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HART_dreyer
07-05-2004, 04:50 PM
Hello,

Alright, since they've closed off the GD forum I'll just post this here.

I may or may not have reached the 200 victory mark without death (albeit been close numerous times), I may or may not have been shot down 10 times, which means I may or may not have 20:1 ratio, which may or may not be too shabby. I'm quite sick of this now, it takes some time to update the site with the kill log and upload the tracks every single time so I'll now be taking a long break, possibly for many months. I hope people enjoyed these tracks as otherwise I've wasted my time!

http://www.dreyermachine.com/il2/

LALALALA, ok. Later!

Regards,
dreyer
the dreyer vs. Hartmann game! (http://www.dreyermachine.com/il2/)
"Above us, there is nothing above but the stars... above us."

[This message was edited by HART_dreyer on Tue July 06 2004 at 10:21 AM.]

HART_dreyer
07-05-2004, 04:50 PM
Hello,

Alright, since they've closed off the GD forum I'll just post this here.

I may or may not have reached the 200 victory mark without death (albeit been close numerous times), I may or may not have been shot down 10 times, which means I may or may not have 20:1 ratio, which may or may not be too shabby. I'm quite sick of this now, it takes some time to update the site with the kill log and upload the tracks every single time so I'll now be taking a long break, possibly for many months. I hope people enjoyed these tracks as otherwise I've wasted my time!

http://www.dreyermachine.com/il2/

LALALALA, ok. Later!

Regards,
dreyer
the dreyer vs. Hartmann game! (http://www.dreyermachine.com/il2/)
"Above us, there is nothing above but the stars... above us."

[This message was edited by HART_dreyer on Tue July 06 2004 at 10:21 AM.]

Philipscdrw
07-05-2004, 05:02 PM
Very interesting; you're recording these tracks online, right? I've always wanted to watch PvP dogfights.

PhilipsCDRw
Grand Stenographer of the Boards.

View Cpt. Eric Brown's review of FB here (http://www.aerosociety.com/raes/news/SimReview.pdf) and discuss it here. (http://forums.ubi.com/eve/forums?a=tpc&s=400102&f=63110913&m=309109534&r=875101634#875101634)

"Nietzsche is dead." - God.

HART_dreyer
07-05-2004, 05:03 PM
Every single one is from online dogfights flying on full real servers, except Warclouds which feature partial plane tag icons at close range.

Regards,
dreyer
the dreyer vs. Hartmann game! (http://www.dreyermachine.com/il2/)
"Above us, there is nothing above but the stars... above us."

bodaw
07-05-2004, 05:04 PM
Dreyer, I enjoy your tracks very much and I try to learn as much as I can from them tracks. Thank you for taking your time to post these tracks, so newbies like myself could learn from it.

~S!~
bodaw

XyZspineZyX
07-05-2004, 05:12 PM
You want us to believe you've had 200 consecutive victories ONLINE... all vs. human players... without ONE death in the interim??

Yeah, right. Tell me another. Allow me to be the first to cough, *bull*****.

And tracks of the individual kills mean nothing but to prove each kill happened.

This sim isn't fundamentally designed well enough for a player to get 200 kills vs.other humans. Between the FM, the DM, or some AI tailgunner or AAA gun, you're going to catch a golden BB at some point.

Sorry, I simply do not believe it.

HART_dreyer
07-05-2004, 05:15 PM
That's fine, you don't need to.

Regards,
dreyer
the dreyer vs. Hartmann game! (http://www.dreyermachine.com/il2/)
"Above us, there is nothing above but the stars... above us."

PBNA-Boosher
07-05-2004, 06:19 PM
I believe you Dreyer.

Boosher
_____________________________
"So do all who live to see such times, but that is not for them to decide. All you have to decide is what to do with the time that is given to you..."
-Gandalf

JZG_Waltrip
07-05-2004, 06:35 PM
As much as I hate to admit it, I think Stigler's right. ;-)

WTE_Galway
07-05-2004, 07:07 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by JZG_Waltrip:
As much as I hate to admit it, I think Stigler's right. ;-)<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I would reserve opinion until seeing the tracks

The difficulty of achieving 200 kills online DoD would partly depend on the rules you set yourself .. if you are happy to just exit the server if the going gets messy it makes things a lot easier than if you insist on landing before exiting

if you literally followed Hartman's lead and only engaged when it was safe and you had an advantage it would make it a lot more likely you would succeed

HART_dreyer
07-05-2004, 07:27 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>The difficulty of achieving 200 kills online DoD would partly depend on the rules you set yourself .. if you are happy to just exit the server if the going gets messy it makes things a lot easier than if you insist on landing before exiting<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I don't use such a rule of course! That's the same as cheating in my opinion. I always have to land, as you'll notice on my tracks. Except a few that cuts of due to the map being changed.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>if you literally followed Hartman's lead and only engaged when it was safe and you had an advantage it would make it a lot more likely you would succeed<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I don't do that. I fly with a certain amount of risk, it would take too long to rack up victories otherwise.

Regards,
dreyer
the dreyer vs. Hartmann game! (http://www.dreyermachine.com/il2/)
"Above us, there is nothing above but the stars... above us."

patch_adams
07-05-2004, 07:32 PM
You are good but I know better pilots.

HART_dreyer
07-05-2004, 07:37 PM
I would certainly hope so!

Regards,
dreyer
the dreyer vs. Hartmann game! (http://www.dreyermachine.com/il2/)
"Above us, there is nothing above but the stars... above us."

ZG77_Nagual
07-05-2004, 07:55 PM
S! Dreyer. I'm quite sure what you are doing is possible - very difficult - but possible. Certainly not without alot of skill however.

S!

Lt.Davis
07-05-2004, 08:11 PM
Before i know what plane u fly, i'm 50:50 believe in you, but after i know your are flying 109s, than i 100% believe in you.

"Biar berputih tulang, jangan berputih mata"
Translated:
"Let the whites of your bones, but do not show the whites of your eyes"

XyZspineZyX
07-05-2004, 08:38 PM
My reason for not believing this is, I fly very carefully, always try to survive and rtb, and take only calculated risks, too, but find that the game system has all kinds of bullsh** ways to "punish" historical, smart flying: from collisions you pulled up to avoid, to IL-2 Terminator rear gunners, to ship gunners who can't miss, disappearing dots, etc., etc., etc.

I think it might be possible to do this against AI, since they are easier to "figure out" than any online opponent.... but against humans, they're too unpredictable, and they often don't fly to survive (even if you do), so they press attacks that are suicidal, creating collisions, etc.

crazyivan1970
07-05-2004, 08:39 PM
What server are you going to dreyer? Just curious.

V!
Regards,

http://blitzpigs.com/forum/images/smiles/smokin.gif

VFC*Crazyivan aka VFC*HOST

http://www.rmutt.netfirms.com/coop-ivan.jpg

http://www.rmutt.netfirms.com/vfc/home.htm

Kozhedub: In combat potential, the Yak-3, La-7 and La-9 fighters were indisputably superior to the Bf-109s and Fw-190s. But, as they say, no matter how good the violin may be, much depends on the violinist. I always felt respect for an enemy pilot whose plane I failed to down.

