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View Full Version : Devs dont nerf centerion



A4einboy
07-14-2017, 12:26 AM
Dont listen to players that come here saying cent is op because its the oppiste and they dont want to take the time to learn how to beat him. I use him alot in 1v1 and hes horrible he only has 4 bars of health and you could never get a fully charged heavy on anyone . How is cent op but lawbringer gets a free bash off of a block that means lawbringer dosent have to do anything but wait to block . Acctully cent needs a buff because the recovery from a missed timed kick is crazy . You guys need to work on conectivity right now and stop catering to nerfs and buffs listen to everyone not just the people that want nerfs and buffs . Most people left because of the error codes leave the heros alone

Existentialmeme
07-14-2017, 12:40 AM
Most people on here complains about Centurion in 4v4 and not 1v1......

The_B0G_
07-14-2017, 12:45 AM
LB bash doesn't do any damage, and the followup light can be dodged... not really the same thing.

People realize his 1v1 game isn't really anything special, unless he's a turtle, then his punish is kind of crazy, one mistake and you're down 4 bars of health.

Most people have issues with his 4v4 impact, 1v2 is hard no matter what, throw a Cent in there an it becomes nearly impossible to win. That's why they are taking so long to nerf him, they want to tone down his unlimited unblockables in 4v4 mode without ruining him in 1v1.

DimmerScroll021
07-14-2017, 01:03 AM
Most people on here complains about Centurion in 4v4 and not 1v1......

The punch landing through revenge alone is a call for adjustment. Activating revenge is a game mechanic and no one class should be able to break that kind of mechanic as it's used to fight when odds are > 1v1. This sort of an adjustment is also geared toward 4v4 and not 1v1 as revenge is a bit harder to get in 1v1. If centurion isn't broken then everyone should be able to hit through the activation of revenge. Lawbringer shouldn't be able to do it either. Or everyone should be able to do it, this isn't a class specific mechanic that is detailed out in the characters moveset, so it shouldn't be a thing.

Yes, centurions need to be adjusted down to scale out the pin lock that players face right now in 4v4. And as Roman has stated, the adjustment is only being applied when there are more than one centurion in a match to keep people from blatantly exploiting the game and ruining other people's experience. If it were me they would have had their charged heavy stamina cost adjusted as well to apply max charge stamina penalty on feint just like every other class. As it stands the centurion can feint their charged heavy 16 times which is close to three times higher than any other character in the game, the most being 6 from berserker. This gives the centurion a very clear advantage when it comes to mind game tactics, baiting out mistakes, and punishing their opponent unreasonably hard given then have other tools to force offense such as their true unblockables (kick) and their variable timings which only a handful of classes has (warden SB, Valkyrie shield bash, shinobi charged heavy, and conqueror flail and shield bash come to mind) this makes the class unnecessarily strong in 4v4 and compounds with every additional centurion that is on the same team. 1v1 he's has a lot of tools and they aren't touching those, just 4v4 to stop the ganking madness.

Antonioj26
07-14-2017, 01:10 AM
The punch landing through revenge alone is a call for adjustment. Activating revenge is a game mechanic and no one class should be able to break that kind of mechanic as it's used to fight when odds are > 1v1. This sort of an adjustment is also geared toward 4v4 and not 1v1 as revenge is a bit harder to get in 1v1. If centurion isn't broken then everyone should be able to hit through the activation of revenge. Lawbringer shouldn't be able to do it either. Or everyone should be able to do it, this isn't a class specific mechanic that is detailed out in the characters moveset, so it shouldn't be a thing.

