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View Full Version : Map design disadvantages long range Characters



RunnerRunner22
04-04-2017, 09:40 AM
Playing mainly duel and Brawl as Nobushi, a lot (if not most) of the maps put me at a major disadvantage from the get-go. There are so many bridges, narrow paths, tight spaces and ledges, it's not even funny. When playing as Nobushi, I NEED to keep the opponents at range. She is even called a zoning character. However, the maps are to confined in the aforementioned game modes, so I just cannot do it. In most cases, I have to decide if I want to fight directly next to a ledge (or on a bridge), which is stupid, especially against certain characters, or in a space with the size of a phone booth. This map design heavily favours characters that excel at close range like the peacekeeper, whereas I am forced to fight at a range that doesn't suit my class AND, as if that wasn't bad enough, a lot of my attacks, due to the long range of the Naginata, bounce off the walls.

tl;dr: maps are too confined, we need more arena-style maps.

Yarzahn
04-04-2017, 10:33 AM
Most of the time I just end up playing Brawl with a stranger, because maps aren't as terrible.
Most of the duel arenas are literally bridges over pits or tiny rooms. Only about 1/3 of the maps are actually proper fighting rings.

CandleInTheDark
04-04-2017, 10:36 AM
It's no easier for peacekeepers, we might like to be in your personal space but we like to be in your personal space on our own terms and usually from an angle :p Especially when we don't make a habit of spamming. I hate the tower ruin with a passion.

Hillbill79
04-04-2017, 10:53 AM
Assassin classes all struggle on bridges.... we need room to dance.

Draghmar
04-04-2017, 11:01 AM
I know your pain...I always try to reposition myself if there's a space. Like running off the bridge or something.

CandleInTheDark
04-04-2017, 11:09 AM
That only works so well, we get more lateral space but I am lucky I don't gas out often because there is very little room to back off except back onto the bridge.

chiller2k3
04-04-2017, 11:14 AM
I main LB and I also hate it .. so often I shove, immediately stop my attack and try to give my opponent a hand that he will not fall off! I want proper fights not these "ups, sry I looked at you and you fall down the bridge"
I also can see most players do not want these narrow maps and you go to these "we better take this small 1mē fighting place instead of fighting on the bridge"

CandleInTheDark
04-04-2017, 11:26 AM
It is worse when there are two areas like that like the tower ruin, most combinations of map rotation will give you four rounds of that.

CandleInTheDark
04-04-2017, 11:38 AM
And to be clear I don't mind when there are environmental hazards like the circular saw or a pit on the edge of the map, get situational awareness, but when there is no choice, yeah it can be grating.

RunnerRunner22
04-04-2017, 11:57 AM
In those tiny rooms, conquerors are the worst. Every bash knocks you against a wall and grants him a free heavy.

Gray360UK
04-04-2017, 12:00 PM
Yeah I had to play 3 Duels last night, a mode I detest, but it was for a Daily Order and I can't pass up that easy 400 Steel.

Decided to use my Nobushi, probably my best Dueller, and the number of times the Duel was on a narrow walkway / bridge.

if you try to avoid the obvious hazard of being kicked over the edge by backing up you end up fighting with your back to a wall in a 6 foot square space where you cannot use any of the Nobushis mobility / range to your advantage. Really got sick of it.

And why so many Conquerors that are only looking for opportunities to bash you over / into / down something. Got 3 different Conquerors in a row. All with the same tactic. And people say Peacekeepers are cheesy spammers.

God I hate Duels ;)

RunnerRunner22
04-04-2017, 12:01 PM
I main LB and I also hate it .. so often I shove, immediately stop my attack and try to give my opponent a hand that he will not fall off! I want proper fights not these "ups, sry I looked at you and you fall down the bridge"
I also can see most players do not want these narrow maps and you go to these "we better take this small 1mē fighting place instead of fighting on the bridge"

Haha, good to see that I'm not the only one. Sometimes, I accidentally kick someone down a ledge and they get super angry. I didn't mean to, I swear!

CandleInTheDark
04-04-2017, 12:03 PM
Yeah I tend to duel or brawl, but I definitely avoid duel when it is in the area the tower is in when I can.

RunnerRunner22
04-04-2017, 12:37 PM
When fighting on a bridge, it really triggers me when someone intentionally throws me off the ledge although I clearly could have done the same 3 times before but didn't, since it is cheesy and cheap.

