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UnblockableMeta
08-20-2017, 06:39 PM
I'm am still very confused at the notion that Centurion is 'balanced' in 1v1's. My main reasoning deals with the concept of punishment. For vanilla characters the outcome of the scenarios below are obvious and mostly uniform:

1. GB'd and thrown into a wall
2. Getting Parried
3. Getting exhausted


1./2. Usually a heavy of some sort follows a light or just a slower harder hitting heavy, if you're PK i believe three bleeds or two with the third being the deep gouge post heavy on a wall splatted opponent is the most punishing of being being on the receiving end of these scenarios though i could be wrong.

3. CGB, block, CGB, block, dodge unblockable parry bait feints

At this point your punishment ends. You recover from the situation with blocking or CGB-ing until you regain footing or return the favor with a parry yourself. This does not happen with Centurion. Parrying is the only source of stamina damage for many vanilla characters in the game and this is how it should be. This game was not built to handle such a mechanic being capitalized on so greatly. One parry deals a great deal or stamina damage as it is. To have a parry mixup exclusive to Centurion (and now gladiator) that can rob most heroes of more than 80% of their stamina and a kick that can deplete the rest (as well as the GB punches if you wrongly dodge an anticipated kick) border on the notion of balance but then to have the capability of keeping a hero's stamina depleted pushes this character way over the line IMO although that could be somewhat forgiven if like all characters his stamina eventually got depleted as well which does happen...

...in the hands of someone who doesn't yet know to draw out the punishment. In the hands of an expert he will never enter the state of exhaustion and you will never leave it lest the Centurion wills it.

And don't even get me started on the range, tracking, heavy quick feint 50/50 and wall pin issues as they deserve (or already have) their own thread.

The nerf of this character is long overdue but i expect the eyes of the dev's (as well as yours) are far more focused on what the new heroes are up to aren't they.

Knight_Raime
08-20-2017, 07:16 PM
As someone who's actually very experienced with centurion in 1v1 the main reason someone struggles with him is purely because they're not aware of what he can and can't do. Like not everyone knows when he can throw a jab or a kick. He's basically got too many options for someone who doesn't spend the time to learn him.

In my own thread about nerf/buffing him I mentioned this and suggested some nerfs to cut down on his options so he becomes more understandable.
I don't believe his parry counter is OP since being out of stamina is pretty easy to avoid punishment in at the moment. Plus you're not getting much real damage with the parry counter and in the current meta we exist in guaranteed damage is the most important thing since most people like to turtle. Maybe post defensive meta changes the amount of stamina it does should be looked at. But for now it's fine.

I personally think his wall combo should stay since it's no longer infinite outside corners (which a few other heros have as well btw) and he's about punishing people with splats. But if it absolutely had to go I wouldn't miss it. My main issue with him is a lot of his kit just frankly isn't good and he doesn't have a good opener. The one saving grace he has in my eyes (wall combo, parry punishes, and bugged stamina feint cost aside) is his heavy soft feint combo. But doing that from neutral doesn't really work. and i've started running into people who can and have escaped it. So even that trick is getting worse now.

But yeah. I think he just feels overwhelming. if we got rid of light parry punishes as a whole, fixed his stamina bug, and removed some of his options where kick/jab can be placed he'd be more tollerable for people.

RatedChaotic
08-20-2017, 07:16 PM
As a Conq main........I feel that pain. I'm doing less and less blocking as time goes on. Yep I turtle then punish with him. I'm that hated guy.

lMoosel
08-20-2017, 08:39 PM
He's in an alright spot in 1v1. The problem is nobody wants to learn the matchup it's just easier for them to complain. I can't even tell you the last time I've struggled against one and that's against good high MMR players. I'm maining him currently so I know what he can and can't do. People panic the get themselves in trouble (over dodging, spamming giving easy parrys) and get crushed. I completely agree he is strong though that low HP is a problem sometimes but I really don't think he's OP. I've gone up against some amazing conqs that will make you hate life while playing cent. It's just matchup knowledge.

Depressd_Cent
08-20-2017, 08:56 PM
He's in an alright spot in 1v1. The problem is nobody wants to learn the matchup it's just easier for them to complain. I can't even tell you the last time I've struggled against one and that's against good high MMR players. I'm maining him currently so I know what he can and can't do. People panic the get themselves in trouble (over dodging, spamming giving easy parrys) and get crushed. I completely agree he is strong though that low HP is a problem sometimes but I really don't think he's OP. I've gone up against some amazing conqs that will make you hate life while playing cent. It's just matchup knowledge.

plus cent gets punished if you dodge his kicks or punches, pretty much guaranteed a gb or attack on him. his health is bad 2 heavys and a zone and there goes the cent. i look at it as a 50/50 he either lands his hits in which he melts you or he misses then he's ****ed

brashtralas
08-20-2017, 09:16 PM
plus cent gets punished if you dodge his kicks or punches, pretty much guaranteed a gb or attack on him. his health is bad 2 heavys and a zone and there goes the cent. i look at it as a 50/50 he either lands his hits in which he melts you or he misses then he's ****ed

You should play him some more. You have zero recovery on a whiffed kick. Just light attack to ensure that you're not punished.

I play as him as well, and he's just fundamentally flawed. No one wants an all or nothing force of destruction, not to mention his 4v4 superiority.

Tyrjo
08-20-2017, 09:39 PM
Centurion is not fun to play against because he can kill you from pretty much one parry or one mistake.

You need to be offensive against him to shut down his eternal flurry of attacks, yet you cannot be offensive against him because it will most likely mean that you will run out of stamina. Then you are finished. He is the most hated character in the game and is probably guilty of many people putting the game down and never coming back. Like already mentioned, fundamentally flawed in design.

Depressd_Cent
08-20-2017, 10:52 PM
You should play him some more. You have zero recovery on a whiffed kick. Just light attack to ensure that you're not punished.

I play as him as well, and he's just fundamentally flawed. No one wants an all or nothing force of destruction, not to mention his 4v4 superiority.

i do play him why do you think i said that you can get a guaranteed gb after you dodge his kick or block his heavy then dodge his regular punch (not charged) ive seen it and done. seen as its been done to me and ive done it to other cents. the two heavys and zone is from the raider

Mia.Nora
08-20-2017, 11:39 PM
Bandanaa proved all those points to be true in the tournament against best of players by going on a 10+ rounds win streak, and only lost because of nobushi cheating with exploits.

Centurion as of now has the best wall punish, best light parry punish and best OOS punish in the game. But that is not the biggest offender in 1v1, it is that most Centurions do nothing but mixup

1. heavy feints back to back
2. fast heavies
3. soft feint heavies into GB
4. semi-charged heavies to throw off parry window

Here is the big problem with above. As tournament also showed that, when they do that all you can do is wait. You cant risk parrying or dodging the way you would do vs other classes. That means extremely boring and annoying defensive play. Only way to prevent that is by going on offensive, but then he has the best punish in the game, and what you may get out of your offense is extremely lopsided vs what punish you will get.

In 4v4 he is cancer due to his tracking, unblockable, pinning attack that enters you into 6 second cutscene.

Herbstlicht
08-20-2017, 11:53 PM
Hm, op is relative, but he is absolutely top tier in duels, there simply is no denying this. Fix it with nerfs, changes for the whole battle system or buffs for the low tier heros, i don't mind. But at some point, a change has to and will happen.

Good thing is new centurion weapons are shiny, so you might survive some nerfs :3

AnEnticingSquid
08-20-2017, 11:53 PM
His absurd light punish and the fact that if you whiff an attack or gb, you just lost half your health an all or your stamina in a 5.5 second cutscene is why I consider him op. Not because he can't be countered, but because no other character gets more confirmed damage by a long shot and his stamina is endless. So yeah, compared to most of the cast, he is far superior. The only characters that are better are the ones with extremely poorly optimized 50/50s like wardens sb or raiders charge. But what do the lower tier characters have to fight him with? Nothing but turtling up and reacting to everything does. Which is exactly what he was designed to defeat...

UbiJurassic
08-21-2017, 12:12 AM
Centurion is 1v1 always seems to be a polarizing topic. Most of the feedback we get says that his 1v1 prowess isn't oppressing, with some players calling it weak even. Something to keep in mind when fight Centurion 1v1 is that there are multiple out's to his combos. Whether that be a gap in between his attacks to dodge or the opportunity to parry him, he does have some vulnerabilities to his playstyle when he doesn't have a team to cover him in between his combos.

Herbstlicht
08-21-2017, 12:42 AM
Well, he is not unbeatable and many centurions do not turtle up in duels, so it is not too bad actually. Still, the punish in all the consequences are out of line when it is the traditional cast fighting him. Same is true for the highlander, as a slow hero, he really suffers against the centurion despite his many options in theory. So maybe try to trust those tournament results and some simple numbers - like punishment optuins centurion vs punishment options other heroes (take highlander here, makes for absurd numbers right now ˆˆ). And then there still remains this nasty cutscene. Would prefer this damage instant, would feel less stupid then. Still bad though.

Mia.Nora
08-21-2017, 12:42 AM
Centurion is 1v1 always seems to be a polarizing topic. Most of the feedback we get says that his 1v1 prowess isn't oppressing, with some players calling it weak even. Something to keep in mind when fight Centurion 1v1 is that there are multiple out's to his combos. Whether that be a gap in between his attacks to dodge or the opportunity to parry him, he does have some vulnerabilities to his playstyle when he doesn't have a team to cover him in between his combos.

While I can understand what you say might be valid in a fight between two inexperienced players, no experienced centurion will ever attempt a jab after a blocked heavy. Mind you he cant be punished on whiffed kick either, all he needs to do is immediately chain into heavy and feint that heavy.

There is absolutely no exit on his combo if he GBs/parries you near a wall. This is a confirmed full combo where he throws you to wall, fully charges heavy, fully charges jab, and confirmed jump for 65 damage and a ton of stamina damage. So what you say is completely invalid.

Moreover his heavies are faster than a good portion of the cast and he can mixup them the way I mention in this post already by going for either quick heavies, just feints, soft GBs or semi charged heavies that throw out parry window. There is no opportunity whatsoever in between those.

Whatever punishable moves he has, like; long distance kick attempts without a follow up, or jab attempt after a blocked heavy, or jump attack from neutral, or fully charged heavy from neutral.. Centurion players simply do not do them. They do not need to do them, only noobs make those mistakes. And rest of his kit is not punishable.

Just watch tournament again, those players were the very best. Yes they came there by exploits and cheats, but still they were the very best players who are capable of parrying flickered oroichi zones. Yet a guy who picked Centurion 3 weeks prior to finals wiped the floor with them all for 16 round win streak, only losing to a cheating nobushi.

You are welcome :)

UbiJurassic
08-21-2017, 01:11 AM
While I can understand what you say might be valid in a fight between two inexperienced players, no experienced centurion will ever attempt a jab after a blocked heavy. Mind you he cant be punished on whiffed kick either, all he needs to do is immediately chain into heavy and feint that heavy.

There is absolutely no exit on his combo if he GBs/parries you near a wall. This is a confirmed full combo where he throws you to wall, fully charges heavy, fully charges jab, and confirmed jump for 65 damage and a ton of stamina damage. So what you say is completely invalid.

Moreover his heavies are faster than a good portion of the cast and he can mixup them the way I mention in this post already by going for either quick heavies, just feints, soft GBs or semi charged heavies that throw out parry window. There is no opportunity whatsoever in between those.

Whatever punishable moves he has, like; long distance kick attempts without a follow up, or jab attempt after a blocked heavy, or jump attack from neutral, or fully charged heavy from neutral.. Centurion players simply do not do them. They do not need to do them, only noobs make those mistakes. And rest of his kit is not punishable.

Just watch tournament again, those players were the very best. Yes they came there by exploits and cheats, but still they were the very best players who are capable of parrying flickered oroichi zones. Yet a guy who picked Centurion 3 weeks prior to finals wiped the floor with them all for 16 round win streak, only losing to a cheating nobushi.

You are welcome :)

Definitely good points. We watched how players in the tournament played very closely and it definitely brought a host of things to light that we may look to address in the near future. As long as people, like yourself, keep highlighting potential balance concerns, we'll be sure to keep getting them over to the team.

AnEnticingSquid
08-21-2017, 02:05 AM
Definitely good points. We watched how players in the tournament played very closely and it definitely brought a host of things to light that we may look to address in the near future. As long as people, like yourself, keep highlighting potential balance concerns, we'll be sure to keep getting them over to the team.

Not trying to call you out, I'm sure your just doing your job, but these problems have existed since the day this character was put into the game and EVERY SINGLE DAY people point out these very same concerns and all we get is " We will look into that.". Truth is this character has been out for months now and he is the same as he was on launch day. Do you know how disheartening it is to constantly hear " We are working on it" with nothing else to show for it other than the same copy and paste reply? It gives many many people zero trust in the developers ability to balance this game. Not just with centurian either. Why is it that warden still has a 50/50? I can guarantee you nobody except warden mains think this is a balanced mechanic. Same with raider new rediculouse 50/50 That I saw posts BEFORE IT WAS EVEN IMPLIMENTED saying it was a terrible idea. Yet here we are... still waiting for them to undo that damage... Eventually you get to the point where you say **** it... they aren't listening. Then there is one less person in this ever declining player base... Sorry if this sounds personal, because it's not. I just don't want to see this game destroy itself before it even has a chance to shine and it's frustrating watching that happen.

RatedChaotic
08-21-2017, 02:29 AM
He's in an alright spot in 1v1. The problem is nobody wants to learn the matchup it's just easier for them to complain. I can't even tell you the last time I've struggled against one and that's against good high MMR players. I'm maining him currently so I know what he can and can't do. People panic the get themselves in trouble (over dodging, spamming giving easy parrys) and get crushed. I completely agree he is strong though that low HP is a problem sometimes but I really don't think he's OP. I've gone up against some amazing conqs that will make you hate life while playing cent. It's just matchup knowledge.

You clearly misunderstood what I was saying about the Conq. Any Conq main would agree that with the number of unblockables some heroes have its a bit unfair at times when 2 of our abilities in our moveset are negated because we need to block to activate it. Superior Block and Superior Block Heavy. I dont know what kind of Conqs you played that you thought were good. But a really good Conq takes advantage of those 2. Kinda defeats the purpose of those moves when we are dodging more than blocking as a strong defender. See what I mean.

Mia.Nora
08-21-2017, 02:37 AM
You clearly misunderstood what I was saying about the Conq. Any Conq main would agree that with the number of unblockables some heroes have its a bit unfair at times when 2 of our abilities in our moveset are negated because we need to block to activate it. Superior Block and Superior Block Heavy. I dont know what kind of Conqs you played that you thought we good. But a really good Conq takes advantage of those 2.

He is right about Centurion vs Conq matchup, not because Conqueror win that; but because it takes away the exploitable behaviour of Centurion relying solely on heavy mixups. You cant use heavies vs a conqueror, that much is granted. That means Centurions now have to rely on light mixups instead.

On the conqueror's end there is nothing he can do apart from 12 damage SB-lights, and the first messup he does he gets punished for 65 damage. Conqueror still not gonna win the fight, but it will be so much more boring and longer than any other fight.

RatedChaotic
08-21-2017, 02:47 AM
He is right about Centurion vs Conq matchup, not because Conqueror win that; but because it takes away the exploitable behaviour of Centurion relying solely on heavy mixups. You cant use heavies vs a conqueror, that much is granted. That means Centurions now have to rely on light mixups instead.

On the conqueror's end there is nothing he can do apart from 12 damage SB-lights, and the first messup he does he gets punished for 65 damage. Conqueror still not gonna win the fight, but it will be so much more boring and longer than any other fight.

1..Wrong......Cent has 0 heavy unblockables?
2. The point I was getting at Superior Block and Superior Block Heavy negated by the amount of unblockables he able to throw in little time.

As a Conq unblockables are my worries because of my moveset requires me to block to benefit from it.. But thank you for the light mix up. Superior Block will stop those. L2P

Antonioj26
08-21-2017, 03:05 AM
1..Wrong......Cent has 0 heavy unblockables?
2. The point I was getting at Superior Block and Superior Block Heavy negated by the amount of unblockables he able to throw in little time.

Really the unblockable cent can do is the kick. He can't do the jab since he needs to do a heavy first and the same goes for his fully charged heavy. The cent will have to whiff the initial heavy but all the conq has to do is sit there and see what the cent will follow through with.

Half charged heavy=free gb
Fully charged heavy=free parry
Heavy soft feint gb=reset after cgb

Even cents kick is riskier since conquerors shield bash can punish it.

RatedChaotic
08-21-2017, 03:12 AM
really the unblockable cent can do is the kick. He can't do the jab since he needs to do a heavy first and the same goes for his fully charged heavy. The cent will have to whiff the initial heavy but all the conq has to do is sit there and see what the cent will follow through with.

Half charged heavy=free gb
fully charged heavy=free parry
heavy soft feint gb=reset after cgb

even cents kick is riskier since conquerors shield bash can punish it.

lmao.....You can do your first heavy out of range. Scrub.

Antonioj26
08-21-2017, 03:17 AM
lmao.....You can do your first heavy out of range. Scrub.

Reread that, dummy. I already said that you can whiff it. I then wrote out how it would be easy to counter for conqueror. Don't get fussy with me because you can't beat out one of your best matchups.

Mia.Nora
08-21-2017, 03:19 AM
1..Wrong......Cent has 0 heavy unblockables?
2. The point I was getting at Superior Block and Superior Block Heavy negated by the amount of unblockables he able to throw in little time.

As a Conq unblockables are my worries because of my moveset requires me to block to benefit from it.. But thank you for the light mix up. Superior Block will stop those. L2P

His light mixup comes after kick, you cant block that, nothing to L2P there. Just like Antonioj said, as Conq you do not need to worry about any unblockables but kick from Centurion, and after landing that he has 2 choices light > light/GB, or he goes for fully charges heavy after kick, which you should be able to parry. If he misses kick he gets 12 damage from side dodge SB>light. Apart from that from neutral he can attempt some useless H>soft GB but that is easy to CGB since as conq you wont attempt to parry anyway, and his only other approach left is direct lights which you just block.

That's about it, for everything else, like literally everything else Centurion can do all you need to do is just block. If he attempts from neutral to H>unblockable charged heavy parry that and punish for 25 damage. If he attempts anything except above, it results in a punishable situation. Problem is that if a Centurion does nothing but above, and a Conq does nothing but SB>light that fight will take several minutes. That is the problem in that matchup.

Centurion is a cancer in 1v1 with his heavy mixups and insane punish, but conqueror is immune to both since he Cent cant use heavies and conq doesn't attack. But in return it turns into a staring contest since conq doesn't have anything to try apart from bash>light that wont risk him getting 65 punish with high odds.

Mia.Nora
08-21-2017, 03:20 AM
Reread that, dummy. I already said that you can whiff it. I then wrote out how it would be easy to counter for conqueror. Don't get fussy with me because you can't beat out one of your best matchups.

I think he cant parry the unblockable from neutral (whiff H into air form far) then unblockable. That's on him. This is only a problem in 4v4 but it is a huge problem in 4v4. Still this thread is about 1v1 not 4v4.

Antonioj26
08-21-2017, 03:25 AM
I think he cant parry the unblockable from neutral (whiff H into air form far) then unblockable. That's on him. This is only a problem in 4v4 but it is a huge problem in 4v4. Still this thread is about 1v1 not 4v4.

I'm sure that's the case, I'm also pretty sure he only plays against ai so it's not like they whiff the first heavy anyway.

Mia.Nora
08-21-2017, 03:31 AM
I'm sure that's the case, I'm also pretty sure he only plays against ai so it's not like they whiff the first heavy anyway.

