 4h to make. And I don't want to put anymore time into it (the program I used, Openshot, isn't that snappy in editing stuff like that).

But here is a timing example from the Warden where I am pretty sure that it should have failed with Warlord or the other Heroes I have tried:
https://youtu.be/rrDAhEc1hjA?t=36s

@Antonioj26 this is right, it seems all the other Heroes are behaving all the same, with the CGB having a really small time window, only the Warden gives much more leeway.
This could now swing both ways: Warden is the intended behaviour, and all the others are wrong, or the other way around.

Vakris_One
09-12-2017, 09:32 PM
You guys are right, and it is actually the Warden that is the exception to the rule. I tested it just now with other characters and all of them cannot CGB with as much leeway as the Warden gets if you just press the GB button once.

I tend to double tap the GB button in order to Counter Guard Break thus this was an issue I never would have known existed. If you double tap the GB button Warlord and the others do the CGB just fine as long as you do it at the correct time. It is only the Warden that can do it with just a single tap it seems. I haven't tested the entire roster but once you check through a few of them it becomes apparent very quickly that Warden does have just a bit more leeway than others with CGB.

It's not a game breaker but it maybe should be sorted out. In the meantime I find that double tapping the GB button when countering guard break works consistently amongst pretty much all the characters, Warden included. So just get into the habit of double tapping when doing a CGB, it works for me at least.

UbiJurassic
09-13-2017, 12:51 AM
Thanks for the feedback on the CGB on Warlord. It's great to see some players trying to help out by offering advice, but I'll make of note of this just in case there is an issue with the timing on Warlord.