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Hillbill79
04-29-2017, 07:40 PM
Because its lame as f...

2v2 is far more fun... and for those... Honourable players....... where is the honour in watching a team mate die... where is the honour in losing because of something in your head?


You break the game mode... bots don't adhere to it either.

I will gank you if I can, I will defend my team mate, I will switch opponents if my team mates class is at a disadvantage.

We shall improvise, we shall adapt, we shall overcome. You do not get to decide how "I" get to play a brawl.

If you quit... I will report you.

That is all. :)

CitizenPuddi
04-29-2017, 07:42 PM
So just... Like.

Do that?

What's the point of beating your chest and announcing it to the world?

Hillbill79
04-29-2017, 07:43 PM
Because I'm sick of the **** someone gets if they ever dare to play it as a 2v2..... even from your own team...

For ages ive respected the 1v1 as that seems to be the meta...nah.. not anymore.

I had an Orochi say to me earlier.... "how dare you try to res your teammate"

Because its part of the mode... that's why.

CitizenPuddi
04-29-2017, 07:54 PM
Because I'm sick of the **** someone gets if they ever dare to play it as a 2v2..... even from your own team...

For ages ive respected the 1v1 as that seems to be the meta...nah.. not anymore.

I had an Orochi say to me earlier.... "how dare you try to res your teammate"

Because its part of the mode... that's why.

just wait for ranked

all of those honor rules will go straight out the window

not much anybody can do about it until then

Hillbill79
04-29-2017, 07:57 PM
I'll wait.... been here since beta.... until then... i'll keep fighting 2v2. :)

Everyone can do something about it... they can take brawl for what it is... a brawl, not 1 or 2 duels.

Hormly
04-29-2017, 08:06 PM
So just... Like.

Do that?

What's the point of beating your chest and announcing it to the world?

A forum is a place where peopl express their views and opinions, much like how you just did sir.

some people

xNioh
04-29-2017, 08:07 PM
Yo dude, sometimes is better watch from the side and then make a 1vs1 insted of 2vs1 and make enemy get revenge.
A good player will beat you and your team mate if he will have revenge mode.
I like to let this with honor.
If you want a orgy , go to skrimish.

Hillbill79
04-29-2017, 08:09 PM
2v2 is 2v2.

Not an orgy...... I don't like skirmish mode really. Its my least played mode.

Revenge is easy to beat.... back off, don't get hit.

If you want 1v1, go to duel.

There is no "I" in Team.


Yo dude, sometimes is better watch from the side and then make a 1vs1 insted of 2vs1 and make enemy get revenge.
A good player will beat you and your team mate if he will have revenge mode.
I like to let this with honor.
If you want a orgy , go to skrimish.

CitizenPuddi
04-29-2017, 08:17 PM
A forum is a place where peopl express their views and opinions, much like how you just did sir.

some people

i mean... yeah, sure

but discussion forums are generally set aside for discussion

this was more of an announcement than anything if you wanna get technical

some people

Hillbill79
04-29-2017, 08:20 PM
Come on guys..... discuss, no need for jibes at each other.

Toxic communities cant get better while toxicity remains.

Respect others view points, debate it all you like... no need for disrespect.

We are nothing but pixels on a screen after all. :)

CitizenPuddi
04-29-2017, 08:24 PM
Come on guys..... discuss, no need for jibes at each other.

Toxic communities cant get better while toxicity remains.

Respect anothers view point, debate it all you like... no need for disrespect at.

We are nothing but pixels on a screen after all. :)

word

not sure what's left to discuss tho

the honor crowd is mostly imports from dark souls, and i've already had more than a few 10+page discussions on the matter (should check those threads out, some were pretty insightful)

they're pretty set in their ways and no amount of discussion is going to change their minds-- at least until ranked gets released, where they'll have no choice but to dump their self-gimped ways if they want to stay competitive

Hillbill79
04-29-2017, 08:34 PM
word

not sure what's left to discuss tho

the honor crowd is mostly imports from dark souls, and i've already had more than a few 10+page discussions on the matter (should check those threads out, some were pretty insightful)

they're pretty set in their ways and no amount of discussion is going to change their minds-- at least until ranked gets released, where they'll have no choice but to dump their self-gimped ways if they want to stay competitive

I have read/followed a lot of threads on the subject... initially, I didn't mind playing the 1v1 meta... but, frankly, its boring as hell now... I can tolerate it very little anymore..