You will be surprised but it does. Then again it also does silly stuff like lunge attacks from neutral, or jabs after blocked heavies. Centurion lvl3 bot is annoying due to his insane parry rate (like all lvl3 bots) with insane punish. It parries PK second light for example. Still it is a very good example how strong Centurion is in 1v1, since the only things you can punish vs it are the stuff real players refuse to attempt. And when he goes aggressive on close range with heavy mixups, the way real players do, all you can do is just sit back react with just blocks or dodging kicks with no punish afterwards (real players feint a heavy after kick for punish immunity unless you are kensei/assassin). Bot at least does some unblockable heavies in his mixup for punish, which real players don't do either.

Thread got derailed, lets put it back on topic;

Centurion is very strong in 1v1 with below issues;
1. Best wall punish
2. Best light parry punish (in open environment)
3. Best corner punish %100 > 0 (swap sides Charged Heavy>Jab)
4. Exploit of Unblockable icon & orange flash popping on enemy screen, when Centurion soft GBs his charge heavy near end
5. His heavy mixup being very strong with options of feint, quick Heavy, Heavy>soft GB, semi-charged heavy (throwing away parry window), semi-charged heavy into soft GB, and exploit at #4. When he goes for that all you can do is sit back and defend yourself with blocks/CGB without a punish opportunity.

Centuion is total B.S. in 4v4 due to;
1. His whiff H (into air) > heavy is a death sentence that is performed super easily which has those attributes; unblockable, tracks after dodge, tracks after roll, tracks around obstacles & corners, does 65 damage and puts enemy in a 6 second cutscene that is not interrupted by his ally attacks. Best solution would be removing pin effect from his charged heavies on targets locked onto someone else.
2. His CC ignores revenge.

mrmistark
08-21-2017, 05:05 AM
Honestly, though I hate cent, there is only two fixes That I feel he really needs:

Less stamina pool (this would put a limit on his punishes especially the wall splat)

Ub charged heavy with less tracking. (Seriously, this one is the one that makes me the most angry. I get it, you can parry yeah yeah got it but for real? You literally can only rear dodge and that's if you had a solid amount of space between you in the first place. How does a side dodge or even a roll STILL get caught by this? It can literally do a damn 360 degree turn and still hit you, and yeah I get it it's more of a 1v1 topic and it's the 4v4 that makes it hard to parry meaning you get caught with it, but even though parryable in 1v1 pretty easily if you know the timing, there is no other attack in the whole games history that has literally forced you to parry or get hit with so much damage: heavy ub into undodgeable charge jab into talon or a zone and god forbid you're by a wall, good fight)

Dude_of_Valor
08-21-2017, 12:36 PM
Honestly, though I hate cent, there is only two fixes That I feel he really needs:

Less stamina pool (this would put a limit on his punishes especially the wall splat)

Ub charged heavy with less tracking. (Seriously, this one is the one that makes me the most angry. I get it, you can parry yeah yeah got it but for real? You literally can only rear dodge and that's if you had a solid amount of space between you in the first place. How does a side dodge or even a roll STILL get caught by this? It can literally do a damn 360 degree turn and still hit you, and yeah I get it it's more of a 1v1 topic and it's the 4v4 that makes it hard to parry meaning you get caught with it, but even though parryable in 1v1 pretty easily if you know the timing, there is no other attack in the whole games history that has literally forced you to parry or get hit with so much damage: heavy ub into undodgeable charge jab into talon or a zone and god forbid you're by a wall, good fight)

Funny on your last point I find that it is dodging sideways that makes him miss and not backwards (though I do delay my dodge somewhat whilst slowly moving back).

S.J.Lannister
08-21-2017, 02:00 PM
How many times we need to ask for balance for Centurion?

It is Season 3 already. Maybe balance will come with Season 4, with dedicated servers, no false new armors, rainbows and unicorns.

RatedChaotic
08-21-2017, 02:26 PM
I'm sure that's the case, I'm also pretty sure he only plays against ai so it's not like they whiff the first heavy anyway.

Ya but my point is you can still do it. I can see you dont have an open mind and that its usually your way or the highway here. .Also to add to my point....What other heavy hero loses 2 of his moveset moves because of unblockables? Conqs moveset is small already and to remove 2 of them for an unblockable is alittle bs imo.

But you said Cent only has one unblockable and your wrong there. You always wanna play this top tier player card and think we play vs the best players everyday in every match we play. That whats so hilarious.

An yes I do pvp sometimes here *******. But is when I'm not getting disconnects, ragequits, resyncs, and errors. Which is hardly ever. I just rather pvp in games with less issues than pvp here. I'm not the greatest like you make yourself out to be all the time. But I'm sure I would surprise you in pvp.

Antonioj26
08-21-2017, 02:41 PM
Ya but my point is you can still do it. I can see you dont have an open mind and that its usually your way or the highway here. .Also to add to my point....What other heavy hero loses 2 of his moveset moves because of unblockables?

But you said Cent only has one unblockable and your wrong there. You always wanna play this top tier player card and think we play vs the best players everyday.

What other hero loses his 3/4 of his mixup game because of conquerors superior block? I didn't say he only has one unblockable, I said he really can only do one since the others have to be followed by a heavy. If a cent whiffs a heavy you already know whats coming, either he feints the second heavy into GB (which he will probably be out of range for so probably wouldnt work anyway), let off a half charged heavy (which means a free GB for you), or does a fully charged unblockable (which takes 1100ms) and if you cant parry the final option then thats on you. You don't need to be a top tier player to parry a setup that takes almost 2 full seconds.

If you want to admit that you are hindered by your skill then fine but don't claim to speak for all conquerors.

RatedChaotic
08-21-2017, 03:02 PM
Did I say I couldnt parry it? No I didnt. I am actually good at parrying it.

But I like how you said I would know whats coming and then listed multiple things. Yet you didnt answer my question. You tried side stepping it with another question. And I thought you were the For Honor guide to god tier.....

Antonioj26
08-21-2017, 03:26 PM
Did I say I couldnt parry it? No I didnt. I am actually good at parrying it.

But I like how you said I would know whats coming and then listed multiple things. Yet you didnt answer my question. You tried side stepping it with another question. And I thought you were the For Honor guide to god tier.....

But that's not the case I already explained centurion only has one viable unblockable against conqueror so I didn't dodge your question. You said that he has so many unblockables or something of the sort and aside from the kick they are all useless against conqueror. I would have to make the assumption you couldn't parry it since you were the one saying you can start it up out of range, why would you bring it up if you had no problem parrying it?

RatedChaotic
08-21-2017, 03:33 PM
Because its possible to do it. Thats why I brought it up. Not because I couldnt parry it. You are very narrow minded.

Antonioj26
08-21-2017, 03:35 PM
Because its possible to do it. Thats why.

And it shouldn't be a problem for a conq, like I said 1 viable unblockable.

RatedChaotic
08-21-2017, 03:36 PM
And it shouldn't be a problem for a conq, like I said 1 viable unblockable.

Ya and humans dont make mistakes ever. But ok Cent is fine and Conq is fine. I'm wrong. I just play vs AI anyway so I dont know anything about this game. Carry on....

Antonioj26
08-21-2017, 03:41 PM
Ya and humans dont make mistakes ever.

such a dumb argument. Guess with that sort of logic that makes shugos demons embrace viable without a wall or light parry since humans make mistakes sometimes.

RatedChaotic
08-21-2017, 03:44 PM
such a dumb argument. Guess with that sort of logic that makes shugos demons embrace viable without a wall or light parry since humans make mistakes sometimes.

Dumb but true

Antonioj26
08-21-2017, 03:48 PM
Dumb but true

For bad players who don't recognize their strong match ups, sure.

RatedChaotic
08-21-2017, 03:53 PM
For bad players who don't recognize their strong match ups, sure.

hmmm Ya I'm just an AI player remember....I dont know these things lol.....Ya I'm bad I'll admit that. I'd rather be that than be one that thinks their good. I bet I'd surprise you tho.

Antonioj26
08-21-2017, 03:56 PM
hmmm Ya I'm just an AI player remember....I dont know these things lol.....

lol I mean yeah pretty much from what you've said here that's very true.

RatedChaotic
08-21-2017, 04:01 PM
lol I mean yeah pretty much from what you've said here that's very true.

Ya saying and doing are the same. Fight me and find out....

Aarpian
08-21-2017, 04:10 PM
He's not OP, his power is just almost all loaded into his defensive punishes.

Bandana nearly won that series because he's an incredibly good player with disgustingly good reactions.

Antonioj26
08-21-2017, 04:10 PM
Ya saying and doing are the same. Fight me and find out....

If I had an Xbox I would love to.

Netcode_err_404
08-21-2017, 04:23 PM
He's not OP, his power is just almost all loaded into his defensive punishes.

Bandana nearly won that series because he's an incredibly good player with disgustingly good reactions.

Good reactions won't allow you to win 16 games in a row with a kensei or a Nobushi.


Cent is not only op, is completely broken. Stop justify that **** and get real people. This **** forum is a waste of time cuz ppl like you who defends that gargabe class without getting honest for a minute.

A single heavy parry near a wall will grant him

- 60 confirmed damage
-100% stamina drain
-Wall stunlock 100-0 if you get stucked near a corner


I will take into consideration kensei, which is my favourite class for duels, he has 120 hp, so half healh bar is gone out of a single heavy parry.

A single light parry is even worse.


Fun fact, he has the best parrypunish in the game, without beeing a counter attacker

Second fun fact: He has more disabling power than disablers.

He has 110 hp, 10 hp less than a kensei. And has 40 more stamina than a kensei.



If you or any other here will say that cent is fine, delete your accounts, ty

Aarpian
08-21-2017, 04:42 PM
Good reactions won't allow you to win 16 games in a row with a kensei or a Nobushi.


Cent is not only op, is completely broken. Stop justify that **** and get real people. This **** forum is a waste of time cuz ppl like you who defends that gargabe class without getting honest for a minute.

A single heavy parry near a wall will grant him

- 60 confirmed damage
-100% stamina drain
-Wall stunlock 100-0 if you get stucked near a corner


I will take into consideration kensei, which is my favourite class for duels, he has 120 hp, so half healh bar is gone out of a single heavy parry.

A single light parry is even worse.


Fun fact, he has the best parrypunish in the game, without beeing a counter attacker

Second fun fact: He has more disabling power than disablers.

He has 110 hp, 10 hp less than a kensei. And has 40 more stamina than a kensei.



If you or any other here will say that cent is fine, delete your accounts, ty

Actually a single heavy parry near a wall will guarantee him:
stamina drain off the parry counter knee or guardbreak into 2 pommel hits into wall throw
a fully charged heavy for 30 damage
fully charged jab for more stamina drain
50 damage from unlocked zone attack

If they have specific distance from the wall you can actually do this:
Parry counter into normal heavy (25 damage)
guaranteed punch into wall stun
fully charged heavy (30 damage)
fully charged punch
unlocked zone attack (50 damage)


Offensively though, he has basically no options. Everything he does is completely reactable, his light chain is unusable because no light>heavy exists so the 2nd attack is a guaranteed parry for the opponent, his zone attack guarantees the enemy a punish whether they get hit or not, so long as they dodge the last hit (unlocked or not). His HP is low and his dodge recovery is mediocre.

Good reactions won't let you win 16 games in a row with Kensei because he's garbage. Good reactions would probably let you win 16 games in a row with Nobushi though.

Like I said, almost all of cent's power is stacked into his parry punishes (which is terrible design because ubi is bad at making games), but he's still worse than Peacekeeper or Warlord.

Netcode_err_404
08-21-2017, 07:13 PM
Actually a single heavy parry near a wall will guarantee him:
stamina drain off the parry counter knee or guardbreak into 2 pommel hits into wall throw
a fully charged heavy for 30 damage
fully charged jab for more stamina drain
50 damage from unlocked zone attack

If they have specific distance from the wall you can actually do this:
Parry counter into normal heavy (25 damage)
guaranteed punch into wall stun
fully charged heavy (30 damage)
fully charged punch
unlocked zone attack (50 damage)


Offensively though, he has basically no options. Everything he does is completely reactable, his light chain is unusable because no light>heavy exists so the 2nd attack is a guaranteed parry for the opponent, his zone attack guarantees the enemy a punish whether they get hit or not, so long as they dodge the last hit (unlocked or not). His HP is low and his dodge recovery is mediocre.

Good reactions won't let you win 16 games in a row with Kensei because he's garbage. Good reactions would probably let you win 16 games in a row with Nobushi though.

Like I said, almost all of cent's power is stacked into his parry punishes (which is terrible design because ubi is bad at making games), but he's still worse than Peacekeeper or Warlord.



Kensei is not garbage, is balanced.


The fact that in this game balanced = trash, is a side effect of the game's broken mechanics.



Centurions is the avatar of much of these broken mechanics.

Cen'ts kneeing after the parry can start a wall chainstun combo + 100+ stamina dmage.


And yes a godlike reflezes bushi could win all.


Sadly a playaer like that doesn' exist yet.

brashtralas
08-21-2017, 07:25 PM
Jumping backwards an argument or two, I murder centurions with my conqueror.

How, you might ask? I turtle him to death. I stare at him and dodge(when the game allows it) and block/gb his heavies.

Eventually he grows bored and throws himself from a cliff. Thankfully, I'm a patient man.

Tyrjo
08-21-2017, 10:05 PM
Centurion is 1v1 always seems to be a polarizing topic. Most of the feedback we get says that his 1v1 prowess isn't oppressing, with some players calling it weak even. Something to keep in mind when fight Centurion 1v1 is that there are multiple out's to his combos.

The only polarizing about the Centurion opinions are the Centurion mains (or people claiming not to be, yet they are) in one corner and the rest of the players in the other.

Antonioj26
08-21-2017, 11:04 PM
The only polarizing about the Centurion opinions are the Centurion mains (or people claiming not to be, yet they are) in one corner and the rest of the players in the other.

Not really, kweassa1 nor I play cent yet everytime someone cries about something that can easily be countered we are there to explain how to. Instead whiners just keep crying about the non broken parts about centurion instead of the things that legit need to be looked at (wall splat, light parry punish, stamina pool.) When people cry about valk, LB, zerk, kensei, Orochi, etc. I do the same thing.

ImmortalBeaver
08-21-2017, 11:22 PM
I don't think Centurion is OP, but I'd posit the same idea I've had since shortly after the character came out: He's fundamentally flawed in his design. Super hard punish, insanely low health. This means that if his opponent makes a mistake, the opponent is going to die or lose a significant chunk of health, and the opposite is also true. If any of Centurion's heavily punishable moves get punished, he'll die or lose most of his health.

I'm far from being a great player, I'll admit that, but I think the easiest way to improve Cent is to just reduce his punish and increase his health. Bring him in line with the other characters, and make the focus on him as a close-range brawler with solid mix-ups. I suppose that won't happen given that Peacekeeper is just as broken now as she was at launch, Warlord has seen no real changes, and now we have the terror known as Gladiator while Orochi and Kensei are so bad as to be unplayable. This game needs serious, meaningful balance fixes ASAP.

As a related aside, I'd note that I agree wholeheartedly with the notion that the game should be balanced around 1v1s, with feats balancing out group fights. I mention this because I read it somewhere yesterday and I think it'd fix a lot of this game's issues, what with Ubi trying to balance for completely different modes, and I'd like to see the idea get a bit of a spotlight.

Netcode_err_404
08-22-2017, 01:35 AM
I don't think Centurion is OP, but I'd posit the same idea I've had since shortly after the character came out: He's fundamentally flawed in his design. Super hard punish, insanely low health. This means that if his opponent makes a mistake, the opponent is going to die or lose a significant chunk of health, and the opposite is also true. If any of Centurion's heavily punishable moves get punished, he'll die or lose most of his health.

I'm far from being a great player, I'll admit that, but I think the easiest way to improve Cent is to just reduce his punish and increase his health. Bring him in line with the other characters, and make the focus on him as a close-range brawler with solid mix-ups. I suppose that won't happen given that Peacekeeper is just as broken now as she was at launch, Warlord has seen no real changes, and now we have the terror known as Gladiator while Orochi and Kensei are so bad as to be unplayable. This game needs serious, meaningful balance fixes ASAP.

As a related aside, I'd note that I agree wholeheartedly with the notion that the game should be balanced around 1v1s, with feats balancing out group fights. I mention this because I read it somewhere yesterday and I think it'd fix a lot of this game's issues, what with Ubi trying to balance for completely different modes, and I'd like to see the idea get a bit of a spotlight.



Low health ? He has 15 less health than a kensei.

ItBeJUSTICE1
08-22-2017, 02:28 AM
I'm am still very confused at the notion that Centurion is 'balanced' in 1v1's. My main reasoning deals with the concept of punishment. For vanilla characters the outcome of the scenarios below are obvious and mostly uniform:

1. GB'd and thrown into a wall
2. Getting Parried
3. Getting exhausted


1./2. Usually a heavy of some sort follows a light or just a slower harder hitting heavy, if you're PK i believe three bleeds or two with the third being the deep gouge post heavy on a wall splatted opponent is the most punishing of being being on the receiving end of these scenarios though i could be wrong.

3. CGB, block, CGB, block, dodge unblockable parry bait feints

At this point your punishment ends. You recover from the situation with blocking or CGB-ing until you regain footing or return the favor with a parry yourself. This does not happen with Centurion. Parrying is the only source of stamina damage for many vanilla characters in the game and this is how it should be. This game was not built to handle such a mechanic being capitalized on so greatly. One parry deals a great deal or stamina damage as it is. To have a parry mixup exclusive to Centurion (and now gladiator) that can rob most heroes of more than 80% of their stamina and a kick that can deplete the rest (as well as the GB punches if you wrongly dodge an anticipated kick) border on the notion of balance but then to have the capability of keeping a hero's stamina depleted pushes this character way over the line IMO although that could be somewhat forgiven if like all characters his stamina eventually got depleted as well which does happen...

...in the hands of someone who doesn't yet know to draw out the punishment. In the hands of an expert he will never enter the state of exhaustion and you will never leave it lest the Centurion wills it.

And don't even get me started on the range, tracking, heavy quick feint 50/50 and wall pin issues as they deserve (or already have) their own thread.

The nerf of this character is long overdue but i expect the eyes of the dev's (as well as yours) are far more focused on what the new heroes are up to aren't they.

Couldn't agree more man. Just starting off as a cent i destroy most players who aren't insanely skillfull

RatedChaotic
08-22-2017, 02:42 AM
Couldn't agree more man. Just starting off as a cent i destroy most players who aren't insanely skillfull

Having a rep7 conq, rep 5 Lb, rep5 cent, and a few other rep heroes..I understand but some try hards dont.

But I'm a pve player what do I know?

Antonioj26
08-22-2017, 03:06 AM
Having a rep7 conq, rep 5 Lb, rep5 cent, and a few other rep heroes..I understand but some try hards dont.

But I'm a pve player what do I know?

Lol you are being the biggest baby ever for me pointing out you are a pve player. Aren't you a father?

Butonfly
08-22-2017, 03:50 AM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sX2YvI0LILM


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoew6lqNvg8

Antonioj26
08-22-2017, 04:08 AM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sX2YvI0LILM


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoew6lqNvg8

From those two videos yeah I would say that. He has problems but neither of those videos showcase them or at least it doesn't seem like that's your intention. First you ran at him and gave him a free parry with a running attack, then you failed to dodge the jab, then you failed to cgb the quick throw.

Second video is you were out numbered so not really a fair way to judge a character, when it got back to you being 1v1 you dodged the kick which was good but you followed up with a gb. 9/10 times your rando garden variety cent will follow up a missed kick with a heavy or light because 9/10 times people will do the exact same thing you did. Be that 1/10 my friend. His wall splat shouldn't do that much and if that's what you were trying to get across I'd be right there with you but I have a feeling that wasn't the point of those videos.

Aarpian
08-22-2017, 09:06 AM
Having a rep7 conq, rep 5 Lb, rep5 cent, and a few other rep heroes..I understand but some try hards dont.

But I'm a pve player what do I know?

If you're genuinely a PVE player - absolutely nothing, because bots read inputs and the things that are effective against bots are not necessarily the same things that are effective against players.

