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View Full Version : Valkyrie Needs a Buff



KeepersWay
05-23-2017, 03:42 AM
Valkyrie needs a buff in her current stage either she face rolls someone that has no idea how to dodge sweep or know how shield bash works. or She struggles to even get an enemy to half health if the person turtles or is waiting to parry her.

So currently she stands as in either get lucky 1 hit light pokes on the to the enemy eventually get parried due to a lucky parry or just expected parry and get punished severely since most characters like lawbringer, warlord, even raider have much higher health pool. She essentially has a hard time opening up opponents. Moreover, her poison move which could be used to punish turtles that use really safe lights such as lawbringers top light is hard to achieve due to such a small deflect window and even when you do confirm it the confirmation is not clear enough such as in the case of a berserker deflect, Orochi or even peacekeeper leaving this ability essentially useless high risk low reward.

In my opinion she needs her second light to be faster such as a way to punish her is from dodging a predicted sweep not from eating the first light and just taking it. By making the second light safer it opens up the opportunity to either continue the chain to a third light or heavy which could be slower or sweeping, feint cancel into gb, shield bash or doing nothing.

So right now as it stand valkyrie most fights are either take a few lights, get a lucky parry or eat the first light parry the second light and punish her. In most case she looses heavily from one parry with such a small amount of HP and such a high risk move set.

Valkyrie is not in a good state right now she currently is just a noob stomper.

Juuzaam
05-23-2017, 05:15 AM
Before everything is falling apart in this thread...KeepersWay is playing on PC. I havent seen that many console player complaining abour her recently, probably just because there are currently others to complain about, but we got 2 different game versions. One where she is just cancer light spaming, hard to handle(console) and one of the strongest heros, while on the other version she is bascily out of competition.

I am playing Valky and i am on pc too. I feel like a buff at the current state of the game is just wrong, we need the bugs fixed and loose the stupid turtle meta to not turn her into something broken overpowered like Warlord.

When it comes down to playing vs Valky it is all about handling the 2nd light in her chain. If someone is able to block this, valkys tool set becomes restricted to basic tools, while her basic tools are probably the weakest in game. With her small health pool an almost always unwinable situation. (No need to even talk about someone beeing able to parry the 2nd light...)
As an addition, Her basic 50/50, got a negative risk reward ratio vs every hero in game...making it in theory a bad choice.

DrinkinMyStella
05-23-2017, 09:15 AM
NOOOO im a rep 9 valk and i win most of my fights with her mixup she's actually kinda balanced now if you buff her then she will be to OP and hated on then they will nerf her worse than she was before leave my valky alone :p

My.Insanity
05-23-2017, 09:48 AM
as a Valk rep 11 (on PC) i think she is in a good state.. ofc a slight dmg buff would be nice or a new mix-up like (light / heavy / light) so enemys who try to parry your "2nd light" are getting hit by a heavy cuz the timing is a little bit later :P but overall i love her kit and yes the only way to beat a turtle is to turtle... XD sad but true.

CaynAldan
05-23-2017, 12:17 PM
Valk is quite strong and balanced right now. She just have a damage a little low, but very little. She needs a lot of attacks to hut a bit. I'll buff a little her damage against downed enemies (for synergy with sweep) and tweak a little (maybe a point or two) her attacks use of stamina before buff her damage, that could be a bit OP.

But i won't dare to buff her in any other way or she will became too OP

Sam_Wise0013
05-23-2017, 01:04 PM
Why do people keep saying valk is agod on console and to fast to block...She is annoying when you are 2v1 but her lights arent crazy to block, sounds like a blocking issue

DrinkinMyStella
05-23-2017, 01:40 PM
as a valk main most people i play against struggle to block the first light but normally block the second so i tend to use my shield bash in my mix-up a lot to open turtles. I find it really easy to beat valks because i know exactly what they will do so i can counter easily.