Prophit618
04-04-2017, 03:20 PM
When fighting on a bridge, it really triggers me when someone intentionally throws me off the ledge although I clearly could have done the same 3 times before but didn't, since it is cheesy and cheap.

When they do it as they're about to lose, I can't really complain. If you tried to play nice and you're about to get killed, I can't fault you for taking advantage of the ledge then.

But yeah, starting on narrow bridges is the worst. When you're in a position where getting CGBed will kill you instantly, that's pretty annoying. Especially since a lot of the times my throwing out a grab is nigh instinctual, as I'm used to using it in the generally more open settings of Dominion.

I feel even worse for Lawbringers or Conquerors who aren't trying to ledge-kill and get stuck on those stages. They lose like half of their offense due to moves that would accidentally toss someone in those situations.

massive02
04-04-2017, 03:24 PM
the level designers had a bit too much fun here and definitely need to tone it down a notch. Hopefully by season 2 we'll see more freedom for the players to actually fight.

RunnerRunner22
04-04-2017, 04:25 PM
I hope someone from Ubi takes notice. I don't see much talk about this, although to me it is a glaring issue.

Probably because the 4v4 modes have a much higher population. I can't stand those modes, however. They are unbalanced gank-fests where everybody runs a ridiculously overpowered revenge build. Elimination is kind of okay, though I wish they would disable feats there. Being one-shotted at the beginning of the final round by a Valkyrie's Javelin is not my understanding of fun or a fair fight.

CandleInTheDark
04-04-2017, 04:29 PM
I hope someone from Ubi takes notice. I don't see much talk about this, although to me it is a glaring issue.

Probably because the 4v4 modes have a much higher population. I can't stand those modes, however. They are unbalanced gank-fests where everybody runs a ridiculously overpowered revenge build. Elimination is kind of okay, though I wish they would disable feats there. Being one-shotted at the beginning of the final round by a Valkyrie's Javelin is not my understanding of fun or a fair fight.

At least revenge is being nerfed soon and might be more in the future, which going by some of the salt on the forums some people will need to get used to.

RunnerRunner22
04-04-2017, 04:45 PM
In addition to nerfing revenge, they should increase friendly fire and at the same time introduce some kind of punishment for hurting/killing team mates. This would force players to coordinate their attacks when ganging up on somebody instead of just blindly spamming attacks and unblockables.

Anyway, for me the heart of the game lies in Duel and Brawl mode. This is where the combat system shines. Nothing beats the rush of a good, clean 1v1 without gimmicks and cheese. So I really, REALLY hope that they give us better maps with enough space to actually fight. UBI PLS

RunnerRunner22
04-05-2017, 11:26 AM
Has there been any word from Ubisoft about new maps at all?

CandleInTheDark
04-05-2017, 12:08 PM
Same as with the heroes, two new maps a season.

Frappenstain
04-05-2017, 01:09 PM
Go to wide area than. Use the terrain. I always having a problem with cliffs or spike walls, and i always seek suitable zone to fight. I'm really having a hard time to understand this community. Too much needless questions and flame....

RunnerRunner22
04-05-2017, 01:17 PM
Who's flaming? Also, it is not possible to just go to a wide area, since there are no such areas on many maps, which is exactly my complaint. I don't understand your issue with this thread. You are neither forced to read it nor to comment, you know.

Helnekromancer
04-05-2017, 07:12 PM
If you play Nobushi you have to come to grips that the game will not cater to you. Just try to win on stages that are not bridges or has tons of environmental kills like the Samurai map, with a pit, cliff, fire, spiked walls, and walls to be thrown in you're never safe on that map xD. And when you are on a map with a lot of room use that to your advantage and abuse it. :)

Specialkha
04-05-2017, 07:15 PM
I would say that the title of this thread is wrong. Because, on the contrary, narrow path, bridge, etc... are an advantage for long range combat. But a disadvantage for assassin who relies on mobility to fight. Long range hero like nobushi, LB or Valk just need to keep their distance with their foe, they can't dodge what you throw at them.

Yarzahn
04-05-2017, 07:17 PM
Go to wide area than. Use the terrain. I always having a problem with cliffs or spike walls, and i always seek suitable zone to fight. I'm really having a hard time to understand this community. Too much needless questions and flame....

Have you ever played Duel game mode? You do you just make a blind reply?
Half the arenas do not have a "wide area".