Tyrjo
08-22-2017, 09:42 AM
From those two videos yeah I would say that. He has problems but neither of those videos showcase them or at least it doesn't seem like that's your intention. First you ran at him and gave him a free parry with a running attack, then you failed to dodge the jab, then you failed to cgb the quick throw.


Free or not. A parry from a Centurion and this is what it leads to. Totally UNFUN to play against. You try to be offensive with throwing ONE attack, and your done for.

Butonfly
08-22-2017, 11:06 AM
From those two videos yeah I would say that. He has problems but neither of those videos showcase them or at least it doesn't seem like that's your intention. First you ran at him and gave him a free parry with a running attack, then you failed to dodge the jab, then you failed to cgb the quick throw.

Second video is you were out numbered so not really a fair way to judge a character, when it got back to you being 1v1 you dodged the kick which was good but you followed up with a gb. 9/10 times your rando garden variety cent will follow up a missed kick with a heavy or light because 9/10 times people will do the exact same thing you did. Be that 1/10 my friend. His wall splat shouldn't do that much and if that's what you were trying to get across I'd be right there with you but I have a feeling that wasn't the point of those videos.

Fair and balanced gameplay. Working as intended. Best thing to happen to the game. We can all agree.

Specialkha
08-22-2017, 11:44 AM
I played my Orochi today, and a centurion killed me 100% hp to 0 in one combo. My orochi was disabled during the whole time and it lasted like 3, maybe 4 second. Great gameplay, would not pay for that again.

RatedChaotic
08-22-2017, 01:10 PM
If you're genuinely a PVE player - absolutely nothing, because bots read inputs and the things that are effective against bots are not necessarily the same things that are effective against players.

Yet if you go to my xbox captures you'll find pvp videos using matchmaking......Just made one last night and have many since closed beta. Just proving Antonio and you make asses of yourselves for assuming. Lmao. Just because I play pve doesnt mean I never pvp. I just dont like the current state of this games matchmaking, stability, bugs and exploits that are in play in this games pvp. I have a better experience in other games pvp that I own. Here I either get errors, get into games almost over, or have bots on my team or against them anyway in pvp. So why hate?

Stability in my region sucks...so its better for me to pve than pvp at this time. When I can get thru multiple games in a row in pvp I'll gladly switch...until then I'll do my orders vs AI and go pvp elsewhere. Thank you.

Aarpian
08-22-2017, 01:45 PM
Yet if you go to my xbox captures you'll find pvp videos using matchmaking......Just made one last night and have many since closed beta. Just proving Antonio and you make asses of yourselves for assuming. Lmao. Just because I play pve doesnt mean I never pvp. I just dont like the current state of this games matchmaking, stability, and connection. I either get errors, get into games almost over, or have bots on my team or against them anyway in pvp. So why hate?

Stability in my region sucks...so its better for me to pve than pvp at this time. When I can get thru multiple games in a row in pvp I'll gladly switch...until then I'll do my orders vs AI and go pvp elsewhere. Thank you.

I see reading comprehension is not your strong suit.

RatedChaotic
08-22-2017, 01:51 PM
I see reading comprehension is not your strong suit.

Likewise.No its not lol....I'm a grunt. Tho I see players saying they practice vs lvl3 bots for many reasons....Why do they practice vs them if it doesnt help?

Antonioj26
08-22-2017, 02:05 PM
Free or not. A parry from a Centurion and this is what it leads to. Totally UNFUN to play against. You try to be offensive with throwing ONE attack, and your done for.

All he got was 25 damage and stamina damage, everything after that could have been defended against but as I said he didn't.

Antonioj26
08-22-2017, 02:08 PM
Fair and balanced gameplay. Working as intended. Best thing to happen to the game. We can all agree.

Glad you can do the grown up thing, realize you made mistakes in your videos, and that it was your fault. Not enough people do that so I gotta give props.

Antonioj26
08-22-2017, 02:14 PM
Yet if you go to my xbox captures you'll find pvp videos using matchmaking......Just made one last night and have many since closed beta. Just proving Antonio and you make asses of yourselves for assuming. Lmao. Just because I play pve doesnt mean I never pvp. I just dont like the current state of this games matchmaking, stability, bugs and exploits that are in play in this games pvp. I have a better experience in other games pvp that I own. Here I either get errors, get into games almost over, or have bots on my team or against them anyway in pvp. So why hate?

Stability in my region sucks...so its better for me to pve than pvp at this time. When I can get thru multiple games in a row in pvp I'll gladly switch...until then I'll do my orders vs AI and go pvp elsewhere. Thank you.

So unreasonably butt hurt over me saying "I'm also pretty sure he only plays against ai." I looked at your stats last night and you have next to no pvp experience https://fhtracker.com/profile/xbox/RatedChaotic. Guess I was wrong about you, huh?

Antonioj26
08-22-2017, 02:18 PM
Likewise.No its not lol....I'm a grunt. Tho I see players saying they practice vs lvl3 bots for many reasons....Why do they practice vs them if it doesnt help?

To practice parry timing and combos against particular heros or just practice tech in general, turns out you can't pick your opponents character for them. Don't think either of us said it doesn't help, just that it's not the same thing as a human. Truth is even level 3 bots are a joke.

RatedChaotic
08-22-2017, 02:23 PM
So unreasonably butt hurt over me saying "I'm also pretty sure he only plays against ai." I looked at your stats last night and you have next to no pvp experience https://fhtracker.com/profile/xbox/RatedChaotic. Guess I was wrong about you, huh?

Ya its hard to get pvp experience when you have 20min que times, errors, get disconnected, resynce every other game and have bots in pvp anyway. Ya totally worth my time.....lol Of course you dont experience those multiple times in just an hour of game time.....but I do....and its not worth it to me.....

Antonioj26
08-22-2017, 02:25 PM
Ya its hard to get pvp experience when you have 20min que times, errors, get disconnected, resynce every other game and have bots in pvp anyway. Ya totally worth my time.....lol

I don't care what your reasoning is, you are still a pve player so you don't know what you are talking about when it comes to pvp. I know you'll take that as an insult but it's just the truth, why would you have knowledge about something you never do?

Kaijudub
08-22-2017, 02:28 PM
It's cool rated, old Antonio here likes to cheat and rage quit out of games.... You can check his ultimate stats here AlyssaA-3 if you like.

He also likes to call people out on the internet and then never get round to actually fighting them.

Antonioj26
08-22-2017, 02:31 PM
It's cool rated, old Antonio here likes to cheat and rage quit out of games.... You can check his ultimate stats here AlyssaA-3 if you like.

He also likes to call people out on the internet and then never get round to actually fighting them.

Funny how it's only my duel record that is that high, do you think I would only rage quit duels if I cared about my record that much? Like I said if you can't get that high of a record fighting noobs then that's on you. It's also not my fault you and I have opposite schedules, we happen to be on opposite sides of the country. I haven't turned down a challenge from anyone and I wouldn't do it from scrub who can't recognize wardens strength either.

RatedChaotic
08-22-2017, 02:35 PM
I don't care what your reasoning is, you are still a pve player so you don't know what you are talking about when it comes to pvp. I know you'll take that as an insult but it's just the truth, why would you have knowledge about something you never do?

I never do? lmao just because of a stat tracker lol....I guess these players that challenge me thru xbox messages in custom games are bots aswell.

Antonioj26
08-22-2017, 02:36 PM
I don't care what your reasoning is, you are still a pve player so you don't know what you are talking about when it comes to pvp. I know you'll take that as an insult but it's just the truth, why would you have knowledge about something you never do?

I never do? lmao just because of a stat tracker lol....I guess these players that challenge me thru xbox messages in custom games are bots aswell.

I'm sure you have a ton of those :rolleyes:

RatedChaotic
08-22-2017, 02:37 PM
[QUOTE=RatedChaotic;12864387]

I'm sure you have a ton of those :rolleyes:

Not a ton but a few

Antonioj26
08-22-2017, 02:40 PM
[QUOTE=Antonioj26;12864389]

Not a ton but a few

barely any. I barely get any as a pvp player, why would people who actively play pve want to do custom pvp matches? makes no sense.

RatedChaotic
08-22-2017, 02:45 PM
[QUOTE=RatedChaotic;12864396]

barely any. I barely get any as a pvp player, why would people who actively play pve want to do custom pvp matches? makes no sense.

Why is custom game an option in the first place? Many reasons...to add/remove features. Between my friends and my sons friends we do them quite often. That is until we start having issues staying grouped which is daily. So we bounce to other games.

Antonioj26
08-22-2017, 02:51 PM
[QUOTE=Antonioj26;12864405]

Why is custom game an option in the first place? Many reasons...to add/remove features. Between my friends and my sons friends we do them quite often.

Then you still don't really have that much experience. Playing against the same people isn't the same as playing different people every match. Your friends and your sons have habits and tech that you should know about and read. People online won't give you that info until you've fought them and picked up on it.

RatedChaotic
08-22-2017, 03:00 PM
[QUOTE=RatedChaotic;12864416]

Then you still don't really have that much experience. Playing against the same people isn't the same as playing different people every match. Your friends and your sons have habits and tech that you should know about and read. People online won't give you that info until you've fought them and picked up on it.

Yet when I was doing online duels last night I got the same player 3 times in a row even used find new opponent....lol Different players every match my ***....

Antonioj26
08-22-2017, 03:06 PM
[QUOTE=Antonioj26;12864429]

Yet when I was doing online duels last night I got the same player 3 times in a row even used find new opponent....lol

Yeah the matchmaking sucks since the population is shrinking, who would have knew? My point which seems to have flown over your head is learning the behaviors of thousands of brand new people in a short amount of time isnt the same as using the knowledge you have of players you constantly play with.

RatedChaotic
08-22-2017, 03:20 PM
[QUOTE=RatedChaotic;12864453]

Yeah the matchmaking sucks since the population is shrinking, who would have knew? My point which seems to have flown over your head is learning the behaviors of thousands of brand new people in a short amount of time isnt the same as using the knowledge you have of players you constantly play with.

It didnt. I agree with you.....my point is its hard to stick to pvping here on xbox because of the connections and stability in my region is horrible. You think I dont want to pvp at all. Well your wrong....I been trying to since release on and off thats why I only have 3hrs of pvp. I just dont find the enjoyment in waiting 20 mins to find a game just to disconnect or get an error after making it in...its been that way since release for me. I have better things to do than argue with you all day over a bug infested game that you believe is perfect.

D3dicatedSrv3rz
08-22-2017, 03:20 PM
Not trying to call you out, I'm sure your just doing your job, but these problems have existed since the day this character was put into the game and EVERY SINGLE DAY people point out these very same concerns and all we get is " We will look into that.". Truth is this character has been out for months now and he is the same as he was on launch day. Do you know how disheartening it is to constantly hear " We are working on it" with nothing else to show for it other than the same copy and paste reply? It gives many many people zero trust in the developers ability to balance this game. Not just with centurian either. Why is it that warden still has a 50/50? I can guarantee you nobody except warden mains think this is a balanced mechanic. Same with raider new rediculouse 50/50 That I saw posts BEFORE IT WAS EVEN IMPLIMENTED saying it was a terrible idea. Yet here we are... still waiting for them to undo that damage... Eventually you get to the point where you say **** it... they aren't listening. Then there is one less person in this ever declining player base... Sorry if this sounds personal, because it's not. I just don't want to see this game destroy itself before it even has a chance to shine and it's frustrating watching that happen.

I main PK although warden is my second best hero. The bash i find is quite a balanced 50/50. i easily and repeatedly leave the situation with a roll and my opponent soon learns that it won't work. You can recover the stamina lost from the roll easily against a warden unlike a Centurion. The raider 50/50 well... idk

Antonioj26
08-22-2017, 03:27 PM
[QUOTE=Antonioj26;12864466]

It didnt. I agree with you.....my point is its hard to stick to pvping here on xbox because of the connections and stability is horrible. You think I dont want to pvp at all. Well your wrong....I been trying to since release. I just dont find the enjoyment in waiting 20 mins to find a game just to disconnect or get an error after making it in...

Except that's not what I think and I didn't say that either. What I said was "I'm pretty sure he only plays against ai." Like I said, your reasoning doesn't matter, your experience does and your experience is mainly with bots, friends, and family. I play golf maybe once a month with my father in law for the past year or so, and I would never go up to someone who has been playing golf every week for 2 decades and imply we are on the same level. Don't take that as an insult, just recognize we are playing two different games.

RatedChaotic
08-22-2017, 03:38 PM
[QUOTE=RatedChaotic;12864523]

Except that's not what I think and I didn't say that either. What I said was "I'm pretty sure he only plays against ai." Like I said, your reasoning doesn't matter, your experience does and your experience is mainly with bots, friends, and family. I play golf maybe once a month with my father in law for the past year or so, and I would never go up to someone who has been playing golf every week for 2 decades and imply we are on the same level. Don't take that as an insult, just recognize we are playing two different games.

LMAO.....So you have never had golf game where you have done better than a more experienced player? Because with your ideology its impossible......Yet history proves that it is possible.....just saying...I dont have much xp with pvp but I'm still batting over .500

Antonioj26
08-22-2017, 03:44 PM
[QUOTE=Antonioj26;12864536]

LMAO.....So you have never had golf game where you have done better than a more experienced player? Because with your ideology its impossible......

That's not the analogy.... man you really aren't even trying to listen are you? My point was he has more experience and knowledge, he plays golf a lot and I don't. I pvp a lot, you don't. I have very little knowledge when it comes to golf. You have very little knowledge when it comes to pvp.

Antonioj26
08-22-2017, 03:47 PM
[QUOTE=Antonioj26;12864536]

LMAO.....So you have never had golf game where you have done better than a more experienced player? Because with your ideology its impossible......Yet history proves that it is possible.....just saying...I dont have much xp with pvp but I'm still batting over .500

Yeah and it's easy to do that since matchmaking more often then not will setup you up with guys who have little to no experience in pvp, your mmr is low. If you were to be thrown in a higher mmr you wouldn't be as successful. It's the reason my duel record is so high yet kaijudub can't piece that puzzle together.

RatedChaotic
08-22-2017, 03:50 PM
[QUOTE=RatedChaotic;12864559]

That's not the analogy.... man you really aren't even trying to listen are you? My point was he has more experience and knowledge, he plays golf a lot and I don't. I pvp a lot, you don't. I have very little knowledge when it comes to golf. You have very little knowledge when it comes to pvp.

I'm sorry but in all my 30+ years gaming experience. I have seen many day one players actually be better than veteran players in many games and even here.So I have to disagree with you.

Antonioj26
08-22-2017, 03:54 PM
[QUOTE=Antonioj26;12864573]

I'm sorry but fom my 30+ years gaming experience. I have seen many day one players actually be better than veteran players. So I disagree with you.

Yeah it's called naturally talent, and again I'm not talking about being better I'm talking about having more knowledge and experience. Even if I was those few exceptions don't disprove anything. How many times do I have to say this?

RatedChaotic
08-22-2017, 03:58 PM
[QUOTE=RatedChaotic;12864587]

Yeah it's called naturally talent, and again I'm not talking about being better I'm talking about having more knowledge and experience. Even if I was those few exceptions don't disprove anything. How many times do I have to say this?

Ya ya I burnt you stfu.........

Antonioj26
08-22-2017, 04:03 PM
[QUOTE=Antonioj26;12864597]

Ya ya I burnt you stfu.........

You really didn't. Let me make this easier for you, if I remember right you are a vet. What would happen if back in your day near the end of your term some brand new kid fresh outta boot camp started critiqueing you or telling you how to do something you've done a million times?

D3dicatedSrv3rz
08-22-2017, 04:05 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sX2YvI0LILM


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoew6lqNvg8

Just wait till you get your Celtic Curse side feint parried. I believe it holds the record of the fastest OOS in the game.

Shakti.
08-22-2017, 04:10 PM
Centurion is 1v1 always seems to be a polarizing topic. Most of the feedback we get says that his 1v1 prowess isn't oppressing, with some players calling it weak even. Something to keep in mind when fight Centurion 1v1 is that there are multiple out's to his combos. Whether that be a gap in between his attacks to dodge or the opportunity to parry him, he does have some vulnerabilities to his playstyle when he doesn't have a team to cover him in between his combos.

The players calling it weak are playing as Centurion.

Antonioj26
08-22-2017, 04:13 PM
The players calling it weak are playing as Centurion.

Not me or kweassa1. Dumb argument is dumb. If You call riptide strike weak when someone is complaining about it does that make you an Orochi player? Nope

Aarpian
08-22-2017, 04:42 PM
[QUOTE=Antonioj26;12864597]

Ya ya I burnt you stfu.........

Jesus christ kid are you high? You almost exclusively play V.S. A.I., you demonstrably don't know what the **** you're talking about when it comes to PVP balance because you don't PVP.

Antonioj26
08-22-2017, 04:52 PM
[QUOTE=RatedChaotic;12864607]

Jesus christ kid are you high? You almost exclusively play V.S. A.I., you demonstrably don't know what the **** you're talking about when it comes to PVP balance because you don't PVP.

The thing is he's not a kid, he's a grown man who is at least In his 30's and maybe in his 40's since he has kids that are old enough to play this game with him.

RatedChaotic
08-22-2017, 05:53 PM
[QUOTE=RatedChaotic;12864607]

Jesus christ kid are you high? You almost exclusively play V.S. A.I., you demonstrably don't know what the **** you're talking about when it comes to PVP balance because you don't PVP.

Posted a vid to the xbox community of me pvping using matchmaking and calling you out on this bs...Feel free to view it xbox users......eat it antonio and Aarpian.....lol How you like dem apples?....Not as bad as you think lol.....and I was using a rep1 warden I hardly know anything about against a high rep high account rep Bezerker.... pvp experience my ***....I've been pvping for years.... lol

You contradicted yourself is why I said you got burnt......

Antonioj26
08-22-2017, 06:00 PM
[QUOTE=Aarpian;12864758]

Posted a vid to the xbox community of me pvping using matchmaking and calling you out on this bs...Feel free to view it xbox users......eat it antonio and Aarpian.....lol How you like dem apples?....Not as bad as you think lol.....and I was using a rep1 warden I know **** about lol

We know it's not impossible to pvp, you just don't do it and you only having 50 something pvp matches shows it. Would still like to see these vids but I don't know how since I don't have an Xbox

Antonioj26
08-22-2017, 06:09 PM
[QUOTE=Aarpian;12864758]

Posted a vid to the xbox community of me pvping using matchmaking and calling you out on this bs...Feel free to view it xbox users......eat it antonio and Aarpian.....lol How you like dem apples?....Not as bad as you think lol.....and I was using a rep1 warden I know **** about lol

You contradicted yourself is why I said you got burnt......

But I didn't contradict myself, you are just failing to understand my point which is nothing new for you. Please see my example about you being a vet and a rookie coming in telling you how to do your job, maybe that'll help you grasp it.

brashtralas
08-22-2017, 06:14 PM
It's been long enough now that I believe nothing will be changed. I truly believe the centurion is fundamentally flawed, so fixing him is no easy task, if possible at all.

I have repped him up several times now and still think his all or nothing approach to combat isn't fun for the player or his opponent. But, by golly, he is awesome looking.

His 4v4 status is utterly awful, and giving diminishing returns on cc won't change that. Why? Because it only takes one off-screen charged heavy into charged jab into his team demolishes your prone body.

Sadly the centurions are showing up again(or were before I went on vacation) because the new characters aren't quite so good as the centurion(though I'd make an argument for gladiator with his very strong kit, mixup options, and stamina management).

Maybe after all the defensive meta changes are over we will see something, but I'm really not holding my breath at this point. There's a lot of double standards when it comes to balancing, and the centurion largely avoided any for an entire season.