HART_dreyer
07-05-2004, 08:55 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Stiglr:
My reason for not believing this is, I fly very carefully, always try to survive and rtb, and take only calculated risks, too, but find that the game system has all kinds of bullsh** ways to "punish" historical, smart flying: from collisions you pulled up to avoid, to IL-2 Terminator rear gunners, to ship gunners who can't miss, disappearing dots, etc., etc., etc.

I think it might be possible to do this against AI, since they are easier to "figure out" than any online opponent.... but against humans, they're too unpredictable, and they often don't fly to survive (even if you do), so they press attacks that are suicidal, creating collisions, etc.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Show tracks to prove this "bull****" you speak of. I don't really know what you mean. A lag collision death would not be counted in my rules, however I have not yet had one occur. Also Flak placed other places than on the enemy airfield (i.e. flak in the middle of the damn map) I would not count either if it killed me. So far that hasent happened either.

Regards,
dreyer
the dreyer vs. Hartmann game! (http://www.dreyermachine.com/il2/)
"Above us, there is nothing above but the stars... above us."

HART_dreyer
07-05-2004, 08:57 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by crazyivan1970:
What server are you going to dreyer? Just curious.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Hello Ivan,

I fly in either GreaterGreen, Warclouds, Finnish Gulf Server (rearly), Swedish www.flygflottilj16.se (http://www.flygflottilj16.se) server...and I've also been to Birds of Prey full real and some other full real server I don't remember. But most of the time I use Warclouds/GG.

Regards,
dreyer
the dreyer vs. Hartmann game! (http://www.dreyermachine.com/il2/)
"Above us, there is nothing above but the stars... above us."

Red_Russian13
07-05-2004, 09:06 PM
Hart_dreyer;

I was skeptical too, when I first read about this in one of your old posts. But I actually took the time to visit your site and read your self imposed rules and have seen your listings. I didn't jump to conclusions and discount the possibility all together. Difficult, yes. Impossible, no. Lucky at times, I think probably. Keep it up and let us know how it goes. I frankly didn't think you'd make 200. Good luck!

Red Russian

pcisbest
07-05-2004, 10:47 PM
I am curious, how doese Dreyer prove that he has 200 consecutive kills without dying? Track files show the kills yes, but they dont show if he has died or not, he could have just not shown us the tracks where he dies! I am not saying you are a liear Dreyer, but I am saying it is impossible to either prove OR disprove you, which ultimately makes your accomplishment meaningless.

In other words, it would be like a track runner who broke a world record, but didnt have any witnesses or official documentation other then his own write up recording his lap time.

SpookyRuben
07-05-2004, 10:55 PM
Hi Dreyer,

Thanks for all the tracks, looking forward to seeing them, well some at least, there are an a lot of them.

It took you a lot of dedication to put your site togeather, and I am sure there are, and will be, a great number of pilots who are very appriciative of the resource you have provided.

Thanks again and Cheers,

Spook

HART_dreyer
07-05-2004, 10:55 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> posted 05-07-04 21:47
I am curious, how doese Dreyer prove that he has 200 consecutive kills without dying? Track files show the kills yes, but they dont show if he has died or not, he could have just not shown us the tracks where he dies! I am not saying you are a liear Dreyer, but I am saying it is impossible to either prove OR disprove you, which ultimately makes your accomplishment meaningless.

In other words, it would be like a track runner who broke a world record, but didnt have any witnesses or official documentation other then his own write up recording his lap time.

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


You are absolutely correct. Though it is far from meaningless. 1.) I had fun (most important part) 2.) There's now a source for LW online tracks.

People really don't need to post if they believe me or not, I DON'T CARE! Have fun.

Regards,
dreyer
the dreyer vs. Hartmann game! (http://www.dreyermachine.com/il2/)
"Above us, there is nothing above but the stars... above us."

HART_dreyer
07-05-2004, 10:58 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by SpookyRuben:
Hi Dreyer,

Thanks for all the tracks, looking forward to seeing them, well some at least, there are an a lot of them.

It took you a lot of dedication to put your site togeather, and I am sure there are, and will be, a great number of pilots who are very appriciative of the resource you have provided.

Thanks again and Cheers,

Spook<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Thanks m8!

Regards,
dreyer
the dreyer vs. Hartmann game! (http://www.dreyermachine.com/il2/)
"Above us, there is nothing above but the stars... above us."

SpookyRuben
07-06-2004, 12:07 AM
I don't have anything to add to what I said above, but felt this deserved a mention.

Just downloaded another track from your site Dreyer, fired it up and had the pleasure of watching you stick it to one of my squadies lol...

Good fun to watch, and a fine reminder that it's a small world. Thanks again.

Cheers,

Spook

janos71
07-06-2004, 12:13 AM
It is possible: I've seen guys with kill/death-ratio 50:1 on servers with real settings and statsrecord, good pilots who know how to survive a mission.

CaptainGelo
07-06-2004, 01:16 AM
you again.... http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/52.gif http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/51.gif you dont count a death if there is a lag or if you get vulched do you?......

'''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''' '''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''' '''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''' '''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''' '''
http://www.danasoft.com/sig/oleg86.jpg
'''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''' '''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''' '''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''' '''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''' '''


plane is 2slow, guns are 2weak and DM suck?...Then click here (http://www.hmp16.com/hotstuff/downloads/Justin%20Timberlake%20-%20Cry%20Me%20A%20River.mp3) | Fear british army. (http://216.144.230.195/Videos/Medium_WMP8/British_Attack.wmv)

http://img23.photobucket.com/albums/v68/wolf4ever/Animation3.gif
Bad boys, bad boys, what you gonna do, what you gonna do when they come for you..

NN_EnigmuS
07-06-2004, 02:12 AM
yup and you never fly other aircraft online like Il2 etc...for achieving objectives

i understand now why i'm often the only one trying to go to targets lol

some here must be mad for taking online game so seriously,and fly only one plane on dogfight room

anyway dogfight room meens nothing because you'are the only not want to die and lot of players only watch for fun there and kill too

anyway nice stuff if you really perform that without dying,but with posting it seems to me quite making the interesting one and the experten but anyway it's your choise

but i'm sure lot of players can beat you in 1vs1 here(not me perhaps but there is always sombody better)so...

i will fly those server dog more often hehe what is your Hl nickname?
it will be very cool to end such a record to us

the hunting is open folk!!!

http://www.nnavirex.com/public/enigmus.gif

BuzZz_WG
07-06-2004, 02:29 AM
I don't know if it's true or not. The thing I care about are your tracks. I hope you will group them sometime (like a zipfile for each week) so the downloading is a bit easier. I hope to learn a lot from your tracks.

It's fun to see a person having fun with his own role-playing-game and that's what it's all about, fun.

BREAK! BREAK!
Nevermind...

