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View Full Version : The REAL reason people hate Centurion...



ATBallZ88
05-18-2017, 09:09 PM
He promotes PLAYER SKILL DEVELOPMENT, and EFFECTIVE TEAMWORK

I was responding to another post from another person having issues with the Centurion. In several threads, I copied and pasted one of my long posts about the Centurion's attack capabilities and how to handle them. Offering several tips to people about how to combat the Centurion if they're seriously having a hard time. One of said tips, was that the player should learn to run away from a gank situation and find help from an ally to divide and conquer when facing multiple Centurions. To this remark, it was answered something along the lines that "you dont need to learn to run and get help when dealing with any other character in the game".

Okay, here's the thing. The Centurion and the Shinobi are new characters that introduce completely new styles of play, and trying to compare either of the two to pre-existing characters is comparing apples to oranges. Yet the Centurion seems to be seeing the most hate, because people seem to be getting demolished in both 1v1 and gank type scenarios.

The Centurion is specifically designed to kill the turtle meta, and his entire moveset is geared toward ripping you out of your guard and forcing you to either move out of the way or parry. You CAN NOT fight him like you fight every other character in the game. In order to avoid getting completely destroyed, you need to learn to break loose from the sole reliance on blocking or shield camping and actually learn how to effectively time dodges and parries. In other words, he is actively promoting skillful development that can help you to get better at the game against ALL characters.

Now, when it comes to ganks, ganks in general are annoying as hell. But against the constant onslaught of unblockables, dealing with a group of Centurions can be straight up cancer. However, this IS A GOOD THING. You have to remember that this is a character that is DESIGNED TO RIP THROUGH YOUR GUARD, so trying to fight on a group solo and trying to take on the world by yourself by attempting to multi-directional guard into revenge spam IS JUST GOING TO GET YOU KILLED. The majority of the For Honor community is chock full of people with "I'm gonna kill absolutely everything and **** everyone else, steal all the kills, intentionally spam attacks into my allies to knock them around so I can do so, and me me me me me" attitudes and play styles. The Centurion forces you to not only seek out help, but further promotes EFFECTIVE teamwork where you have to work together cooperatively rather than selfishly or you're all going to die.

The implementation of this character, both on the solo side and when it comes to teamwork, actively promotes growth and development . And that's why you people hate it so much. You don't want to have to learn how to play outside of your comfort zone. And you definitely don't want to learn how to play cooperatively and have to give up being selfish d-bags. Oh no, I'm fighting Centurions so I can't beat on my allies, boo hoo.

SAVAGE_CABBAGE1
05-18-2017, 09:13 PM
https://youtu.be/IMno3nB0hHg

"Effective Teamwork"

DeLatv
05-18-2017, 09:18 PM
Something so dumb i havent read for a while...

Can i guess, how much Centurion have you been playing these past 2 days?...

ATBallZ88
05-18-2017, 09:24 PM
I've seen that exact same situation in any pair containing a nobushi, conqueror, or lawbringer. The Centurion isn't doing anything that hasn't already been done. It should be noted however, that electing to begin the fight against the orochi with your back to a wall in the first place was a poor decision.

JohnBrasser
05-18-2017, 09:28 PM
I agree with you, everyone in the community would rather scream and cry begging for nerfs rather then actually learn how to play wit and against these new heros.

But unfortunately Ubisoft will listen to these whiners and in a week or so I bet these new heros will be get an unneeded nerf then there will be more complaining about how they were nerfed..

It will be a never ending cycle.

ATBallZ88
05-18-2017, 09:28 PM
Something so dumb i havent read for a while...

Can i guess, how much Centurion have you been playing these past 2 days?...

Played him for a few hours. Let me guess, you're one of the people getting destroyed because you suck at the game, don't know what a dodge or parry is, and generally whine about anything that kicks your ***?

SAVAGE_CABBAGE1
05-18-2017, 09:29 PM
I've seen that exact same situation in any pair containing a nobushi, conqueror, or lawbringer. The Centurion isn't doing anything that hasn't already been done. It should be noted however, that electing to begin the fight against the orochi with your back to a wall in the first place was a poor decision.
I agree on that being a poor decision, but not a decision that should kill me with being able to do nothing about it

It is worth noting that the attack was undodgeable. At least Conq and Nobushi are dodgeable

Also worth noting that I don't agree with the LB Pancake spam, I believe it should have a delay before use just as the Cent should have a slight slowing of the attack.

ATBallZ88
05-18-2017, 09:39 PM
I agree on that being a poor decision, but not a decision that should kill me with being able to do nothing about it

It is worth noting that the attack was undodgeable. At least Conq and Nobushi are dodgeable

Also worth noting that I don't agree with the LB Pancake spam, I believe it should have a delay before use just as the Cent should have a slight slowing of the attack.

The reason the attack was undodgeable was because you were being staggered by the orochi long enough for the centurion to fully charge his heavy attack. The Centurion has two attacks that can pin you in place and allow you to fully charge the punch, the leaping thrust attack and the fully charged heavy. Both of them are disgustingly slow and easy to dodge. The problem being faced here, again as mentioned in my original post, is that you're trying to fight SOLO AGAINST A CENTURION IN A GANK SITUATION. You can't do that. If you were facing him 1v1, like with that first centurion, it wouldn't have ended the way it did. But you can't get mad for being in a constant state of stun-lock that was more the fault of the Orochi than the Centurion.

D4_Grizzly
05-18-2017, 09:46 PM
"I've seen that exact same situation in any pair containing a nobushi, conqueror, or lawbringer."

No, u don't. Grab, punch, kick. over and over again, all unblockable. U have totaly no chance to get away. I tried it over and over again. Grab, punch, kick. Totaly unbalanced!