And for he record, I'm all for balancing other characters as well. Wardens sb cancel needs to go, lawbringers bock->shove needs to go, shuffling never, EVER should have had demons embrace(poor planning from the start on that one, imo), warlord shouldn't be able to grab you, turn, aim, and run you off an edge, carry moves should have a longer startup, and frankly, a ranger character in a game based around 4v4 probably shouldn't have made it at all. And conqueror needs a total rework.

That way I don't seem biased(warden/lawbringer/centurion/conqueror main).

I like knights.

RatedChaotic
08-22-2017, 06:14 PM
Reread my ^^^ comment....Nots not my problem you dont know how to view them..as you told me.... your reasons/excuses dont matter to me....and reread your posts....you did contradict yourself....Have a good day I'm done here.....

Antonioj26
08-22-2017, 06:16 PM
Reread my ^^^ comment....Nots not my problem you dont know how to view them..as you told me.... your reasons/excuses dont matter to me....

I don't care that much but if you are ashamed of your gameplay I understand.

Alustar.
08-22-2017, 06:37 PM
So I guess me making a Centurion rage quit a duel is fair cause he was upset he lost with an OP hero? Oh wait I won so he CANT be OP.

Duh my bad. As you were.

Antonioj26
08-22-2017, 06:48 PM
So I guess me making a Centurion rage quit a duel is fair cause he was upset he lost with an OP hero? Oh wait I won so he CANT be OP.

Duh my bad. As you were.

Nah it's you who is OP al. Ban him!

AKDagriZ
08-22-2017, 07:21 PM
one thing i hate on top of everything mentionned in OP is how he get going with his stun combo when he connect a heavy . he is the only hero who have a free follow up just by connecting a heavy . That could be an interesting aspect of a new heroes . but why do i have to fall on my back and suffer the heavy UB while i am on my back ???

Centurion is probably the only heroes that i dont even try to parry or deflect , i focus on Countering GB and dodging the kicks/jab i can't tell which come first .
Centurion is what conqueror should have been

Centurion is a whimp and i dont feel sad for him when i see a lonelyone on the battlefields who lost all his other centurion friends since new DLC of new season.

**** this guy ! when i pre ordered this game no one ever told me that in the first dLC the 2 new heroes would be complete trash ! both of them and killing the game for 2 month until new new heros would be available and people would play less thes 2 piece of junk

Netcode_err_404
08-22-2017, 07:27 PM
I think all discussions are meaningless, becayuse there always will be someone claiming that broken x or y is fine.

So lets just agree on the fact that


Game is not competitive = **** balance.who cares.

Alustar.
08-22-2017, 08:37 PM
Nah it's you who is OP al. Ban him!

Not another Alu ban-wagon XD, this would make 3, so I guess according to ancient numerology, it must be true.

Alustar.
08-22-2017, 08:38 PM
I think all discussions are meaningless, becayuse there always will be someone claiming that broken x or y is fine.

So lets just agree on the fact that


Game is not competitive = **** balance.who cares.

Have you ever stopped to consider that they feel this way because these things are, in fact, true? Gods forbid you take some advice like I did...

Netcode_err_404
08-22-2017, 08:44 PM
Have you ever stopped to consider that they feel this way because these things are, in fact, true? Gods forbid you take some advice like I did...



Considering i've read that warlord is fine, i'd say no.

Butonfly
08-22-2017, 08:47 PM
Glad you can do the grown up thing, realize you made mistakes in your videos, and that it was your fault. Not enough people do that so I gotta give props.

Guys, listen, there is nothing wrong with the fact Centurion can 100-0 a target without running out of Stamina, regardless of if mistakes were made, or opportunities were missed. If anything Centurion needs a buff. If the playerbase wants him to be doing less unblockables and CC, Ubi just needs to add damage to his kicks and punches. That way the target will die faster, which should result in a whopping 50% less kicks and punches made by Centurions overall.

There is nothing wrong with how centurion plays, even if 99% of the playerbase thinks so. Come on guys, you just have to be reasonable.

Antonioj26
08-22-2017, 09:10 PM
Guys, listen, there is nothing wrong with the fact Centurion can 100-0 a target without running out of Stamina, regardless of if mistakes were made, or opportunities were missed. If anything Centurion needs a buff. If the playerbase wants him to be doing less unblockables and CC, Ubi just needs to add damage to his kicks and punches. That way the target will die faster, which should result in a whopping 50% less kicks and punches made by Centurions overall.

There is nothing wrong with how centurion plays, even if 99% of the playerbase thinks so. Come on guys, you just have to be reasonable.

Glad you can admit you made mistakes. Every character can 100-0 someone if the opponent arent defending themselves with maybe a couple exceptions from those with very low damage (valk, conq) Also would love to see the survey that says "99% of the playerbase" thinks there's a problem with the way centurion plays. Like I said, if you showed a video of you getting infinite splatted, getting demolished by light parries, or him showcasing his ridiculous stam pool then I would fully be on board.

Instead what you showed was you don't know that highlander has a terrible running attack and you shouldn't do it unless you want to give a free parry, you don't know how to dodge the jab, you don't know how to cgb, you don't know how to parry or block, and you go for the obvious gb after the kick even though it's usually followed up with an attack.

Alustar.
08-22-2017, 10:47 PM
Considering i've read that warlord is fine, i'd say no.

I see the problem now, you read somewhere that classes other than yours are OP and decided to run with it instead of learning how to best counter.
But go on, I'd love to hear you whine some more about EVERY class and what they can do that you can't.

Have you ever posted anything that's not a baseless complaint about "insert arbitrary overpowered rage on X hero"?

Netcode_err_404
08-22-2017, 11:06 PM
Theres no x hero, raiders, pk, cents and WL's are broken.


Raiders can spam stampede and have the entire match on their side.

WL can win with a parry, Cents can win with 1 parry and some kicks or a chain wall, pk spam r1.



Theres no learn how to counter, Rather ubisoft should l2 balance.


The best couner of these classes, is one of these classes

OR a very defensive warden,

Stop beeing the "git gud" guy, And open your eyes. Both of them. And use the glasses if you need them.

Alustar.
08-22-2017, 11:29 PM
Theres no x hero, raiders, pk, cents and WL's are broken.


Raiders can spam stampede and have the entire match on their side.

WL can win with a parry, Cents can win with 1 parry and some kicks or a chain wall, pk spam r1.



Theres no learn how to counter, Rather ubisoft should l2 balance.


The best couner of these classes, is one of these classes

OR a very defensive warden,

Stop beeing the "git gud" guy, And open your eyes. Both of them. And use the glasses if you need them.

Lol my eyes are open kid, that's how I'm able to beat every hero you listed just now. And honestly, if you are losing to stampede, dodge.

Cent: parry and block.

PK light spam? LOLOLOL!!! So wait. I actually have a LOT of experience here.

PK lights now have an extended animation after the second light hit so you actually CAN'T be light spammed. Well not unless you just sit there, with a PK in your face and don't even bother to attempt a dodge or block.

And here's why mathematically you are wrong. PK lights are better thrown at different angles. Attacking the same time twice gets you blocked or worse. So let's say for arguments sake that the initial light hit is always going to be too fast for you. So aim for the second. Now here's where the math gets tricky so keep up:

For NONassassin classes; you've just been hit on a flank that wasn't protected. Which means the second attack now has 90% chance of coming from the other unprotected side, since you just got hit from one angle and your guard stance hasn't changed.

For assassin classes these rules are a little less applicable, but the same probability formula applies.

So really what this says is you can't preform the basic human function of pattern recognition. And here I thought mankind was supposed to be the formoste species in that regard?

UnblockableMeta
08-23-2017, 02:04 AM
Did not expect this thread to last this long.

Reading most of these comments it seems that his punish is far greater than what most of the other heroes are capable of, stamina is an issue, and many players find themselves altering there play-style completely when fighting one. Parries and deflects are becoming less and less relevant with the most experienced of Cents as the heavy variations are ridiculous and correctly timed dodging is becoming the only means of defense. Ironically with my PK i find myself standing my ground more than i would against any other character as the heavy feint into a GB has stop my side step a sad amount of times.

The biggest problem I think is how much he limits the play-style of heroes. There's less risk and therefore (i think) less enjoyment when fighting a Cent than with every other hero (except maybe gladiator). People would risk their last attack that made them OOS or try their luck with an open heavy hoping there opponent would think it was parry bait or time a deflect but with the cost of failure so great no one wants to take that chance as that 1v1 is pretty much decided from then on...

...or at least losing a large amount of your health is.

I really don't know if it's arrogance or ignorance that led the dev's to attempt to combat the Def. Meta with a character like this. Both maybe? Ugh.

Butonfly
08-23-2017, 02:16 AM
Did not expect this thread to last this long.

Reading most of these comments it seems that his punish is far greater than what most of the other heroes are capable of, stamina is an issue, and many players find themselves altering there play-style completely when fighting one. Parries and deflects are becoming less and less relevant with the most experienced of Cents as the heavy variations are ridiculous and correctly timed dodging is becoming the only means of defense. Ironically with my PK i find myself standing my ground more than i would against any other character as the heavy feint into a GB has stop my side step a sad amount of times.

The biggest problem I think is how much he limits the play-style of heroes. There's less risk and therefore (i think) less enjoyment when fighting a Cent than with every other hero (except maybe gladiator). People would risk their last attack that made them OOS or try their luck with an open heavy hoping there opponent would think it was parry bait or time a deflect but with the cost of failure so great no one wants to take that chance as that 1v1 is pretty much decided from then on...

...or at least losing a large amount of your health is.

I really don't know if it's arrogance or ignorance that led the dev's to attempt to combat the Def. Meta with a character like this. Both maybe? Ugh.

How dare you make a fair and balanced assessment of the feedback offered in this thread, and accurately portray the problems with Centurion so eloquently. If you'd been reading you would have seen responders like Antonioj26 respond numerous times asserting there's nothing wrong with Centurion, and that his place in the game as he exists is not only healthy, but the single best feature this game has without exception. For shame. Honestly.

I just can't understand why he's a lone voice on this topic. Considering how well implemented and mechanically sound Centurion is, you'd think everybody would be defending Centurion and singing the devs praises. Yet for some reason there is almost universal agreement of the opposite. Even Ubisoft has acknowledged they're looking hard at making changes to him. The establishment agreeing with the laymen? Madness! Whatever could the explanation for this be!

Antonioj26
08-23-2017, 02:57 AM
How dare you make a fair and balanced assessment of the feedback offered in this thread, and accurately portray the problems with Centurion so eloquently. If you'd been reading you would have seen responders like Antonioj26 respond numerous times asserting there's nothing wrong with Centurion, and that his place in the game as he exists is not only healthy, but the single best feature this game has without exception. For shame. Honestly.

I just can't understand why he's a lone voice on this topic. Considering how well implemented and mechanically sound Centurion is, you'd think everybody would be defending Centurion and singing the devs praises. Yet for some reason there is almost universal agreement of the opposite. Even Ubisoft has acknowledged they're looking hard at making changes to him. The establishment agreeing with the laymen? Madness! Whatever could the explanation for this be!

Except I'm not the only one and I also didn't say there isn't anything wrong with him. Aarpian, kweassa, and Raime have said similar things to me. He has problems but none showcased by your video, sorry to say you just need to learn to play. I already told you what's wrong with the character and needs to be changed, the rest comes down to him being a noob stomper.

I've already pointed out that you made 3 mistakes in your first video and then another 2 in the second coupled with the fact that you were being attacked by someone else at the same time. What am I wrong about? If you want you can keep doing the passive aggressive woman thing instead of coming up with an argument if you want, but it won't win you this fight.

Alustar.
08-23-2017, 03:13 AM
Except I'm not the only one and I also didn't say there isn't anything wrong with him. Aarpian, kweassa, and Raime have said similar things to me. He has problems but none showcased by your video, sorry to say you just need to learn to play. I already told you what's wrong with the character and needs to be changed, the rest comes down to him being a noob stomper.

I've already pointed out that you made 3 mistakes in your first video and then another 2 in the second coupled with the fact that you were being attacked by someone else at the same time. What am I wrong about? If you want you can keep doing the passive aggressive woman thing instead of coming up with an argument if you want, but it won't win you this fight.

Throw me in there too, and this is coming from a person who Antonio can verify I suck at 1v1, however I love me some skirmish and live for 4v4s and I don't know anyone here who has run head first into a group of anything solo like I do, let alone a group that has one or more centurions.
I do this regularly, and most times the Centurion is the first to go down.
In 1v1 it's different. But thanks to players like Antonio, Kweasa and Candle I too can count myself among those that just could give two ****s about Centurions. The things I dislik about them in 4s is being addressed, hell already they cut down on how effectively he can lockdown an opponent before external attacks pull you out.

To me it's just another trophy head when I decapitate them.

D3dicatedSrv3rz
08-23-2017, 04:06 AM
Did not expect this thread to last this long.

Reading most of these comments it seems that his punish is far greater than what most of the other heroes are capable of, stamina is an issue, and many players find themselves altering there play-style completely when fighting one. Parries and deflects are becoming less and less relevant with the most experienced of Cents as the heavy variations are ridiculous and correctly timed dodging is becoming the only means of defense. Ironically with my PK i find myself standing my ground more than i would against any other character as the heavy feint into a GB has stop my side step a sad amount of times.

The biggest problem I think is how much he limits the play-style of heroes. There's less risk and therefore (i think) less enjoyment when fighting a Cent than with every other hero (except maybe gladiator). People would risk their last attack that made them OOS or try their luck with an open heavy hoping there opponent would think it was parry bait or time a deflect but with the cost of failure so great no one wants to take that chance as that 1v1 is pretty much decided from then on...

...or at least losing a large amount of your health is.

I really don't know if it's arrogance or ignorance that led the dev's to attempt to combat the Def. Meta with a character like this. Both maybe? Ugh.

https://media2.giphy.com/media/l0MYy7QpDDVGVfAAw/giphy.gif

Netcode_err_404
08-23-2017, 04:09 AM
Lol my eyes are open kid, that's how I'm able to beat every hero you listed just now. And honestly, if you are losing to stampede, dodge.

Cent: parry and block.

PK light spam? LOLOLOL!!! So wait. I actually have a LOT of experience here.

PK lights now have an extended animation after the second light hit so you actually CAN'T be light spammed. Well not unless you just sit there, with a PK in your face and don't even bother to attempt a dodge or block.

And here's why mathematically you are wrong. PK lights are better thrown at different angles. Attacking the same time twice gets you blocked or worse. So let's say for arguments sake that the initial light hit is always going to be too fast for you. So aim for the second. Now here's where the math gets tricky so keep up:

For NONassassin classes; you've just been hit on a flank that wasn't protected. Which means the second attack now has 90% chance of coming from the other unprotected side, since you just got hit from one angle and your guard stance hasn't changed.

For assassin classes these rules are a little less applicable, but the same probability formula applies.

So really what this says is you can't preform the basic human function of pattern recognition. And here I thought mankind was supposed to be the formoste species in that regard?

Next 10k tourney I expoect you to win then

We.the.North
08-23-2017, 04:21 AM
You know there is a problem when a post like this gets 120 replies and Ubisoft still hasn't nerfed the centurion in any meaningful way.

****in centurion.

Sekiro...
08-23-2017, 04:46 AM
Centurion is not fun to play against because he can kill you from pretty much one parry or one mistake.

You need to be offensive against him to shut down his eternal flurry of attacks, yet you cannot be offensive against him because it will most likely mean that you will run out of stamina. Then you are finished. He is the most hated character in the game and is probably guilty of many people putting the game down and never coming back. Like already mentioned, fundamentally flawed in design.

That is true.
The season 3 heros are here and even with things to be adjusted they are not broken like centurion.

I'm still awaiting for a real nerf for centurion.

Rikuto01.tv
08-23-2017, 05:16 AM
Centurion could have the worst moveset in the game but as long as he can parry for 50-80% he's top tier.

HumoLoco
08-23-2017, 05:19 AM
Centurion is not that op lmao. his one of any his attack actually need to land in order grab or jab. you can block to ruin his day. When you block his attack then dodge because they are guarantee to grab or jab. If they are in charge just rolling back not side to side. Go play him learn him why is hes not that op.

Butonfly
08-23-2017, 06:31 AM
Except I'm not the only one and I also didn't say there isn't anything wrong with him. Aarpian, kweassa, and Raime have said similar things to me. He has problems but none showcased by your video, sorry to say you just need to learn to play. I already told you what's wrong with the character and needs to be changed, the rest comes down to him being a noob stomper.

I've already pointed out that you made 3 mistakes in your first video and then another 2 in the second coupled with the fact that you were being attacked by someone else at the same time. What am I wrong about? If you want you can keep doing the passive aggressive woman thing instead of coming up with an argument if you want, but it won't win you this fight.

Assumption, assertion, ad hominem, rhetoric, name calling, foul language, sexism, hyperbole. Your posts have been full of these things, and numerous- I wouldn't blow my horn if I were you ;D

Tyrjo
08-23-2017, 10:36 AM
Centurion is not that op lmao. his one of any his attack actually need to land in order grab or jab. you can block to ruin his day. When you block his attack then dodge because they are guarantee to grab or jab. If they are in charge just rolling back not side to side. Go play him learn him why is hes not that op.

What a well written post. :rolleyes: Centurions attack doesn't need to land in order for him to jab. That is how it SHOULD work though. What do you think happens if you dodge when Centurion GB? Wall splat (if a wall is close, which it is). Charged heavy, charged jab, eagles talon. 50% health gone, probably all your stamina. No good Centurions does charged heavy from nothing, those things are parried 99% of the time.

Kaijudub
08-23-2017, 12:39 PM
Assumption, assertion, ad hominem, rhetoric, name calling, foul language, sexism, hyperbole. Your posts have been full of these things, and numerous- I wouldn't blow my horn if I were you ;D

Tbh he's not the only guilty party, theres a little group of them that high five and like each others posts to make them feel like they're backed up. You'd be forgiven for thinking they were the same person considering their equal lack of writing ability and burning desire to trash talk everyone.

The funny thing is Antonio is a proven rage quitting stat padder that likes to enforce his opinion as fact, with complete disregard to the FACT his opinions are the complete opposite of those in the high level / competitive community. At this point I use the forum for nothing more than to watch the pond life that frequents this place, it's just comedy now.

Jiblet2017
08-23-2017, 01:12 PM
Lol my eyes are open kid, that's how I'm able to beat every hero you listed just now. And honestly, if you are losing to stampede, dodge.



Are you are aware that the entire point of stampede is to mixup GB. If you are dodging these with most of the cast you will be GB'd (as im sure you are aware that raider has a run/dodge gb).

Kaijudub
08-23-2017, 01:20 PM
Are you are aware that the entire point of stampede is to mixup GB. If you are dodging these with most of the cast you will be GB'd (as im sure you are aware that raider has a run/dodge gb).

Just keep dodging, just keep dodging, just keep dodging, dodging, dodging.

Alustar's a god, he can 100% predict a charge or a gb even before the raider knows he's going to do it.

OH kappa.

Jiblet2017
08-23-2017, 01:45 PM
Tbh he's not the only guilty party, theres a little group of them that high five and like each others posts to make them feel like they're backed up. You'd be forgiven for thinking they were the same person considering their equal lack of writing ability and burning desire to trash talk everyone.

The funny thing is Antonio is a proven rage quitting stat padder that likes to enforce his opinion as fact, with complete disregard to the FACT his opinions are the complete opposite of those in the high level / competitive community. At this point I use the forum for nothing more than to watch the pond life that frequents this place, it's just comedy now.

There certainly is a group that seems like they want to portray themselves as "hardcore" with a there is a counter to everything attitude. I dont disagree that there is a counter to everything, but they ignore the risk reward ratio completely when making these statements (e.g., how hard is it to counter with respect to it's in-game counterparts and how much are you punished if you fail to counter). In the end it comes down to the fact that they have invested a lot of time in the game, and may feel uneasy about making too many changes to their investment.

