View Full Version : Revenge nerf went too far.

04-08-2017, 01:32 PM
TL : DR at the bottom
Just to make sure we're all on the same page I will simply copy and paste the patch changes;

Attack and Defense stats no longer apply when in Revenge mode. Only the Revenge Attack and Revenge Defense stats apply when in Revenge.
Debuff Resistance will no longer reduce the Guardbreak Counter window of opportunity.
Revenge gain by Defense is now applied only when you block or parry a hit.
Revenge gain by Injury is now only applied when you get revenge from taking damage.


Revenge mode Defense (found on Weapon slot 2, usually hilt)
maximum bonus decreased from 48.2% down to 32.1%
maximum penalty decreased from -16.1% to -10.6%
Revenge gain by Defense (found on Weapon slot 2, usually hilt)
maximum bonus decreased from 36.2% down to 24.1%
maximum penalty decreased from -12.1% to -8.0%
Revenge mode attack (found on Weapon part 3, usually guard)
maximum bonus decreased from 48.2% down to 24.1%
maximum penalty decreased from -16.1% to -8.0%
Revenge mode duration (found on Helm part)
maximum bonus decreased from 54.0% down to 25.0%%
maximum penalty decreased from -18.0% to -8.3%

First thing to make clear, I am not saying revenge was fine as it is, I don't think there was anyone who believed revenge was acceptable in its former state... What I am going to advocate here, is that the nerf that was put in place not only went too far but was also the wrong nerf that was needed.

(This bit below depends on you knowing how to deal with someone with active revenge (Blocking, parrying, backing off, guard breaks etc)
Secondly, let me explain why I believe revenge is an essential mechanic in the game and its application;
Simply put, it is to discourage roaming gangs of ganking, as many experienced players know and have had happen to them, you're about to beat your opponent, its fairly one sided, then your ally decides they want to join in, so they start swinging into their block enough to give them revenge, and then all of a sudden you're on the ground and this sure kill is taken away from you.
It is a comeback feature and we all know this, so we don't gank unless our ally is losing that fight...

Those playing dominion properly and boosting a point know full well at some point you're going to have to defend it against 2+ people, if you're vastly better than them, you'll probably win, but if you're facing people of equal skill you're going to have your work cut out for you... But with revenge you have a better chance. Same goes for elimination, we've all had that time when its just you left vs 2+, sometimes they're nice and let you 1v1 it out until the end, but a lot of the time its now you vs the lot of them at once, revenge gives you a chance.

Now with explanations gone, lets explain the rights and wrongs with the nerf and what they should have done.

Where they went right;
The fixes, these are all right decisions to make, and frankly, after my 245 hours of playing this game, the fact that my default attack and defence was also applied during Revenge was something I was actually unaware of... And I think many other players also did not know this.
The revenge gain from incorrect sources, this was also a right decision, as it is a bug and shouldn't be in the game.

Where they went wrong;
The problem is, even with these fixes, they still decided to nerf everything about revenge by roughly 50% all round. What should have happened was the bug fix goes in, see how it plays out from there, then if the defence, attack and time were still too much, then change these gear stats, they did it all at once and that is where the issue lies, you can't fix a games core structure while the bugs are still effecting gameplay mechanics.
Maybe in the end we find that attack defence and time still needed nerfing with the bug fixes, but now we'll never know, now we have an extremely weak revenge in comparison that now people can run around ganking without penalty.

Here is how revenge should've been nerfed;
Bugs fixed, attack and defence normal stats no longer affecting revenge attack and defence, see how it plays out, fix at a later date if needed.
Players with revenge can no longer knock people down using knock back abilities (Warlord headbutt, valk shield bash, Nobushi kick, Warden shoulder bash etc.)
Revenge should not be possible to get in a 1v1 setting.
That's it, that is all it needed in my opinion to make revenge fairer.

Direct message for Ubisoft;
We appreciate you fixing stuff, obviously we want bugs cleaned out and balance restored, but don't do it all at once, the bugs must be fixed first before we can really see if the balance is messed up because of the bugs or if there is a problem with the hero themselves. (Exceptions being things which are completely unaffected by bugs such as Warlord headbutts and PK light spam)

Didn't need to fix bugs and nerf effects at the same time do bugs first and also don't allow knock backs to knock down people when you have revenge.
Revenge not possible for 1v1s in any game type.