SAVAGE_CABBAGE1
05-18-2017, 09:48 PM
The reason the attack was undodgeable was because you were being staggered by the orochi long enough for the centurion to fully charge his heavy attack. The Centurion has two attacks that can pin you in place and allow you to fully charge the punch, the leaping thrust attack and the fully charged heavy. Both of them are disgustingly slow and easy to dodge. The problem being faced here, again as mentioned in my original post, is that you're trying to fight SOLO AGAINST A CENTURION IN A GANK SITUATION. You can't do that. If you were facing him 1v1, like with that first centurion, it wouldn't have ended the way it did. But you can't get mad for being in a constant state of stun-lock that was more the fault of the Orochi than the Centurion.

Three things

1: It was because I was in a corner, making it undodgeable, seeing as I could not physically dodge it.

2: The Orochi had nothing to do with it, if you look closely, me being punched gave me hyper armor for a duration, making me unstaggerable.

3: Even IF the first two points were invalid, this would still make it a broken combonation of characters, meaning that it's still abusable in a normal situation

No amount of numbers should take out any skill required in a game, that's a 100 to 0 combo on one of the highest health characters

Robert223333
05-18-2017, 11:29 PM
I agree with you, everyone in the community would rather scream and cry begging for nerfs rather then actually learn how to play wit and against these new heros.

But unfortunately Ubisoft will listen to these whiners and in a week or so I bet these new heros will be get an unneeded nerf then there will be more complaining about how they were nerfed..

It will be a never ending cycle.

Exactly that. Is it possible to auto-ignore threads containing the words "broken" and "nerf"? :D

Bloodlust_1138
05-19-2017, 03:25 AM
Spot on! He's a new character and once you e figured out his weaknesses he's easy as he has only four bars of health. He hits heavy, but he's very vulnerable to flanking attacks.

In a few weeks time, when people have figured out the Shonibi, you'll hear the same people crying about that character too.

drazaaa
05-19-2017, 08:47 AM
Spot on! He's a new character and once you e figured out his weaknesses he's easy as he has only four bars of health. He hits heavy, but he's very vulnerable to flanking attacks.

In a few weeks time, when people have figured out the Shonibi, you'll hear the same people crying about that character too.



Do you really know how many ppl will quit this game in few weeks? I already know more than 10 players who already uninstall this game.Also this players was playing the game since Beta !!!

ATBallZ88
05-19-2017, 01:36 PM
Do you really know how many ppl will quit this game in few weeks? I already know more than 10 players who already uninstall this game.Also this players was playing the game since Beta !!!

People are quitting the game for numerous reasons, the most prominent being the outrageous connection issues on the crappy decision to use P2P rather than dedicated servers. If people are leaving because they're losing to the new characters, good riddance, they probably suck at the game. If you've been playing since beta and are seriously having a hard time against these characters, learn how to play the game and get good. 95% of the people playing are garbage, no-skill crybaby whiners who want the game to be Minecraft. It isn't Minecraft. It's supposed to be hard, and it rewards people who take the time to develop skill and play the game legitimately. Maybe if people spent less time crying and more time actually trying to acquire some skill, learn how to dodge, parry, and guardbreak counter, they wouldn't be having the floor mopped up with them. Take some time off ganking, ledge fishing, and spamming heavies/unblockables that are easy to avoid or parry and actually learn how to fight, by your self, against all of the different characters.

DonBlechbuechse
05-19-2017, 02:22 PM
open ur eyes guys, these two new champs will get nerfed soon.
its just bait to get new money and giving noobs a champ they can win with without using brain ;)

just stop playing until they patch and earned enough money

Bloodlust_1138
05-19-2017, 02:32 PM
Do you really know how many ppl will quit this game in few weeks? I already know more than 10 players who already uninstall this game.Also this players was playing the game since Beta !!!

I honestly don't care. The game will be all the richer without them constantly stabbing me in the back when they're on my team.

Jazz117Volkov
05-19-2017, 02:57 PM
Centurion doesn't seem too bad, really. My only issue with him is the camera pirating. Very jarring.

You can parry your way out of some of his onslaught. Broke into his combo tonight with Crushing Counter. Just have to learn the moves. He's a strong hero, for sure, and maybe Ubi will do a bit of re-balancing, but it's too early to say either way.

KripledxxNiNja
05-19-2017, 05:09 PM
I am REP 37 in total and I'm running the Centurion at least up to REP 5. I'll tell you now after playing him people will not be sticking to it after a couple of weeks. He has alot of Defensive flaws and easily punishable moves with a lower HP. Once the community gets use to seeing him and his moves sets over time, he will not be as viable of a pick anymore. I think he will fall down lower than the old raiders pick rate.

Saurons_blade
05-19-2017, 05:26 PM
I've seen that exact same situation in any pair containing a nobushi, conqueror, or lawbringer. The Centurion isn't doing anything that hasn't already been done. It should be noted however, that electing to begin the fight against the orochi with your back to a wall in the first place was a poor decision.

Why? That's what the LB is designed to do. Shoving and pushing and throwing people until they are defenseless, AKA wallstunned.

Saurons_blade
05-19-2017, 05:29 PM
I am REP 37 in total and I'm running the Centurion at least up to REP 5. I'll tell you now after playing him people will not be sticking to it after a couple of weeks. He has alot of Defensive flaws and easily punishable moves with a lower HP. Once the community gets use to seeing him and his moves sets over time, he will not be as viable of a pick anymore. I think he will fall down lower than the old raiders pick rate.

How is his defense bad? His guardswitch speed is pretty good, and he can parry like anyone else.

Saurons_blade
05-19-2017, 05:47 PM
Played him for a few hours. Let me guess, you're one of the people getting destroyed because you suck at the game, don't know what a dodge or parry is, and generally whine about anything that kicks your ***?

You obviously don't even know what the defensive meta is, smart ***. Block camping is not as problematic as the fact that any parry is way to rewarding unless you parry the kensei/nobushi. It puts attackers at a way to high risk, that's why we are stuck in the defense meta. people would just punch the block until it moves into the wrong direction, They just don't do it because they know the parry will punish them to hard.