Never played dark souls... don't think I want to either from what I have read on here.

Not my cup of tea. :)

CandleInTheDark
04-29-2017, 09:15 PM
Eh I do my own thing, like an opponent once went running towards the other fight, I caught her, kicked her off a ledge, got wow spam, helped corner my other opponent so he had less room to move, had a stab when his back was turned, got wow spammed when he got killed, thing there is who took me towards that ledge and the other fight? Duel I try not to enviro kill unless the other obviously goes for it, but as soon as it is a team game anything goes.

Hillbill79
04-29-2017, 09:18 PM
Exactly... team game... Anything goes.

Fight to win.

Same for duel... enviros are there to be used... a good player wont let you...


Eh I do my own thing, like an opponent once went running towards the other fight, I caught her, kicked her off a ledge, got wow spam, helped corner my other opponent so he had less room to move, had a stab when his back was turned, got wow spammed when he got killed, thing there is who took me towards that ledge and the other fight? Duel I try not to enviro kill unless the other obviously goes for it, but as soon as it is a team game anything goes.

CandleInTheDark
04-29-2017, 09:29 PM
Exactly... team game... Anything goes.

Fight to win.

Same for duel... enviros are there to be used... a good player wont let you...

There is also the fact I have a shorter range gb ;) I only got the valk because I can gb on the move.

Butonfly
04-29-2017, 09:55 PM
Duelers ruin brawl. It's not just that they want to do their 1v1, but when someone wants to brawl, they get uppity, the teammates pulls off, and the other two run a full gank so they can carry on their "1v1's" unhindered after. This devolves into griefing.

It's real simple. If you want to 1v1, go to duel. But there's no way to disentify these players from ruining brawl, so there's no point trying to change it.

The solution is to just not play Brawl.

Hillbill79
04-29-2017, 10:11 PM
Ill keep playing it... my way...

:)


Duelers ruin brawl. It's not just that they want to do their 1v1, but when someone wants to brawl, they get uppity, the teammates pulls off, and the other two run a full gank so they can carry on their "1v1's" unhindered after. This devolves into griefing.

It's real simple. If you want to 1v1, go to duel. But there's no way to disentify these players from ruining brawl, so there's no point trying to change it.

The solution is to just not play Brawl.

SlashingElbow
04-29-2017, 11:19 PM
Lol i only respect it if i see the other team do it first or else im ganking the **** out of you.. Im supposed to let my brother in arms die because of some fake honor code?

UbiJurassic
04-29-2017, 11:43 PM
https://media2.giphy.com/media/8WAaTb100QiDC/giphy.gif

Gray360UK
04-30-2017, 12:03 AM
https://media2.giphy.com/media/8WAaTb100QiDC/giphy.gif

+10 cool points for using a Breakfast Club gif. I approve.

bmason1000
04-30-2017, 02:38 AM
I recently had a team mate in elimination back off after i finished my opponent and came in to help with theirs. Second round he started bashing me until i walked off and let him 1v1. Brawl i kinda get? I guess? But elimination? That seems very silly.

CandleInTheDark
04-30-2017, 02:44 AM
My team lost the first round in elimination, figured we needed to change things up so I ran to a fight next across the way, they were still staring off some five seconds after the round started, I had stealth, put a blade in the back of my opponent and got wow spam from both of them. I refuse to do it in brawl I am not doing it in elimination either.

That_guy44
04-30-2017, 03:01 AM
I love when I attack my teammates` opponent and instead of defending they spam "Wow!". Like the thought never even occurred to some people that they may need to learn to fight two opponents at once in brawl.

Hillbill79
04-30-2017, 01:00 PM
Just called scum, for res'ing a team mate.

Its a sad world we live in.

CoyoteXStarrk
04-30-2017, 01:22 PM
Did the Brawl order yesterday.

Had 3 matches of quality respectful 1v1 brawl gameplay. I thank god most people play the game mode properly otherwise those orders would be obnoxious as hell.