CaptainGelo
07-06-2004, 02:37 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by NN_EnigmuS:
yup and you never fly other aircraft online like Il2 etc...for achieving objectives

i understand now why i'm often the only one trying to go to targets lol

some here must be mad for taking online game so seriously,and fly only one plane on dogfight room

anyway dogfight room meens nothing because you'are the only not want to die and lot of players only watch for fun there and kill too

anyway nice stuff if you really perform that without dying,but with posting it seems to me quite making the interesting one and the experten but anyway it's your choise

but i'm sure lot of players can beat you in 1vs1 here(not me perhaps but there is always sombody better)so...

i will fly those server dog more often hehe what is your Hl nickname?
it will be very cool to end such a record to us

the hunting is open folk!!!

http://www.nnavirex.com/public/enigmus.gif <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

he always changing his nickname....

'''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''' '''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''' '''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''' '''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''' '''
http://www.danasoft.com/sig/oleg86.jpg
'''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''' '''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''' '''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''' '''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''' '''


plane is 2slow, guns are 2weak and DM suck?...Then click here (http://www.hmp16.com/hotstuff/downloads/Justin%20Timberlake%20-%20Cry%20Me%20A%20River.mp3) | Fear british army. (http://216.144.230.195/Videos/Medium_WMP8/British_Attack.wmv)

http://img23.photobucket.com/albums/v68/wolf4ever/Animation3.gif
Bad boys, bad boys, what you gonna do, what you gonna do when they come for you..

gombal40
07-06-2004, 03:04 AM
Like the tracks, People can learn from this The rest... oww well its his game isnt it?

WUAF_Badsight
07-06-2004, 03:11 AM
BOY there are a lot of knockers lol

.
__________________________________________________ __________________________
actual UBI post :
"If their is a good server with wonder woman views but historic planesets...let me know!"
http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

zjulik
07-06-2004, 04:08 AM
OK, you probably expect to get some flaming when you describe your achievements. Here is one. I downloaded and watched a couple of your tracks, and what someone else wrote about keeping in the safe until sure to have an advantage (if that was Hartmann`s tactic) is certainly what you do. Hovering at 2500m for minutes (isn`t that boring?), searching for dogfights in progress, then diving down to interrupt. In one track it seems you literally stole a kill from someone who had been pursuing a victim for some time. Not good etiquette in my book.

Secondly, you would perhaps last an evening, but certainly not two, with my squad. Not all that impressed.

But kudos to you for having the nerve to brag about this! A true *virtual* ace.

Scragbat
07-06-2004, 04:13 AM
Whoa! That's a lot of kills ~S~

A little skeptical though I have to admit http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/51.gif

Friendly fire happens, we all know about this. It happens today and it has happened for as long as we can remember, but these don't count against you? I think they should.
Getting killed in your chute should count too IMO, be it by AA or an enemy aircraft.
It sounds a little like making up your own rules to cheat death (sorry).

Hartmann: 'Listen God, it was a friendly fire kill! That don't count man!'

God: 'You're right my son, my mistake. I shall send you back to Earth immediately!'

http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/88.gif http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/88.gif http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/88.gif http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/88.gif

To quell the skeptics I think you need to back up your claims with some stats... I had a look on greatergreen for a 'dreyer' and this is all I could find Dreyer stats? Greatergreen (http://greatergreen.com/il2/stats/playerdetails.php?id=953). There's hardly any airtime for this guy so maybe it's not you or you fly by a different name.
Sorting GreaterGreen by pilots with the most kills gives this result GreaterGreen top kills (http://greatergreen.com/il2/stats/search.php?sort=3&name=).
You will be hard pressed to find a pilot here with a better K/D ratio than 3. Even though you could regard these pilots as the best (maybe?).

All being said you show a lot of dedication and at the end of the day that's a lot of online kills! ~S~

Here are my humble stats from the server I mostly frequent Scrag's stats on UKD (http://www.il2hq.com/Stats/playerdetails.php?id=1019)
Not a great K/D ratio you'll agree, but some fine fun online though!
Also had a dabble on GreaterGreen myself Scrag on GG (http://greatergreen.com/il2/stats/playerdetails.php?id=2929), not great at all, but once I have mastered my TrackIR I will return there http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-happy.gif
~S~

http://www.appy55.dsl.pipex.com/FB/squigsig.gif
Scragbat's Forgotten Battles Virtual Movies (http://www.appy55.dsl.pipex.com)

[This message was edited by Scragbat on Tue July 06 2004 at 03:31 AM.]

NN_EnigmuS
07-06-2004, 04:24 AM
ouch never know that stats were on greetergreen lol that's why i shoot 3 time my squad mate for fun last time oups http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/88.gif

http://www.nnavirex.com/public/enigmus.gif

xanty
07-06-2004, 04:43 AM
Hi all:

Well, yes, no, true, false, lie, truth... does it really have to be like that?

I am a casual flyer, and I casual reader too (forums I mean), and I certainly don't follow such players' feats, but I will say two things:

* Why would he lie? there is not need for it, and judging by his attitude here, I can say he neither does.

* This is his way of experimenting the game, as others do: some people play to vulch, others to bomb targets, others to escort (not enough) and many just to take the others down... and then the team killers and cheaters too (unfortunally) His "way" of playing the just present an alternative self-imposed way that seems almost sporting.

I feel encouraged by the feat or its possivilities and inspires me to do an online career that goes in the same DoD manner. You may feel the same, but the BS cry seems louder. ?

http://www.silence.plus.com/xanty/stuff/fb_sig.jpg

OldMan____
07-06-2004, 05:02 AM
Just a question... what is your usual ping in these servers you fly on? I usually can't play more then 2 hours without a lag death of some sort.

If brute force does not solve your problem... you are not using enough!

WOLFMondo
07-06-2004, 05:06 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by NN_EnigmuS:
yup and you never fly other aircraft online like Il2 etc...for achieving objectives

i understand now why i'm often the only one trying to go to targets lol<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I sometimes get that feeling too. Its hard enough to get an escort but even when you do I often get the feeling that im being used as bait http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-sad.gif.

http://bill.nickdafish.com/sig/mondo.jpg
Wolfgaming.net. Where the Gameplay is teamplay (http://www.wolfgaming.net)
Home of WGNDedicated

609IAP_Recon
07-06-2004, 05:19 AM
Nice job there - especially good to see you track it like you do - you don't happen to be an accountant? http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Salute!

Recon

Forgotten Skies (http://www.forgottenskies.com)

Nanuk66
07-06-2004, 05:27 AM
I guess its a case of wotever 'flicks ur switch' dreyer.

Sounds to me thou you've burnt yourself out trying to accomplish this 'feat'.

Hope it was worth it..