And besides, the people have a point. Tthe centurion needs one confirmed hit to throw out a huuuge combo that wrecks all your stamina and half of your healthbar. And in addition to that, his light attacks are just as fast as the PK lights. If THAT hero is considered OP, than why would the centurion, with the exact same speed, not be? His heavy game is very effective, but what really makes him OP, ist the light attack speed comming in addition to that. (I won't count the dumb *** wall stun lock here.) People know how to counter Peace keepers, People knew how to counter shieldbashes and shoulderbashes. These things have still been considered OP though, so why would the centurion not be? Another problem with the centurion is how ****ing easy he is to play, and how hard it is to counter him. it isn't impossible, it is to hard to do in comparison to other heroes. Why is the Raider underpowered? because he is to easy to counter. one light attack will interrupt every attack he tries to throw at his opponent, and even if you can't throw a light attack for some reason, you will still have a very easy time with parrying him. Why is the conqueror underpowered? because every opponent knows exactly what he is up to. he has no mix ups, no feinting game, nothing. Just a nerved shield bash. Every hero can be countered effectively, but mistakes are not as likely to happen with OP characters as they are with UP characters. It is never impossible to counter anything in videogames. Developers are not dumb, they are professionals. Balancing is so hard because even a counterable attack can be to strong in certain cases.

Galasdir
05-19-2017, 06:21 PM
The big unbalance with the Centurion right now is the fact that one successful hit and there goes all your stamina bar. Just remove or nefr his ability to lower your stamina bar. Thats about it. The rest can be learned.

ATBallZ88
05-19-2017, 06:22 PM
@Sauron

Awww, somebody sounds salty. I don't know what Centurions you've been fighting, but when you actually play him, it's a completely different experience. His guard switch is practically non-existent, so you're going to get destroyed by any character with a light spam combo that can quick shift from side to side. All of his unblockables are slow and easy to side-step into punish, save for the uncharged quick punch, which is actually really easy to predict and avoid if you're fighting a spammer. As to his light attacks, as fast as a PK? Not in my experience. I've had my light attacks playing as the Centurion beat out by the Warden's heavies, having initiated the attacks at the exact same time. All of his attacks are choreographed to the point that interrupting and/or avoiding them is child's play. If you lose in a 1v1 against a Centurion as he is now, you're either a garbage player or you've encountered a hacker. The only place he truly shines is in gank squads, and that's really only because people use him exactly as they've been abusing the conq/lawbringer shove attacks in gank squads. People need to get over themselves because, at the end of the day, the problem isn't that the new characters are OP, it's that you either aren't as good as you think you are or that you simply haven't taken the time to acquaint yourself with the new movesets and how to respond to them. The new characters are far from overpowered, but IF they are, it's because crybabies like you have *****ed and moaned and complained so much that the original characters have been nerfed to uselessness. Maybe, rather than calling for more nerfs, you should ask the devs to put everyone back to the way they were before you all started tearing up every time you lost a fight.

Papi_2_xTimes
05-19-2017, 07:09 PM
stop trying to block the centurion and dodge him. its very easy and hes left wide open. dodge is his kryptonite and it works every time because if you dodge at the last minute then most likely they will try to start the rest of that stun lock combo and give you even more time to punish. spread the word, dodge the centurion dont block. just dont dodge into a wall. all his power is in that stun lock combo he's kind of disappointing outside of that.

UnSeenWorld
05-19-2017, 07:09 PM
You can't even ****ing counter him. You have to wait till he does a mistake. Like he tries to attack you with lights or whatever he is doing. Or is trying to charge his heavy.
Otherwise you are just ****ed cause you see every Cent player just doing the same combo over and over. He got a trackable charged Heavy (how ****ing OP is that?)
Either you begin with a kick or get a stab in and follow it with a Jab and you are down on the floor with no stamina at all and maybe 50 HP left. Repeat the whole thing like 3 - 5 times till the enemy is dead cause the Centurion isn't using any stamina at all during the whole process. If i got no stamina for the 10th time he hasn't even used half his bar. So ****ing broken.
You can just hope to dodge the kick or get a lucky parry in, in hope you ****ing kill him in the process. Even Shinobi is easier to counter
Ubisoft, before you release such broken chars, how about you ****ing fix Conquerer. Cause he is pretty much non existent right now even tho he is one of the most fun heroes out there.
Ragemod off.

GereinathHunter
05-19-2017, 07:15 PM
Centurion is Frost's shotgun.

It's in every round spamming away in any situation regardless of skill or effort and, despite being identified as a problem by players and devs, wont get patched for at least a month in order to promote buying DLC for poorly tested add-on content, and then when asking staff directly if there are plans to fix it you get fed some bullcrap about "not having enough data to nerf it yet." Rinse + repeat for every subsequent DLC.

GPG_Gabriel
05-19-2017, 07:16 PM
JohnBrasser (http://forums.ubi.com/member.php/2298612-JohnBrasser) - Funny you say that, I just posted almost the the same message. The guy was complaining about the Ninja Kick. My reply -

"the point that u say, "Let me start by saying I don't have any issues dodging the shinobi kick, I'll dodge it like 9/10 times." Then why is it a problem? Maybe my kick was a diversion or just used to close the gap for my real intent, which was/is the attack. I have competed in martial art tournaments, and I can only begin to tell you how big of a headache I had, after my opponent followed up a rounhouse kick (that missed me) with a follow up backhand that landed and knocked my *** out. But in your instance your saying, he should have had to pause xMS before he could be able to through any follow up.... I wish gamers would stop wanting stuff to be so easy, and publishers giving it to them calling it balancing. Learn your art! Learn your and your opponents strengths and weaknesses! PEACE!"

And now after reading yours, I just realized something.

These same punks that complain because they refuse to train and develop skill are the same jerks that couldn't make it on the team in school. Imagine if the coach or school or athletic board did like game publishers and "balanced the game"

Each Hero is different and must be approached differently, period. Point Blank. It takes practice and skill. PERIOD. Stop b**&&* ing and get to practicing and "Mastering"...

Glad to see your post John. You must not belong to the "entitled, think everybody owe them something" generation(s).

I do however, believe UBI owes us a game that utilizes the network better to keep a match going or to correctly reward players when there match ends.