Although Antonio, Kwessa, knight_raime, and Alustar regular pat each other on the back - there is nothing inherently wrong with that. However, each have acknowledged problems with the cent -even Antonio. "I've extended the olive branch to you and even agreed with you on what needs changing with centurion (stam pool, wall stun, light parry punish)." (source: http://forums.ubi.com/showthread.php/1725393-Cent-move-that-follows-you-mid-air/page8)

Besides some tracking issues which some disagree on, that is really all the majority of players want nerfed.

-reduce his stamina pool (just bring it in line with Raider- he can be tied for 1st which isn't bad).
-Reduce his 75 damage light parry punish (using unlock zone).
-reduce his wall-stun damage and corner punish.

If you acknowledge that these things need fixing, it seems you are aware that he needs balance. To answer every post with get gud, he is balanced seems disingenuous given you feel things so fundamental as stamina pools, wall punishes, and parries are out of line.

Thanks for the discussion guys. Try to stay on topic and not resort to ad-hominem attacks. Most people in this thread are in agreement with the core of what needs to be fixed about centurion, so there is no real sense of beating a dead horse. Lets just hope unanimity is enough to have the devs test some of the changes we have all suggested so they can move on to making minor tweaks to the rest of the cast and fix exploits.

Kaijudub
08-23-2017, 01:49 PM
There certainly is a group that seems like they want to portray themselves as "hardcore" with a there is a counter to everything attitude. I dont disagree that there is a counter to everything, but they ignore the risk reward ratio completely when making these statements (e.g., how hard is it to counter with respect to it's in-game counterparts and how much are you punished if you fail to counter). In the end it comes down to the fact that they have invested a lot of time in the game, and may feel uneasy about making too many changes to their investment.

Although Antonio, Kwessa, knight_raime, and Alustar regular pat each other on the back - there is nothing inherently wrong with that. However, each have acknowledged problems with the cent -even Antonio. "I've extended the olive branch to you and even agreed with you on what needs changing with centurion (stam pool, wall stun, light parry punish)." (source: http://forums.ubi.com/showthread.php/1725393-Cent-move-that-follows-you-mid-air/page8)

Besides some tracking issues which some disagree on, that is really all the majority of players want nerfed.

-reduce his stamina pool (just bring it in line with Raider- he can be tied for 1st which isn't bad).
-Reduce his 75 damage light parry punish (using unlock zone).
-reduce his wall-stun damage and corner punish.

If you acknowledge that these things need fixing, it seems you are aware that he needs balance. To answer every post with get gud, he is balanced seems disingenuous given you feel things so fundamental as stamina pools, wall punishes, and parries are out of line.

Thanks for the discussion guys. Try to stay on topic and not resort to ad-hominem attacks. Most people in this thread are in agreement with the core of what needs to be fixed about centurion, so there is no real sense of beating a dead horse. Lets just hope unanimity is enough to have the devs test some of the changes we have all suggested so they can move on to making minor tweaks to the rest of the cast and fix exploits.

You sir are eloquent, bravo.

Alustar.
08-23-2017, 02:10 PM
Assumption, assertion, ad hominem, rhetoric, name calling, foul language, sexism, hyperbole. Your posts have been full of these things, and numerous- I wouldn't blow my horn if I were you ;D
I love it when people try to dismantle an argument by claiming the argument was presented in the wrong manner.


Are you are aware that the entire point of stampede is to mixup GB. If you are dodging these with most of the cast you will be GB'd (as im sure you are aware that raider has a run/dodge gb).

Yes, I'm also aware of "how" and "when" to dodge. If a raider is point blank and tries to charge. Just light tap. If he's further away and you time the dodge right, you wind up behind him for free damage.

As to me being "godly" that's online my ability to play a distance and mobility game. Ask anyone who's gone up against me. It's not easy to make solid connections.

Antonioj26
08-23-2017, 02:13 PM
Assumption, assertion, ad hominem, rhetoric, name calling, foul language, sexism, hyperbole. Your posts have been full of these things, and numerous- I wouldn't blow my horn if I were you ;D

Good argument pointing out where I was wrong.

Antonioj26
08-23-2017, 02:19 PM
Tbh he's not the only guilty party, theres a little group of them that high five and like each others posts to make them feel like they're backed up. You'd be forgiven for thinking they were the same person considering their equal lack of writing ability and burning desire to trash talk everyone.

The funny thing is Antonio is a proven rage quitting stat padder that likes to enforce his opinion as fact, with complete disregard to the FACT his opinions are the complete opposite of those in the high level / competitive community. At this point I use the forum for nothing more than to watch the pond life that frequents this place, it's just comedy now.

would love to see the proof of me rage quitting and padding stats. Have you been watching me play all of my matches? I only have 57 duels recorded, are you telling me that if you started up a fresh character you cant stomp people that are brand new to the game or have a low mmr into the ground enough and get a 86% win rate? Did you also forget that it goes by matches and not unique opponents? If someone sticks around and I beat them for 5 matches thats almost 10% of my wins right there.

Antonioj26
08-23-2017, 02:24 PM
There certainly is a group that seems like they want to portray themselves as "hardcore" with a there is a counter to everything attitude. I dont disagree that there is a counter to everything, but they ignore the risk reward ratio completely when making these statements (e.g., how hard is it to counter with respect to it's in-game counterparts and how much are you punished if you fail to counter). In the end it comes down to the fact that they have invested a lot of time in the game, and may feel uneasy about making too many changes to their investment.

Although Antonio, Kwessa, knight_raime, and Alustar regular pat each other on the back - there is nothing inherently wrong with that. However, each have acknowledged problems with the cent -even Antonio. "I've extended the olive branch to you and even agreed with you on what needs changing with centurion (stam pool, wall stun, light parry punish)." (source: http://forums.ubi.com/showthread.php/1725393-Cent-move-that-follows-you-mid-air/page8)

Besides some tracking issues which some disagree on, that is really all the majority of players want nerfed.

-reduce his stamina pool (just bring it in line with Raider- he can be tied for 1st which isn't bad).
-Reduce his 75 damage light parry punish (using unlock zone).
-reduce his wall-stun damage and corner punish.

If you acknowledge that these things need fixing, it seems you are aware that he needs balance. To answer every post with get gud, he is balanced seems disingenuous given you feel things so fundamental as stamina pools, wall punishes, and parries are out of line.

Thanks for the discussion guys. Try to stay on topic and not resort to ad-hominem attacks. Most people in this thread are in agreement with the core of what needs to be fixed about centurion, so there is no real sense of beating a dead horse. Lets just hope unanimity is enough to have the devs test some of the changes we have all suggested so they can move on to making minor tweaks to the rest of the cast and fix exploits.

Thats very dishonest of you to take my extending the "olive branch" quote out of context. Here I thought we were finally getting somewhere. I already explained to you that cent has problems, his combos and his offense arent it. Unblockables that are 600ms and 700ms that can be punished should not be nerfed, simple as that. The problem is I'm not answering every post with get gud, I'm answering the posts that show where there were mistakes or are just flat out wrong. If you posted a video of you getting wallsplat to death, light parried to death, or centurion unleashing a barrage of attacks without losing stamina my response would not be get gud.

Kaijudub
08-23-2017, 02:24 PM
would love to see the proof of me rage quitting and padding stats. Have you been watching me play all of my matches? I only have 57 duels recorded, are you telling me that if you started up a fresh character you cant stomp people that are brand new to the game or have a low mmr into the ground enough and get a 86% win rate? Did you also forget that it goes by matches and not unique opponents? If someone sticks around and I beat them for 5 matches thats almost 10% of my wins right there.

lol all i see is " I cheat"

No point in taking you seriously, not that many people ever really did.

Keep dragging the tread out though dude, you do love a de rail don't you.

Antonioj26
08-23-2017, 02:28 PM
lol all i see is " I cheat"

No point in taking you seriously, not that many people ever really did.

Keep dragging the tread out though dude, you do love a de rail don't you.

So you cant beat noobs and low mmr players? Should have known from all your cry baby warden threads.

Jiblet2017
08-23-2017, 03:29 PM
Thats very dishonest of you to take my extending the "olive branch" quote out of context. Here I thought we were finally getting somewhere. I already explained to you that cent has problems, his combos and his offense arent it. Unblockables that are 600ms and 700ms that can be punished should not be nerfed, simple as that. The problem is I'm not answering every post with get gud, I'm answering the posts that show where there were mistakes or are just flat out wrong. If you posted a video of you getting wallsplat to death, light parried to death, or centurion unleashing a barrage of attacks without losing stamina my response would not be get gud.

Out of context? I provided the link to the original post. If you would like i can provide more context from the very same page if that clarifies your position. . .

When I said that your balance changes should be based on how you feel and not a way of "extending an olive branch," you replied (on the very same page):

"The nerfs weren't the olive branch, the nerfs have always been how I felt. I got a lot of posts so it would be hard to find but from the very beginning I've said the exact same thing before I even ran into you. His stam pool is too high, his light parry punish is too strong, and his wall stun is too strong."

source: http://forums.ubi.com/showthread.php/1725393-Cent-move-that-follows-you-mid-air/page8

I am not saying his lights or heavies need to be nerfed (I actually have never mentioned his attacks), and am simply agreeing with your recommendations. With respect to his parry punish, wall punish, and stam pool we certainly are getting somewhere so thank you for pointing that out!

Since this is just a videogame forum, I really don't mind doublespeak that much. However, i really recommend not contradicting yourself in writing for things that actually matter. It can get you in hot water pretty quickly or at the very least make people doubt your credibility. You seem like a nice kid (or guy or man - not sure your age), and i would hate for your credibility to be tarnished IRL.

As always, thank you for the discussion minus the defensive (and pretty ironic) claim of dishonesty.

Antonioj26
08-23-2017, 03:39 PM
Out of context? I provided the link to the original post. If you would like i can provide more context from the very same page if that clarifies your position. . .

When I said that your balance changes should be based on how you feel and not a way of "extending an olive branch," you replied (on the very same page):

"The nerfs weren't the olive branch, the nerfs have always been how I felt. I got a lot of posts so it would be hard to find but from the very beginning I've said the exact same thing before I even ran into you. His stam pool is too high, his light parry punish is too strong, and his wall stun is too strong."

source: http://forums.ubi.com/showthread.php/1725393-Cent-move-that-follows-you-mid-air/page8


I am not saying his lights or heavies need to be nerfed (I actually have never mentioned his attacks), and am simply agreeing with your recommendations. With respect to his parry punish, wall punish, and stam pool we certainly are getting somewhere so thank you for pointing that out!

Since this is just a videogame forum, I really don't mind doublespeak that much. However, i really recommend not contradicting yourself in writing for things that actually matter. It can get you in hot water pretty quickly or at the very least make people doubt your credibility. You seem like a nice kid (or guy or man - not sure your age), and i would hate for your credibility to be tarnished IRL.

As always, thank you for the discussion minus the defensive (and pretty ironic) claim of dishonesty.

Man you started off really great but then towards the end you got this passive aggressive tone to you, why do this? I haven't contradicted myself, if I have then please point out where. You had to have known that no one was going to read that entire post that you linked, the olive branch part of the quote didn't even have to be put in. That added nothing to the quote other than it makes it seem like I'm caving to the nerf cries when that's just not true, I've said it since the beginning. Show me where I've been dishonest, would love to see it.

RatedChaotic
08-23-2017, 03:40 PM
would love to see the proof of me rage quitting and padding stats. Have you been watching me play all of my matches? I only have 57 duels recorded, are you telling me that if you started up a fresh character you cant stomp people that are brand new to the game or have a low mmr into the ground enough and get a 86% win rate? Did you also forget that it goes by matches and not unique opponents? If someone sticks around and I beat them for 5 matches thats almost 10% of my wins right there.

Your a hypocrite......... You have only like 10 more duels than me LMAO......Yet you bash me for not having any pvp experience I'm sorry the best mode for that xp is duels not 4v4s...I was done but his comment here was epic......4v4 is more for a laid back game real hardcore pvpers duel...guess your not one of those.

Antonioj26
08-23-2017, 03:43 PM
Your a hypocrite......... You have only like 10 more duels than me LMAO......Yet you bash me for not having any pvp experience I'm sorry the best mode for that xp is duels not 4v4s...

How am I hypocrite? I still have far more experience than you, and I also have a second account https://fhtracker.com/profile/psn/Antonio-J26 so nice try. I stopped playing it though because my cousin was also playing it and was using my steel.

RatedChaotic
08-23-2017, 03:46 PM
How am I hypocrite? I still have far more experience than you, and I also have a second account https://fhtracker.com/profile/psn/Antonio-J26 so nice try. I stopped playing it though because my cousin was also playing it and was using my steel.

Nice try aswell. Makes me wonder if any of it was really you then..Nice try trying to defend that. You just make me question your stats even more....Have a good day...

Antonioj26
08-23-2017, 03:48 PM
Nice try aswell. Makes me wonder if any of it was really you then..

No way to prove it either way, I also don't really care about the opinion of a pve player.

Jiblet2017
08-23-2017, 04:05 PM
Man you started off really great but then towards the end you got this passive aggressive tone to you, why do this? I haven't contradicted myself, if I have then please point out where. You had to have known that no one was going to read that entire post that you linked, the olive branch part of the quote didn't even have to be put in. That added nothing to the quote other than it makes it seem like I'm caving to the nerf cries when that's just not true, I've said it since the beginning. Show me where I've been dishonest, would love to see it.

Not passive aggressive! Just life advice (although its pretty obvious lying is bad).

You claimed that your parry, stam, and wall punish nerf recommendations were taken out of context (even though i provided link- laziness and not reading is up to each person i guess).

Then i showed you on the very same page where you said that you believed those nerfs were needed, even before you started writing to me.

The contradiction: Claiming that i was misusing your words (aka using them out of context), but your own response shows that I was accurately representing what you said and the meaning you meant to convey: cent needs changes to these areas.

Hope that clarifies, and as always - no hard feelings Ant!

Antonioj26
08-23-2017, 04:20 PM
Not passive aggressive! Just life advice (although its pretty obvious lying is bad).

You claimed that your parry, stam, and wall punish nerf recommendations were taken out of context (even though i provided link- laziness and not reading is up to each person i guess).

Then i showed you on the very same page where you said that you believed those nerfs were needed, even before you started writing to me.

The contradiction: Claiming that i was misusing your words (aka using them out of context), but your own response shows that I was accurately representing what you said and the meaning you meant to convey: cent needs changes to these areas.

Hope that clarifies, and as always - no hard feelings Ant!

I hate you so much, you found my weakness (call center speak).

RatedChaotic
08-23-2017, 04:23 PM
No way to prove it either way, I also don't really care about the opinion of a pve player.

And I dont care about the opinion of a hypocrite. Have a good day...

Antonioj26
08-23-2017, 04:31 PM
And I dont care about the opinion of a hypocrite. Have a good day...

No proof of me being a hypocrite but there certainly is of you being a pve player. Good day.

Jiblet2017
08-23-2017, 04:36 PM
I hate you so much, you found my weakness (call center speak).

Well I certainly dont hate you and appreciate your stam pool, light parry punish, and wall punish nerf suggestions for centurion! The Goop even made a thread about it to discuss your recommendations further.

While you may call it call-center speak, I just generally call this being polite and having a honest discussion on recommended balance changes (sorry if I am upsetting you - I can lose my temper at times as well and my post history can attest to that)! However, If a good dose of common courtesy is your weakness, certainly never travel to Canada sir!;)

Antonioj26
08-23-2017, 04:47 PM
Well I certainly dont hate you and appreciate your stam pool, light parry punish, and wall punish nerf suggestions for centurion! The Goop even made a thread about it to discuss your recommendations further.

While you may call it call-center speak, I just generally call this being polite and having a honest discussion on recommended balance changes (sorry if I am upsetting you - I can lose my temper at times as well and my post history can attest to that)! However, If a good dose of common courtesy is your weakness, certainly never travel to Canada sir!;)

But this isn't how you always talk, you just started this.

RatedChaotic
08-23-2017, 04:53 PM
No proof of me being a hypocrite but there certainly is of you being a pve player. Good day.

Its a known fact duels will give you the best experience when it comes to being a pvper. And with you admitting you have only done 50ish duels. Yet you call me a pver for only having 40ish duels. Ya your a hypocrite. Then you try to used a shared account to justify it and with the name AntonioJ (Probly Jose) who knows how many cousins you got running aroud there. Yeah I went there...Sorry... lmao...Have a good day

Antonioj26
08-23-2017, 05:04 PM
Its a known fact duels will give you the best experience when it comes to being a pvper. And with you admitting you have only done 50ish duels. Yet you call me a pver for only having 40ish duels. Ya your a hypocrite. Then you try to used a shared account to justify it and with the name AntonioJ (Probly Jose) who knows how many cousins you got running aroud there. Yeah I went there...Sorry... lmao...Have a good day

Except I have a second profile but go ahead and ignore that again. You can't prove how many duels are from my cousin and how many are from me. I've also dueled many people from these very forums (cumbuster4000, that_guy44, sweaty_mudflaps, and killuminatish that are very good duelists and I haven't taken a beating from any of them except for cumbuster4000. Not sure why you assume Jose, sounds like a bit of racism from on old relic. No worries though I don't get sensitive over ignorant comments, I've already put you in your place, old man. You are grasping at straws at this point.

Jiblet2017
08-23-2017, 05:05 PM
But this isn't how you always talk, you just started this.

Hence the "I can lose my temper at times as well and my post history can attest to that" sentence. Nobody is perfect, but there is no time like the present for being polite! Secondly, I am pretty sure you made the nerf recommendations "before you even met me." They are good and I agree with them whole-heartedly.

psyminion
08-23-2017, 05:11 PM
I've got 949 PvP Dominion matches and over 1000 PvP duel/brawl matches and I'm just sitting here like
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DHztL1SVYAAAPOD.jpg

GladiatorHood
08-23-2017, 06:36 PM
Just stop whining u idiots

Alustar.
08-23-2017, 06:39 PM
Duels are a singular aspect of this game and in no way are the be all for determining skill in PvP. That's simply showing your ability to handle ONE opponent under preestablished conditions.

Not to take away from duelists, but I know several people who would rock me 1v1 but there are few I would be hesitant In trusting them to effectively hold their ground in 4s.

iHunny
08-23-2017, 07:35 PM
I wish I could learn how Centurion works but I cant since I am not allowed to test him in (How to play), if I could i would not be this salty...

Butonfly
08-23-2017, 08:51 PM
Good argument pointing out where I was wrong.

Assumption: I never stated my position. But for whatever reason you felt the need to address it? The result was you speaking to the air, creating a figment of your imagination to fight with, and fight you did!
Assertion: Naturally the hubris that followed your assumptions flourished allowing you to presume a position of authority.
Everything else: The result of both of these was the pervading attitude you've expressed throughout. The majority of your offerings have been little more than hot air and nastiness.

Despite all this, and to be fair to you, I think you have had a point to make, and you made it, which is great! Holding to a "Play to win" stance myself, I don't disagree that learning the movesets and putting the right counters in the right places is not only possible, but key! Of course there's more to be taken into consideration when talking balance, so there is certainly more to be addressed on the centurion topic.

So yeah, you've been plenty wrong in your address, whether you want to acknowledge that or not. Without a doubt you've been a jerk, and regardless of how anyone thinks about Centurion, that's worth pointing out : ) - Not from a place of meanness, but with the hope of a little self reflection.

We.the.North
08-24-2017, 12:07 AM
Tomorrow's warrior den better have something about a ****in long overdue nerf to this cancer.

For **** sake what's taking so long, EVERYONE godamn agrees he's beyond broken in dominion. Who cares about 1v1 being "on par" with other ******** hero, he's breaking a whole game mode by himself.

Get your god damn head out of your *** Ubisoft for god sake.

160 replies here Ubisoft, are you seriously still thinking you need more data. 160 angry replies of people sick of your turtle speed balancing.

And while we're at it, nerf the warlord too already. He's another hero the whole frickin community agrees he's broken.

