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View Full Version : Explain why playing with "honor" shouldn't be a bannable offense.



ToToxicForUplay
09-09-2017, 04:24 PM
Oh, wait you can't.

Its not a "way to play" Its griefing. Plain and simple, you are watching you teammate die when you are supposed to be helping them. You would have to do some serious mental gymnastics to convince me that playing with honor isn't just griefing but with a different name.

CandleInTheDark
09-09-2017, 04:28 PM
Because the devs have said both ways are valid and speaking as someone who doesn't particularly like the honour system, the people flaming them for how they want to play are as bad as the people doing that on the other side of the coin.

Antonioj26
09-09-2017, 04:37 PM
This conversation has been discussed a billion times. Just get friends and your problem is solved.

mrmistark
09-09-2017, 04:48 PM
Personally, Honor isn't just not ganking an opponent. It's not hitting the opponent in a 1v1 situation like duel, start of elimination etc. while they are emoting at the beginning to show respect. It's not purposely throwing them off a ledge when in all other rounds they could have done this to you but chose to continue attacking rather than a simple round ending push. In my opinion it's just polite honestly. You don't have to not gank, and by all means when getting ganked or in a true team setting like dominion anything goes IMO. But in my eyes it's unfair to punish a player with a whole chain because they wanted to do an emote in the start of the round. Most round starting emotes are to show respect and hitting them starts a toxic salt battle and is just honestly rude. I don't emote at the begging but if people pay that respect it should be at the bare minimum not rubbed in their face, and in most polite circumstances the favor returned. It's one thing to play the game as intended, it's another thing to act rude. A lot of players may disagree with me here, and that's fine, but I think when BASIC Honor like the little things mentioned above is ignored or neglected then it just makes this community even more salty, and even more toxic.

CandleInTheDark
09-09-2017, 05:05 PM
Personally, Honor isn't just not ganking an opponent. It's not hitting the opponent in a 1v1 situation like duel, start of elimination etc. while they are emoting at the beginning to show respect. It's not purposely throwing them off a ledge when in all other rounds they could have done this to you but chose to continue attacking rather than a simple round ending push. In my opinion it's just polite honestly. You don't have to not gank, and by all means when getting ganked or in a true team setting like dominion anything goes IMO. But in my eyes it's unfair to punish a player with a whole chain because they wanted to do an emote in the start of the round. Most round starting emotes are to show respect and hitting them starts a toxic salt battle and is just honestly rude. I don't emote at the begging but if people pay that respect it should be at the bare minimum not rubbed in their face, and in most polite circumstances the favor returned. It's one thing to play the game as intended, it's another thing to act rude. A lot of players may disagree with me here, and that's fine, but I think when BASIC Honor like the little things mentioned above is ignored or neglected then it just makes this community even more salty, and even more toxic.

Certainly, I agree that people should not be flamed for playing the way they want to play, thing there is that goes both ways. Take the bowing example you brought up,personally I haven't attacked anyone doing that but I don't feel obliged to stand off, I feel that the game gave us chance to do that before calling fight and if it were like the fifth player who had done that or if they were doing it every round I would kind of feel they were wasting my time because I want to get on with it and get to the next fight and honestly the fact that I am locked on and walking towards you is plenty of warning that I am coming.

Ledging, eh I kind of don't deliberately because often I have been pulled away from ledges after being guard broken but again,I feel that those who rage message people who do are as much a part of the problem.

Waynedetta40k
09-09-2017, 06:38 PM
This is an interessting question but the answer is quite simple.
From a pure logical point of view it is griefing, because you do not use everything to your advantage to win on purpose but it is OK because the community is this way.
If a community accepts something which is usally unacceptable its suddenly ok.

It would be the same to not buy proper weapons in Counter Strike when you know the enemy cant afford some either and then call it honourable, but the CS community wont accept this behaviour and report you for trolling.
Or tax beeing actually the same as theft but its legalised by government and widley accepted so thats ok too.

So you are right it is trolling but the community wants is this way so its ok.