GPG_Gabriel
05-19-2017, 07:22 PM
You can't even ****ing counter him. You have to wait till he does a mistake. Like he tries to attack you with lights or whatever he is doing. Or is trying to charge his heavy.
Otherwise you are just ****ed cause you see every Cent player just doing the same combo over and over. He got a trackable charged Heavy (how ****ing OP is that?)
Either you begin with a kick or get a stab in and follow it with a Jab and you are down on the floor with no stamina at all and maybe 50 HP left. Repeat the whole thing like 3 - 5 times till the enemy is dead cause the Centurion isn't using any stamina at all during the whole process. If i got no stamina for the 10th time he hasn't even used half his bar. So ****ing broken.
You can just hope to dodge the kick or get a lucky parry in, in hope you ****ing kill him in the process. Even Shinobi is easier to counter
Ubisoft, before you release such broken chars, how about you ****ing fix Conquerer. Cause he is pretty much non existent right now even tho he is one of the most fun heroes out there.
Ragemod off.

Funny, I have beet a Centurion a many of times. It matters what hero you have going up against him, he has to get close enough to do what he do, I keep the correct distance and don't be where he need me to be!

UnSeenWorld
05-19-2017, 07:33 PM
Funny, I have beet a Centurion a many of times. It matters what hero you have going up against him, he has to get close enough to do what he do, I keep the correct distance and don't be where he need me to be!

And what Hero are you using? Don't give me Warden, PK, Warlord and that crap in the top 5

Diabel5283
05-19-2017, 07:52 PM
Exactly! Finally someone says it! It's fun to hear shinobi players complain about centurion combos. And every other assassin for that matter.

Diabel5283
05-19-2017, 07:56 PM
if you were in a corner, then that's why you lost! You know, there's this thing called being aware of your surroundings, even in gaming.

Qarismah
05-19-2017, 08:04 PM
if you were in a corner, then that's why you lost! You know, there's this thing called being aware of your surroundings, even in gaming.

It's impossible to entirely avoid walls/corners/ledges on certain maps in this game.

People keep yelling that the centurion is intended to be a turtle meta killer, which is fine. However, the centurion can still turtle as well as anyone else. So now we have someone who "beats the turtle meta" while also being able to participate in it... How is that balanced? You have to play risky against him but he doesn't have to do the same.

Papi_2_xTimes
05-19-2017, 08:36 PM
ive been using the valkyrie to just eat these centurions alive same for the shinobi. just dodge them both. i will say that the shinobi kick is unfair as he can hit with hit no matter if you hit him before he connects with light and heavy attacks. that should change other than that, the centurion is just extremely predictable. dodge left or right and punish, you can abuse that as much as they abuse their combo but the need to jump or grab to start their little combo. dodge DO NOT BLOCK or he will just grab. dodge and slash. thats the big secret no one can figure out so far. DO NOT BLOCK CENTURIONS, DO NOT BLOCK CENTURIONS. HE IS VERY VERY PREDICTABLE. once i figured out to dodge its been pretty rare that i lose in duels and brawls to centurions. i dont think ive lost at all to one today and ive been playing all day.

Saurons_blade
05-19-2017, 08:38 PM
@Sauron

Awww, somebody sounds salty. I don't know what Centurions you've been fighting, but when you actually play him, it's a completely different experience. His guard switch is practically non-existent, so you're going to get destroyed by any character with a light spam combo that can quick shift from side to side. All of his unblockables are slow and easy to side-step into punish, save for the uncharged quick punch, which is actually really easy to predict and avoid if you're fighting a spammer. As to his light attacks, as fast as a PK? Not in my experience. I've had my light attacks playing as the Centurion beat out by the Warden's heavies, having initiated the attacks at the exact same time. All of his attacks are choreographed to the point that interrupting and/or avoiding them is child's play. If you lose in a 1v1 against a Centurion as he is now, you're either a garbage player or you've encountered a hacker. The only place he truly shines is in gank squads, and that's really only because people use him exactly as they've been abusing the conq/lawbringer shove attacks in gank squads. People need to get over themselves because, at the end of the day, the problem isn't that the new characters are OP, it's that you either aren't as good as you think you are or that you simply haven't taken the time to acquaint yourself with the new movesets and how to respond to them. The new characters are far from overpowered, but IF they are, it's because crybabies like you have *****ed and moaned and complained so much that the original characters have been nerfed to uselessness. Maybe, rather than calling for more nerfs, you should ask the devs to put everyone back to the way they were before you all started tearing up every time you lost a fight.

You know another problem? whenever somebody tries to share honest negative feedback he is immediately called a cry baby. I can parry the centurion, I can dodge him, and I do win against him. That doesn't change anything I said. I can counter PKs, Valkyries and zone attacks too, that doesn't make them less OP. I was merely saying how the centurion and certain other classes are stronger than others, which IS a problem. There shouldn't be a hero outperforming another one in every regard. But such heroes do exist, and the centurion is one of them.

Uncle_Draza
05-19-2017, 09:38 PM
He promotes PLAYER SKILL DEVELOPMENT, and EFFECTIVE TEAMWORK

The Centurion is specifically designed to kill the turtle meta, and his entire moveset is geared toward ripping you out of your guard and forcing you to either move out of the way or parry. You CAN NOT fight him like you fight every other character in the game. In order to avoid getting completely destroyed, you need to learn to break loose from the sole reliance on blocking or shield camping and actually learn how to effectively time dodges and parries. In other words, he is actively promoting skillful development that can help you to get better at the game against ALL characters.

When fighting Centurion, all youre going to is wait for him to do his combos so you can dodge and guard break. He backsteps way to fast to even attempt to do lights or heavies, and he is heavily rewarded by parries. This is the ignorance of the "hes the turtle breaker xdxdxd" rhetoric, because you're going to play even more passive against a character with infinite stunlock and stamina draining combos. Not saying he's uncounterable, but if you really justified this character as the character that makes everyone else more skilled by encouraging dodging, you're being a hypocrit. Not every player in this game uses the playstyle of assassins, to some of us, backsteping out of every attack is just as much turtling as constant blocking. You aren't rewarded much for parrying Centurion, he should have all his stamina drained for getting parried while using his slow heavy jab into unblockable. If he plays agro correctly (think of Warlords slow creeping strategy) he is pretty hard to punish, and he can corner bash spam better than conquerer. He's also pretty decently rewarded just for a simple combo, by your logic, Shugokis should only use Demons Embrace and headbutt, because thats basically how I see the new Centurion meta.

