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slayerh4x
02-14-2017, 12:42 PM
Hello,

I am just playing the Valk today for the first time and cant figure out how to use the Shoulder Pin ability. That icon makes no sense to me and isn't in the legend.

How do I execute this move? :confused::confused:

SethUnleashed
02-14-2017, 02:15 PM
yes it is explained right in the moveset.

the valkyrie can basically do "deflects" but they are named differently ...

so you dodge into an attack at last second and instantly press heavy attack. and i mean INSTANTLY... i feel the window to trigger shoulder pin is shorter than normal deflect-counters.

Pulver25
02-15-2017, 12:49 AM
Hi, I' ve bren trying to do this move lfor like an hour. In the description it says "block or dodge": In the cases of block It counts me as a failed parry If done too quickly or as a normal heavy attack If too slow (nothing in Between). If I tried to use it after a dodge, just normal heavy attack..

I havent seen anyone doing this move yet, and I can be doing it wrong 10-20 times ina row till It goes out, but 1 hour...

I throw the question, is it bugged??? Does anyone has been able to trigger this move or has seen it?

P.S: Its a shame, because valk moves seems nice but too slow/no damaging, feels like it lacks something and maybe this movement working as a basic mechanic is that thing...

Vunak_
02-15-2017, 01:11 AM
Shoulder Pin is not the missing link for Valk. Its not worth the risk to try and do the Dodge Counter into Shoulder Pin. Shoulder Pin does peanuts for damage and you cant chain into anything else from it. Its better to just parry into GB or Hunter's Strike. You will end up doing more damage to your opponent with those two options.

l_Azure_l
02-15-2017, 01:18 AM
Shoulder Pin is not the missing link for Valk. Its not worth the risk to try and do the Dodge Counter into Shoulder Pin. Shoulder Pin does peanuts for damage and you cant chain into anything else from it. Its better to just parry into GB or Hunter's Strike. You will end up doing more damage to your opponent with those two options.

It's the bleed effect that multiply the dmg that enemy would take which is what Valk's lacking. IMO, her deflect shouldn't be harder than parry and right now it's almost impossible that no one really rely on it.

SethUnleashed
02-15-2017, 01:19 AM
Shoulder Pin is not the missing link for Valk. Its not worth the risk to try and do the Dodge Counter into Shoulder Pin. Shoulder Pin does peanuts for damage and you cant chain into anything else from it. Its better to just parry into GB or Hunter's Strike. You will end up doing more damage to your opponent with those two options.

exactly. same is true for all deflects. the timing is too strict for the mostly miniscule benefit you get ... risk/reward just isnt there.

@Pulver25:
its the same timing as a normal deflect and it is triggered like a deflect (doding into an attack), its just worded a bit confusing.
also: from what i've tested, i FEEL like the window for the valkyries deflect seems a tiny bit shorter than it is for the other assassins AND the input-window for the shoulder-pin (heavy attack) is also shorter than it is for the other assassins.

i feel like they over-nerfed the valkyrie after the alpha and some stuff broke with it or was never updated while it was for the other classes.
i personally am not gonna play her until she gets another good look from the devs.

Miadous
02-15-2017, 05:34 AM
I started the game today ready to love the Valkyrie until they make the Berserker better, which I mained during the betas. Nope, they both suck. Going to look for a 3rd option.

Eleanor-Ripley
02-15-2017, 06:23 AM
The bleed ia actually quite awesome on assassins where it matters.
The extra damage you di once its applied isnt that much however.
I wouldnt say its impossible to time the dodge, but in most cases you end up with a regular dodge because you react too soon. Which seems flawed

Asarian.
02-24-2017, 09:21 AM
Don't bother with shoulder-pin. Dodge counters are pretty broken. The problem is they don't work like normal counters. Using it when the guard flashes doesn't actually work 9 times out of 10. Instead, each incoming attack from various classes seems to have its own tiny window where you can use a dodge counter, that has nothing to do with when it flashes like other counters. This makes it a completely unfeasible move, unless you somehow mastered the perfect reaction time to every different incoming attack in the game. I practiced for hours with the timing of them, and got fairly good, it can be done, but it isn't realistic. Especially when you consider that the actual damage from shoulder-pin really isn't that amazing anyway. It's a lot safer and a lot more realistic to just use standard light counters (followed up by another light attack or one of the dodge-light attacks) or heavy counters, which you can follow up with a heavy/bash cancel. The only advantage I found from trying to master shoulder-pin, was that when I eventually figured out how pointless it was, I'd been practicing the timing of that tiny window so much, that now normal counters are crazily easy for me to pull off.

TCTF_SWAT
02-24-2017, 09:29 AM
Shoulder pin deals 25-30 damage total...that's a nice chunk of damage.

SethUnleashed
02-24-2017, 11:00 AM
Shoulder pin deals 25-30 damage total...that's a nice chunk of damage.

not worth the risk most of the time as the timing is too strict to do it reliably if there is any sort of lag (which there always is xD)

also you can ONLY follow a shoulder-pin up with a shield-crush as the heavy attack that triggers the pin DOES count toward a shield-crush (feavy->gb) but it DOES NOT count toward a normal chain (heavy->light->anything) which is hell of a lot stupid.

also, dont EVER do shoulder-pins against nobushi light attacks as the nobushi has a faster recovery and an auto-block after you do the deflect (which is also extremely stupid and probably not intended).

also, dodging in general with the valks seems quite off imo.
the window to actually avoid an attack is really strange and more often than not you will get hit cause you dodged too soon (yeah, good reaction time will get you killed ... #logic)
i only use dodges to avoid unblockables that i cant parry.

Jagermind
02-24-2017, 11:27 AM
Hey Vikings, knight here so take what I say with a grain of salt but her shoulder pin is actually pretty useful in terms of giving more options for how to deal with an attack,

You can light attack to pseudo crushing parry in any direction, dmg is meh but it nets you a win for the exchange and sets you back to neutral.
You can dodge attack, decent dmg, can continue into a few other attacks.

But the shoulder pin, deals a decent chunk of damage, can be followed up by shield into sweep or anything you can reliably use after a shield bash. Ive only played her today but I'm looking to ramp up my hours on her, she seems really fun and I love the smoothness of her over the shoulder execution.

MORE importantly though. Her dodge mechanic auto corrects her guard into the direction she dodges. You can leave your guard on one side of your body to try to bait the attacker into attacking an open side. Even if they feint and swap to another direction once you swap your guard you can dodge in the direction of their actual attack. The moves kinda meh on its own, but it definitely has its uses.

Side note, for the love of all that is holy, start pushing the weebs back into their boxes man.

Scoregasms2286
02-24-2017, 10:36 PM
It's the bleed effect that multiply the dmg that enemy would take which is what Valk's lacking. IMO, her deflect shouldn't be harder than parry and right now it's almost impossible that no one really rely on it.

This times 1000000. I never go for Dodge blocks, because 99.9% of the time they fail vs Real players. In Lvl 3 bots, all day everyday, I seriously cant land 1 in PVP, I choose to parry instead as it is a much safer risk/return

SethUnleashed
02-25-2017, 03:03 PM
i'd love if the heavy from the shoulder pin would NOT count towards a shield-crush as its the most useless thing to do after a pin, but the ONLY thing you can transition into that gets a guaranteed hit.
the sweep after is easily dodged.

sadly, the heavy that triggers the pin does NOT count toward a normal heavy->light->anything combo
and you cannot do a guaranteed guardbreak as any guardbreak input will translate into a shield-crush and if you wait a moment and then guardbreak, it can be countered.