UbiInsulin
09-09-2017, 06:49 PM
This is an interessting question but the answer is quite simple.
From a pure logical point of view it is griefing, because you do not use everything to your advantage to win on purpose but it is OK because the community is this way.
If a community accepts something which is usally unacceptable its suddenly ok.

It would be the same to not buy proper weapons in Counter Strike when you know the enemy cant afford some either and then call it honourable, but the CS community wont accept this behaviour and report you for trolling.
Or tax beeing actually the same as theft but its legalised by government and widley accepted so thats ok too.

So you are right it is trolling but the community wants is this way so its ok.

This right here is a deep post.

I think it's in sort of a grey area (my personal preference would be to help out my teammate if they appeared to need help), but bans for this kind of behavior would be very hard to enforce consistently. Ultimately, we want players to be able to express themselves as they see fit. We have practical players and more chivalrous one on these forums, and both play-styles are welcome.

Honorable players should accept that they might not have honorable opponents/teammates and adapt as best they can, and the same goes for our utilitarian players.

CandleInTheDark
09-09-2017, 06:56 PM
This is an interessting question but the answer is quite simple.
From a pure logical point of view it is griefing, because you do not use everything to your advantage to win on purpose but it is OK because the community is this way.
If a community accepts something which is usally unacceptable its suddenly ok.

It would be the same to not buy proper weapons in Counter Strike when you know the enemy cant afford some either and then call it honourable, but the CS community wont accept this behaviour and report you for trolling.
Or tax beeing actually the same as theft but its legalised by government and widley accepted so thats ok too.

So you are right it is trolling but the community wants is this way so its ok.

The thing is in this lies the problem, not everyone can agree that this is or isn't acceptable and people on both sides of it have decided that the other set of people are doing it wrong, I have seen a lot of these threads and they have been started by people who can't stand the honour system and by those who think that anything not 1v1 is effectively cheating and so they both call out the other side as griefing.

The problem is there are two game modes that both sets of people have decided only their way should apply, brawl and elimination (I would say dominion as well but really good luck convincing people who don't want to 1v1 that they are to back off). Both sides can cherrypick things to support their argument from the fact the mode says 4v4/2v2 to the fact that it puts you opposite someone and so we see more and more of these threads. Personally if I want a 1v1 I queue up duel and I am not sticking to 1v1 in others under any circumstances, of course I can only control my own actions, so really like Insulin said, people need to accept that people play in different ways.

Vakris_One
09-09-2017, 07:07 PM
No, it is not griefing to play differently to someone else. Respect each other's playstyles even if you don't play that way and all will be well. The constant tantrum throwing over this topic is both pointless and unecessary.

bmason1000
09-09-2017, 07:15 PM
Personally, Honor isn't just not ganking an opponnt. It's not hitting the opponent in a 1v1 situation like duel, start of elimination etc. while they are emoting at the beginning to show respect...
I feel disrespected by people emoting and punish accordingly. I understand i am an EXTREME minority in this feeling and don't really elect anyone else to share that. Just figured I'd bring it up to say "hey, there's players who feel differently from others." That is why none of it is enforceable as "griefing." We, as a community, simply can not agree on what behaviour is or is not griefing. Its not universal like going out of your way for team kills in an fps. Something the entire video game community/industry agrees upon as griefing. The whole "honor" concept in fh is too muddled. Even members of the honor crowd disagree with eachother on what's acceptable occasionally.

Waynedetta40k
09-09-2017, 07:45 PM
Well, you gotta see it like this. People are usally playing to win within a competitive game and for honor is much likley very competitive.
If you ask any CS:GO player if he think if its ok to go on eco everytime the enemy does in a ranked game he will show you the middle finger.
Its not griefing to play differntly than someone else but some playstyles are griefing and giving an advantage away on purpose because you just want to in a competitive game is for sure griefing.
But as I said before what in some communitys is unaccaptable is totally fine in others.

Waynedetta40k
09-09-2017, 07:47 PM
This right here is a deep post.