Ubisoft basically combined Warden and Warlord in one character and put him on steroids, two characters who people rant about "turtling" but some how their love child centurion isn't a Turtle unblockable spammer for only using unblockable abilities that have free hits. It's not "teamwork" If a Conq or Warlord use their charges to stunlock people in ganks, its "OP pls ubisafht fix", but if two Centurions are timing their stabbing combos on a guy with revenge so that he literally never can attack or even move, that's teamwork? As much as that is theoretically "working as a team" to shut down the enemy, I think this is taking it a little to far. He shouldn't be able to knockdown people with revenge, even though a lot other characters can do similar things to stunlock and enemy for a long time while he is revenge (LB, Shugoki, etc), his knockdown is way to long, and he can immdiately start the chain right when the opponent has recovered.

Don't defend the broken aspects of this character because you feel like it's necessary for using against characters you already think are unbalanced. That's not how a game like this should function.

Saurons_blade
05-20-2017, 05:44 PM
When fighting Centurion, all youre going to is wait for him to do his combos so you can dodge and guard break. He backsteps way to fast to even attempt to do lights or heavies, and he is heavily rewarded by parries. This is the ignorance of the "hes the turtle breaker xdxdxd" rhetoric, because you're going to play even more passive against a character with infinite stunlock and stamina draining combos. Not saying he's uncounterable, but if you really justified this character as the character that makes everyone else more skilled by encouraging dodging, you're being a hypocrit. Not every player in this game uses the playstyle of assassins, to some of us, backsteping out of every attack is just as much turtling as constant blocking. You aren't rewarded much for parrying Centurion, he should have all his stamina drained for getting parried while using his slow heavy jab into unblockable. If he plays agro correctly (think of Warlords slow creeping strategy) he is pretty hard to punish, and he can corner bash spam better than conquerer. He's also pretty decently rewarded just for a simple combo, by your logic, Shugokis should only use Demons Embrace and headbutt, because thats basically how I see the new Centurion meta.

Ubisoft basically combined Warden and Warlord in one character and put him on steroids, two characters who people rant about "turtling" but some how their love child centurion isn't a Turtle unblockable spammer for only using unblockable abilities that have free hits. It's not "teamwork" If a Conq or Warlord use their charges to stunlock people in ganks, its "OP pls ubisafht fix", but if two Centurions are timing their stabbing combos on a guy with revenge so that he literally never can attack or even move, that's teamwork? As much as that is theoretically "working as a team" to shut down the enemy, I think this is taking it a little to far. He shouldn't be able to knockdown people with revenge, even though a lot other characters can do similar things to stunlock and enemy for a long time while he is revenge (LB, Shugoki, etc), his knockdown is way to long, and he can immdiately start the chain right when the opponent has recovered.

Don't defend the broken aspects of this character because you feel like it's necessary for using against characters you already think are unbalanced. That's not how a game like this should function.

I love it when people take more than three minutes to think over their own arguements. This dude people, get's it. Everything he said is valid and makes sense, and don't you dare to call him a crybaby because of that.

ATBallZ88
05-20-2017, 06:49 PM
I'm not even going to bother replying anymore after this post, as trying to talk to you people about anything is like beating a dead horse, and you're too focused on the wrong aspects of any argument made to even see the point that is being projected. If you've read my posts and, in your single-mindedness, thought that any of them were truly about defending any character, broken aspect, or overpoweredness, then you've completely overlooked what I'm saying. I don't care about the Centurion or whatever character you're *****ing about.

For those of you who got what I was saying, thank you.

For those of you who didn't, I'm going to spell it out. The For Honor community is suffocated by people who would rather have the game set to permanent easy mode, and cry and complain about anything they have a hard time with, rather than take the time to develop any real skill or learn about how to play with and against the differing characters that make up our glorious roster. People want to be able to use any character without any trouble against any other character without having to bother learning how to use them effectively. Without having to learn how to play the game, how to parry, how to dodge, how to guardbreak counter, how to conserve stamina and fight intelligently rather than just spamming attacks until they're exhausted, or how to fight effectively in a group and work as a team. It's much easier to ***** and moan and complain until the devs take away anything that makes it hard for you, turning the entire roster into a disgusting joke of ineffective carbon copies of eachother and removing any and all aspects of skillful play, than it is for you to bother with some growth and development. You whiner *******s are dumbing the game down to the point it's just boring anymore, and it's not getting any better. I'm sick and tired of good games being destroyed by casuals who want the game to be easy for them, only for it to happen, then the ******bags move on to the next title and leave the ruined piece of garbage behind for loyalists and fans. So to all of you who fit that category, **** you.

Saurons_blade
05-21-2017, 02:45 PM
I'm not even going to bother replying anymore after this post, as trying to talk to you people about anything is like beating a dead horse, and you're too focused on the wrong aspects of any argument made to even see the point that is being projected. If you've read my posts and, in your single-mindedness, thought that any of them were truly about defending any character, broken aspect, or overpoweredness, then you've completely overlooked what I'm saying. I don't care about the Centurion or whatever character you're *****ing about.

For those of you who got what I was saying, thank you.