Are there scrubs who can only win via 2v1? Of course there are, but luckily they are in the minority.

Hillbill79
04-30-2017, 01:31 PM
In what possible way, is fighting 2 duels in a 2v2 "Brawl" the proper way?

What it is, is just how some people like to play it... not how it was intended to be played.

I don't need to 2v1 to win... but I like a 2v2 fight... I even like having 2 against me..... sometimes I win, sometimes I don't. Still fun though.


Did the Brawl order yesterday.

Had 3 matches of quality respectful 1v1 brawl gameplay. I thank god most people play the game mode properly otherwise those orders would be obnoxious as hell.


Are there scrubs who can only win via 2v1? Of course there are, but luckily they are in the minority.

CoyoteXStarrk
04-30-2017, 01:35 PM
In what possible way, is fighting 2 duels in a 2v2 "Brawl" the proper way?

What it is, is just how some people like to play it... not how it was intended to be played.

I don't need to 2v1 to win... but I like a 2v2 fight... I even like having 2 against me..... sometimes I win, sometimes I don't. Still fun though.

Not gonna get into a never ending argument so don't expect me to retort beyond this.


I just stand by my original statement.


I thank god most people play Brawl in a honorable way. If I wanted a button mashing poo flinging crapstorm I would go to skirmish


Its the way the majority of the community plays and I pray to god it stays that way. :)

Hillbill79
04-30-2017, 01:37 PM
2v2 is nothing like a 4v4 in how it plays, it is not a heavy spam fest at all.

Honourable? Letting your team mate die, in a team game is not honourable.

Maybe Ubi should explain how they intended it to be played......


Not gonna get into a never ending argument.


I just stand by my original statement.


I thank god most people play Brawl in a honorable way. If I wanted a button mashing poo flinging crapstorm I would go to skirmish ;)

CoyoteXStarrk
04-30-2017, 01:39 PM
2v2 is nothing like a 4v4 in how it plays, it is not a heavy spam fest at all.

Honourable? Letting your team mate die, in a team game is not honourable.

Maybe Ubi should explain how they intended it to be played......

Funnny you say that lol the devs and the mods have now stated on multiple occasions that they merely gave us the tools to play with and they will let us play how we the players choose how to play.


So no thats not gonna happen either.


You guys just need to accept most players wanna play Brawl that way. Its not gonna change anytime soon. :)

CitizenPuddi
04-30-2017, 01:45 PM
Maybe Ubi should explain how they intended it to be played......

They already have.

I can't find the post, but if I remember right it basically boiled down to, "Hey man, leave us out of this, people are going to play how they want to play no matter what anybody says."

Which is true.

They also hinted at future game modes that might make both parties happy, so that's something to look forward to.

Honorable players will gimp themselves and turn 2v2 brawl into 1v1+1v1 dual duel no matter what anybody tells them.

At least until ranked becomes a thing.

It was actually after a long-winded thread with Coyote that I realized this, so I figured it best to just wait 'til ranked and leave the largely unnecessary and unproductive arguments on the matter off the board until complaints of "dishonor in ranked" start cropping up.

CoyoteXStarrk
04-30-2017, 01:46 PM
At least until ranked becomes a thing.


People think that once Ranked gets here Honor play will disappear.


Its not gonna happen. It won't be as widespread, but if you think its gonna disappear you are gonna be disappointed lol


There will be a substantial amount of players who will take honor even MORE seriously at that point. Myself included.

CitizenPuddi
04-30-2017, 01:50 PM
People think that once Ranked gets here Honor play will disappear.


Its not gonna happen. It won't be as widespread, but if you think its gonna disappear you are gonna be disappointed lol


There will be a substantial amount of players who will take honor even MORE seriously at that point. Myself included.

More competitive players will climb the ranks.

Being more competitive typically means more going balls to the wall do anything to win and less "step back and lower my chances of ranking up".

I'm just putting two and two together, chief.

CoyoteXStarrk
04-30-2017, 01:53 PM
More competitive players will climb the ranks.

Being more competitive typically means more going balls to the wall do anything to win and less "step back and lower my chances of ranking up".

I'm just putting two and two together, chief.

Not saying you aren't.