I think it's in sort of a grey area (my personal preference would be to help out my teammate if they appeared to need help), but bans for this kind of behavior would be very hard to enforce consistently. Ultimately, we want players to be able to express themselves as they see fit. We have practical players and more chivalrous one on these forums, and both play-styles are welcome.

Honorable players should accept that they might not have honorable opponents/teammates and adapt as best they can, and the same goes for our utilitarian players.

You guys are the once to decide whats wrong and whats right.
If you want to build a proper competitive scene you gotta either enforce what you consider right behavior or punish the wrong. Not communicating properly with the community will only lead to further proplems and frustration within the playerbase.

UbiInsulin
09-09-2017, 07:55 PM
You guys are the once to decide whats wrong and whats right.
If you want to build a proper competitive scene you gotta either enforce what you consider right behavior or punish the wrong. Not communicating properly with the community will only lead to further proplems and frustration within the playerbase.

Sorry if there was any ambiguity in what I said, but I don't think there is an answer here basically. We're certainly not interested in punishing players for expressing themselves with different gameplay styles.

S0Mi_xD
09-09-2017, 08:07 PM
It is simple, the image of "Honor" we have in our time is just a romanticized term.
It's the same thing like our Picture from Knights who safe the Princess, or Pirates who where Adventurer or wanted to be free and life their ways.

Knights where soldiers, people who where paid to fight for the ones who could effort them.
Pirates where mostly thiefs.

Out of a logical point of view those who win have the Honor, the other aspect of Honor we sympathize is just show.

And yes, you can say it is griefing xD

FatFreeIce
09-09-2017, 10:29 PM
I don't think you understand what "griefing" is. To watch you die is not griefing. If I was to actively attack you while you are fighting an opponent that is griefing. I would be banned from a boat load of games if watching someone die was griefing. It's like saying in CS go you see a team mate getting shot at and instead of running over to help you waited until he either won his "duel" or lost. Playing Diablo in hardcore and instead of saving someone dying, I watch them die. This is not griefing. I am not actively ruining your gaming experience. I am enjoying the game how I want to, by either helping or not helping, but I am NOT hindering you.

SwellChemosabe
09-09-2017, 11:12 PM
Like it's been mentioned countless times before, it's up to the players. Everybody has their way of playing and we should respect it. No point in getting salty over a game with no concrete set of rules other than "Don't use cheats or glitches".

all other means of play are perfectly acceptable in any game mode. ledging, ganking, spamming, or "Honor it out"

these are favored and frowned upon by many players but we can't just ban them because they decide that's how they want to play.

personally, I really don't care. If i'm in a game and there appears to be some mutual agreement between players that it's an honor fight, then i'll oblige. All it means is that if you die, I get your kill. Also on the other side of that, I really don't appreciate it when a teammate comes out of nowhere and finishes my opponent off, stealing my kill after I've already done all the work. But then that just means i'll have to work harder to get it so I adapt. I may not like getting ganked but that just means if it happens the act is likely to be returned in fold, so don't give me any **** because you started a gank war that you couldn't win (which happens a lot, believe me)

The honor crowd, as I see it, draws inspiration from the fact that this game is based around medieval combat with ancient iconic warriors who's stories and legends are showered with the concept of honor and they like to recreate that through their gaming experience. there's nothing wrong with that at all. More competitive players will go to any extent to ensure a victory and that's perfectly fine too. Neither side is right or wrong, is purely a matter of perspective.

as for the emote thing, I think it's more how you perceive it. Most players I run into start with the beginning emote before a fight and it's typically in the form of whatever salute that hero has. I reciprocate it and for me it's like a "Hey, good luck, fight well, lets do this" kind of thing. if they spam it they're probably just having a little fun with their emote button and I can't blame them cause that **** is funny. if you really feel as though they're mocking you, just brush it off and move on, it is just a game and there's no reason to get that upset over some silly function the game provides.

psyminion
09-09-2017, 11:51 PM
I like to think I'm pretty honorable.

in 4v4 it's war, so I'll do whatever to win. gank, ledge, spikes, fire, emote spam to confuse my enemy... anything goes. the war is greater than the warrior.