For those of you who didn't, I'm going to spell it out. The For Honor community is suffocated by people who would rather have the game set to permanent easy mode, and cry and complain about anything they have a hard time with, rather than take the time to develop any real skill or learn about how to play with and against the differing characters that make up our glorious roster. People want to be able to use any character without any trouble against any other character without having to bother learning how to use them effectively. Without having to learn how to play the game, how to parry, how to dodge, how to guardbreak counter, how to conserve stamina and fight intelligently rather than just spamming attacks until they're exhausted, or how to fight effectively in a group and work as a team. It's much easier to ***** and moan and complain until the devs take away anything that makes it hard for you, turning the entire roster into a disgusting joke of ineffective carbon copies of eachother and removing any and all aspects of skillful play, than it is for you to bother with some growth and development. You whiner *******s are dumbing the game down to the point it's just boring anymore, and it's not getting any better. I'm sick and tired of good games being destroyed by casuals who want the game to be easy for them, only for it to happen, then the ******bags move on to the next title and leave the ruined piece of garbage behind for loyalists and fans. So to all of you who fit that category, **** you.

Now THAT'S what I call salty, giving up your arguement after less then three posts, using other peoples behaviours as an excuse in a desperate attempt to make your own points viable.

The problem with the centurion isn't necessarily how hard he is to counter. Difficulty is a good thing, the reason people play pvp is just that, we wan't opponents who think, because pve is to simple/easy. The problem with the centurion, is how hard he is to counter in COMPARISON to other heroes. If the other heroes would be as strong as the centurion, nobody would critizise him. But the other heroes are not as strong. THAT is the issue. IF they would buff all the underpowered heroes instead of nerving all the overpowered ones, I'd appreciate it a lot more than i appreciate nervs. However, nerving is often an easier solution than buffing. Nerving is easy because you can look at a particulary strong aspect and make it weaker. IF you buff something, you must consider why to do it, how to do it, and how much is to much. Imagine the Raider getting a buff that would double his attackspeed on heavies. It would be insane, and completely game breaking. Taking a game breaking aspect and making it weaker, is a lot less likely to **** up though, and this is the reason why we see so much nervs and so little buffs. For honor is no different than other games in this aspect.

mint-car
05-26-2017, 12:52 AM
I think you're completely right, and I think the game propably needs to move away from the defensive playstyle being the best one, but it's still likely to drive me away from the game personally. I've developed a playstyle that pretty much doesn't include dodging. It seems to be one too many things to keep in mind at once. So far I've managed to get along fine just getting good at parrying and counter attacking at the right time. Thing is that I've played the game enough that I don't feel like investing that much time in it anymore. Requesting me to make a big leap in skill to be able to compete at this stage will just cause me to give up. As far as the community is concerned that's propably good riddance right? I'm inclined to agree with that too. I only hope large portions of the player base aren't like me.

OmerTuvia
06-21-2017, 04:45 PM
are you serious? do you actually defend this ganking playstyle?

this character is good in 1v1 only. i fought many cents (they are everywhere) and my win-lose against them is fairly the same. so in a 1v1 its a great character, with strengths and weaknesses like any other character

the real problem is the ganking of course
you say it promotes skill development? now tell me, how the **** can i dodge a kick from 2 cents or 3 cents or even 1 normal character and 1 cent? the kick is way too fast, and has a high staggering animation. it is designed for 1v1. but in ganking? get hit by this and you are ****ed. and while you are getting ****ed everyone else in the fight will **** you as well. because why the **** not? and if you get hit by the jab, everyone will **** you while you are on the ground. yup, real skill development

and you suggest that when ever i see a cent with another random character i should flee? do you actually encourage to run away from a 2v1 fight? this game is built for fighting, not running away.
before these new characters 2v1 was possible, and required actual skill. now it is just impossible and the only option is to run screaming. this is not for honor

Sekiro...
06-21-2017, 09:17 PM
He promotes PLAYER SKILL DEVELOPMENT

Maybe u right...

So, to make the game fair theres only 2 options:
Buff all other characters to the same level of centurion (and promote player skill development :o)
Nerf centurion to the same level of others (to promote fair matches)

nice try by the way.

Duskmare
06-21-2017, 09:20 PM
Have to say, I think you've got it all wrong OP.

People don't like the centurion because he takes control away from them. Whether it's breaking their stamina down constantly to the point where they can't even attack or hitting them with a single charged heavy for half their health while they have no choice but to sit there for a few seconds and wait until the game gives them control of their character back.

KiahsRevenge
06-21-2017, 11:01 PM
Wow! He removes the ability to be able to dodge or counter in any meaningful way before you get ganked in 4v4 situations. Effective teamwork? Player skill development? How high were you when you wrote this? He gives teams the ability to destroy opposing players by making them helpless to react. I've been playing since day one. No means a pro, rank 28 overall. Rank 10 Kensei which is what I play most dominion or skirmish game modes. When I find myself in a 1 v X situation I try to survive and win. I would say that I succeed roughly half the time depending on my opponents of course(since the revenge nerf) But increasingly find myself fighting in these situations with cents who take the power of defending myself out of my control. I can only dodge so much. The blinding seizure inducing screen effects do not help ether. Cent needs a nerf to the stamina drain by the kicks and punches. His tracking with some of his moves is rediculous as well.

PDXGorechild
06-22-2017, 12:39 PM
Nah you've got it all wrong mate.

I can't pay attention to everything going all time time around me in a fight, even with a solid team at my back. A centurion only has to hit me from behind with an unblockable and the chain starts, before I know it i'm in a stun lock and have no control over my character. Meanwhile, every one else on their team gets free hits on me. Literally might as well drop my controller for 5 seconds for all the good it will do me, by which time I will be long dead.

It's boring and there's f*ck all you can do about it. This game mechanic works in RPG games like WoW where you have various escape mechanisms, potions and spells etc to get you out of trouble. If someone disables you in For Honour, which the centurion does abundantly, it's game over if the other team is in the least bit organised. The only way to combat it at the moment is to fight fire with fire. I don't wanna do that. Having 2 Cents on my team to counter the enemies 2 Cents isn't my idea of fun.

Jazz117Volkov
06-22-2017, 03:38 PM
Cent relies too much on stun-locking, so he's going to be tough to balance and irritating if you don't understand what he's doing. But nerf his punch too much and he becomes a toothless joke; keep it the way it is, and unless you focus on learning to deal with Centurion specifically, he'll seem alien and unbalanced. Cent spam does highlight a bizarre design choice though; Revenge has no effect on attacks that don't deal direct damage: kicks, punches, shoves, etc. But I think balance is less of an issue than it's made out to be.