KGr.HH-Sunburst
07-06-2004, 06:55 AM
sorry guys but this isnt that hard at all
200 kills in how many time ? 2 months ?
i make 200 kills a week if i fly a few hours every day on a full real server no biggie but i fly with risk and throw my self in furballs from time to time in non turning planes for example http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/35.gif but that also means i die more often and not with the thought i might get killed in a sortie

so if i take off from the place with the least chance of getting vulched (far away airfields)
and fly not on the typical flying routes (base to base) and not engage multiple bougies ,fly high and disengage when in disadvantege etc etc etc i think more of us can achive that

i dont think its some great uber ace skill but
just plain dicipline and fly to live not to kill

still he did a good job as he has that dicipline wich i believe is harder than actual shooting an aircraft down

SIDE NOTE: having tons of luck is better than having tons of skill
example: he got shot down 10 times and he never got a PK thats a great example of luck as it only takes one silly bullet to do


http://img31.photobucket.com/albums/v94/sunburst/SUNSIGD9.jpg
''All your Mustangs are belong to us''

HART_dreyer
07-06-2004, 08:42 AM
SpookyRuben: http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif Fun fun!

NN_EnigmuS: When flying under this RPG I won't escort anyone, try to complete any objectives or even help my own teammates. I will help my teammates if they make it easy for me, but otherwise I'll let them die. Because it's too risky.

zjulik: In what tracks do I hover around at 2500meters? How is that safe? I'd rather not go under 3000 unless I know I'm the top dog. "In one track it seems you literally stole a kill from someone who had been pursuing a victim for some time. Not good etiquette in my book." What track was this? I won't steal kills intentionally.

Scragbat: Yeah, it's nice to be a virtual fighter pilot, I have so many benefits compared to the real deal.

OldMan____: 50-250 depending on which server.

JG50_Recon: No http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

NaNuK66: Yes.

RK_HH-Sunburst: 200 kills a week huh? Lets see, a few hours a day should be around 2-4? Let's use 3, 3x60min=180x7days = 1260 minutes played, 6.3 minutes per kill. Including take-off/landings and travel time to target you sure are fast killer!

Regards,
dreyer
the dreyer vs. Hartmann game! (http://www.dreyermachine.com/il2/)
"Above us, there is nothing above but the stars... above us."

[This message was edited by HART_dreyer on Tue July 06 2004 at 08:05 AM.]

BSS_Goat
07-06-2004, 08:58 AM
Hart dreyer says:
RK_HH-Sunburst: 200 kills a week huh? Lets see, a few hours a day should be around 2-4? Let's use 3, 3x60min=180x7days = 1260 minutes played, 6.3 kills per minute. Including take-off/landings and travel time to target you sure are fast killer!



Is it me or is someones math wrong http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/59.gif
Maybe 6.3 min per kill?
http://images.allposters.com/images/dar/yng-17.jpg

http://www.blacksheep214.com/

Patriotism is your conviction
that this country is superior to all other countries because you were born in it
--George Bernard Shaw

HART_dreyer
07-06-2004, 09:05 AM
Haha, thanks goat. That's what I meant to say!

Regards,
dreyer
the dreyer vs. Hartmann game! (http://www.dreyermachine.com/il2/)
"Above us, there is nothing above but the stars... above us."

Nanuk66
07-06-2004, 09:08 AM
Either way that Geezer is gonna have a hard time getting 200 kills in a week, especially if hes only playing a few hours a day.

Unless, of course, he Mr Uber Flyer blokey...

BSS_Goat
07-06-2004, 09:22 AM
No offense anyone....just trying to help. BTW congrats Hart Dreyer.

http://images.allposters.com/images/dar/yng-17.jpg

http://www.blacksheep214.com/

Patriotism is your conviction
that this country is superior to all other countries because you were born in it
--George Bernard Shaw

gates123
07-06-2004, 09:27 AM
Well if its the same Dreyer that has his stats on Greatergreen then you only have 1.7 hrs of flightime and 4 kills 1 death. I think before you pronounce that you fly there he puts maybe another 20 hours in at least. I guarantee that his ego will be shot as well as his k:d ratio when its all said in done.

http://www.bombergirl.com/images/noseart/raidhotmama.jpg
Did anyone see that or was it just me?

BSS_Goat
07-06-2004, 09:44 AM
DAMN Gates shes HOT!!

http://images.allposters.com/images/dar/yng-17.jpg

http://www.blacksheep214.com/

Patriotism is your conviction
that this country is superior to all other countries because you were born in it
--George Bernard Shaw

steiner562
07-06-2004, 09:49 AM
What a bunch of spiteful brats http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif,dont see anyone else here posting 200+ trks of kills on the net, cheers dreyer for posting them,always fun to watch and take tips from,so keep em cominghttp://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

XyZspineZyX
07-06-2004, 10:05 AM
First of all, flying smart by having altitude, waiting until you have an advantage and cherry picking distracted, fleeing or clueless opponents is not to be derided. It simply makes sense. You guys who pride yourselves on doing "all the tricky maneuvering and hard turning" while ending up as smoking holes a majority of the time...it's YOU who could learn something from Hartmann's tactics. An easy kill on an unwary opponent counts the exact same as a 10 minute, scissors-flailing dogfight. And if you LAND said kill, it is better than a guy who got 3 and then died. In real life, he'd likely never get credit for those 3, unless his wingies saw to it when they got home. He'd simply be DEAD, and unable to "hit Refly". More people should fly with this in mind.

That being said, I still feel the sim itself has elements in it that make this "Hartmann style" of flying more dangerous than it should be. IL-2 punishes altitude advantages, especially by 109 pilots with it's overemphasized concrete elevator, the maddeningly inconsistent visibility of dots, and the overeffective camoflage/blending with ground cover. Planes in the weeds have all the advantages they shouldn't. Again, these are reasons why I think this "200 kills without death" claim can't possibly be true. It has less to do with whether I think this guy actually has the skill to pull it off. There are some guys online who are really good. But even for them, the sim will screw them at some point, if plain bad luck doesn't.

Now, it is interesting that there may be some weasely "qualifcations" about what does NOT constitute a death. Any replies to this?

Another red light: the fact that this "pilot" might not have been using one handle during his exploits. Why the need for such secrecy? While it's true that others online might "know" a name and be on the lookout, that still doesn't make pilots with poor SA skills eagle eyes.

More and more, this begins to smell like 3 day old fish.

Zayets
07-06-2004, 10:21 AM
I officially announce that I will try the same with the IL2-3M.
Of course , I am joking http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif
On a serious note , I have tried to do the same with the IL2 to match the record of some guy called Briuhanov. He flew 140 missions , killed 40 tanks,1train,152 ground vehicles and many other war machines.Apparently he was the most "productive" IL2 driver.
Problem is that I can't do that in DF servers where the sole objective is to scratch the other one's ****.I want to move the ground , hide , strike and come home. Needless to say , my side never provide cover/escort. So I'm pretty much stuck with the offline campaign.