CaynAldan
05-23-2017, 02:08 PM
Same for me. In fact, a lot of pepole parry my second light

bananaflow2017
05-23-2017, 04:27 PM
Rep 18 valk in console here.
At least it's not a buff she needs. She needs an opener. Even on console there are players who turtle u into the ground.
A good warden ALLWAYS parries my second light. No matter where i place it.
Then u cant dash atack. Oh will be blocked and u will her gbed.
Only option: feint 1818182 attacks and try to hit a light(first is faster) but the second will be parried. So u have to bash what is dodged easily and will end up in another gb.
So valk is one of the most offensive characters without an opener....

KeepersWay
05-23-2017, 11:20 PM
Rep 18 valk in console here.
At least it's not a buff she needs. She needs an opener. Even on console there are players who turtle u into the ground.
A good warden ALLWAYS parries my second light. No matter where i place it.
Then u cant dash atack. Oh will be blocked and u will her gbed.
Only option: feint 1818182 attacks and try to hit a light(first is faster) but the second will be parried. So u have to bash what is dodged easily and will end up in another gb.
So valk is one of the most offensive characters without an opener....

I dont understand whats wrong with my buff suggestions to speed up the second light and to make the poison should deflect more worthwhile and easier to confirm.

Multiple people agree that the second light gets parried almost always. Thats the main issue here, Her first light rivals pk, however. The second light gets parried for a gb which gets punished really hard by most characters.Half the time I verse players that essentially eat the first light specially with the low amount of damage it provides just to parry the second and get a free gb for tons of damage. Just not worth the risk as it stands valk is not viable in competitive play, except 4's and even then she is just a cc bot not a good duelist. She needs a buff to be at least decent, she struggle's against decent people and above in skill level.

Chili_Reis
05-24-2017, 04:21 AM
The shoulder pin after deflect is blockable sometimes and definitively needs to be looked at. Rest of it is fine though. Part of the reason why only few use it is because parry is just stronger and easier.
Once parry is nerfed deflects could be worth using.
Valk needs some help with her chains. She is so predictable versus a good opponent that she can only use the first light versus them.
Also her shield crush guarantees nothing. However, she gets punished with a guard break when dodged.

After a shield crush all she can do is a sweep, guard break or a light. As soon as you see an indicator you know that it is going to be a light that can't be feinted. This results in a safe parry for the defender.
Shield crush needs to be safer or it should guarantee something. I would prefer it to be safer.
Additionally, she needs a heavy as second attack in one of her chains. I like Metal4.theCore's suggestion of a light, heavy, light combo so her second lights are not free parries.

jhmgrose
06-07-2017, 09:31 PM
Valkyrie should have as powerful a Shield Bash as Conqueror. Meaning to say, if she Shield Bashes an enemy into a wall, it should be a guaranteed Top Heavy.

AKDagriZ
06-11-2017, 12:59 AM
Valkyrie needs a buff in her current stage either she face rolls someone that has no idea how to dodge sweep or know how shield bash works. or She struggles to even get an enemy to half health if the person turtles or is waiting to parry her.

So currently she stands as in either get lucky 1 hit light pokes on the to the enemy eventually get parried due to a lucky parry or just expected parry and get punished severely since most characters like lawbringer, warlord, even raider have much higher health pool. She essentially has a hard time opening up opponents. Moreover, her poison move which could be used to punish turtles that use really safe lights such as lawbringers top light is hard to achieve due to such a small deflect window and even when you do confirm it the confirmation is not clear enough such as in the case of a berserker deflect, Orochi or even peacekeeper leaving this ability essentially useless high risk low reward.

In my opinion she needs her second light to be faster such as a way to punish her is from dodging a predicted sweep not from eating the first light and just taking it. By making the second light safer it opens up the opportunity to either continue the chain to a third light or heavy which could be slower or sweeping, feint cancel into gb, shield bash or doing nothing.

So right now as it stand valkyrie most fights are either take a few lights, get a lucky parry or eat the first light parry the second light and punish her. In most case she looses heavily from one parry with such a small amount of HP and such a high risk move set.