Yes, centurions need to be adjusted down to scale out the pin lock that players face right now in 4v4. And as Roman has stated, the adjustment is only being applied when there are more than one centurion in a match to keep people from blatantly exploiting the game and ruining other people's experience. If it were me they would have had their charged heavy stamina cost adjusted as well to apply max charge stamina penalty on feint just like every other class. As it stands the centurion can feint their charged heavy 16 times which is close to three times higher than any other character in the game, the most being 6 from berserker. This gives the centurion a very clear advantage when it comes to mind game tactics, baiting out mistakes, and punishing their opponent unreasonably hard given then have other tools to force offense such as their true unblockables (kick) and their variable timings which only a handful of classes has (warden SB, Valkyrie shield bash, shinobi charged heavy, and conqueror flail and shield bash come to mind) this makes the class unnecessarily strong in 4v4 and compounds with every additional centurion that is on the same team. 1v1 he's has a lot of tools and they aren't touching those, just 4v4 to stop the ganking madness.

Similar attacks to the jab (headbutt, shield bash, shove, etc.) go through revenge activation, why should it be any different for cent? His charged heavy should be parried but his jab shouldn't react any different than the other attacks I listed above.

brashtralas
07-14-2017, 01:16 AM
Let's just make believe that the centurion isn't in any way imbalanced at all. He's 100% balanced.

He's still not fun to fight against. He's annoying and changes the whole game to dodge, dodge, dodge.. oops! You're near a wall. Now you're dead.

What's that? Go on the offensive? Well, I can't. I don't have any stamina.

He's simply not fun.

RenegadeRasta
07-14-2017, 01:44 AM
Centurion is getting nerfed. Get rekt.

Xb1MasterNoctis
07-14-2017, 02:39 AM
I don't even play him i main the Orochi centurion doesn't need a nerf people just need to get good.

DimmerScroll021
07-14-2017, 03:23 AM
Similar attacks to the jab (headbutt, shield bash, shove, etc.) go through revenge activation, why should it be any different for cent? His charged heavy should be parried but his jab shouldn't react any different than the other attacks I listed above.

And as I had stated in the original post, none of these should beat revenge. Revenge states that attacks are auto parried on activation. It doesn't state "only light and heavy attacks are parried" the guardbreak button is being utilized as an attack in all of those scenarios. Shoulder bash, shield bash, jab, kick, it doesn't matter. Here's a better comparison, why is it that a Valkyrie sweep, a Kensei top heavy unblockable, raider unblockable, and shugoki unblockable all get auto parried and they get knocked down? Because, they are attacks and should be by the words stated within the game as to what revenge does. Either make all unblockables go through revenge and essentially get rid of the mechanic, or do what it says it should do and parry the attacks regardless of if the attack is thrown with the light, heavy or guardbreak button because as it stands the words in every characters hero specific traits is blatantly false and when faced with a two on one situation when someone hits it and should feel like they get a second to breathe, they aren't plowed into the ground by an attack that they believed should not have hit them.

bmason1000
07-14-2017, 03:32 AM
And as I had stated in the original post, none of these should beat revenge. Revenge states that attacks are auto parried on activation. It doesn't state "only light and heavy attacks are parried" the guardbreak button is being utilized as an attack in all of those scenarios. Shoulder bash, shield bash, jab, kick, it doesn't matter. Here's a better comparison, why is it that a Valkyrie sweep, a Kensei top heavy unblockable, raider unblockable, and shugoki unblockable all get auto parried and they get knocked down? Because, they are attacks and should be by the words stated within the game as to what revenge does. Either make all unblockables go through revenge and essentially get rid of the mechanic, or do what it says it should do and parry the attacks regardless of if the attack is thrown with the light, heavy or guardbreak button because as it stands the words in every characters hero specific traits is blatantly false and when faced with a two on one situation when someone hits it and should feel like they get a second to breathe, they aren't plowed into the ground by an attack that they believed should not have hit them.
But all of those attacks are unparryable. That's why revenge doesn't activation doesn't parry them. What the description should say is "auto parries all attacks that can be parried normally."

brashtralas
07-14-2017, 03:51 AM
May as well say "Devs, continue to enrage and alienate your player base!"

Let's get real, people.