Zayets out

http://server5.uploadit.org/files/Zayets-sigIAR.jpg

gates123
07-06-2004, 10:36 AM
Zayets. I'm not one to promote my favorite server but I can garantee you if your a mudmover and want to play online you'll usually get an escort on Greatergreen if you ask for one. The players there play as a team most of the time and I've run into alot of bomber formations with multiple escorts. Its by far the most bomber friendly online server there is. There are usually multiple ground objectives for both sides with alot of meyhem in between. Oh and of course the best part is historic plane match-ups.

http://www.bombergirl.com/images/noseart/raidhotmama.jpg
Did anyone see that or was it just me?

patch_adams
07-06-2004, 10:49 AM
If he used the same name everytime he flew perhaps he would have more credibility because there would be witnesses.

Danschnell
07-06-2004, 10:50 AM
Hmm.

I personally am doubtful about his achievment. I get about 50 kills a week, but my record online is 13 kills without being shot down.

I practically never get shot down, but I still always die, and this is why...

No matter how careful you are, the game is designed to make you die at some point. In a P-47, you will regularly suffer dying in your cockpit from the very first round to hit you. Pilot kills happen too often because of the DM.

The same goes for AAA. It is completely random so no matter how good you are it will get you eventually. Ships too.

Vulching you can't avoid, and bomber gunners will take you out too eventually because if a plane has gunners all round theres no way to stop them shooting at you and getting a pilot kill.

You can wobble and wiggle and go at areas where the guns are weaker, but you will catch a 'golden bullet' eventually.

Put simply, pilots of Dreyer's skill and valour really SHOULD be able to claim 200 kills without dying, its just that Ubisoft makes it so easy for all those random and unavoidable things that happen kill your pilot in his cockpit.

If an AAA shell suddenly bursts next to me from miles away and kills me outright, it has nothing to do with any bad skill from me... so if Dreyer decided to ignore it if he was killed that way, I can't say I blame him.

Ubisoft should make the gameplay better by reducing pilot kills.

HART_dreyer
07-06-2004, 10:57 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Stiglr:That being said, I still feel the sim itself has elements in it that make this "Hartmann style" of flying more dangerous than it should be. IL-2 punishes altitude advantages, especially by 109 pilots with it's overemphasized concrete elevator, the maddeningly inconsistent visibility of dots, and the overeffective camoflage/blending with ground cover. Planes in the weeds have all the advantages they shouldn't. Again, these are reasons why I think this "200 kills without death" claim can't possibly be true. It has less to do with whether I think this guy actually has the skill to pull it off. There are some guys online who are really good. But even for them, the sim will screw them at some point, if plain bad luck doesn't.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

That is not ture at all. Flying the 109 the game does NOT punish you for having an altitude advantage. What are you smoking? The 109 gets hard to handle at high speed due to compression and that's just one of the drawbacks flying this bird. THAT'S JUST HOW IT IS. However the advantages outnumbers the disadvantages by far. You don't have to keep a high speed in order to land a victory at all. View my tracks and you'll see what kind of technique I use to sucker my prey in and strike from above. It's so simple yet effective.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Another red light: the fact that this "pilot" might not have been using one handle during his exploits. Why the need for such secrecy? While it's true that others online might "know" a name and be on the lookout, that still doesn't make pilots with poor SA skills eagle eyes.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I use smurf names always, as I've explained before this is due to an experienced I had on my previous attempt which ended at 43 victories. Basically someone saw me join the server, camped above my airfield and after I took off bounced and was the indirect cause to my death. I don't want people to know I'm flying; online pilots are suicidal enough without knowing they have a chance to ruin my track record. I'd like people to fly as they would normally and not target me specifically.

Regards,
dreyer
the dreyer vs. Hartmann game! (http://www.dreyermachine.com/il2/)
"Above us, there is nothing above but the stars... above us."

HART_dreyer
07-06-2004, 11:03 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Danschnell:
Vulching you can't avoid, and bomber gunners will take you out too eventually because if a plane has gunners all round theres no way to stop them shooting at you and getting a pilot kill.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Vulching is quite easy to avoid. If I see a P-38 or anyone else attacking still aircraft you simply wait for him to make his attack run on you and then before he fires hit refly. Once he passes hit fly again. VOLIA! Problem solved. Just wait for him to die. Or if it's really bad, I leave the server.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>No matter how careful you are, the game is designed to make you die at some point. In a P-47, you will regularly suffer dying in your cockpit from the very first round to hit you. Pilot kills happen too often because of the DM.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Actually no, I'm very surprised I have not yet died due to a pilot kill. If you view my tracks I've been shot in the cockpit area many, many times yet still not suffered anything more than a pilot injury. BF-109 rarely suffers PK's in the game if you fly smart.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>If an AAA shell suddenly bursts next to me from miles away and kills me outright, it has nothing to do with any bad skill from me... so if Dreyer decided to ignore it if he was killed that way, I can't say I blame him.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


Yes, that's why I don't count AAA/Flak in the middle of the map, because it's just random and ruins my fun. I do however count AAA/Flak coming from enemy airfield, as if I want to be so stupid to follow a target in there I better be prepared to die.

Regards,
dreyer
the dreyer vs. Hartmann game! (http://www.dreyermachine.com/il2/)
"Above us, there is nothing above but the stars... above us."

HART_dreyer
07-06-2004, 11:21 AM
A god damnit I'm just going to edit the inital post.

Regards,
dreyer
the dreyer vs. Hartmann game! (http://www.dreyermachine.com/il2/)
"Above us, there is nothing above but the stars... above us."

XyZspineZyX
07-06-2004, 11:25 AM
You ought to. "Not counting ship ack" because its poor modeling offends your sensibility and "ruins your fun" is rather "convenient" for explaining away deaths.

By the way, can you tell us which of your deaths WERE fun? I can't remember any of mine I enjoyed.

The way you've amended the initial post certainly makes the achievement sound much less definitive, I must say. Hmmm...if I had managed 200 kills without death I think I'd have managed much more of a middle ground in my waffling. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

However, I'm sure there's a lot of good stuff in your tracks, and the collection of them is a great achievement in and of itself. At least congratulate yourself on that.

Jaws2002
07-06-2004, 11:31 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by HART_dreyer:
I use smurf names always, as I've explained before this is due to an experienced I had on my previous attempt which ended at 43 victories. Basically someone saw me join the server, camped above my airfield and after I took off bounced and was the indirect cause to my death. I don't want people to know I'm flying; online pilots are suicidal enough without knowing they have a chance to ruin my track record. I'd like people to fly as they would normally and not target me specifically.

Regards,
dreyer
_http://www.dreyermachine.com/il2/_
"Above us, there is nothing above but the stars... above us."<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Then pls don't compare yourself with Hartman.
Stalin himself put a bounty of his head, I don't remember how much but quite a lot.
If you want to play this * Acehood * of yours do it in the daylight, using your name.
Some enemies will try to watch their backs more, and some will try to take you down.
Then flying so careles for the team mates was not Hartman's way. He never lost a wingman.
IN a scripted server, with a war to be won, you'll end up just like Hartman: the ace of aces in a concentration camp in Siberia... se... abused and humiliated by all those IL-2 drivers that won the war.

http://img78.photobucket.com/albums/v258/&lt;FA&gt;Jaws/Uber2sm.jpg

HART_dreyer
07-06-2004, 11:37 AM
Yep, it sure is convenient. That's one of the great things about making your own friggen game and rules, you get to be right no matter what.