Valkyrie is not in a good state right now she currently is just a noob stomper.

i tought the same thing for a long time ,but let me tell you this from a now rep 28 valkyrie who never gave up on her . she is underestimated and with valk it is constant endless evolution.

i would be happy to help you if you struggle with her .i know many thing about her that many people ignore. the shoulder pin only need much practice use as much as you can like a second nature because her parry doesn'T give you much guaranteed GB

i think most people who come to this conclusion. are player who think they have to rely on light light spear sweep or pouncing thrust as an opener which everyone knows now it is almost a guaranteed GB on you.When those 2 option don't work most panic like i was for a long time

The thing is when you know better with Valkyrie you almost not spear sweep in a 5 round duel maybe one or twice not if not even

Arkhos1988
06-11-2017, 01:37 AM
After a shield crush all she can do is a sweep, guard break or a light.
Realy, that's your problem, try to open up anybody as kensei. Sry there might be a time where she will need a buff but atm i consider her one of the most balanced champs. Her second light gets allways parryed well sry, kenseis doge hit gets parries all day long.
The problem is more likely that there is more than one other champ who needs a nerf or a rework. Maybe ask for that instead of the current buffcrying that we see all over the forum.

Chili_Reis
06-14-2017, 11:03 PM
After a shield crush all she can do is a sweep, guard break or a light.
Realy, that's your problem, try to open up anybody as kensei. Sry there might be a time where she will need a buff but atm i consider her one of the most balanced champs. Her second light gets allways parryed well sry, kenseis doge hit gets parries all day long.
The problem is more likely that there is more than one other champ who needs a nerf or a rework. Maybe ask for that instead of the current buffcrying that we see all over the forum.
They haven't coded a special version just for me so it is not just my problem. And kensei HAS heavies in his mixups.
Neither Valk or Kensei can open turtles but Kensei at least has decent punishes and 20 damage top lights. Valk scales with the incompetence of your opponent. If he can parry lights you can't go for any mixup because of lack of feints.
Everything she does rewards little damage if it works and ends in being guard broken on dodge/block.
Also if you do Kensei dodge attacks as opener you deserve getting parried. Every dodge attack gets parried when used as opener except for Nobushi's in some cases.
Valk scales with the incompetence of your opponent. Versus a good player Kensei is actually better than Valk because of way higher parry punishes and both can't really use any of their mixups.
One of the most balanced champs? She has risk/reward always in favor of the defender. As soon as they ship the heavy parry nerf they nerf her alot aswell because it removes her single good punish.

And how does a nerf of another fighter allow her to use her kit without getting parried / guard broken?
Because that is the main problem with her. She is just way too easy to punish and her punishes suck.

Will_Schwarz
06-14-2017, 11:27 PM
I do think the deflect window is much smaller than for any other character with a deflect, and wouldn't mind an increase in that. Otherwise, she's cool to me. I'm relatively low rep compared to y'all (though I do play as every character,) but, due to her low health, I'm just very careful during initial engagement. Then, once there's an opening, I go super aggro, attempting to finish the opponent before he/she can interrupt. And, her defense is really good, so if I'm facing a careful player, I can typically avoid getting caught in bad situations.
Tbh, when playing as Val, I seem to have the most trouble against Valkyrie noobs. They're just hard to predict for me, and I tend to overestimate their strategy.

l8knight347
06-15-2017, 12:11 AM
all the mix ups come after the second light right? I don't play valk but if that is right a buff to the speed of the second light would make her 1000x more annoying than the cent. people roll from her because if you dodge the sweep you will just get guard broke. her shield bash will almost go around corners to knock people down and reaches 3x farther than it should. the deflect should be buffed but the shield bash should be fixed so that the animation obeys physics.

XxHunterHxX
06-15-2017, 12:14 AM
is this a joke ?