in a brawl I will save my team mate from an execution but not interfere before that because like others have said, it's a bit much to work for a kill and then have your overeager teammate jump in to steal it.

when it comes to a 1v1 duel... well I prefer to show my opponent that I'm a classy guy and I will use my respectful combat emote before a match (not every round) to show respect.... much like bowing before a karate match or touching gloves in mma/boxing. if a person doesn't have any experience in real life martial arts I don't expect them to understand what it's about in game so I don't take it personally if they try to hit me when I'm bowing.

that being said, you try to hit me when I'm bowing you'll get parried>guardbroken>top heavy for messing up my Zen (yes because it is a combat stance emote you can cancel into a parry or attack almost instantly).

in my humble opinion some folks need to chill the f out and spend more time getting gud and less time complaining on the forums about other random people in a video game and their playstyles.

The_B0G_
09-10-2017, 12:13 AM
Personally I can't see how watching an ally die in a team based mode could ever be considered an honorable thing in the first place. You're aiding the enemy in winning the battle by not participating, you're not honorable, you would be branded either a coward or a traitor, certainly not honorable.

If you want to role play honor, play duels. Usually in brawls people fight 1v1 even after on player is defeated. 4v4 has no need for this type players that only hinder their teams. It is definitely reportable as greifing in my opinion.

Rikuto01.tv
09-10-2017, 12:22 AM
Because the devs have said both ways are valid and speaking as someone who doesn't particularly like the honour system, the people flaming them for how they want to play are as bad as the people doing that on the other side of the coin.

The problem with the honor system is that there is no system. It exists purely in the individuals head and what honor is happens to change from person to person.

One person thinks that honor means having a fight fair and square, not using ledges, bowing before every fight, whatever.

My version of honor is respecting your opponent(s) enough to use whatever means necessary to kill them because doing anything less means you are treating them as inferior players who can't handle the real game.

AkenoKobayashi
09-10-2017, 12:27 AM
The concept of honor, at its core, is subjective to the individual. What you find is honorable may not be honorably to someone else. As far as I'm concerned as long as you don't violate the terms of agreement, you are being honorable. Of course, not taking the consequences of your actions responsibly is also dishonorable.

And spamming the same move is dishonorable. *cough*Valk leg sweep*cough*

Antonioj26
09-10-2017, 12:30 AM
The concept of honor, at its core, is subjective to the individual. What you find is honorable may not be honorably to someone else. As far as I'm concerned as long as you don't violate the terms of agreement, you are being honorable. Of course, not taking the consequences of your actions responsibly is also dishonorable.

And spamming the same move is dishonorable. *cough*Valk leg sweep*cough*

It's been awhile since I've seen someone complain about valk or her sweep but it makes me laugh every single time.

CandleInTheDark
09-10-2017, 12:36 AM
The problem with the honor system is that there is no system. It exists purely in the individuals head and what honor is happens to change from person to person.

One person thinks that honor means having a fight fair and square, not using ledges, bowing before every fight, whatever.

My version of honor is respecting your opponent(s) enough to use whatever means necessary to kill them because doing anything less means you are treating them as inferior players who can't handle the real game.

Oh yeah certainly I agree, I am a dishonourable savage >.> I don't prescribe to any kind of honour system, my point is threads like this from people of either side, hatemail and attacking your own partner for not playing the way you do doesn't help the toxicity level in the community.

Waynedetta40k
09-10-2017, 02:58 PM
Sorry if there was any ambiguity in what I said, but I don't think there is an answer here basically. We're certainly not interested in punishing players for expressing themselves with different gameplay styles.

I totally got what u were saying even if the gameplaystlyle includes sabotage its ok.
Because thats what they are doing they are crippling their own team and you just name it in a different way so its sounds acceptable.
Solutions to this problem have been posted in this forums by others and by me several times.