Regards,
dreyer
the dreyer vs. Hartmann game! (http://www.dreyermachine.com/il2/)
"Above us, there is nothing above but the stars... above us."

XyZspineZyX
07-06-2004, 11:39 AM
HartDreyer wrote:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>The 109 gets hard to handle at high speed due to compression and that's just one of the drawbacks flying this bird. THAT'S JUST HOW IT IS.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

At high speed, yes, at medium speed, not nearly as much. But in IL-2 you can throttle back, drop your nose in a shallow/moderate dive and at just over 350kph be a third as slow as any Russian fighter at picking up your nose. Not only does this allow them to just loopfight you to death if you commit to the fight, often the slow recovery prevents you from seeing the break, and smartly pulling up to maintain your alt/energy advantage.

This happens all the time when you try to hunt Hartmann style from a perch.

HART_dreyer
07-06-2004, 11:41 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Jaws2002:
Then pls don't compare yourself with Hartman.
Stalin himself put a bounty of his head, I don't remember how much but quite a lot.
If you want to play this * Acehood * of yours do it in the daylight, using your name.
Some enemies will try to watch their backs more, and some will try to take you down.
Then flying so careles for the team mates was not Hartman's way. He never lost a wingman.
IN a scripted server, with a war to be won, you'll end up just like Hartman: the ace of aces in a concentration camp in Siberia... se... abused and humiliated by all those IL-2 drivers that won the war<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I don't have a wingman.

Alright, changed the name.

Regards,
dreyer
the dreyer vs. Hartmann game! (http://www.dreyermachine.com/il2/)
"Above us, there is nothing above but the stars... above us."

XyZspineZyX
07-06-2004, 11:41 AM
Well, you come in here and call yourself the second coming of Hartmann (actually, without even getting to THREE HUNDRED, let alone 352), and people aren't going to let "convenient" puffery, stat-shuffling and lies go unchallenged.

HART_dreyer
07-06-2004, 11:43 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Stiglr:
At high speed, yes, at medium speed, not nearly as much. But in IL-2 you can throttle back, drop your nose in a shallow/moderate dive and at just over 350kph be a third as slow as any Russian fighter at picking up your nose. Not only does this allow them to just loopfight you to death if you commit to the fight, often the slow recovery prevents you from seeing the break, and smartly pulling up to maintain your alt/energy advantage.

This happens all the time when you try to hunt Hartmann style from a perch.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

You're just not doing it right. I've adapted my own style that works every time. If you want we can do some 1on1 fights with you in a LA-7 versus mine K4/G10-14or G6/AS where I get to start with an altitude advantage and we'll see who wins.

Regards,
dreyer
the dreyer vs. Hartmann game! (http://www.dreyermachine.com/il2/)
"Above us, there is nothing above but the stars... above us."

HART_dreyer
07-06-2004, 11:46 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Stiglr:
Well, you come in here and call yourself the second coming of Hartmann (actually, without even getting to THREE HUNDRED, let alone 352), and people aren't going to let "convenient" puffery, stat-shuffling and lies go unchallenged.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

First thing I wrote on my page was "I'm not comparing my self to Hartmann, I just thought it would be a fun game to play...". OK THEN.

Regards,
dreyer
the dreyer vs. Hartmann game! (http://www.dreyermachine.com/il2/)
"Above us, there is nothing above but the stars... above us."

[This message was edited by HART_dreyer on Tue July 06 2004 at 11:15 AM.]

gates123
07-06-2004, 12:11 PM
Gee there's nothing worse then an ego-freak. Let me guess you are...15? Dreyer feel free to join us on Greatergreen at night and myself and the regulars that fly there more then 1.7 total hrs will be happy to cut your ego in half along with your wingtips. Forgive me all I've just been dragged to his sea-level.

http://www.bombergirl.com/images/noseart/raidhotmama.jpg
Did anyone see that or was it just me?

HART_dreyer
07-06-2004, 12:12 PM
I guess sarcasm is lost on you...

Regards,
dreyer
the dreyer vs. this is a hoot game! (http://www.dreyermachine.com/il2/)
"Above us, there is nothing above but the stars... above us."

OldMan____
07-06-2004, 12:19 PM
Dont pay attention.. this is typical from someone jealous. You made great tracks.

If brute force does not solve your problem... you are not using enough!

Groundbait
07-06-2004, 12:25 PM
Hey thanks for all the tracks you're posting dreyer, really interesting for a novice like myself.

Don't let em p1ss on your fire matey http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

"To be ignorant of what occurred before you were born is to remain always a child" - Cicero

HART_dreyer
07-06-2004, 12:26 PM
Thanks, as long as some find use of the tracks it was worth it. Have a good one.

Regards,
dreyer
the dreyer vs. this is a hoot game! (http://www.dreyermachine.com/il2/)
"Above us, there is nothing above but the stars... above us."

Scragbat
07-06-2004, 12:53 PM
You must expect flames when your original claim was that you reached 200 kills without a single death. This is practically impossible in this game. Unless you hit 'refly' after every kill or when you are entering a situation where you know you can't win.

What you should have done was first explain your own personal game rules and how they overule what is coded into the game. I think you should have made the point that you have actually died along the way in scoring these 200 kills but have discounted these deaths because of your own 'rules'. If you are discounting deaths by friendly fire then that has obviously happened during this campaign. As must the other situations that you haved laid out in your rules for 'deaths that will be disregarded'.

The point is your original post may have given people the impression that you achieved this feat of 200 kills without dying once based on the rules of the game as we know them. If that were true then you would be the best online Ace ever!

~S~

http://www.appy55.dsl.pipex.com/FB/squigsig.gif
Scragbat's Forgotten Battles Virtual Movies (http://www.appy55.dsl.pipex.com)

gates123
07-06-2004, 12:58 PM
Dreyer I'm sure there are alot in the community that appreciate your tracks. Thats good. It's just your blatent egotistical atitude and over cockyness that ruins the good that your trying to accomplish. I mean where's this track of you getting shot down and killed yesterday in a P-40?

http://greatergreen.com/il2/stats/sortiedetails.php?id=1089081180&playerid=953

Is that not you? I mean if I just sat at 5k all game who knows what my stats would look like. I enjoy jabo runs and clearing teamate's six but you don't see me starting topics on my hit percentage or bomb to target ratio. http://greatergreen.com/il2/stats/playerdetails.php?id=257

There are alot of online pilots that you havent tangled with so please do the community a favor and lose the attitude. Please don't brag just to wrangle hits on your site. Promote the tracks the the pilot.

http://www.bombergirl.com/images/noseart/raidhotmama.jpg
Did anyone see that or was it just me?

HART_dreyer
07-06-2004, 01:05 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Scragbat:
You must expect flames when your original claim was that you reached 200 kills without a single death. This is practically impossible in this game. Unless you hit 'refly' after every kill or when you are entering a situation where you know you can't win.