Just saying their will be plenty of players myself included still playing with honor in Brawl Ranked regardless of how my teammate or enemies wanna play. I will play how I wanna play and so will plenty of others.


Even if that means I lose and I take my teammate down with me. Not gonna change my playstyle based on some imaginary ranking system.

CitizenPuddi
04-30-2017, 01:58 PM
Even if that means I lose and I take my teammate down with me.

Which very well could be considered griefing-- just giving you a heads up on that, but nobody has any idea how Ubisoft plans to handle stuff like that for ranked so maybe not idk.

"Playing the way you want to play" that winds up becoming a detriment to your team is reportable as griefing in just about every competitive game I can think of.

CoyoteXStarrk
04-30-2017, 02:02 PM
Which very well could be considered griefing-- just giving you a heads up on that, but nobody has any idea how Ubisoft plans to handle stuff like that for ranked so maybe not idk.

"Playing the way you want to play" that winds up becoming a detriment to your team is reportable as griefing in just about every competitive game I can think of.

Ubisoft is NEVER going to punish people for playing with Honor.


If I was spamming emotes along a edge not even trying to win that is one thing, but if you think anyone is gonna get banned because they respect the 1v1 you are dreaming lol


Its never gonna happen and you know it.

Hillbill79
04-30-2017, 02:12 PM
some imaginary Honour system.

Fixed that for you.

CitizenPuddi
04-30-2017, 02:12 PM
Ubisoft is NEVER going to punish people for playing with Honor.


If I was spamming emotes along a edge not even trying to win that is one thing, but if you think anyone is gonna get banned because they respect the 1v1 you are dreaming lol


Its never gonna happen and you know it.

i never said anything about banning, and you and i both know that "honor" rules are different from everyone that follows them and it's not all about "respecting the 1v1 in this 2v2 mode"

alls i know is that if I'm locked in a difficult 1v1 and get killed, and then my teammate that stood back and watched the slaughter gets killed too and we both lose because if it-- I'm going to report it, because my teammate's conscious decision to not lend a hand caused our defeat.

same thing goes for if i'm on the other side of that scenario

i'd be sorely disappointed if my teammate died and the enemy didn't press their advantage.

because that's what all parties signed up for when they clicked on "2v2 brawl"

CoyoteXStarrk
04-30-2017, 02:15 PM
i never said anything about banning, and you and i both know that "honor" rules are different from everyone that follows them and it's not all about "respecting the 1v1 in this 2v2 mode"

alls i know is that if I'm locked in a difficult 1v1 and get killed, and then my teammate that stood back and watched the slaughter gets killed too and we both lose because if it-- I'm going to report it, because my teammate's conscious decision to not lend a hand caused our defeat.

same thing goes for if i'm on the other side of that scenario

i'd be sorely disappointed if my teammate died and the enemy didn't press their advantage.

Even IF the Devs came out and said its not okay to respect the 1v1 and they will punish it etc etc


I would simply just target the opponent and maybe swing my weapon a few times. I will not under any circumstance no matter what is on the line jump on an enemy 2v1 in Brawl and give it my all to kill them that way. I just won't.



I take solace in the fact there are thousands of players just like me and that there is no conceivable 100% accurate way to punish the people who play like we do :)

RatedChaotic
04-30-2017, 02:23 PM
You paid for the game. Play it however you like bro. If the other team gets upset. So be it. They can go find another match with players that play the way they want. It doesnt mean you have too. They qued knowing its a brawl not a duel. If they want dual duels they can go find players with a similar mindset.

CitizenPuddi
04-30-2017, 02:23 PM
Even IF the Devs came out and said its not okay to respect the 1v1 and they will punish it etc etc


I would simply just target the opponent and maybe swing my weapon a few times. I will not under any circumstance no matter what is on the line jump on an enemy 2v1 in Brawl and give it my all to kill them that way. I just won't.