Antonioj26
09-10-2017, 03:36 PM
I totally got what u were saying even if the gameplaystlyle includes sabotage its ok.
Because thats what they are doing they are crippling their own team and you just name it in a different way so its sounds acceptable.
Solutions to this problem have been posted in this forums by others and by me several times.

one of which is just making friends with someone who likes to play like you, pretty easy and now everyone gets to play the way they want. You call it sabotage, others call it ganking, jumping someone, or stabbing someone in the back.

Waynedetta40k
09-10-2017, 03:53 PM
one of which is just making friends with someone who likes to play like you, pretty easy and now everyone gets to play the way they want. You call it sabotage, others call it ganking, jumping someone, or stabbing someone in the back.

Ofc they call it like that, this is how the gamemode works.
Making friends is fine, but I like to be independent and play whenever I want.
Any other compettitive game gets you banned for trolling.
4v4 is 4v4 and not a row of 1v1s
Dont call it different playstyle just call it sabotaging because thats what it is if you do not use every possible advantage to win and handicap your team on purpose.

Antonioj26
09-10-2017, 04:03 PM
Ofc they call it like that, this is how the gamemode works.
Making friends is fine, but I like to be independent and play whenever I want.
Any other compettitive game gets you banned for trolling.
4v4 is 4v4 and not a row of 1v1s
Dont call it different playstyle just call it sabotaging because thats what it is if you do not use every possible advantage to win and handicap your team on purpose.

Don't call it sabotage, call it being too much of a chicken to fight in a 1v1 fight because you know you'll lose.

kweassa1
09-10-2017, 04:16 PM
I know it can be frustrating.. but seriously, you can't ban people for being stupid. :)

Just write the guy's name down, and never play with him again. Tell him the exact reason -- his "honor" is stupidity -- and you don't agree with his methods, and drop from the game within 30sec grace period.

SoulEavens
09-10-2017, 04:17 PM
What is honor? That is something everyone has to Decide for himself.

In my Case, I will do everything to Win in 4v4 Modes. In Duels and Brawls, i won't push my oponent off Ledges, and i will let my Comrade finish his Fight.
No matter if he Wins or looses. After that i wait a sec till my Opponent is ready, (if my Comrade loses) and the second Fight begins.

Honor is not something that is Fixed. Honor is deeply Personal. What Honor means to one Person might be very different to what it means to another, and both vies are absulutly Ture for the Person in Question.

Trbevis
09-10-2017, 04:44 PM
Honor lot are happy with whatever results and just want to enjoy the game with good fights.

Dishonorable lot want to win at any costs because it means everything to them winning on a video game.

I am honorable and i find most people are, when im playing a brawl for instance and my teamate is spamming the help button it actually makes me laugh. Some of the best matches ive had on for honor ive lost, and i couldnt care less because they were brilliant matches and everyone agreed to stay in for a rematch, its very rare but getting an honorable elimination match is amazing, especially when the last guy on one team fights one of yours and everyone left stands around chanting haha
But just my opinion, if you play dishonorable i get revenge (beast mode), then everyone loses hahaha

Waynedetta40k
09-10-2017, 05:36 PM
Don't call it sabotage, call it being too much of a chicken to fight in a 1v1 fight because you know you'll lose.

If I wanted 1on1 there is duel, If I want teamplay there is 4v4.
People are just making up stuff to play the game their way and not the way its meant to be played.
If Ubi wanted you to do 1on1 duels in a row they would give you the winner stands mode.
You can call it chicken ofc but i go by the definition and there we are back to the word sabotage/griefing.

Its like playing league of legends and tell people they are ******s if they ever leave their lane to help others.
Its like playing coutnerstrike and don't abuse money advantage.

Antonioj26
09-10-2017, 05:48 PM
If I wanted 1on1 there is duel, If I want teamplay there is 4v4.
People are just making up stuff to play the game their way and not the way its meant to be played.
If Ubi wanted you to do 1on1 duels in a row they would give you the winner stands mode.
You can call it chicken ofc but i go by the definition and there we are back to the word sabotage/griefing.

Its like playing league of legends and tell people they are ******s if they ever leave their lane to help others.
Its like playing coutnerstrike and don't abuse money advantage.