What you should have done was first explain your own personal game rules and how they overule what is coded into the game.
I think you should have made the point that you have actually died along the way in scoring these 200 kills but have discounted the deaths because of your 'rules'.

If you are discounting deaths by friendly fire then that has obviously happened during this campaign. As must of the other situations that you haved laid out in your rules for 'deaths that will be disregarded'.

The point is your original post may have given people the impression that you achieved this feat of 200 kills without dying based on the rules of the game as we know them. Not your own personal rules.

~S~
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I have not dis-counted any deaths as of yet I've not died at all from either Friendly Fire, Flak (albeit been damaged) or anything else my rules allows me to discount. It's obviously NOT impossible, as I've managed to do it. Whether you believe me or not don't make much of a difference to me.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Dreyer I'm sure there are alot in the community that appreciate your tracks. Thats good. It's just your blatent egotistical atitude and over cockyness that ruins the good that your trying to accomplish. I mean where's this track of you getting shot down and killed yesterday in a P-40?
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

If you read my website you would have seen I'm now on a long break and won't be playing the RPG for a while (months). I'll now be entering a learning period where I need to experiement with various things. You think I'd fly a P-40 which I've flown maybe 2-3 times before and risk 201 victories? Seriously? I had 5 109's on me in that sortie and I was meerly turning and burning and laxing it.

And by the way please refer me to whatever I've written that gives of such an egotistical attitude?

Regards,
dreyer
the dreyer vs. this is a hoot game! (http://www.dreyermachine.com/il2/)
"Above us, there is nothing above but the stars... above us."

gates123
07-06-2004, 01:22 PM
[QUOTE]Originally posted by HART_dreyer:

I fly in either GreaterGreen, Warclouds, Finnish Gulf Server (rearly), Swedish [...and I've also been to Birds of Prey full real and some other full real server I don't remember. But most of the time I use Warclouds/GG.



Dreyer you "claim" to fly on greatergreen yet you have a total of 1.7 hrs of flightime and have been shot down twice, to say you fly there all the time is being cocky and full of you know what. I spend most of my time there so I should know w/o having to look at your stats. Spend some real time there at peak night hours against good pilots and I promise you your so called campaign will end in multiple violent deaths. Greatergreen's community boasts some of the best pilots in the game, your 1.7 hrs there doesn't cut what you call "most of the time".

This is my last post I refuse to get myself further into this BS.

http://www.bombergirl.com/images/noseart/raidhotmama.jpg
Did anyone see that or was it just me?

XyZspineZyX
07-06-2004, 01:26 PM
I don't find your attitude egostistical at all.

It's just the flimsy rules you use to determine no death.

No death means exactly that. You did not explode, crash and burn, suffer a collision, get vulched, get run over on the runway by a friendly, get PK'd or even get captured (which for most pilots, did count for death, at least for that war, it stopped a career). This also includes getting screwed by the sim in all the forms it's famous for.

If I discounted all my "bullsh**" deaths, I'd be riding a pretty nice streak myself. But, much as the deaths are undeserved, the result of poor modeling, lag, bad luck, the other guy just being better, or whatever, they're still deaths.

Nobody, you'll notice, is ****ging the value of the tracks you've compiled. It's just the bogus claim you're wrapping them up in, like fishoil-stained newspaper. Drop that, and you're onto something.

Zhadetski
07-06-2004, 01:43 PM
I would like the same to be attempted in VVS non LA

HART_dreyer
07-06-2004, 01:52 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by gates123:
Dreyer you "claim" to fly on greatergreen yet you have a total of 1.7 hrs of flightime and have been shot down twice, to say you fly there all the time is being cocky and full of you know what. I spend most of my time there so I should know w/o having to look at your stats. Spend some real time there at peak night hours against good pilots and I promise you your so called campaign will end in multiple violent deaths. Greatergreen's community boasts some of the best pilots in the game, your 1.7 hrs there doesn't cut what you call "most of the time".
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

If you had payed attention you would have noticed I don't fly under the name dreyer.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>This is my last post I refuse to get myself further into this BS.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Yeah please don't.

Regards,
dreyer
the dreyer vs. this is a hoot game! (http://www.dreyermachine.com/il2/)
"Above us, there is nothing above but the stars... above us."

HART_dreyer
07-06-2004, 01:55 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Stiglr:
I don't find your attitude egostistical at all.

It's just the flimsy rules you use to determine no death.

No death means exactly that. You did not explode, crash and burn, suffer a collision, get vulched, get run over on the runway by a friendly, get PK'd or even get captured (which for most pilots, did count for death, at least for that war, it stopped a career). This also includes getting screwed by the sim in all the forms it's famous for.

If I discounted all my "bullsh**" deaths, I'd be riding a pretty nice streak myself. But, much as the deaths are undeserved, the result of poor modeling, lag, bad luck, the other guy just being better, or whatever, they're still deaths.

Nobody, you'll notice, is ****ging the value of the tracks you've compiled. It's just the bogus claim you're wrapping them up in, like fishoil-stained newspaper. Drop that, and you're onto something.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

If/When you do the same thing you can make your own rules and make it as hard for your self as possible. But just to note the few situations I would not count a death in has STILL NOT HAPPENED. So whatever.

Regards,
dreyer
the dreyer vs. this is a hoot game! (http://www.dreyermachine.com/il2/)
"Above us, there is nothing above but the stars... above us."

Adlerangriff
07-06-2004, 02:02 PM
"Vulching is quite easy to avoid. If I see a P-38 or anyone else attacking still aircraft you simply wait for him to make his attack run on you and then before he fires hit refly. Once he passes hit fly again. VOLIA! Problem solved. Just wait for him to die. Or if it's really bad, I leave the server."


This is cheezy. Hitting refly is no solution. This statement goes a long way to discrediting whatever body of work you were here selling.
If you hit refly when challenged, a 2000 kill streak is possible.

HART_dreyer
07-06-2004, 02:06 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Adlerangriff:
"Vulching is quite easy to avoid. If I see a P-38 or anyone else attacking still aircraft you simply wait for him to make his attack run on you and then before he fires hit refly. Once he passes hit fly again. VOLIA! Problem solved. Just wait for him to die. Or if it's really bad, I leave the server."


This is cheezy. Hitting refly is no solution. This statement goes a long way to discrediting whatever body of work you were here selling.
If you hit refly when challenged, a 2000 kill streak is possible.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Some would say Vulching is cheesy.

You can't hit refly while in mid-air.

Regards,
dreyer
the dreyer vs. this is a hoot game! (http://www.dreyermachine.com/il2/)
"Above us, there is nothing above but the stars... above us."

Intruder_GP
07-06-2004, 02:17 PM
Dryer...What is the name you fly under and I would like to fight you 1vs1. If you are such a good pilot...post me a time and place so I can have the pleasure of experiencing a good fight. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-wink.gif I go by personal fights before I can give you that credit. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/11.gif

HART_dreyer
07-06-2004, 02:22 PM
Not that I care for your Credit, but I'll gladly fly against you in a duel. I'm not good flying on the edge but this is something I want to practice. Do you use IRC or MSN/AIM?