I take solace in the fact there are thousands of players just like me and that there is no conceivable 100% accurate way to punish the people who play like we do :)

you're stubborn and won't adapt on this front, and that's fine

honorable players likely won't commit to winning and ranking up, so there's a good chance i (and others that don't play with honor) won't have to climb very far to get away from it almost entirely

just like how i dont have to deal with attack torbjorn, battle mercy, and people that don't take flash because "my escape is in my kit lol" anymore, it works out

Gray360UK
04-30-2017, 02:24 PM
I take solace in the fact there are thousands of players just like me and that there is no conceivable 100% accurate way to punish the people who play like we do :)

A couple of hundred maybe, I'm not sure there are thousands left playing the game :p

CoyoteXStarrk
04-30-2017, 02:25 PM
you're stubborn and won't adapt on this front, and that's fine

honorable players likely won't commit to winning and ranking up, so there's a good chance i (and others that don't play with honor) won't have to climb very far to get away from it almost entirely

just like how i dont have to deal with attack torbjorn and battle mercy anymore, it works out

Hey man if it makes you feel better to think that then go for it.


But you know as well as I do no matter the rank there will be honor players. Just like no matter the rank there will be scrub players who got carried to their rank just like every other ranked mode in the history of ranked modes.

CitizenPuddi
04-30-2017, 02:29 PM
Hey man if it makes you feel better to think that then go for it.


But you know as well as I do no matter the rank there will be honor players. Just like no matter the rank there will be scrub players who got carried to their rank just like every other ranked mode in the history of ranked modes.

no doubt

im just looking forward to it being -waaaaaay- less common

and the juicy discussions of "dishonor in ranked" that are almost certain to crop up

CoyoteXStarrk
04-30-2017, 02:30 PM
no doubt

im just looking forward to it being -waaaaaay- less common

and the juicy discussions of "dishonor in ranked" that are almost certain to crop up

So long as there are enough of us to make life miserable for everyone else I will be content :)

CitizenPuddi
04-30-2017, 02:31 PM
So long as there are enough of us to make life miserable for everyone else I will be content :)

that's a pretty crappy attitude y u do taht

Hillbill79
04-30-2017, 02:34 PM
Thing is, you wont... you'll just get smashed by those not adhering to your way of playing... then you'll be on here complaining again. :)


So long as there are enough of us to make life miserable for everyone else I will be content :)

CoyoteXStarrk
04-30-2017, 02:36 PM
that's a pretty crappy attitude y u do taht

Because outside of the Honor crowd people think winning = good at the game.


And that isn't true in most games. Especially at a mode like Brawl. The better team doesn't always win, but fighting with honor gives the best team the better chance.


if people need to get wrecked and get mad before they realize this then so be it.


That it for me tonight though guys. I need to get some sleep at some point. Catch you all in another thread.

CoyoteXStarrk
04-30-2017, 02:40 PM
Thing is, you wont... you'll just get smashed by those not adhering to your way of playing... then you'll be on here complaining again. :)

Sorry but i'm not complaining lol


You are the one that made the thread about brawl being totes best when played 2v2.


Too bad the majority of players don't care what you have to say and will continue playing it the honorable way lol



you misspelled something

ftfy


Exactly! Glad we can finally agree on something.

CitizenPuddi
04-30-2017, 02:40 PM
Because outside of the Honor crowd people think winning = good at the game.

i mean...

that's usually the standard metric


And that isn't true in most games. Especially at a mode like Brawl. The better team duelists don't always win, but fighting with honor gives the best team duelists the better chance.


if people need to get wrecked and get mad before they realize this then so be it.


That it for me tonight though guys. I need to get some sleep at some point. Catch you all in another thread.

fixed a a couple of grammatical errors for you, friend

CoyoteXStarrk
04-30-2017, 02:42 PM
fixed a a couple of grammatical errors for you, friend

You gotta be quicker than that mate.

I responded to your first post before you deleted it in order to post this one to sound a bit more edgy :)

CoyoteXStarrk
04-30-2017, 02:45 PM
i mean...

that's usually the standard


Not its not lol not in a game like this.


To put it another way the Cleveland Browns won a couple games last year. Does that make them the better team than the ones they beat?


No. It doesn't. It just means in that moment that day in those circumstances they won.


There is a difference between winning and being good.

Alustar.
04-30-2017, 02:47 PM
Did I just read that right. Winning a match does not mean you played better? THEN HOW FICK DID I WIN!?

And here I thought I was starting to play right since I was winning more matches, but that's wrong? Should I be losing more in order to claim I'm getting better?