TheTKOShow
07-14-2017, 04:24 AM
He is too strong. The jab knock out needs to take a chill. Especially when in revenge, like why should that be able to knock me down in revenge. Knock back fine but down, come on. The light grab and throw would be fair. If it was just a push back and not directional, a lot of environment deaths to that one. His stam pool is ridiculous. I mean how was the kick or jab not needed yet. And yes some people are ******ed when encountering a cent, but his parry timer is a little funky with the charge heavy to guard break looming, like wtf, give that to the shigoki and the world would just ignite in flames

Archangel0818
07-14-2017, 06:39 AM
Anybody who comes on here and says just "git gud" against centurion is someone who runs around in a pack of them. First he has way to many tracking attacks, second he can gb, use any unblockable and heavy after heavy after heavy and never drop below half stamina, but one hit and he will completely drain all other characters stamina to 0. raise his stamina cost and it wouldn't be so bad. Yes he is definitely beatable in a 1v1 but add any other character to a 1v2 and that's death almost instantly. As for these groups that run around in a 4v4 with 4 centurion and act like they are the greatest players on the face of the earth....... >1 centurion is a broken op tactic and that's just the honest truth

Ubi-Swaguchi
07-14-2017, 10:05 AM
The team never looks to nerf characters. They look to balance them :)

Dude_of_Valor
07-14-2017, 10:18 AM
Let's just make believe that the centurion isn't in any way imbalanced at all. He's 100% balanced.

He's still not fun to fight against. He's annoying and changes the whole game to dodge, dodge, dodge.. oops! You're near a wall. Now you're dead.

What's that? Go on the offensive? Well, I can't. I don't have any stamina.

He's simply not fun.

This ^^^

Lyskir
07-14-2017, 10:30 AM
Cent need a nerf on his stamina bar and his crazy inpact on the revenge status, 1 cent is enough to completly shut down revenge

I have defended him a bit before but I have played a bit 4v4(im a duel/bawl player) I understand the complaints, every time a centurion intervenes in a fight you can stop immediately since you just can not move anymore...its super frustrating and thats why i stick to 1v1 or 2v2^^

vgrimr_J
07-14-2017, 10:42 AM
no brainer that should have been done long ago in title update or hotfix is to lower his stamina pool alot.

Lyskir
07-14-2017, 11:34 AM
no brainer that should have been done long ago in title update or hotfix is to lower his stamina pool alot.

agree

Vingrask
07-14-2017, 11:54 AM
I was playing Shinobi, dueling, yesterday, to see the patch.

A lot of Lawbringers. Annoying.

Then a Centurion.
Was hard, 2 mistakes and a round was lost.
2-2, last round, I was doing a lot of moves, trying connect the easy-counterable-super-punishble-shinobi's-chains. Suddenly, I don't remember if was a Parry or a GB, but I was caught near a wall. There was no other place to go, was where the fight evolved to. I was full health. Centurion had 10% HP. One Parry/GB. Just One. And I lost the entire round and match, helpless.

Centurion is fine.

DimmerScroll021
07-14-2017, 03:32 PM
no brainer that should have been done long ago in title update or hotfix is to lower his stamina pool alot.

It's not really the stamina pool that's the issue, it's the stamina consumption, particularly. I have submitted a bug report on it personally:

Submitted June 13th
Ticket number: 04860482

Ticket details:

YOUR MESSAGE
Currently due to the charged nature of these two characters heavy attacks, the attacks asses minimal to no stamina drain when feinted. All original 12 characters have their heavy attacks stamina assessment at the beginning of the movement (upon pressing R2 /trigger) and are able to feint at most 6 times depending on attack speed. Centurion and shinobi are able to both feint their heavy attacks no less than 16 times upon test, this is anywhere from 3-4 times the amount of an original character and places them at a significant competitive advantage over other characters.

I have tested using all side heavy attacks for all classes and due to the severity of the issue only required one test which I have uploaded to you tube and have placed the link below. Please address this issue as I believe this is clearly unintentional and should be fixed.