I'd Ubi wanted you to stab everyone in the back then they would start banning people for not doing it. It's not like the examples you gave at all since those are universally unacceptable whereas "honor" is something that's widely debated and the norm for a large chunk of the population. I'm not even for these arbitrary rules of honor that people make up in their head. In my opinion calling one teammate helping another "ganking" is just as dumb as someone waiting for a fair 1v1 to finish and calling it "sabotage."

Also I'm speaking more from a brawl and elimination perspective, dominion I would agree with you.

Waynedetta40k
09-10-2017, 06:31 PM
I'd Ubi wanted you to stab everyone in the back then they would start banning people for not doing it. It's not like the examples you gave at all since those are universally unacceptable .

Right this is the only difference they are unacceptable because its not league of honor or Counter honor. Those games do not have the word "honor" in their names and the developers made clear rules. While in For Honor people are making up stuff about honor, because the word honor is part of the name and this is why this behaviour which you usally wouldnt accept in other game is widely accepted in here but that doesnt mean it isnt griefng/trolling or whatever you wanna call it.

If ubisoft brought winner stands mode it would be quite clear tough.

Ubi not banning people is no evidence, I mean people won tournaments with the use of bugs... lol ubi just doesnt care to much

Antonioj26
09-10-2017, 06:51 PM
Right this is the only difference they are unacceptable because its not league of honor or Counter honor. Those games do not have the word "honor" in their names and the developers made clear rules. While in For Honor people are making up stuff about honor, because the word honor is part of the name and this is why this behaviour which you usally wouldnt accept in other game is widely accepted in here but that doesnt mean it isnt griefng/trolling or whatever you wanna call it.

If ubisoft brought winner stands mode it would be quite clear tough.

Ubi not banning people is no evidence, I mean people won tournaments with the use of bugs... lol ubi just doesnt care to much

But it's not just because it's the name, the only other game I can think of that's sorta similar is dark souls and there unspoken rules of honor like chugging or ganking. I'm positive these people would exist whether the name was for honor or not, might be less but they just that as a dumb excuse.

Ubi already stated their disapproval about bugs and exploits, but acknowledge it's their fault. They haven't done so for the honor people and they certainly haven't called it grieving or trolling because that's clearly not what the people playing with honor are intending.

Waynedetta40k
09-10-2017, 07:01 PM
But it's not just because it's the name, the only other game I can think of that's sorta similar is dark souls and there unspoken rules .

Unspoken rules do not have a place in competitive games.
If people want several 1on1's in a row lUbi should just give them a game mode which is exactly like that.

Antonioj26
09-10-2017, 07:06 PM
Unspoken rules do not have a place in competitive games.
If people want several 1on1's in a row lUbi should just give them a game mode which is exactly like that.

Or you can make a friend.

Mythic MK II
09-10-2017, 11:10 PM
Well, it all depends on the players. Some want to actually finish 1v1 fights instead of being helped by their team mates. I am talking about brawls though. 4v4 is alway gank or be ganked in my eyes. Too many variables in the form of players.
I myself like to complete a 1v1 in a brawl without the help of my team mate. You can make the argument that I should just play Duels but having the chance of fighting another guy right after is nice at times. Hoping you team mate can beat the other guy and if not you try to be the one to come in the clutch.

Also, with Revenge, being attacked by 2 people may actually give you the advantage, depending on the heroes they use, over them them instead.

I have had plenty of encounters where my team mate tried to "help" me and that just made my opponent get revenge and me being killed. The fight is no longer in my controll, if I had it in the first place.

Sure 2v1 can help out but my experience is the opposite for the majority of my experience.

CandleInTheDark
09-10-2017, 11:29 PM
Well, it all depends on the players. Some want to actually finish 1v1 fights instead of being helped by their team mates. I am talking about brawls though. 4v4 is alway gank or be ganked in my eyes. Too many variables in the form of players.
I myself like to complete a 1v1 in a brawl without the help of my team mate. You can make the argument that I should just play Duels but having the chance of fighting another guy right after is nice at times. Hoping you team mate can beat the other guy and if not you try to be the one to come in the clutch.