Yes, I'm whining. One person whining is sad. The whole community whining, it's more than an isolated incident.

Aarpian
08-24-2017, 10:43 AM
Tomorrow's warrior den better have something about a ****in long overdue nerf to this cancer.

For **** sake what's taking so long, EVERYONE godamn agrees he's beyond broken in dominion. Who cares about 1v1 being "on par" with other ******** hero, he's breaking a whole game mode by himself.

Get your god damn head out of your *** Ubisoft for god sake.

160 replies here Ubisoft, are you seriously still thinking you need more data. 160 angry replies of people sick of your turtle speed balancing.

And while we're at it, nerf the warlord too already. He's another hero the whole frickin community agrees he's broken.

Yes, I'm whining. One person whining is sad. The whole community whining, it's more than an isolated incident.

160 replies of **** players asking ubisoft to compensate for their lack of skill.

Balancing a game around bad-mediocre players is a surefire way to kill it.

Butonfly
08-24-2017, 11:18 AM
160 replies of **** players asking ubisoft to compensate for their lack of skill.

Balancing a game around bad-mediocre players is a surefire way to kill it.

Actually, players asking for balance based on power to skill ratio is legitimate. Your assumption, of course, is that those players making the request are "bad-mediocre", which is a claim you have to substantiate. Otherwise it's just strawman and assumptions.

Also, a large majority of the replies in this thread are centurion defenders, and of those posts many if not most contain mud slinging and personal attacks. So yeah.

S.J.Lannister
08-24-2017, 01:01 PM
Actually, players asking for balance based on power to skill ratio is legitimate. Your assumption, of course, is that those players making the request are "bad-mediocre", which is a claim you have to substantiate. Otherwise it's just strawman and assumptions.

Also, a large majority of the replies in this thread are centurion defenders, and of those posts many if not most contain mud slinging and personal attacks. So yeah.

Couldn't agree more. Just found on other thread:

https://media.giphy.com/media/Mz3LNfVU9zaHS/giphy.gif

Alustar.
08-24-2017, 01:37 PM
Actually, players asking for balance based on power to skill ratio is legitimate. Your assumption, of course, is that those players making the request are "bad-mediocre", which is a claim you have to substantiate. Otherwise it's just strawman and assumptions.

Also, a large majority of the replies in this thread are centurion defenders, and of those posts many if not most contain mud slinging and personal attacks. So yeah.

So then how do you explain a **** player like me (that falls into the category of mediocre) taking the advice from the playerbase that has experience with that hero, then turning around and smashing every noob Centurion I meet?

Here's the bottom line about "OP" characters that holds true regardless of personal opinion:
A character or ability is only technically considered OP if ANY Player, regardless of skill or experience, can pick up the hero and use it to easily dominate with little to no skill required.

So if you are claiming Centurion is OP out your money where you mouth is. Show us a video of you going in with a fresh Centurion and dominating every match you have. If you can do that, then yes. I'd be more willing to be supportive, however as it stands, that's not the case. Even in 4s where Cent has the most issues with his stuns, he is easily dealt with by a competent player.

Aarpian
08-24-2017, 02:25 PM
Actually, players asking for balance based on power to skill ratio is legitimate. Your assumption, of course, is that those players making the request are "bad-mediocre", which is a claim you have to substantiate. Otherwise it's just strawman and assumptions.

Also, a large majority of the replies in this thread are centurion defenders, and of those posts many if not most contain mud slinging and personal attacks. So yeah.

It's not a claim I can provide material evidence to you for, but I have been involved in the competitive scene since the game was launched, and not a single competitive player thinks centurion is overpowered.

We.the.North
08-24-2017, 02:29 PM
Here's the bottom line about "OP" characters that holds true regardless of personal opinion:
A character or ability is only technically considered OP if ANY Player, regardless of skill or experience, can pick up the hero and use it to easily dominate with little to no skill required.

Bandana made it to the finals of last tournament, with a 16 rounds win streak, using the Centurion. He started playing him 2-3 weeks before the tournament. Dont tell me you can fully master a class in that short a time. Also, in that tournament, most people made it far by using unlock tech and other exploits. Centurion doesn't have that many unlock tech (other than his zone attack, which can only be used effectivement under certain circonstances) ... yet, he still made it to the finals.

Centurion is strong in 1v1. But I'll agree, he's not "OP". However, his kit completely breaks 4v4. Everyone agrees about that even the so called Centurion defenders. They just chose to completely ignore 4v4 in their arguments.

We.the.North
08-24-2017, 02:32 PM
160 replies of **** players asking ubisoft to compensate for their lack of skill.

Balancing a game around bad-mediocre players is a surefire way to kill it.

https://fhtracker.com/profile/pc/We.the.North/heroes

The funny thing about people asking for nerf ... is that sometime, the people asking for it are the ones playing at high level and that actually know what they are talking about.

Aarpian
08-24-2017, 02:33 PM
Bandana made it to the finals of last tournament with the Centurion. He started playing him 2-3 weeks before the tournament. Dont tell me you can fully master a class in that short a time. Also, in that tournament, most people made it far by using unlock tech and other exploits. Centurion doesn't have that many unlock tech (other than his zone attack, which can only be used effectivement under certain circonstances) ... yet, he still made it to the finals.

Centurion is strong in 1v1. But I'll agree, he's not "OP". However, his kit completely breaks 4v4. Everyone agrees about that even the so called Centurion defenders. They just chose to completely ignore 4v4 in their arguments.

Bandana is a better player than the others who turned up to the hero series. LegionUnchained is really the only one who I would say is better than him, and he couldn't make it. The guy has insane reads, and centurion actually does alright vs Warlord and Raider because his wall bang punish really shores up the risk/reward dynamic in his favour if he guesses right on the sprint cheese they both employ.

Aarpian
08-24-2017, 02:38 PM
https://fhtracker.com/profile/pc/We.the.North/heroes

The funny thing about people asking for nerf ... is that sometime, the people asking for it are the ones playing at high level and that actually know what they are talking about.

Thank you for proving my point.

http://i.imgur.com/GSntZd0.png

We.the.North
08-24-2017, 02:42 PM
LoooooooL, any statistician will tell you, you can't make any conclusions based on something with a very small pool of data. Surely my 33 games I played with random hero I totally not master to complete orders are a fair display of my skill. I also happen to help people playing against me in Duels, giving them free hits or showing them how to mix up and combo because I just dont care about duels. I'm a nice guy like that to noobs I face (thank you matchmaking)

LMAO, made my day.

You also show exactly what's wrong with people defending Centurion. They look at a very specific thing (1v1 duels) and they dont let go. They dont look anywhere else and yell the Centurion is fine based exclusively on duel and how to play against him.

You'll see my experience largely comes from 4v4 where the Centurion is completely broken. How about we talk 4v4 a little ?

Specialkha
08-24-2017, 02:42 PM
It's not a claim I can provide material evidence to you for, but I have been involved in the competitive scene since the game was launched, and not a single competitive player thinks centurion is overpowered.

Well, most competitive players use cheese and unlock exploit and find it normal, so I am not really sure we should take their thoughts into account.

Aarpian
08-24-2017, 02:47 PM
LoooooooL, any statistician will tell you, you can't make any conclusions based on something with a very small pool of data. Surely my 33 games I played with random hero I totally not master to complete orders are a fair display of my skill.

LMAO, made my day.

You also show exactly what's wrong with people defending Centurion. They look at a very specific thing (1v1 duels) and they dont let go. They dont look anywhere else and yell the Centurion is fine based exclusively on duel and how to play against him.

You'll see my experience largely comes from 4v4 where the Centurion is completely broken. How about we talk 4v4 a little ?

So why the **** did you link me your profile in an attempt to convince me you weren't a bad-mediocre player you absolute spastic?


Well, most competitive players use cheese and unlock exploit and find it normal, so I am not really sure we should take their thoughts into account.
Most competitive players use all the tools available to them and don't draw arbitrary lines in the sand so they can evaluate what's strong and what isn't through a lens they specified and thus ignore any arguments to the contrary because they don't like them.

If you want to have a discussion about what's strong and what isn't, you have to take into account everything they are capable of.

We.the.North
08-24-2017, 03:01 PM
So why the **** did you link me your profile in an attempt to convince me you weren't a bad-mediocre player you absolute spastic?

Because I linked you my Hero page where you'll see my Valkyrie is well above average.

Also, can you read ?? I always said Centurion is fine in 1v1. The problem is "being fine in 1v1" doesn't give him the right to completely screw us in Dominion where he is beyond broken with cinematic long stunlock that doesn't break when their allies also hit the pinned / stunned / knocked down target.

Again, Centurion is beyond broken IN DOMINION and needs to be nerfed. In duels, just pick another hero. Let dominion be fun again.

Aarpian
08-24-2017, 03:06 PM
Because I linked you my Hero page where you'll see my Valkyrie is well above average.

She's not well above average, she's completely average. 69% is no where near a competitive level. Hell, the only characters I have below that are ones I don't even play.
And who gives a **** about dominion win rates anyway?

We.the.North
08-24-2017, 03:26 PM
I get it, you only care about Duels. How about showing some empathy and considering the point of view of players (like me) who almost exclusively play Dominion ??

Like I said, you can still have a healthy duel environnement by Nerfing the Centurion (just pick another hero) and by doing so, you fix the unhealthy environnement we suffer from in Dominion.

And that 69% win rate for a solo player in Dominion (not 4 youtubers grouping and rolling everything) is not something you spit on. I might not be tournament worthy, but I'm probably in the top 5% players. You're having a very toxic attitude.


Hell, the only characters I have below that are ones I don't even play.

https://fhtracker.com/profile/pc/Aarpian/heroes

Is that you ??

Seeing how centurion is your most played hero, I understand you want to protect him. Also, you're a good player congratz, probably better than me, but not by that high of a margin. Doesn't give you the right to have such a toxic attitude toward others and disregard any arguments and discussions that aren't directed toward duel gameplay.

By the way, altho Duel is the tournament mode at the moment, it's also the least played mode. At some point, when you create a game and try to keep your playerbase happy, you need to look at the bigger picture. Many players, me included, play exclusively Dominion and other 4v4 modes. You want to keep your playerbase happy ?? Then fix the modes that are most played. Duel will still be fine with other heroes.

Aarpian
08-24-2017, 03:29 PM
I get it, you only care about Duels. How about showing some empathy and considering the point of view of players (like me) who almost exclusively play Dominion ??

Like I said, you can still have a healthy duel environnement by Nerfing the Centurion (just pick another hero) and by doing so, you fix the unhealthy environnement we suffer from in Dominion.

Cent is fine in dominion as well - again, he's a noob stomper. His strength is that he's good at ganking people with a team mate. On the flipside, he's god-awful at surviving vs multiple opponents as all his damage has long animations that make him more vulnerable than the guy he's attacking.
If you want to cry about 4v4 characters, take a look at Nobushi.

Tyrjo
08-24-2017, 03:41 PM
https://fhtracker.com/profile/pc/Aarpian/heroes

Is that you ??

Seeing how centurion is your most played hero, I understand you want to protect him.

This is hilarious. So what we hear from this guy are totally biased opinions about his "main" being balanced. From now on we can ignore whatever he says about Centurion. :D

Aarpian
08-24-2017, 03:48 PM
This is hilarious. So what we hear from this guy are totally biased opinions about his "main" being balanced. From now on we can ignore whatever he says about Centurion. :D

I play him because he's fun. Notice he's not even in my top 3 winrates. It's also how I know he's not that good.


Seeing how centurion is your most played hero, I understand you want to protect him. Also, you're a good player congratz, probably better than me, but not by that high of a margin. Doesn't give you the right to have such a toxic attitude toward others and disregard any arguments and discussions that aren't directed toward duel gameplay.
I'm a much worse player than I used to be when I was winning tournaments, but even so I'm much better than you. That's my winrate when the only people I rematch are people who beat me.
By the way, the thread title is LITERALLY "Why Centurion Is Still OP in 1v1"

We.the.North
08-24-2017, 04:05 PM
This is hilarious. So what we hear from this guy are totally biased opinions about his "main" being balanced. From now on we can ignore whatever he says about Centurion.

Nah dont ignore him, he's still a good player making some valid points. He just choose which points he constantly bring forward : his opinion and arguments being largely directed toward duel gameplay.

He actually made a very valid point about Centurion. When he comes from your "dead camera angle" and do his charged heavy, you are right he will dominate. But when he's on the receiving end of a 2v1, his hour long cutscene can't really be used, which make him weaker. He's 100% right about that.

The problem I see with this logic is the following : A lot of heroes have half their tools taken away from them when the fight becomes 2v1 against them. Have you seen a Shinobi do a sickle rain when he's outnumbered ?? No, every characters suffer from having their kit cut in half when outnumbered.

The other problem I see is the following : When a Centurion gank you from a dead camera angle, the fight last 5-8 seconds and it's over. Then, those 2 players will run around creating other 2v1 situations and it becomes a snowball effect. When characters other than the centurion comes at you from a dead angle, you'll suffer a hit and the fight is far from over at that point, you might even get a revenge proc which will help you either win or survive until your teamate arrives. In other words, Centurion creates 2v1 snowball effect with lightning quick ganks and other characters are much, much slower at creating this snowball effect when ganking.

Again, look at the big picture. Dominion is a TEAM game. The Centurion's impact in that TEAM game is huge because it creates a snowball effect of unfair fights where their opponent are not only outnumbered, they are outnumbered against a Centurion that will close the issue within seconds.



By the way, the thread title is LITERALLY "Why Centurion Is Still OP in 1v1"

160 replies later, I think you can agree the issue is bigger than the title and this has become a Centurion feedback chain of post.

RatedChaotic
08-24-2017, 06:22 PM
Well the ability to feint that many times in one stam bar is OP in 4v4 and 1v1. 16 times in one bar was it? And now it is going be nerfed/fixed to 8....Clearly he wasnt OP.

I'm just a pve player...I know nothing....wink Good changes for xbox today. I finally maybe able to pvp more than AI and get some of these monkeys off my back...

Specialkha
08-24-2017, 07:14 PM
So why the **** did you link me your profile in an attempt to convince me you weren't a bad-mediocre player you absolute spastic?


Most competitive players use all the tools available to them and don't draw arbitrary lines in the sand so they can evaluate what's strong and what isn't through a lens they specified and thus ignore any arguments to the contrary because they don't like them.

If you want to have a discussion about what's strong and what isn't, you have to take into account everything they are capable of.

This is why I loled at most so called competitive players in this game or another, because they would use any glitch or exploit to win. (Just to remind you Glitch or exploit = cheat).

RatedChaotic
08-24-2017, 07:29 PM
This is why I loled at most so called competitive players in this game or another, because they would use any glitch or exploit to win. (Just to remind you Glitch or exploit = cheat).

Yes and is why I pve more than pvp. I refuse to stoop to that level of gameplay and refuse to be part of it in anyway. Apparently my standards of pvping is way above most here as you can see. But I'm not sorry for that at all.

Antonioj26
08-24-2017, 07:31 PM
Yes and is why I pve more than pvp. I refuse to stoop to that level of gameplay and refuse to be part of it in anyway. Apparently my standards of pvping is way above most here as you can see. But I'm not sorry for that at all.

Keep making up whatever excuses you need to so you don't have to face being a terrible player, old timer. You're making me laugh every step of the way on your delusional journey.

RatedChaotic
08-24-2017, 07:37 PM
Ya I'm terrible at this game I'm not afraid to admit it....Never said I was good. But I'm positive I'm better than your portraying me to be....

Antonioj26
08-24-2017, 07:39 PM
Ya I'm terrible at this game I'm not afraid to admit it....

Bout time. Glad we can finally agree that you don't know what you are talking about.

RatedChaotic
08-24-2017, 07:47 PM
Bout time. Glad we can finally agree that you don't know what you are talking about.

Lmao......Apparently you dont either. Not all your claims were correct. Warriors Den has proved you wrong on many occasions.

Casper5632
08-24-2017, 07:52 PM
Different classes are strong against different things. As a Lawbringer I was completely helpless against cents. They can avoid the "Free" light attack after a parry, they can avoid the "Free" light attack after a shove, and the LBs heavy use of stamina means they are likely to get exhausted fighting a cent.

Now that I play a highlander I find them much less of a threat, as my heavy defensive attack will do much more damage than their unblockable lunge stab and give me super armor so their faster stab cant interrupt me. Also they have very little hope of defensive metaing against the spinning feint slash.

This game needs more balance in general, but if cents got nerfed anymore they would be completely non viable against most enemies. This game needs general tweaking, not outright nerfs at this time.

Antonioj26
08-24-2017, 07:57 PM
Lmao......Apparently you dont either.

But I do though, I've been right about everything so far. You complained about conqueror having his two best tools taken away by cents unblockables when it should be obvious that your two best tools actually took away all of his mixups and left him with one slow unblockable. But as a pve player you wouldn't understand that.

RatedChaotic
08-24-2017, 08:04 PM
But I do though, I've been right about everything so far. You complained about conqueror having his two best tools taken away by cents unblockables when it should be obvious that your two best tools actually took away all of his mixups and left him with one slow unblockable. But as a pve player you wouldn't understand that.

Ya but sure his 16 fients didnt help him with that huh? Warriors Den has proved you wrong many times Antonio....Get off your high horse.

Antonioj26
08-24-2017, 08:08 PM
Ya but sure his 16 fients didnt help him with that huh? Warriors Den has proved you wrong many times Antonio....Get off your high horse.

What does his feints have to do with you not being able to block his attacks?

RatedChaotic
08-24-2017, 08:11 PM
What does his feints have to do with you not being able to block his attacks?

Why are they fixing it if it does nothing bad? It must be doing something huh?

Antonioj26
08-24-2017, 08:12 PM
Why are they fixing it if it does nothing bad?

Why are you dodging my question? Also would like for you to find a quote where I said it was fine that he could feint 16 times.

RatedChaotic
08-24-2017, 08:15 PM
Why are you dodging my question? Also would like for you to find a quote where I said it was fine that he could feint 16 times.

Well I dont know what I'm talking about remember? Maybe you can help me....LMAO

Antonioj26
08-24-2017, 08:18 PM
Well I dont know what I'm talking about remember? Maybe you can help me....

I already explained to you how to counter centurion with conqueror, have you already forgotten, old timer?

RatedChaotic
08-24-2017, 08:34 PM
I already explained to you how to counter centurion with conqueror, have you already forgotten, old timer?

Ya having 6 propane tanks of HME explode 3ft from you does bad things to the brain. I'm sorry I am scatter brained at times and come off as a somebody that has no idea what they are talking about....I'm sorry for that......I apologize. I agree that I mix up what I'm trying to say here on the forums and it mostly comes out wrong....I'm trying man... But to constantly bash me over it is very f*cked up...

Antonioj26
08-24-2017, 08:56 PM
Ya having 6 propane tanks of HME explode 3ft from you does bad things to the brain. I'm sorry I am scatter brained at times and come off as a somebody that has no idea what they are talking about....I'm sorry for that......I apologize. I agree that I mix up what I'm trying to say here on the forums and it mostly comes out wrong....I'm trying man... But to constantly bash me over it is very f*cked up...

Don't worry about it, man. All is forgotten.