Here is the link to the test:

https://youtu.be/xmYQi2vmW-U

Thank you

vgrimr_J
07-14-2017, 07:52 PM
It's not really the stamina pool that's the issue, it's the stamina consumption, particularly. I have submitted a bug report on it personally:

Submitted June 13th
Ticket number: 04860482

Ticket details:

YOUR MESSAGE
Currently due to the charged nature of these two characters heavy attacks, the attacks asses minimal to no stamina drain when feinted. All original 12 characters have their heavy attacks stamina assessment at the beginning of the movement (upon pressing R2 /trigger) and are able to feint at most 6 times depending on attack speed. Centurion and shinobi are able to both feint their heavy attacks no less than 16 times upon test, this is anywhere from 3-4 times the amount of an original character and places them at a significant competitive advantage over other characters.

I have tested using all side heavy attacks for all classes and due to the severity of the issue only required one test which I have uploaded to you tube and have placed the link below. Please address this issue as I believe this is clearly unintentional and should be fixed.

Here is the link to the test:

https://youtu.be/xmYQi2vmW-U

Thank you

can 100% agree on this one. they said that they wont want to destroy him in 1v1 just lower the stamina pool OR increase the stamina cost of moves. can be done in hotfix or title update AGES AGO

Jarl.Felix
07-14-2017, 07:58 PM
Yeah, because holding right click and release gives you 4 bars health dmg . Neah, game is so balanced ! I know other class who can do this ... uhmm.. wait.. there is none !

I dont mind making centurion OP but make those noobs WORK for their dmg ! You do a mistake in front of a centurion and you loose 30 secs of almost perfect gameplaying with any other char.

THAT IS ALL ABOUT !

Blasto95
07-14-2017, 08:04 PM
Yeah, because holding right click and release gives you 4 bars health dmg . Neah, game is so balanced ! I know other class who can do this ... uhmm.. wait.. there is none !

I dont mind making centurion OP but make those noobs WORK for their dmg ! You do a mistake in front of a centurion and you loose 30 secs of almost perfect gameplaying with any other char.

THAT IS ALL ABOUT !

There's a thing called blocking....its pretty effective.
I dont want to blow your mind either, but theres another thing called a parry. Its really easy to do and any hero can do it!
You should try these techniques sometime, I heard they are near necessary to win a match.

Jarl.Felix
07-14-2017, 08:13 PM
There's a thing called blocking....its pretty effective.
I dont want to blow your mind either, but theres another thing called a parry. Its really easy to do and any hero can do it!
You should try these techniques sometime, I heard they are near necessary to win a match.

You're such an ignorant lol :)

Because in a same-skill level duel you will do zero mistake, you will block and parry 100% times, of course. You are a God and the enemy is a complete trash noob. Always :)) Centurion is just a dummy, git gud, block and parry :))

Let me explain you again : Centurion punish amount makes him having the upper edge when you duel him.

I play conqueror and warden. Do you think i can punish centurion with 4 health bars in a single go ?

kweassa1
07-14-2017, 08:21 PM
Seriously, only thing I want fixed nowadays is the goddarned "PIN". That, and maybe the amount of attack attempts he dishes out without suffering low stamina.


The rest is fine, be it 3 or 4 cents.

JibletHunter
07-14-2017, 08:43 PM
people who say that his unblockable heavy/charge heavy is "op" need to parry.

people who say kick/punch is "op" need to dodge.

people who say he's "op" in 4v4 need to not 1v4 enemies, because you simply won't win.

Usually character has the option of dodging, blocking, or parrying attacks.