AKDagriZ
06-15-2017, 02:34 AM
I do think the deflect window is much smaller than for any other character with a deflect, and wouldn't mind an increase in that. Otherwise, she's cool to me. I'm relatively low rep compared to y'all (though I do play as every character,) but, due to her low health, I'm just very careful during initial engagement. Then, once there's an opening, I go super aggro, attempting to finish the opponent before he/she can interrupt. And, her defense is really good, so if I'm facing a careful player, I can typically avoid getting caught in bad situations.
Tbh, when playing as Val, I seem to have the most trouble against Valkyrie noobs. They're just hard to predict for me, and I tend to overestimate their strategy.

I think deflect window is the same for all (i also master deflect with orochi) her defense is pretty strong . she have deflect and superior light block.What more could we ask? If you let go parry and focus only on superior top light block and shoulder pin, She can be both strongest turtle of For Honor and the most agressive .However I think her blocking is a bit slower compare to some other heros.

Valkyrie noob are very hard to fight for me as well . maybe the hardest in this game.

Woohzie
07-05-2017, 10:53 AM
Valk realy needs a boost, she is absolutely useless!! Im rep 10 and most of chars can beat me if they are skilled little bit! Why? Becouse she DOESNT have like MOST OF OTHER CHARS DO free GB after parry (becouse of range!), free heavy after GB (becouse she is so slow!!) NOW chars which have free gb after parry and also have free heavy after gb are much stronger than valk.
When somebody step a side when i do spear sweap they ALWAYS have free GB=free heavy! When i step a side when somebody does any smiliar atack like this and try GB they ALWAYS dodge it, but IF you atack agains valkas, you have ALWAYS free GB! BOOST HER! :mad::mad::mad:
AND her atacks are so weak, they do no damage, but other chars like cents or berserker, or oroshi kill me by 2-3 heavy atacks!! WHAT THE HELL? !!

Chili_Reis
07-05-2017, 03:11 PM
Valk realy needs a boost, she is absolutely useless!! Im rep 10 and most of chars can beat me if they are skilled little bit! Why? Becouse she DOESNT have like MOST OF OTHER CHARS DO free GB after parry (becouse of range!), free heavy after GB (becouse she is so slow!!) NOW chars which have free gb after parry and also have free heavy after gb are much stronger than valk.
When somebody step a side when i do spear sweap they ALWAYS have free GB=free heavy! When i step a side when somebody does any smiliar atack like this and try GB they ALWAYS dodge it, but IF you atack agains valkas, you have ALWAYS free GB! BOOST HER! :mad::mad::mad:
AND her atacks are so weak, they do no damage, but other chars like cents or berserker, or oroshi kill me by 2-3 heavy atacks!! WHAT THE HELL? !!

She has a forward dodge gb and higher gb range than most other fighters.
Also she gets a free heavy after gb. Deals only 25 damage but it is a free heavy.

Yes spear sweep sucks versus a good opponent not only because it is punished way too hard but also it is super risky to use her chains. The sweep after headbutt is dodged like 9 out of ten times versus a mid tier player. At least the chain finisher sweep works sometimes.

Finally the defensive meta probably isn't going to do anything for her except for nerfing her. No gb after heavy means she can't use her only damaging punish. Additionally her heavies are low damage and most likely not even worth risking anything for if they add chip damage. Maintaining a chain after a blocked light would only buff her even further versus bad and new players. Not having any heavy in the middle of her chains just kills her mindgame.

AKDagriZ
07-10-2017, 10:46 PM
you have a problem with when you fight an opponent like the conqueror and the berserker and lawbringer

ill explain why and hope we will get rid of those free gb on lunge attack for good ! ( i have the right to dream no ?)

conq get free gb on heavy block ---- valk get free GB on her after any dash attack . Do the math what safe option do you have left ? answer is regular light only

berserker is not really a problem but if he can delfect half of your attack into free GB , parry some of your attack for a free GB .if he block your dash attack and know he could get a free GB out of it .It become way too much free GB opportunity on the valkyrie

lawbringer is not a problem itself but against valk the only thing he have to do is to poke shove the second light one by one and wear your health down piece by piece . you want to keep distance but if he know how to block properly you won't risk a dash attack to give him a free gb.

finally ,, lately people parry my light more than ever .I can't tell you how much discouraging it is being a valkrie when your light attack get parried and you give free gb on dash attack.At the end against decent players you will fight them close quarter and spam light attack like hell.No dash , no sweep.