Vordred
08-24-2017, 09:02 PM
Not trying to call you out, I'm sure your just doing your job, but these problems have existed since the day this character was put into the game and EVERY SINGLE DAY people point out these very same concerns and all we get is " We will look into that.". Truth is this character has been out for months now and he is the same as he was on launch day. Do you know how disheartening it is to constantly hear " We are working on it" with nothing else to show for it other than the same copy and paste reply? It gives many many people zero trust in the developers ability to balance this game. Not just with centurian either. Why is it that warden still has a 50/50? I can guarantee you nobody except warden mains think this is a balanced mechanic. Same with raider new rediculouse 50/50 That I saw posts BEFORE IT WAS EVEN IMPLIMENTED saying it was a terrible idea. Yet here we are... still waiting for them to undo that damage... Eventually you get to the point where you say **** it... they aren't listening. Then there is one less person in this ever declining player base... Sorry if this sounds personal, because it's not. I just don't want to see this game destroy itself before it even has a chance to shine and it's frustrating watching that happen.


well said i couldn't agree more.

after about a month of season 2, I quit playing and decided to come back for season 3, and really nothing has changed. the Cent is still the same. and now we have more unblockable's and pins with the new characters. really starting to think Ubi is intentionally trying to ruin all the fun of this game.

it such a shame, in terms of concept this is bar far my favorite game. and for years when it was fps shooter after fps shooter. I used to say I really hope someone does a Call of Duty: Medieval Warfare,

but the execution is not so good, and it doesn't feel like the devs are listening, as we seem to just be getting more and more of the stuff people have been complaining about.

Tyrjo
08-25-2017, 04:18 PM
I don't even know if the devs even said that "We will look into that." Maybe they said something about general hero balancing, but the never said they will look into Centurion balancing specifically. Correct me if I'm wrong.

D3dicatedSrv3rz
08-28-2017, 05:13 AM
Soooo dev's

https://media2.giphy.com/media/720g7C1jz13wI/giphy.gif

PDXGorechild
08-28-2017, 01:44 PM
@UBISOFT - After reading the concerns in this thread, countless others since release and piecing together what I think as a long time competitive gamer is wrong with Centurion, is it all boils down to THIS: A good Centurion can and will STUNLOCK you to half of your health or below as punishment for one mistake. Sure, I can avoid it sometimes, if i'm on form, wired and make ZERO mistakes. But one mistake - just one, means this class will, in the hands of somebody of skill and good game knowledge, make you suffer a 5 second cut scene where you will have no control over what is going on.

This is not only horrendously OVERPOWERED, it's BORING. This is sold as a fighting game, right? Which means players should only have their senses, wit and reflexes to rely on. You take away from this when you allow a class to disable somebody for such a huge length of time. It becomes more like an RPG, bringing to mind the painful days of getting stun-locked by rogues in world of Warcraft. At least that had guaranteed ways you could get out of it..

The bottom line is for anyone who doesn't play a Centurion, he has been an almost entirely negative experience for everyone. He's poorly designed from the ground up, and I honestly would rather just see him removed from the roster.

SikanderAzam
08-28-2017, 09:14 PM
I'm am still very confused at the notion that Centurion is 'balanced' in 1v1's. My main reasoning deals with the concept of punishment. For vanilla characters the outcome of the scenarios below are obvious and mostly uniform:

1. GB'd and thrown into a wall
2. Getting Parried
3. Getting exhausted


1./2. Usually a heavy of some sort follows a light or just a slower harder hitting heavy, if you're PK i believe three bleeds or two with the third being the deep gouge post heavy on a wall splatted opponent is the most punishing of being being on the receiving end of these scenarios though i could be wrong.

3. CGB, block, CGB, block, dodge unblockable parry bait feints

At this point your punishment ends. You recover from the situation with blocking or CGB-ing until you regain footing or return the favor with a parry yourself. This does not happen with Centurion. Parrying is the only source of stamina damage for many vanilla characters in the game and this is how it should be. This game was not built to handle such a mechanic being capitalized on so greatly. One parry deals a great deal or stamina damage as it is. To have a parry mixup exclusive to Centurion (and now gladiator) that can rob most heroes of more than 80% of their stamina and a kick that can deplete the rest (as well as the GB punches if you wrongly dodge an anticipated kick) border on the notion of balance but then to have the capability of keeping a hero's stamina depleted pushes this character way over the line IMO although that could be somewhat forgiven if like all characters his stamina eventually got depleted as well which does happen...

...in the hands of someone who doesn't yet know to draw out the punishment. In the hands of an expert he will never enter the state of exhaustion and you will never leave it lest the Centurion wills it.

And don't even get me started on the range, tracking, heavy quick feint 50/50 and wall pin issues as they deserve (or already have) their own thread.

The nerf of this character is long overdue but i expect the eyes of the dev's (as well as yours) are far more focused on what the new heroes are up to aren't they.

The devs will never admit that Centurion is broken. They've made it abundantly clear. But you're totally right that the reason he sucks is the punishment. If I miss miss one parry or whiff one thing, an experienced centurion has a guaranteed punishment that brings to to slightly less than 1 bar of health. In response to a single mistake. Less than one bar.

SikanderAzam
08-28-2017, 09:17 PM
@UBISOFT - After reading the concerns in this thread, countless others since release and piecing together what I think as a long time competitive gamer is wrong with Centurion, is it all boils down to THIS: A good Centurion can and will STUNLOCK you to half of your health or below as punishment for one mistake. Sure, I can avoid it sometimes, if i'm on form, wired and make ZERO mistakes. But one mistake - just one, means this class will, in the hands of somebody of skill and good game knowledge, make you suffer a 5 second cut scene where you will have no control over what is going on.

This is not only horrendously OVERPOWERED, it's BORING. This is sold as a fighting game, right? Which means players should only have their senses, wit and reflexes to rely on. You take away from this when you allow a class to disable somebody for such a huge length of time. It becomes more like an RPG, bringing to mind the painful days of getting stun-locked by rogues in world of Warcraft. At least that had guaranteed ways you could get out of it..

The bottom line is for anyone who doesn't play a Centurion, he has been an almost entirely negative experience for everyone. He's poorly designed from the ground up, and I honestly would rather just see him removed from the roster.

He's preposterously designed. I just don't fight centurions, because they just aren't fair. There's always going to be the kiddos that main him saying "git gud" because they like that he's over powered since it benefits them, but for everyone else he's made many many matches the exact opposite of fun. If there are more than 1 centurions on the enemy team, I just quit. I'd rather suffer 5 minutes of poorly designed matchmaking than 10 minutes of centurion related cutscenes.

Sekiro...
08-29-2017, 12:03 AM
@UBISOFT - After reading the concerns in this thread, countless others since release and piecing together what I think as a long time competitive gamer is wrong with Centurion, is it all boils down to THIS: A good Centurion can and will STUNLOCK you to half of your health or below as punishment for one mistake. Sure, I can avoid it sometimes, if i'm on form, wired and make ZERO mistakes. But one mistake - just one, means this class will, in the hands of somebody of skill and good game knowledge, make you suffer a 5 second cut scene where you will have no control over what is going on.

This is not only horrendously OVERPOWERED, it's BORING. This is sold as a fighting game, right? Which means players should only have their senses, wit and reflexes to rely on. You take away from this when you allow a class to disable somebody for such a huge length of time. It becomes more like an RPG, bringing to mind the painful days of getting stun-locked by rogues in world of Warcraft. At least that had guaranteed ways you could get out of it..

The bottom line is for anyone who doesn't play a Centurion, he has been an almost entirely negative experience for everyone. He's poorly designed from the ground up, and I honestly would rather just see him removed from the roster.

Someone from the STAFF, please hear the community, please say something.
The only players that defends Centurion are the ones that mains him.

Netcode_err_404
08-29-2017, 12:08 AM
Someone from the STAFF, please hear the community, please say something.
The only players that defends Centurion are the ones that mains him.

Which is ******ed, I main LB, but i recognize that the shove "mix up" after block, is totally ******ed, and needs to be fixed.

Antonioj26
08-29-2017, 12:11 AM
Someone from the STAFF, please hear the community, please say something.
The only players that defends Centurion are the ones that mains him.

You can add good players to the list of people who defend centurion since they recognize the only thing he has is his light parry punish and wall splat.

Netcode_err_404
08-29-2017, 12:21 AM
You can add good players to the list of people who defend centurion since they recognize the only thing he has is his light parry punish and wall splat.



Name me these good players.


His light parry punish and wall splat is still twice option than any non s tier vanillas.

Antonioj26
08-29-2017, 12:49 AM
Name me these good players.


His light parry punish and wall splat is still twice option than any non s tier vanillas.

Pretty much every competive player acknowledges that his punishes are the only thing that makes the character. I'm fully aware of how strong it is, it shouldn't be that strong but far more often than not that's not what people are complaining about. I've said my peace more than enough on these boards, I really don't even care anymore at this point. Like I said I don't even use him so doesn't effect me either way, I would do the same for any of the other characters that I don't play as long as I thought they were fine overall minus one or two things.

We.the.North
08-29-2017, 12:52 AM
Pretty much every competive player acknowledges that his punishes are the only thing that makes the character. I'm fully aware of how strong it is, it shouldn't be that strong but far more often than not that's not what people are complaining about. I've said my peace more than enough on these boards, I really don't even care anymore at this point. Like I said I don't even use him so doesn't effect me either way, I would do the same for any of the other characters that I don't play as long as I thought they were fine overall minus one or two things.

Defending something overpowered just because it's the only thing he has is just wrong.

You should agree wall splat is overpowered and like you said, it's the only thing in his kit, so you should at the same time ask the Dev to buff the other sides of his kit so he becomes a well rounded up character with many viable options.

Something I'd like to add, there was a poll recently made on For Honor Reddit. One of the questions was :" If you could remove one character from the game, which would it be ?" and 42% of the community voted Centurion. So there is something defenetely wrong with how "fun" the character is perceived to be.

Antonioj26
08-29-2017, 12:58 AM
Defending something overpowered just because it's the only thing he has is just wrong.

You should agree wall splat is overpowered and like you said, it's the only thing in his kit, so you should at the same time ask the Dev to buff the other sides of his kit so he becomes a well rounded up character with many viable options.

Something I'd like to add, there was a poll recently made on For Honor Reddit. One of the questions was :" If you could remove one character from the game, which would it be ?" and 42% of the community voted Centurion. So there is something defenetely wrong with how "fun" the character is perceived to be.

I already have said it should be removed, I'm not going to say it in every single post especially if I'm acknowledging how strong it is.

Avirex_Idyll
08-29-2017, 03:53 AM
What confuses me the most with cen is his label. He is classified as a "Hybrid: Hard", which from my understand means; "easy to learn, difficult to master". I feel like the cen is "easy to learn, done". there is nothing majorly hard to master about him. his 'go to' move is very simple, much like the warden and Ken, they have a simple move set that is easy to pick up and rather easy to counter. The cen does not share this.

I make this assessment from my time and a Nobushi main. She is easy to learn the basics, but if i want to be any sort of challenge, i have to really work on her to master her abilities. As of now, i don't see cen fitting this idea.

If anything needs to be adjusted, i believe the cost of their unblockables, they can do 8 unblockables before running out of stamina, requiring only 4 to connect to complete drain their opponent of all stamina. Less would be required to connect if any other moves land. My nobushi can only do 4 unblockables and all must hit to drain the stamina. If the cen is a "Hybrid: Hard" then he should require some work to master, not something that anyone can pick up and start stopping people with. Just my .02

Mia.Nora
08-29-2017, 04:14 AM
What confuses me the most with cen is his label. He is classified as a "Hybrid: Hard", which from my understand means; "easy to learn, difficult to master". I feel like the cen is "easy to learn, done". there is nothing majorly hard to master about him. his 'go to' move is very simple, much like the warden and Ken, they have a simple move set that is easy to pick up and rather easy to counter. The cen does not share this.

I make this assessment from my time and a Nobushi main. She is easy to learn the basics, but if i want to be any sort of challenge, i have to really work on her to master her abilities. As of now, i don't see cen fitting this idea.

If anything needs to be adjusted, i believe the cost of their unblockables, they can do 8 unblockables before running out of stamina, requiring only 4 to connect to complete drain their opponent of all stamina. Less would be required to connect if any other moves land. My nobushi can only do 4 unblockables and all must hit to drain the stamina. If the cen is a "Hybrid: Hard" then he should require some work to master, not something that anyone can pick up and start stopping people with. Just my .02

Tournament was a very clear show of that too. Bandanaa picked Centurion just 3 weeks before finals, and he went on a 16 round win streak against players who have not only been using characters they have mastered for months, but also abusing all sorts of exploits. And bandanaa didn't even need to use any exploits at all to wipe the floor with them.

Several problems with Centurion are;

1. Too much stamina, he shouldn't go as long as he can. And to top it off he has corner cheese that lets him go on as long as he has stamina.

2. Too strong parry punish, too strong wall punish.

3. His heavy mixups are way too safe. You can not afford to attempt to parry or deflect against a good centurion going for this mixup;
- fast heavy
- heavy > soft GB
- semi charged heavy
- semi-charged heavy > soft GB
- almost full charged heavy > soft GB (which shows unblockable icon and orange flash on enemy screen!!!)
- full charged unblockable

They just get to pressure you so much more risk free than any other class can. They need to change his soft GB and LIMIT to startup only. Every centurion I duelled exploits almost charged heavy into soft GB. At that time you see the orange flash and unblockable icon, and choose to either risk soft GB or eating 65 damage.

Sekiro...
08-29-2017, 04:15 AM
Which is ******ed, I main LB, but i recognize that the shove "mix up" after block, is totally ******ed, and needs to be fixed.
Indeed.

We.the.North
08-29-2017, 07:17 AM
Pretty sure everything that had to be said as been said in the 220+ posts. Hopefully they talk about it a little in the next Warrior's Den.

Aarpian
08-29-2017, 11:07 AM
Defending something overpowered just because it's the only thing he has is just wrong.

You should agree wall splat is overpowered and like you said, it's the only thing in his kit, so you should at the same time ask the Dev to buff the other sides of his kit so he becomes a well rounded up character with many viable options.

Something I'd like to add, there was a poll recently made on For Honor Reddit. One of the questions was :" If you could remove one character from the game, which would it be ?" and 42% of the community voted Centurion. So there is something defenetely wrong with how "fun" the character is perceived to be.

That is LITERALLY exactly what every competitive player has been saying since forever. All you babies are crying for nerfs when he's already mediocre, because you play like *** and cry when the noob stomper stomps noobs. What he actually needs is power shifting in his kit away from rewarding defense so heavily (like everything else in this game).


Name one
I could literally go into discord right now and have every competitive player who ever played this game say the same thing.

Kaijudub
08-29-2017, 11:14 AM
I could literally go into discord right now and have every competitive player who ever played this game say the same thing.

We'll wait.... take your time.

Alustar.
08-29-2017, 11:26 AM
You guys are still going on about this? I thought we would have settled by now that arguing over this is pointless, as if any real compromise will be achieved.

S.J.Lannister
08-29-2017, 11:33 AM
That is LITERALLY exactly what every competitive player has been saying since forever. All you babies are crying for nerfs when he's already mediocre, because you play like *** and cry when the noob stomper stomps noobs. What he actually needs is power shifting in his kit away from rewarding defense so heavily (like everything else in this game).


I could literally go into discord right now and have every competitive player who ever played this game say the same thing.

So you think that most people are noobs? Yes you do:

https://www.reddit.com/r/CompetitiveForHonor/comments/6w8iwm/for_honor_poll_for_pc_and_console_players/

41% people (301) would see Centurion Removed (console) and 41% people (236) would see Centurion Removed (PC). So 537 people think he is OP

Centurion is the only hero with such numbers in latest Reddit Poll. You can write your thoughts about noobs and noob stomper there.

Personally I think Centurion is Noob First Choice - easy mode. No effort required, just one mistake and maxed-out punish combo.

bananaflow2017
08-29-2017, 01:36 PM
So you think that most people are noobs? Yes you do:

https://www.reddit.com/r/CompetitiveForHonor/comments/6w8iwm/for_honor_poll_for_pc_and_console_players/

41% people (301) would see Centurion Removed (console) and 41% people (236) would see Centurion Removed (PC). So 537 people think he is OP

Centurion is the only hero with such numbers in latest Reddit Poll. You can write your thoughts about noobs and noob stomper there.

Personally I think Centurion is Noob First Choice - easy mode. No effort required, just one mistake and maxed-out punish combo.
Ähm thats true. Most people are noobs....
There is a huge difference between "most players" and the highest lets das 5%.
U will see this as soon as rankeds arrive.
Just look at other games like LoL.
Most people arent not playing Challenger/diamond Tier.....
And this is the difference.....
U cant compare a Hero performance through all skill levels.
I see this when im playing my valk.
When i play against noobs I'm just unstoppable. Against good players i can feel the huge disadvantage i have with my character...

Specialkha
08-29-2017, 02:56 PM
If ranked mode makes it to live, it will be an exploit/glitch fest anyway. A nice way to really see a player skill.

Sekiro...
08-29-2017, 10:17 PM
That is LITERALLY exactly what every competitive player has been saying since forever. All you babies are crying for nerfs when he's already mediocre, because you play like *** and cry when the noob stomper stomps noobs. What he actually needs is power shifting in his kit away from rewarding defense so heavily (like everything else in this game).


I could literally go into discord right now and have every competitive player who ever played this game say the same thing.

I got it, we are all noobs, I can take it.
But why the most of us complains about the same hero??

I mean, we are noobs like you said but even being noobs we can deal with all other heros.
:confused:

Antonioj26
08-29-2017, 10:21 PM
I got it, we are all noobs, I can take it.
But why the most of us complains about the same hero??

I mean, we are noobs like you said but even being noobs we can deal with all other heros.
:confused:

Don't worry, you'll find someone else to complain about after they nerf centurion. There will never be a time that there won't be a scapegoat for the average player, it's not in us as humans to face our own limitations. It's a lot easier to point the nerf bat at others than it is to just be better.

We.the.North
08-29-2017, 11:19 PM
Don't worry, you'll find someone else to complain about after they nerf centurion.

That's a stupid argument right there. Of course, people always will complain about the character that gives them the most problem. When 41% of the community thinks that one character is the Centurion, now there is a problem.

If we fix the Centurion, then maybe 25% will think the next big offender is the Warlord and 25% will think it's the Peacekeeper. That's fine. What's not, is when the whole community comes together to point the finger at a single character. >40%, there is a real problem.

Also, lets use some empathy for a second. Ubisoft is a game company and the way it makes money is by providing "fun" to its playerbase. We all want a balanced game and we all have our opinions about which character is OP and which isn't. At the very top of the competitive scene, we can see what's broken and what's not. But like Ubisoft Dev said many times, the competitive scene is not the only thing that matters when making balance changes. The overall perception of the whole community is also a deciding factor.

You might think Centurion is fine, but 41% of the community would remove Centurion from the game if they could Ban a single hero. He is the undisputed king of the salt mine and a real fun killer to this game ... to a lesser degree, he's killing the playerbase of future Ubisoft Games because of the sheer amount of WAITING players have to endure while the Centurion has still not been fixed in any meaningful way for a whole season.

brashtralas
08-29-2017, 11:20 PM
The condescension here is astounding. Haha

Antonioj26
08-29-2017, 11:42 PM
That's a stupid argument right there. Of course, people always will complain about the character that gives them the most problem. When 41% of the community thinks that one character is the Centurion, now there is a problem.

If we fix the Centurion, then maybe 25% will think the next big offender is the Warlord and 25% will think it's the Peacekeeper. That's fine. What's not, is when the whole community comes together to point the finger at a single character. >40%, there is a real problem.

Also, lets use some empathy for a second. Ubisoft is a game company and the way it makes money is by providing "fun" to its playerbase. We all want a balanced game and we all have our opinions about which character is OP and which isn't. At the very top of the competitive scene, we can see what's broken and what's not. But like Ubisoft Dev said many times, the competitive scene is not the only thing that matters when making balance changes. The overall perception of the whole community is also a deciding factor.

You might think Centurion is fine, but 41% of the community would remove Centurion from the game if they could Ban a single hero. He is the undisputed king of the salt mine and a real fun killer to this game ... to a lesser degree, he's killing the playerbase of future Ubisoft Games because of the sheer amount of WAITING players have to endure while the Centurion has still not been fixed in any meaningful way for a whole season.