Chances are you get stepped on by Centurion because they're better at the game, not because they're Centurion. He's a one trick pony with really awkward parry timing and frankly terrible range. Back-step and poke his face; he can't do jack. It's a reoccurring issue in this game; everyone wants to stand too close. I do it. Learn your spacing: green zones, red zones.

Ganking is another matter entirely, and I'm not convinced hero balance is the way to fix that.

Jediknight482
06-22-2017, 10:44 PM
Lol "The real reason". What a noob and uneducated response. Clearly a biased opinion. And make note that it is just that. An opinion and nothing more. Because Cent in 4v4 is always cancer. Not to mention hes literally the most braindead character there is.

Gemoroda
06-23-2017, 12:12 AM
it's hard to read 5 pages of long comment... basically this thread is useless. the centurion IS and IS NOT op at the same time. in 1v1 2v2 its really manageable with proper skill. in a 2v1 3v1 4v1 cent gang he's op as ****. what do you do when your team mates are dead and 2 cents are chasing you and a 3rd one is cutting you off? SUDDEN DEATH. and the problem isn't his kick. the problem is the knock down on charged jab. because the most effective damage skill the cent has it's his leaping attack. and if one manages to get you down guess what. SUDDEN DEATH. the only thing he needs it's the removal of the knock down and he's balanced as **** (I mean really balanced)

AKDagriZ
06-23-2017, 01:36 AM
OP your right in what you said . I think i can speak for vast majority who don't even plan to use the centurion :

The way he drain out your stamina and how hard it is to turtle away in hope to regen ,
too much unreactable attack (once he get going)
too much punish if you missed one parry
or if he parry you into his unreactable chain
hype armor ability
Heavy into GB.

the only good side side for us who don't plan to use the centurion , is he have low health pool.

If centurion was create to break the defensive meta he is at the same time keeping you in an unreactable state and pretty much out of stamina with very little room for mistake , How do you want to attack in such situations ?

Duskmare
06-23-2017, 04:10 AM
Played against some cents earlier today and realised just how much they've got that annoys me, hahaha.

So, there's the obvious ones like the super combo that leaves you without control for about 4 seconds and takes off half your health, or the stun lock pinning heavies in group situations, but here's some other things I dislike about the cent.

His area attack does so much damage, and since it counts as a single move you can't interrupt it with a superior block. Which means, even if you block/dodge the first one, there's another two swings coming, so you'd have to dodge and/or block all three of them to get out safe. For heavy characters this is especially difficult because if you don't get the perfect block then you're at least going to get chip damage. I'm not even sure some characters like the shugoki can dodge fast enough to weave through all three attacks, so you might end up taking damage after dodging the first attack.

Another thing that annoys me is the constant stunning. Not pinning, but proper stunning. Every single kick or jab leaves you unable to see where his attacks are coming from. Add this to his attacks being some of the fastest in the game and it makes them far harder to react to than any other character. With the damage they do and the options after each attack for following up with more jab, throw or heavy combos, along with his massive stamina pool, the centurion can just beat you down mercilessly without giving you very much of an opportunity to block/dodge and counter.

Finally the severity of his stamina drain. It only takes about 3-4 jabs/kicks/throws to totally destroy your stamina, then you're left without any way of attacking back and you become super susceptible to feints. The speed at which he can deliver the jabs and the small gap to dodge them and the kick makes it really difficult to recover after you get caught in a short centurion combo. I think the attacks also add a delay to your stamina regenerating too. So not only does it kick the stamina out of you and add more for you to restore, it also prevents you from restoring your stamina, giving the cent player plenty of time to hit you again with any of his many stunning/ stamina killing attacks.

In short... The centurion is just a terrible character. He's designed to take control away from people and debilitate them. Stamina management should be entirely down to a player, not something controlled by the enemy. In any group situation the centurion can debilitate any enemy and basically makes it impossible for them do defend themselves. He can do it with almost any of his moves too.

So, my suggestion to fix the centurion would be to remove the stun effects on his kicks and punches (they're already good enough thank you. Free light on the kick and the punch takes stamina and allows you to continue your chain). I would also suggest that his stamina draining attacks drain less stamina, maybe half as much. Finally, I would suggest you get rid of the guaranteed charged jab on a charged heavy hit and reduce the time of the pin considerably. A guaranteed non-charged jab is more than enough.

Jazz117Volkov
06-23-2017, 10:40 AM
^ You raise a lot of good points.

On a more trivial note, for a while I couldn't nail down why the Centurion feels so off; like, doesn't feel like For Honor. The camera is part of it, but it's mainly because several of his moves should be fatal/mortal. He sticks his gladius through your chest. You should be dead, but it's only a "stun" or "pin". Very cartoon compared to the other heroes, whose attacks inflict slash or blunt damage until an execution.

Gemoroda
06-23-2017, 02:05 PM
No centurion can deplete your stamina that fast. sure he can take half of it away. but you stand ground and recover it fast...
hes not that engaging seeing as everi combo starter is easy dodgeable and punishable
i keep hearing people complaining about centurions stamina attacks. but how about raider? hes stamina deplition is far superioor to the centurion. one grab and literaly you go from full stamina to 0 stamina. and bu the time you get half of it back he does that again.

you people seem to want to nerf everi ****ing thing you cant deal wit.
i totaly agree that in 4v4 more than 2 are cancerous. but man you whine a lot for things smaller things than the important ones...

Duskmare
06-23-2017, 05:59 PM
No centurion can deplete your stamina that fast. sure he can take half of it away. but you stand ground and recover it fast...
hes not that engaging seeing as everi combo starter is easy dodgeable and punishable
i keep hearing people complaining about centurions stamina attacks. but how about raider? hes stamina deplition is far superioor to the centurion. one grab and literaly you go from full stamina to 0 stamina. and bu the time you get half of it back he does that again.

you people seem to want to nerf everi ****ing thing you cant deal wit.
i totaly agree that in 4v4 more than 2 are cancerous. but man you whine a lot for things smaller things than the important ones...