CoyoteXStarrk
04-30-2017, 02:49 PM
Did I just read that right. Winning a match does not mean you played better? THEN HOW FICK DID I WIN!?

And here I thought I was starting to play right since I was winning more matches, but that's wrong? Should I be losing more in order to claim I'm getting better?

If you read closer you would understand :rolleyes:


You can win a match and still be worse overall than the team you beat. Look to my Browns example.

Hillbill79
04-30-2017, 02:49 PM
Majority of players eh? Is that some figure you like to have in your head? Based on?


Sorry but i'm not complaining lol


You are the one that made the thread about brawl being totes best when played 2v2.


Too bad the majority of players don't care what you have to say and will continue playing it the honorable way lol





Exactly! Glad we can finally agree on something.

Alustar.
04-30-2017, 02:51 PM
Not its not lol not in a game like this.


To put it another way the Cleveland Browns won a couple games last year. Does that make them the better team than the ones they beat?


No. It doesn't. It just means in that moment that day in those circumstances they won.


There is a difference between winning and being good.


Now I honestly gotta go. You baited me into posting more I'll give you that much.

There is a big difference in arguing which team is theoretically better than another, that's an opinion. But for the. Browns to win, they had to play better tha
The other team. The only time (using your football reference) that I've seen a team play like **** and still win, it took the other team making dumb mistakes. So even then the losing team didn't play as effectively. In short making them, at that moment, the lesser team.

CoyoteXStarrk
04-30-2017, 02:53 PM
Majority of players eh? Is that some figure you like to have in your head? Based on?

You mean other than the fact 90% of the matches on brawl I play its Honorable opponents?


You mean other than the fact that Honorable Brawlers are so prevalent that these threads keep popping up?


You mean other than the fact that Honorable Brawlers are so popular that the Devs have had one more than one occasion comment about how they feel about it?



Oh yeah. Clearly Honorable players are a minority issue :rolleyes:

CitizenPuddi
04-30-2017, 02:54 PM
You gotta be quicker than that mate.

whoop, so i do


I responded to your first post before you deleted it in order to post this one to sound a bit more edgy :)

that is literally what happened, lol


Not its not lol not in a game like this.


To put it another way the Cleveland Browns won a couple games last year. Does that make them the better team than the ones they beat?


No. It doesn't. It just means in that moment that day in those circumstances they won.


There is a difference between winning and being good.


Now I honestly gotta go. You baited me into posting more I'll give you that much.

winning and being good absolutely go hand-in-hand, basically married tho

i dont think anybody so far is suggesting that the cleveland browns are super skilled as per your example

being able to win consistently over long periods of time lends to the notion that one is skilled, and can be used as proof that one is good at something

like...

i've pooped out maybe four or five beautiful welds in all the time i've owned a welding machine

never will anybody be fooled into thinking im good at welding by looking at those and the multitude of gouged metal abortions i've produced over the years

however i -can- say that i am a skilled programmer, what with the years of consistently doing it well and making a living off of it and such

CoyoteXStarrk
04-30-2017, 02:55 PM
Majority of players eh? Is that some figure you like to have in your head? Based on?

You mean other than the fact 90% of the matches on brawl I play its Honorable opponents?


You mean other than the fact that Honorable Brawlers are so prevalent that these threads keep popping up?


You mean other than the fact that Honorable Brawlers are so popular that the Devs have had one more than one occasion comment about how they feel about it?



Oh yeah. Clearly Honorable players are a minority issue :rolleyes:



In short making them, at that moment, the lesser team.


Exactly.

The winning team is better, but only in that moment. A single match is not enough to tell the better team, but an honorable brawl is better at telling which team has the more skilled players.


A pair of skilled duelists are more talented and skillful over 2 randoms that are REALLY good at spamming the same combos and buttons over and over on a single opponent who barely gets a chance to fight back.

Alustar.
04-30-2017, 02:56 PM
If you read closer you would understand :rolleyes:


You can win a match and still be worse overall than the team you beat. Look to my Browns example.

If I win a match, it means at that moment I played better. If I lose a match, I made mistakes that cost me my win. This I underperformed in comparison, and was the lesser player. I'm not going to argue an arbitrary opinion about who's a better gamer.
Outside of hackers and cheats, I can't support the opinion that a winner I didn't play better. That's what sore losers say. Didn't we learn that in kindergarten?