Also, with Revenge, being attacked by 2 people may actually give you the advantage, depending on the heroes they use, over them them instead.

I have had plenty of encounters where my team mate tried to "help" me and that just made my opponent get revenge and me being killed. The fight is no longer in my controll, if I had it in the first place.

Sure 2v1 can help out but my experience is the opposite for the majority of my experience.

Here's the thing, Brawl is the only game other than 1v1 which has no gear stats, no boosts and no feats, if I want a team game where it is just the kits provided to each character, sort of like a no frills 2v2 skirmish (which I would actually like, 2v1 is more doable than 4v1) which would be even better it revenge wasn't a thing and it was just a 2v2 dustup with no powerups, that is where I have to go. Odds are good if I try and get that, I am going to get at least one of the three sending hatemail, there is a non-zero chance my own partner will at best let the other two have at me then have two 1v1's, at worst actively hinder me. I'm not talking about two people getting the jump on one person and having two 2v1's by the by, that doesn't sound fun to me either and I get there is as much bad behaviour on the other side of things. The best example of what I am talking about that people might widely know is the finals of the new character brawl tournament in the season three launch. The four of them got in one place and it was a target switching mad brawl, when one team didn't want that, they made a smart tactical move and found a choke point to enforce 1v1 where they were doing better.

And that is the shame of it, there are a lot of ways to play every mode, but there are too many people on both sides where if you step outside of thier way of playing they are going to be as toxic as possible. I would probably spend most of my time in brawl and I would even go with the honour thing sometimes if it wasn't the case that I dare not play it how I want to because I might get all three of the others salty at me.

kweassa1
09-11-2017, 08:00 AM
And that is the shame of it, there are a lot of ways to play every mode, but there are too many people on both sides where if you step outside of thier way of playing they are going to be as toxic as possible. I would probably spend most of my time in brawl and I would even go with the honour thing sometimes if it wasn't the case that I dare not play it how I want to because I might get all three of the others salty at me.

The thing is, there are 'two' sides to this issue, but they're definitely not on even ground IMO. Like it or not, the universal rule of any game, any form of competition is simply "give your best, honest effort to win". Think about the sports world where sportsmanship is to be kept at all times. If someone screws around with their match/competition and shows dishonest, with no earnest and sincere effort to win the game, and decides to do things like "going easy" on other contendors, teams, etc, that usually warrantes seriously penalties from the governing body of that sport.

As a matter of fact, many earnest and sincere players in competitions would be deeply insulted when someone shows them 'mercy' or 'honor', because not only is it unprofessional, but it also implies that in a sense, the other guy is boasting a form of superiority in a self-serving fashion. The really competitive players usually don't get fired up or angry just because they lose, but when somebody screws up with the match, shows "pity" or stupid shi* like "honor", then that's when you'll see them raving mad like lunatics because it's disrespectful.


I've said this before and I'll say it again -- real honor is when you give it all you got, in earnest, fight as hard as you can, in the most ruthless and bloodthirsty way possible (but within the boundaries of the game rules), showing earnest effort to win. And then, after doing your best, accepting whatever the consequences of the fight/bout/match/whatever ... admit defeat graciously, declare victory humbly... and when the fight is over, leave no grudges behind to the other person. THIS is what means to be honorable.


What the "honor geeks" are doing isn't "honor". It's a self-mastu*bation through honor COSPLAY, "pretending" to be honorable folk, when all they are doing is roleplaying their individual and personal fantasies. That ain't no honor.

Honorable people always do their best to win, do not jeopardize the chances of winning on purpose for some show or display, and CERTAINLY do not let their teammates down.


As a matter of fact, you know what the "COSPLAY honor" really resembles? Your team the clear winners, but just letting the sole enemy survivor fight a series of 1v1s? Predators bringing live prey to their young so they can toy with them before the kill. Bullies surrounding a frail student and daring him to fight 1v1. That's what the COSPLAY honor folk are doing.