I suppose it depends on which character you play too. They have different amounts of stamina after all. If you're playing a cent then he probably won't be able to take away all your stamina in a few hits. I main conqueror so I know that it would take about 3-4 hits from full stamina to get it to nothing, or near about. Since you have to attack and use your stamina too though, he'll usually start his combo after punishing one of your moves when you're at 2/3 or 1/2 stamina anyway. In which case it's even worse trying to recover.

The kick has some ridiculous forward range on it, so if you dodge back to get some distance he can kick and just close the distance of that dodge to hit you. Then he gets a free light attack, you're stunned and you lose a good amount of stamina. His charged heavies are difficult to predict and they have crazy homing on them. There's no such thing as 'getting out of range' with his heavies, you have to dodge or you have to parry. If he then feints that into a guardbreak there's no way to stop it. He'll catch you in a heavy startup or in your dodge. So tell me again how he has no startup attacks...

Personally I think the raider's stamina drain is a bit too extreme too. I mean, he's carrying you. If anything you should be regaining stamina, hahaha. Though the raider's carrying attack is far easier to dodge than any of the cent's attacks since he has to do it from sprinting. However, the raider is way too powerful once you're out of stamina. With his unblockable feint there's pretty much no defence against him since he can feint into then guardbreak, again either catching you in the heavy opener or mid dodge. If you attacked he could also just wait for the parry and then you're pretty much dead...

Haha, we want to nerf everything that seems OP compared to the majority of the other characters. So, I suppose those would count as things people can't deal with since people are at such a massive disadvantage when fighting them. :P
I already mentioned the big things before, but I wanted to point out that there was more to the centurion that makes him horrible and not fun to fight.

bonefat21
06-23-2017, 07:14 PM
No, I hate centurion because he isn't fun to fight. You spend the round game dodging his kick, parrying his unblockable heavy, and avoiding walls like the plague. That's not fun. It's made even worse by the fact that, if he does hit you, you not only lose an absurd amount of stamina, but you may as well go get yourself a snack because you aren't going to be able to play for the next six or so seconds while he lands confirmed hit after confirmed hit and relieves you of your health and stamina. Not fun. Not especially difficult to avoid and not really in need of being nerfed, but not fun.

Ianoneshot
06-24-2017, 04:33 AM
"I've seen that exact same situation in any pair containing a nobushi, conqueror, or lawbringer."

No, u don't. Grab, punch, kick. over and over again, all unblockable. U have totaly no chance to get away. I tried it over and over again. Grab, punch, kick. Totaly unbalanced!

http://forums.ubi.com/showthread.php/1693657-New-knight-character This thread was made by me and it has to do with a character that I thought would be a good add to the game, especially for the centurion haters out there.

Gemoroda
06-25-2017, 10:30 PM
i know. but i have a hard time wit myself when i read posts that want to nerf things that are manageable but people find a hard time with them. because par example, ofc. centurion is a little op. but just a little after he manages to catch you with his kick. because even tho his spartan kick has long range and can catch someone if he dodges backwords, he is super punishable if the enemy dodges to a side. the heavy unblockable , once in the unblockable animation you cant cancel it anymore. its a comited move. and because it is commited you have plenty of time to see it coming. the reason pple have a hard time with it is because just as i am doing 2, i try to parry it way to soon. i get parryed on heavy unblockable 70% of times. raider par example besides the fact that he drains stamina faster than centurion, he can do it from a gb two. so parry gb carry out of stamina. then the big problem is not that he can faint his unblockable zone. not that he can cancel it in a top light. the problem is that he can cancel it even in the last 0.5 seconds.lets adress the issue that raiders cancel into light is op because you can do it even right before you get hit and its impossible to react unles you are 100% sure it will come. and when your out of stamina that is over impossible to guess. yes guess. you can still dodge to a side witouth stamina from centurion s kick. even if he fallows with a light or heavi, that will work only if you try to gb from side dash. if not and the cent attacks he is parryable. and if not, its 100% blockable. and if he charges it to unblockable, again you have time to parry it or dodge into the same thing again witout the fear for the second heavy...

dragon7jdc
06-28-2017, 04:10 PM
quote: He promotes PLAYER SKILL DEVELOPMENT, and EFFECTIVE TEAMWORK.
While istrongly dissagree with you, i still dont hate the centurion. i might hate the player using him justto cheese or use cheape exploits to win and now actuall player skills. non the less i cant hate any hero justfor having their own unique fighting style. Now to my point. centurion hardlly promote player skill dev. but ihave no comment about effective teamework. .

heros like :
Conqurer, Raider, Orochi. Promotes player skill dev. because they have no other way to win othe then going all out and cant afforde to make mistakes too many times. and it takes them a long time to kill their enemy. while cent can lock you in a combo to kill you. while other heros can atleast hiot you twice or three time at most. shinobi maybe more hits. but not like cent. so this isnt a call for nerfs or buffs. just facts.
i respect you opinion about cent and i think he should be left as he is or maybe get buffed. its not my problem here.
let me know what you think.

(KEEP FOR HONOR ALIVE)

MadCYclops
06-28-2017, 04:31 PM
All they have done with the cent is make Shoguki demons embrace shennanigans... a staple in the world of for honor...and to some extent the shinobi is guilty of this as well... The Lockdown frames from both the new characters are absurd in anything outside of 1v1... I mean ppl complain about getting free hits off a guardbreak... how tf did you think theyd feel with 3-12 free hits from opposing team mates while these 2 new characters make you just stand... or kneel, or lie there and take it like a....

ffs anyone with common sense...(yeah i know only about 3 ppl in the world have it now) could tell from the start b4 these characters were introduced that the amount of time you force your opponent to have 0 control and stand there taking it from every side... wouldn't have any kind of positive feedback, other than from ppl who know this (is a insane advantage in 4v4) and don't want the advantage taken away...

tbh i'd almost like to see the old revenge come back, just so these centurion gank squads would run like babies and suck thier thumbs.. lol