CoyoteXStarrk
04-30-2017, 02:58 PM
If I win a match, it means at that moment I played better. If I lose a match, I made mistakes that cost me my win. This I underperformed in comparison, and was the lesser player. I'm not going to argue an arbitrary opinion about who's a better gamer.
Outside of hackers and cheats, I can't support the opinion that a winner I didn't play better. That's what sore losers say. Didn't we learn that in kindergarten?

Not saying a winner didn't PLAY better.


I am saying the winner isn't always BETTER overall.


Sometimes the bad players/Teams win because of luck and randomness. It happens.


My original point is Winning doesn't equal being good.

Alustar.
04-30-2017, 03:03 PM
Exactly.

The winning team is better, but only in that moment. A single match is not enough to tell the better team, but an honorable brawl is better at telling which team has the more skilled players.


A pair of skilled duelists are more talented and skillful over 2 randoms that are REALLY good at spamming the same combos and buttons over and over on a single opponent who barely gets a chance to fight back.

Fist off assuming that every pair that engages in brawl is a button mashing monkey is fallible as that not the case, and those that do spam overheads get rekt. Consictently. It's easy to block mindless overhead spam and punish with the eventual revenge.

An"honorable brawl" is still only good to tell which players play well individually.
A brawl is there to showcase the effectiveness of a pair of players and how they work together.
If you want tiered combat that locks you out of engaging an enemy while he is dealing with another, then ask for a game mode like that. Stop trying to say every team that kills you in brawl are just a bunch of mindless spamming Neanderthals

CitizenPuddi
04-30-2017, 03:04 PM
My original point is Winning doesn't equal being good.

there's a reason they don't give trophies and prize money to teams that won a couple of times because luck

CoyoteXStarrk
04-30-2017, 03:05 PM
Yeah this conversation is going nowhere. You won't be able to convince me 2 guys jumping on 1 person and winning is skill based and I obviously won't be able to convince you Honorable Brawls have merit and are more skill based.



We will just have to agree to disagree. Have a good one.

Alustar.
04-30-2017, 03:06 PM
Not saying a winner didn't PLAY better.


I am saying the winner isn't always BETTER overall.


Sometimes the bad players/Teams win because of luck and randomness. It happens.


My original point is Winning doesn't equal being good.

You do know that applies to 1v1s as well. So why are implying that only applies to 2v2? Is that your defense? The only true test of someone's skill at a game is how well they can beat an opponent in 1v1

CitizenPuddi
04-30-2017, 03:12 PM
You won't be able to convince me 2 guys jumping on 1 person and winning is skill based

you focus too much on that, nobody is trying to convince you that outnumbering your opponent is skillful

it's the fight leading up to the 2v1 where most of the real skill lies, and determines the team's skill as a team

the 2v1 at the end is pretty much the "cool we won let's mop this up and finish it" phase, lol

in no other game is the true skill measured after other factors (such as being outnumbered) kick in

it's not skillful for master yi to press q over a chain of already-almost-dead enemies

it's not skillful for 5 counter-terrorists to firing-squad the last enemy standing

i dont think anybody is claiming that it is, it's pretty well acknowledged that it's just cleaning up the mess at that last phase of whatever game

Alustar.
04-30-2017, 03:17 PM
you focus too much on that

it's the fight leading up to the 2v1 where most of the real skill lies, and determines the team's skill as a team

the 2v1 at the end is pretty much the "cool we won let's mop this up and finish it" phase, lol

Even then if you aren't careful you can lose. I've got footage of a nobushi and orochi pair, I took out the Nobushi quick and was making my way to the orochi when he ducked the other way to double back and revive her. I was last man standing and was now about to be victim of a 2v1. I kept my cool and waited for a revenge pop, then killed them both.