-free GB on dodged sweep
-free GB on dodged shield crush
-free GB on block pouncing thrust
-free GB on block both side hunter strikes
-free GB on regular heavy dodged ( like any class)
-free GB if you get parried (like most class)
-Most parry with valk put your enemy too far and you throw a gb in the air resulting in a free GB on you
-Your shoulder pin and superior block can be blocked

That is a lot of free gb opportunity for one class and most tools are useless in certain case

Woohzie
07-11-2017, 06:22 PM
Yes, yes, exactly! But i dont believe, they will do something with it, they will piss on us and more like add new chars, than ballance contemporary game...

bananaflow2017
08-29-2017, 08:23 AM
Tottally agree with this thread.
So sad. Everyone was crying that valk is so strong so op sweep. This mimimi posts have been everywhere. And Now....
I see a valk in 1 out if 20 matches ( except myself) and she is easily countered by several heroes....

Chili_Reis
08-31-2017, 02:47 PM
She received some nerfs in 4vs4 modes since start of the threat.
Spear sweep only hits the target you are locked on. On top of that it doesn't work half of the time. Just plays the unblockable icon, hits and nothing happens at all.
Maybe sweep doesn't work versus someone in hitstun?
There is just no reason to pick Valk over Lawbringer or centurion in 4vs4 now. Even Gladiator is a better disabler than Valk.
Unlock tech and the guard switch dodge interaction are the last things that makes her decent in duels.
Unlock will be fixed sooner or later anyways and guard switch / dodge probably in the next patch. Worked only vs non assassins anyways.
At least she becomes even worse with gb on parry removal so a lot more people could start to complain.

masen9999
12-02-2017, 01:10 AM
i think valk need a light then heavy attack or heavy and faster heavys

HIPHOPINONOMAS
12-30-2017, 01:20 AM
As stated above by many people, valks issue is that just about all her moves are punishable by a free guard break. Guard breaks in the games current state equates to free heavy, ledging, and/or setup for 50/50.
People complain that valk spams lights but thats because all her moves are punishable except for her standard lights.

As someone mentioned, shield bash doesnt net valk any free dmg but if dodged free guard break punish. Shield bash is amazing against noobs but useless against the pro dodge masters out there. Shield bash needs to either grant a free light or be unpunishable by guard break. Example would be like a centurion kick. A centurion can land a kick and follow with a light. If they miss they can be punished by guard break, unless they throw out another quick attack before the guard break registers. I think this should be the same for valk

The other thing of note are her dash light attacks. If blocked free guard break punish. Kensei had a similar issue and they fixed him. Not sure the logic on why they cannot do the same for valk.

I do not think valk needs more dmg as her lights are fairly quick and her heavies are not really punishable by parries, minus a few heroes that can shield bash or punch you straight off a parry for stamina dmg. She has mixups and tools that many other heroes do not so to add speed or dmg to her attacks could potentially make her too powerful

My 2 cents

Ps light, heavy, light combo would be nice

xXIronwhiteboy2
04-12-2018, 06:52 AM
Been playing Valk since the game came out and I will be the first to say she has gotten better, but still has major issues. She is the easiest class to guardbreak in the game, her heavy's are freakishly slow, her lights are slower than most classes, and her shield tackle does not block as advertised.
That said recently they did fix some problems, sweep now seems to hit a lot better than it used to, when the game was in season two it was basically guaranteed to miss. and they added a fient where you can cancel a heavy to shield bash.
If she could get some guard break defense, and the shield tackle defense actually worked as advertised (It's supposed to maintain all block through the charge, yet I've seen it fail to block frontal attacks, and i've never seen it block a side attack) I'd be happy

Hell_bound
04-24-2018, 02:10 AM
Valk need increase range, she hit like in hand little sword, and need some unblock with chain.