His charged heavy has 3 variable timings which can be soft feinted into GB. Unless the cent is an idiot and fully charges EVERY TIME, parrying is a huge risk because of the variable timing and his ability to get a free gb if he is quick enough. The fact that you cant reliably dodge the attacks make it ever more imbalanced (although i am sure this is unintended: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vi9F36IMY40
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fZmfRLC2_x4
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lAU0tlcafoY
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xqJnOjcdrJM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2E9UJhBHxYE
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MguG22e0Oro
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L4J6aHgVfS8
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b1cX_jptIlQ
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jbRG81P4g2I
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c7l_mQewcGc

Don't fight 1v4. What about a 1v2? I guess No dominion for me,, .since 1v2's are pretty common (there being 3 points and 4 players). A 1v2 with a cent in the mix is very difficult to defend against, so you are either faced with giving up a point or dying? #balanced

The recommendations you give apply to all heroes. These are not centurion magic bullets. Where every other character you have many options against an attack, centurion generally gives much less option (which is why you differentiated between his punch/kick requiring dodges and his charged attack requiring a parry, because it will inexplicably track you if you dodge). I would love to see kensei have this kind of tracking on his top unblock-able.

Saying Parry and dodge is honestly disingenuous- If you parried and dodged everything in the game, you would never lose. Unfortunately we are humans (as can be seen by your stats - looks like you missed some parries) https://fhtracker.com/profile/xbox/GolfTwoEchoZulu I also noticed your second most played hero is centurion at almost 13 hour (with your third only having 4 hours).

Now that we have dismissed your disingenuous argument, we can take a look at how most high level cents actually play. They turtle. Even in dominion a cent can easily sit on a point and turtle OR gank incredibly effectively. If he chooses to sit on a point, all of the dodging and parrying in the world will not help you because he will simply stare at you. Throw out a light or a heavy (eve with feint)? On PC the frame-rate is such that is much easier to parry lights then consul. If I get a light parry with my 108 gear centurion (with hay maker active), I can get over 125 damage with heavy> knockdown> and zone unlock (whih cant be parried even when you get up . . .so that is out)

So essentially, his risk- reward ratio is much more favorable than any other character.. (1) He punishes you harder for mistakes then any other character is able to punish him (except beserker OOS punish . . . but good luck accessing that damage).(2) his attacks require a specific response because of their effectiveness, damage, and tracking where other characters usually have multiple viable responses to their attacks.

I understand it feels good to win in 4's. However this is not healthy for the state of the game. Even the staunch Cent defenders acknowledge he is a MASSIVE problem in 4's.

brashtralas
07-14-2017, 08:56 PM
There's a thing called blocking....its pretty effective.
I dont want to blow your mind either, but theres another thing called a parry. Its really easy to do and any hero can do it!
You should try these techniques sometime, I heard they are near necessary to win a match.

Now I know you don't play the game. Or you play centurion. You know what the one thing I barely ever do against a centurion is?

Block. So few of his moves are actually able to be "blocked" that it's an ineffective tactic. Simply put, of you just intend to block him, you're going to get impaled.

DimmerScroll021
07-14-2017, 10:11 PM
There's a thing called blocking....its pretty effective.
I dont want to blow your mind either, but theres another thing called a parry. Its really easy to do and any hero can do it!
You should try these techniques sometime, I heard they are near necessary to win a match.

Blocking is putting you right in a centurions hands. Kick and jab are both unblockable and widely overused, it's part of his kit and while I agree they should stun, the knockdown on OOS pushes them into a unbalanced state given the amount of stamina drain each one takes off their opponent, and given that neither can be parried you parry tactic is worthless. That leaves dodge as the only counter measure for these two moves and given that a centurion can bait out a dodge with a charged heavy, feint which uses next to no stamina and then go into a kick, jab, charged heavy, or guard break with almost full stamina (see YouTube video above) this puts every other classic player short of classes with shield bash move tactics at a significant disadvantage. I don't care he has the moves to be honest, but the feint needs to be brought in line with the rest of the classes so that it takes a full charged heavy as well as the feint stamina drain. That way they can only hold the onslaught for a short duration, the same as any other character.