And if centurion was removed than someone else would take that 41% top spot. Also the question was if you could remove one, not do you want to remove one so it doesn't even give you the option to say none. It also doesn't prove imbalance only that centurion is unpopular. Mei from overwatch is arguably the most hated character in terms of annoyance but I bet you won't find many that will label her as Overpowered. Like banana said the majority of players are noobs so of course they would rather have the easy way out and remove a character they have trouble with rather than getting better.

Sekiro...
08-30-2017, 12:31 AM
That's a stupid argument right there... Ubisoft is a game company and the way it makes money is by providing "fun" to its playerbase...

You right dude, provides fun is the most important thing for a game and fight centurion isnt fun.

It's so funny to see players posing as pro while defends a broken hero... if you are realy good you can be awesome with any of other 15 heros... but I have my doubts ab that.

Antonioj26
08-30-2017, 12:39 AM
You right dude, provides fun is the most important thing for a game and fight centurion isnt fun.

It's so funny to see players posing as pro while defends a broken hero... if you are realy good you can be awesome with any of other 15 heros... but I have my doubts ab that.

Yeah except I don't use centurion and neither do many of the people who see him as nothing more than a noob stomper. I defend berserker too even though I haven't touched him for more than five minutes.

UnblockableMeta
08-30-2017, 04:13 AM
Tournament was a very clear show of that too. Bandanaa picked Centurion just 3 weeks before finals, and he went on a 16 round win streak against players who have not only been using characters they have mastered for months, but also abusing all sorts of exploits. And bandanaa didn't even need to use any exploits at all to wipe the floor with them.

Several problems with Centurion are;

1. Too much stamina, he shouldn't go as long as he can. And to top it off he has corner cheese that lets him go on as long as he has stamina.

2. Too strong parry punish, too strong wall punish.

3. His heavy mixups are way too safe. You can not afford to attempt to parry or deflect against a good centurion going for this mixup;
- fast heavy
- heavy > soft GB
- semi charged heavy
- semi-charged heavy > soft GB
- almost full charged heavy > soft GB (which shows unblockable icon and orange flash on enemy screen!!!)
- full charged unblockable

They just get to pressure you so much more risk free than any other class can. They need to change his soft GB and LIMIT to startup only. Every centurion I duelled exploits almost charged heavy into soft GB. At that time you see the orange flash and unblockable icon, and choose to either risk soft GB or eating 65 damage.

WOW! I did not realize that his heavy variation kit was so excessive. To have a few 50/50's is enough when some vanilla characters don't but to also have that many different types of just one 50/50 is gross.

Antonioj26
08-30-2017, 04:23 AM
WOW! I did not realize that his heavy variation kit was so excessive. To have a few 50/50's is enough when some vanilla characters don't but to also have that many different types of just one 50/50 is gross.

This doesn't happen, you can't cancel once it's unblockable.

UnblockableMeta
08-30-2017, 04:31 AM
This doesn't happen, you can't cancel once it's unblockable.

I have seen the yellow flash multiple times and its the scariest variation. I can't explain how its done because i refuse to play him but it is possible.

Antonioj26
08-30-2017, 04:34 AM
I have seen the yellow flash multiple times and its the scariest variation. I can't explain how its done because i refuse to play him but it is possible.

If you've seen it why did you just say you didn't know he could do it? Doesn't make a ton of sense friend.

UnblockableMeta
08-30-2017, 04:41 AM
If you've seen it why did you just say you didn't know he could do it? Doesn't make a ton of sense friend.

Don't know 'how' but i know it exists. Now you're confusing me

Antonioj26
08-30-2017, 04:53 AM
Don't know 'how' but i know it exists. Now you're confusing me

nevermind..... point is I've yet to see any proof of this or heard of some special tech that allows you to soft feint an unblockable. I would think something with that much mixup potential would be much more common knowledge so until I see proof I call BS. It's just another dumb rumor that gets spread like wildfire with no sort of proof like the one about getting 90 damage off of a light parry when it's actually 75.

UnblockableMeta
08-30-2017, 05:08 AM
nevermind..... point is I've yet to see any proof of this or heard of some special tech that allows you to soft feint an unblockable. I would think something with that much mixup potential would be much more common knowledge so until I see proof I call BS. It's just another dumb rumor that gets spread like wildfire with no sort of proof like the one about getting 90 damage off of a light parry when it's actually 75.

From what i've seen i dont think its an intentional technique like counter-striking a counter-strike with 2 wardens or when knockdown by a cent he charges a heavy and re-unbalances you instead of the stupid animation taking place but it is possible though i will admit i am unable to provide any proof.

Antonioj26
08-30-2017, 05:13 AM
From what i've seen i dont think its an intentional technique like counter-striking a counter-strike with 2 wardens or when knockdown by a cent he charges a heavy and re-unbalances you instead of the stupid animation taking place but it is possible though i will admit i am unable to provide any proof.

There's another lie right there, 2 wardens can't crushing counter strike eachother. Got anymore? I don't understand what you mean with regards to the centurion knockdown portion of your post.

UnblockableMeta
08-30-2017, 05:38 AM
There's another lie right there, 2 wardens can't crushing counter strike eachother. Got anymore? I don't understand what you mean with regards to the centurion knockdown portion of your post.

You're so confident these things don't exist because you haven't encountered them. The window for opportunity is small but a crushing counter strike can be countered with a crushing counter strike. I've never had the reflexes to do it but ive parried it before, admittedly once.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ppUJlqWR36Y 11:24

not me but you get the idea.

Antonioj26
08-30-2017, 05:54 AM
You're so confident these things don't exist because you haven't encountered them. The window for opportunity is small but a crushing counter strike can be countered with a crushing counter strike. I've never had the reflexes to do it but ive parried it before, admittedly once.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ppUJlqWR36Y 11:24

not me but you get the idea.

Oh that Warden looks strangely like an Orochi, and that crushing counter strike looks strangely like a parry, guess I need to get my eyes checked. Thanks for showing me the proof :rolleyes:

UnblockableMeta
08-30-2017, 06:03 AM
There's another lie right there, 2 wardens can't crushing counter strike eachother. Got anymore? I don't understand what you mean with regards to the centurion knockdown portion of your post.

And the centurion comment was related to intention. I have been unbalanced and on the floor and expecting the jumping stab 5 second animation but instead was met with an unblockable charged heavy and a charged punched that re-unbalanced me to the floor... and then the 5 second animation.

UnblockableMeta
08-30-2017, 06:07 AM
Oh that Warden looks strangely like an Orochi, and that crushing counter strike looks strangely like a parry, guess I need to get my eyes checked. Thanks for showing me the proof :rolleyes:

Then explain to me the logic of why if the counter strike can be parried it can't counter itself...

and i specifically said in my comment earlier that it can be parried (backed up with video evidence) which by the rules of the game should mean that like any other attack itself being a counter strike can be counter strike'd. I really hop you're trolling or you might actually need your eyes checked or at least relearn English a bit

Antonioj26
08-30-2017, 06:08 AM
And the centurion comment was related to intention. I have been unbalanced and on the floor and expecting the jumping stab 5 second animation but instead was met with an unblockable charged heavy and a charged punched that re-unbalanced me to the floor... and then the 5 second animation.

To bring out the unblockable heavy that would require the centurion to whiff the first heavy and then fully charge the second before you had time to get up, and there isn't enough time to get this off while you are on the ground. You would be able to parry it.

Antonioj26
08-30-2017, 06:10 AM
Then explain to me the logic of why if the counter strike can be parried it can't counter itself

Only assassins can parry wardens crushing counter strike. Last I checked warden isn't an assassin.

UnblockableMeta
08-30-2017, 06:14 AM
Only assassins can parry wardens crushing counter strike. Last I checked warden isn't an assassin.

Still doesn't provide damning evidence that a counter-strike can't counter a counter-strike

UnblockableMeta
08-30-2017, 06:16 AM
To bring out the unblockable heavy that would require the centurion to whiff the first heavy and then fully charge the second before you had time to get up, and there isn't enough time to get this off while you are on the ground. You would be able to parry it.

Still doesn't stop cent.s from (by accident most likely) from double re-balancing their opponents

Antonioj26
08-30-2017, 06:18 AM
Still doesn't provide damning evidence that a counter-strike can't counter a counter-strike

You are the one making a claim that it can happen so show it. Shouldn't be that hard to find someone doing it or just replicate it yourself, y'know unless of course you are lying.

Antonioj26
08-30-2017, 06:20 AM
Still doesn't stop cent.s from (by accident most likely) from double re-balancing their opponents

Yeah because their opponents suck, has nothing to do with confirmed damage so no point in bringing it up.

Mia.Nora
08-30-2017, 06:26 AM
I don't understand why you guys bother argueing with Anotnioj, he directly admitted defending centurion just because there are so many people hate it and he wanted to be its defender. He even openly refused to acknowledge logical arguments about why it is broken, and told he had the right to wrongfully support it even when he is wrong and that was fair, because a lot of people dissed centurion with wrong comments.

At this point he not any different then a guy at Discussion Club arguing that yogurt is black. Just move on, even he knows that Centurion is broken.

He knows how broken Centurion's parry punish is, as well as wall splat combo. And when confronted with other things that are valid he refers back to his right to defend centurion with false claims because people do the same to diss it.

If Antonoj, you would like to reply; here is the list of things that are utterly broken with Centurion in current meta;

in 1v1;

1. Parry Punish

2. Wall Punish

3. Corner infinite cheese with enough stamina to 100 > 0 half the rooster

4. Exploit for soft GB near unblockable charged that pops unblockable icon and orange flash on enemy screen

5. Safe heavy mixup pressure that can't be risked to parried/deflected vs a good centurion with;
- quick heavy
- heavy > soft GB
- semi-charged heavy
- semi-charged heavy > soft GB
- exploit at #4
- full charged unblockable heavy

Against above pressure all you can do is block and wait to return to neutral. No other class has that kind of safe pressure.


in 4v4;

Whiffed heavy into unblockable tracking charged heavy that does 65 damage and 6 second FULL stunlock that allows everyone to spam attacks on you without breaking stun. Same attack can come from off screen, it ignores all line of sight limitations and obstacles. There is no correct positioning vs a Centurion gank (exclusive property to cent).



Also you talked about how he would be hurt by defensive meta changes. You clearly did not play test servers. All characters lose GB after parry, not just Centurion; but unlike other characters who has nothing to compensate for it, Centurion has a confirmed parry combo that gets you OOS in one parry unless you were already full stam. And then he just goes for unblockable heavy/soft GB mixup since in defensive meta test there was no parry in OOS. He was way more stronger in comparison to other heroes.

Anyhow. For everyone else who are discussing, there is no need to argue him; since for him it more like a discussion game not a real argument.

Krob75
08-30-2017, 06:27 AM
Way OP

UnblockableMeta
08-30-2017, 06:28 AM
You are the one making a claim that it can happen so show it. Shouldn't be that hard to find someone doing it or just replicate it yourself, y'know unless of course you are lying.

I dont feel like learning capture software and how to edit and upload a video at 1AM especially when i'm in college with many beers to distract my from the books i should be concerned with. At best my statement is plausible but to dismiss based on nothing but disbelief i think is ******ed of you. Its a rare occurrence much like the dev's looking at this forum but it does happen.

Antonioj26
08-30-2017, 06:41 AM
I don't understand why you guys bother argueing with Anotnioj, he directly admitted defending centurion just because there are so many people hate it and he wanted to be its defender. He even openly refused to acknowledge logical arguments about why it is broken, and told he had the right to wrongfully support it even when he is wrong and that was fair, because a lot of people dissed centurion with wrong comments.

At this point he not any different then a guy at Discussion Club arguing that yogurt is black. Just move on, even he knows that Centurion is broken.

He knows how broken Centurion's parry punish is, as well as wall splat combo. And when confronted with other things that are valid he refers back to his right to defend centurion with false claims because people do the same to diss it.

If Antonoj, you would like to reply; here is the list of things that are utterly broken with Centurion in current meta;

in 1v1;

1. Parry Punish

2. Wall Punish

3. Corner infinite cheese with enough stamina to 100 > 0 half the rooster

4. Exploit for soft GB near unblockable charged that pops unblockable icon and orange flash on enemy screen

5. Safe heavy mixup pressure that can't be risked to parried/deflected vs a good centurion with;
- quick heavy
- heavy > soft GB
- semi-charged heavy
- semi-charged heavy > soft GB
- exploit at #4
- full charged unblockable heavy

Against above pressure all you can do is block and wait to return to neutral. No other class has that kind of safe pressure.


in 4v4;

Whiffed heavy into unblockable tracking charged heavy that does 65 damage and 6 second FULL stunlock that allows everyone to spam attacks on you without breaking stun. Same attack can come from off screen, it ignores all line of sight limitations and obstacles. There is no correct positioning vs a Centurion gank (exclusive property to cent).



Also you talked about how he would be hurt by defensive meta changes. You clearly did not play test servers. All characters lose GB after parry, not just Centurion; but unlike other characters who has nothing to compensate for it, Centurion has a confirmed parry combo that gets you OOS in one parry unless you were already full stam. And then he just goes for unblockable heavy/soft GB setup since in defensive meta test there was no parry in OOS. He was way more stronger in comparison to other heroes.

Anyhow. For everyone else who are discussing, there is no need to argue him; since for him it more like a discussion game not a real argument.

Oh look another liar. Sorry friend but that's not what I said. I'll respond to the things you've said are broken.

1. Agreed and have said this since day 1

2. Agreed and have said this since day 1

3. Agreed and have said this since day 1

4. Never encountered it, never seen it, never heard it, call BS but if real sure maybe I guess. Would have to see how it's done, because the unblockable is so slow that I can see it still being easily dodgeable.

5. Pressure that's easily countered by blocking you mean, right? Show me proof of 4 and you may have a point but again sounds like more lies.

So to sum up everything he's got a good light parry punish and a good wall splat, that's it.

Don't care about 4s since I've made no claims about how good or bad he is there so no point in arguing that.

You're right I didn't play the pts since I'm on PlayStation but like I said the only thing that makes him any good is his light parry punish and his wall stun. They are taking away one and making the other more difficult. true he has his parry combo and that does seem like it will be effective to some degree but all it's going to give is 25 confirmed damage. OOS state does seem like it may be a bad position to be in but honestly not a whole lot centurion can do from here, just the same crappy mixups he has before. Sure he will score some chip damage on you while regaining your stam but not enough to break him. 25 confirmed damage oppose to 75-100 seems like a pretty good nerf to me.

Antonioj26
08-30-2017, 06:43 AM
I dont feel like learning capture software and how to edit and upload a video at 1AM especially when i'm in college with many beers to distract my from the books i should be concerned with. At best my statement is plausible but to dismiss based on nothing but disbelief i think is ******ed of you. Its a rare occurrence much like the dev's looking at this forum but it does happen.

I'm dismissing it because it's BS. You are straight up lying for some dumb reason. Warden can't crushing counterstrike another warden, we would have seen it already in videos but you can't find one because it can't happen. Like I said only assassins have the ability to parry the crushing counter strike because of their reflex guard, does warden have reflex guard? No so stop lying.

Mia.Nora
08-30-2017, 06:53 AM
Oh look another liar. Sorry friend but that's not what I said. I'll respond to the things you've said are broken.

1. Agreed and have said this since day 1

2. Agreed and have said this since day 1

3. Agreed and have said this since day 1

4. Never encountered it, never seen it, never heard it, call BS but if real sure maybe I guess. Would have to see how it's done, because the unblockable is so slow that I can see it still being easily dodgeable.

5. Pressure that's easily countered by blocking you mean, right? Show me proof of 4 and you may have a point but again sounds like more lies.

So to sum up everything he's got a good light parry punish and a good wall splat, that's it.

Don't care about 4s since I've made no claims about how good or bad he is there so no point in arguing that.

You're right I didn't play the pts since I'm on PlayStation but like I said the only thing that makes him any good is his light parry punish and his wall stun. They are taking away one and making the other more difficult. true he has his parry combo and that does seem like it will be effective to some degree but all it's going to give is 25 confirmed damage. OOS state does seem like it may be a bad position to be in but honestly not a whole lot centurion can do from here, just the same crappy mixups he has before. Sure he will score some chip damage on you while regaining your stam but not enough to break him. 25 confirmed damage oppose to 75-100 seems like a pretty good nerf to me.

Lol, calling me liar. I could dig up your post history to prove that you said yourself, but wont bother feeding the troll.

#1 to 3 agreed.

#4 exists. It has been brought up several times, even with video proof. It is not my fault if you are oblivious to the state of game. You are total ********ting if you say you can dodge it. Especially since it GBs while displaying unblockable icon.

#5 countered? Chip damage is already in the game, what counter? He gets to chip damage you with risk free pressure.


And you not caring about 4v4 is not an excuse for all the ******** he causes in there. Because most people who hate centurion is due to how much he ruined 4v4s.

On PTR topic, I am not argueing with someone who didn't even test it, where centurion gets to spam risk free unblockables with parry punish being taken out from opponents, and gets to either GB or land unblockable in OOS by a simple heavy>charged heavy mixup.

Anyway I don't even know why I bother replying to you. Keep saying that yogurt is black. Obviously you think saying it enough times will make it so.

Antonioj26
08-30-2017, 07:05 AM
Lol, calling me liar. I could dig up your post history to prove that you said yourself, but wont bother feeding the troll.

#1 to 3 agreed.

#4 exists. It has been brought up several times, even with video proof. It is not my fault if you are oblivious to the state of game. You are total ********ting if you say you can dodge it. Especially since it GBs while displaying unblockable icon.

#5 countered? Chip damage is already in the game, what counter? He gets to chip damage you with risk free pressure.


And you not caring about 4v4 is not an excuse for all the ******** he causes in there. Because most people who hate centurion is due to how much he ruined 4v4s.

On PTR topic, I am not argueing with someone who didn't even test it, where centurion gets to spam risk free unblockables with parry punish being taken out from opponents, and gets to either GB or land unblockable in OOS by a simple heavy>charged heavy mixup.

Anyway I don't even know why I bother replying to you. Keep saying that yogurt is black. Obviously you think saying it enough times will make it so.

#4 meant to say parry I'm getting pretty sleepy over here. Like I said should be pretty easy to find if it's really a problem, I even did some leg work to try and find it and can't find a single video.

#5 4.5 damage per heavy blocked is garbage. Far better characters with safer options for more damage.

Yeah and I've never argued his position in 4s so no point in bringing it up to counter my arguments.

Can't parry while oos but you can dodge it when he turns orange, don't see the problem.

Camemberto
08-30-2017, 08:25 AM
As somewhat of a mediocre player / noob (rep 5 total) this is what I have to say:

I am fairly competent against any other class in the game, but the centurion just takes the fun out of the game.. especially for us "noobs".
Every time I read a comment defending the centurion, that says:"just block this, parry that, dodge that, counterguardbreak this. It's easy af" I'm like: What the hell dude, I'm not some godlike tournament player. I will **** up. Regularly. And I'm fine with that. That's part of the game, nay... part of being human.

The point is, fighting centurions is not fun. At all. Because if I do **** up, which everyone eventually will, I am immediately cutscened to death. This doesn't happen with any other character in the game. I can **** up against ANY other character and be ok with it.

Centurion widens the skill gap.
Any top tier player will win against a mediocre Centurion. You don't have to argue here...
But any mediocre player will get wrecked by a noob Centurion.

Fights against centurions are typically one sided. Either you're lucky and get some spam hits on him, hoping he doesn't react fast enough. Or he does, and you put down the controller, because there is absolutely no way (for an average player) to defend themselves. Kill or die. No inbetween, no tension, no excitement, no skill, just frustration and saltyness.

Tyrjo
08-30-2017, 09:39 AM
On PTR topic, I am not argueing with someone who didn't even test it, where centurion gets to spam risk free unblockables with parry punish being taken out from opponents, and gets to either GB or land unblockable in OOS by a simple heavy>charged heavy mixup.


For Centurions guard breaks aren't hard to come by anyways. Either the opponent block a heavy, get a stun, lose their UI and miss the CGB. Or you get soft feinted and GB.