So uncivilized. *tsk*

Malyngo
09-11-2017, 08:12 AM
I am one of those players that tend to stand by and watch. But this is different on case by case.
I had it more than once that me helping out triggered Revenge mode on the enemy, and he was able to kill us both. So I tend to watch and see how the fight is going, and help out if help is needed.

PDXGorechild
09-11-2017, 08:35 AM
Personally, Honor isn't just not ganking an opponent. It's not hitting the opponent in a 1v1 situation like duel, start of elimination etc. while they are emoting at the beginning to show respect. It's not purposely throwing them off a ledge when in all other rounds they could have done this to you but chose to continue attacking rather than a simple round ending push. In my opinion it's just polite honestly. You don't have to not gank, and by all means when getting ganked or in a true team setting like dominion anything goes IMO. But in my eyes it's unfair to punish a player with a whole chain because they wanted to do an emote in the start of the round. Most round starting emotes are to show respect and hitting them starts a toxic salt battle and is just honestly rude. I don't emote at the begging but if people pay that respect it should be at the bare minimum not rubbed in their face, and in most polite circumstances the favor returned. It's one thing to play the game as intended, it's another thing to act rude. A lot of players may disagree with me here, and that's fine, but I think when BASIC Honor like the little things mentioned above is ignored or neglected then it just makes this community even more salty, and even more toxic.

You think as I do. In Dominion and Skirmish, anything goes. It's objective based or a rumble. With Elimination I go with the flow, if they wanna gank, i'll gank. If they wanna play honourably, I'll play honourably. But in Brawls I will always try to fight honourably and encourage the other team to as well. I'll even forgive them one gank and lay off when it's the other way around to show them no hard feelings. I don't enjoy brawls where the enemy will try to ledge, run off at the start of the fight to help their friend or just generally employ any lame tactic to win, but I dont feel it's a bannable offence. The only reason I stay in these games is how satisfying it feels when the enemy team tries to lame and a gank you but you serve their asses to them anyway :cool:

Aku...
09-11-2017, 12:07 PM
4v4 is a LONG way from being "competitive" (meaning tournament competitive)

the devs are still trying to make 1v1 duels fair, add gear stats, feats and 6 more players to a p2p lobby and you get ****fest where strategy, skill and game knowledge no longer matter

This is no Esport. so why on earth should people get banned for playing a certain way? getting banned for honor? or getting banned for ganking?

winners get the exact same reward as losers. it's not like rainbow 6 siege casual where you get more renown and a roll at an alpha pack for winning

anyone who thinks 4v4 is fair, seriously needs to play and watch pros esport games

keep in mind, the only other esport fighting game with more than 2 players is super smash bros (which isn't great imo), but that mainly revolves around 1v1 and the series is nearly 2 decades old

Vakris_One
09-11-2017, 01:42 PM
This topic is so stupid. All of you here writing mini novels belittling another's playstyle and describing how one playstyle is inferior to the other because you don't subscribe to it is ridiculous and it is sad that you cannot even see that.

It's a f***ing video game guys. Relax and stop b***ing about how someone else chooses to play the game. Adapt to the different situations this game allows and stop being butt hurt or put other players on your own private little ban list and never play with them again if their mere existence hurts your feelies so dang much.

So sad to read grown men bickering over the notion of digital honor like a bunch of pedantic geeks.

EIGHTYYARDS NYC
09-11-2017, 06:48 PM
I have never seen a game where people complain about fighting with "honor". Idc if Im playing Dominion or 4V4 Elimination, if I get somewhere and its a 1V1, Im not going to jump in because my teammate is losing. Get out of here. Lol. He will respawn. If it like game deciding I may still let them shoot the fair one. I usually interfere if my team is danger of losing, other than that I try and play my way unless I see the opponent has desire to play with these same rules.

And the taunting, for real? If I have the opportunity I will, Im paying for my XBL, not you. I bought this game for myself, not for you.

HumoLoco
09-11-2017, 07:27 PM
This conversation has been discussed a billion times. Just get friends and your problem is solved.


I rated this post 9/11 very helpful af.