CitizenPuddi
04-30-2017, 03:22 PM
Even then if you aren't careful you can lose. I've got footage of a nobushi and orochi pair, I took out the Nobushi quick and was making my way to the orochi when he ducked the other way to double back and revive her. I was last man standing and was now about to be victim of a 2v1. I kept my cool and waited for a revenge pop, then killed them both.

and i bet that clutch victory was satisfying af (unless we're talking pre-nerf revenge, 'cause then it's just like yeah okay whatever man)

Alustar.
04-30-2017, 03:31 PM
It was post revenge, but also duel/brawl don't use gear scores, so even then it wouldn't have mattered. But yeah, they started tag teaming me regularly after that. Only died twice the whole match. Once to a ledge and once cause I was at a bar of health and focused on the orochi, didn't see the nobushi come I. And snag the kill.
Even still. That failure to keep my eyes around me was my fault. It doesn't make the pair I was up against garbage and ****ty spammers who mindlessly gank.

CandleInTheDark
04-30-2017, 04:15 PM
There are some of us that will always play it 2v2. I might get wow spam from an enemy I just left to join the two fights, I might get my partner saying sorry and laying into me at the end of the round (though I will point out it didn't stop her playing the situation to win, so not so noble after all) but it is a 2v2 fight and anything goes in that. I find it very selfish to expect people who wanted a team battle without gear score, knowing that if they wanted 1v1 they could have gone to duel for that, to play by an imaginary honour system. I just had someone wow spam me because they walked away from the scene we were all dropped in the forest and expected me to follow rather than take the obvious 2v1 in the fight he walked away from in the first place. Brawl is not set up as a system where the pairs are locked away from each other and I am no longer going to let anyone force me to play it that way, get your own custom matches in groups or ask the devs for your own system because it only takes one to decide they aren't playing by that BS and I will be that one every brawl I am in.

Goat3_Saeko
04-30-2017, 04:17 PM
There is no honor in 2v2 and 4v4 modes there is no reason to let them do 1v1 wtf? I have even heard ppl not to use feast before the 1st fight WTF? Ppl you lost it ... Even when ppl stats in there 11st opponent to do 1v1 is too much

Alustar.
04-30-2017, 04:39 PM
Any random brawl I'm in, after I kill my target, I survey the match. If it looks like my partner is obviously winning, I'll just creep and fck with the guys head. If it's an even fight, I'll drop into guard and throw out feints with an occasional bleed. If my teammate is losing you better believe helping. Better yet if I get to the encounter just before an execution (and you see the ominous PK lurking in the back) and you go for it. That's a freebie.

I get it you want the cool animation, but do you know how much MORE bad *** you look when you drop a fresh corpse and ready up for the next contender? I do. It ****s with me just as much as it ****s with the people I do it too now. Because it shows that not only are you not single minded enough to get tunnel vision, but it shows your awareness.

CandleInTheDark
04-30-2017, 04:51 PM
I get it you want the cool animation, but do you know how much MORE bad *** you look when you drop a fresh corpse and ready up for the next contender? I do. It ****s with me just as much as it ****s with the people I do it too now. Because it shows that not only are you not single minded enough to get tunnel vision, but it shows your awareness.

Case in point, in dominion, I was playing berserker (so I didn't even have stealth up which has been the source of me running into a zone right after someone has run right past me because I wasn't on their mini map), someone finished off a teammate, I was right there and he went for execution anyhow, forward dash heavy from my berserker followed, I executed him and promptly revived my teammate. Free execution because he made himself defenceless for four seconds.

Alchemist..
04-30-2017, 06:43 PM
1st off all 2v2 is not designed properly. How to play 2v2 when I and my partner start on two different ends of the map? The game starts with two 1v1 duels. Should I run to the other end of the map to help my partner? And be killed by it if I play slower character? Once i won my duel it is no longer 2v2 but 1v2 And that is not fun because in 90% the opponent is swept away. It is not surprising that everyone is playing like that because it is just the logic. You play two duels 1v1 not 2v2. First of all, maps should be bigger and teams should start side by side. Then you can start playing 2v2

Joshhhuaaa-SC
04-30-2017, 07:34 PM
This game will be dead before ranked even comes. gg.

That_guy44
05-01-2017, 05:27 AM
Then you are a fool and you are the kind of player that forces players to leave to match due to their team not wanting to behave like a TEAM.


I don't give watery fart what your secret MLG gut sense is telling you, if common sense says group up swallow your pride and group the **** up like a competent player

What this guy said