Regards,
dreyer
the dreyer vs. this is a hoot game! (http://www.dreyermachine.com/il2/)
"Above us, there is nothing above but the stars... above us."

bodaw
07-06-2004, 02:22 PM
Keep up the good work Dreyer. I'm gonna download some more tracks when I get home. Don't let those jealous people get to ya.

~S!~
bodaw

[This message was edited by bodaw on Tue July 06 2004 at 06:52 PM.]

HART_dreyer
07-06-2004, 02:37 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Scragbat:
Well I'm sorry but you haven't actually achieved a great feat based on your original boast.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Yes, alright, fine... I DO NOT CARE. OK?

Regards,
dreyer
the dreyer vs. this is a hoot game! (http://www.dreyermachine.com/il2/)
"Above us, there is nothing above but the stars... above us."

gates123
07-06-2004, 02:42 PM
[QUOTE]Originally posted by HART_dreyer:

You think I'd fly a P-40 which I've flown maybe 2-3 times before and risk 201 victories? Seriously? I had 5 109's on me in that sortie and I was meerly turning and burning and laxing it.

If you had payed attention you would have noticed I don't fly under the name dreyer.
________________________________________________


Dreyer you admit you got shot down in a p-40 then come back and say you don't fly under the name Dreyer? Make up your mind! Bottom line is you got shot down and killed by 5 109's. So quit posting only successfull sorties on your site when in fact you have been shot down online but forgot to think that GG has a stats page that doesn't back-up your claims. How many others are there like this? Feel free to post all the other names you fly under so we all can validate your kills on greatergreen and not be forced to assume all your tracks are in order. Your rules are quite bogus IMHO.

_________________________________________
Did anyone see that or was it just me?

Zayets
07-06-2004, 02:47 PM
WOW!
You can get counted on GG!That's really cool.I would like to know how I'm doing. I've been once on GG in a TB3 http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif
Shoot down some planes withe the beast before they got me.

gates123 , as soon as my box gets its fix , I will try to be a regular on GG. Of course, when I do have time and if only there are some ground pounding machines http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif


Edit : I just seen my ugly face in the stats of GG http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif IL2 and a Hurri , hehe. I think I made a mistake, the TB kills I made in "the other" server, something Finnish I believe. But glad to see I'm in statistics , boy! 0.7 hours , pretty much I should say http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Edit 2 : And I shoot 24 bullets ! http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif
Zayets out

http://server5.uploadit.org/files/Zayets-sigIAR.jpg

HART_dreyer
07-06-2004, 02:50 PM
gates123: Sigh. Do you even bother reading what I'm writing? I flew the P-40 yesterday after my 201st victory. I'VE EXPLAINED SEVERAL TIMES I'M TAKING A BREAK FROM MY RPG. READ MY WEBSITE OR DON'T POST STUPID **** TO ANNOY ME.

Regards,
dreyer
the dreyer vs. this is a hoot game! (http://www.dreyermachine.com/il2/)
"Above us, there is nothing above but the stars... above us."

HART_dreyer
07-06-2004, 02:52 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Scragbat:
Don't take it personally. I'm just pointing out how people view kills in terms of dogfighting. Not actually being kills but lost aircraft.
It's an open debate. Public forum you see...<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

You'll also notice I use the phrase 'Victory' not KILLS. Big difference. A victory as I define it is a won battle; victories can be accomplished without firing a single bullet.

Regards,
dreyer
the dreyer vs. this is a hoot game! (http://www.dreyermachine.com/il2/)
"Above us, there is nothing above but the stars... above us."

crazyivan1970
07-06-2004, 03:10 PM
Actually it is possible but... it requires some serious skills and helluwa patience. If he has both, why not? I haven`t done 200 victories without being killed... but i`v done couple of weeks without being killed back in my "FULL TIME" flying days. Not sure how many planes were shut down tho... i think about 50-60 with maybe 4-5 AC lost. But to me, it is boring, i quickly snapped out of it and got back to usual me, turnfighting Yaks on the deck hehe.

BTW, i would suggest to avoid personal attacks, cause i might get a little upset and push the wrong button here and there http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

V!
Regards,

http://blitzpigs.com/forum/images/smiles/smokin.gif

VFC*Crazyivan aka VFC*HOST

http://www.rmutt.netfirms.com/coop-ivan.jpg

http://www.rmutt.netfirms.com/vfc/home.htm

Kozhedub: In combat potential, the Yak-3, La-7 and La-9 fighters were indisputably superior to the Bf-109s and Fw-190s. But, as they say, no matter how good the violin may be, much depends on the violinist. I always felt respect for an enemy pilot whose plane I failed to down.

RET2001
07-06-2004, 03:17 PM
I notice that this individual has indicated numerous times that he doesn't care what people think. Most of them were just calling him on some things....

Hey mate if you "don't care" so much then why did you post this up on the forum in the first place?

Also these rules are bloody humorous in my book. Sorry but thats the way a lot of people see it.
"Deaths that will be disregarded:
Internet Lag Collisions. Have you ever gone head on with someone, clip your opponent and see your wing come off while he flies around like nothing happened? This is an lag collision as on your screen your aircraft actually hits him but on his screen your aircraft is in a different position relative to him. In this case I will always evaluate the track to see if I in fact clipped my opponent or not.
Friendly Fire Deaths. I cannot control what any random idiot will do to me on my own team so this will not be counted.
AA Fire in general unless it is above enemy airfield. Mainly because many maps have AA in the center of maps making it very random and likely to be killed eventually when flying on the same servers repeatedly.
Lag kills. I.e. someone is 500 meters behind me in a turn and shoots and hits. If the bullets are more than 20-30 meters from my aircraft and yet it hits I *may* void the entire thing (seen on the track).
Chute Shooters. Once I've bailed, I've bailed and that's that.
Other anomalies..."


If you want respect then get on GG or WC and make 200 kills without these girlscout rules, then you will have it mate. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

XyZspineZyX
07-06-2004, 03:23 PM
Scragbat, you're more wrong than Dreyer is.

A "kill" is an aircraft (not a person) destroyed in flight, PERIOD. As long as it is not on the ground when originaly attacked (and thus considered a strafing target destroyed), it is a kill, no matter what happens to the pilot.

That's according to history, and the claiming procedures for probably ALL WWII combatants, too, not what some snotty nosed dogfight pilots "think" or "agree to".

Let's not upbraid the poor guy for anything more than what he actually did with his "optimistic" claim.

Brotrob
07-06-2004, 03:51 PM
LOOOOOOOL !!!

these rule, muhahaha, every noob could reach 200 with this settings !!! Go to VOW or VEF and provve you are good ! There its been devided between the noobs and the real aces ! Just look at the aces killed after their 99 victory ! Jou just forgot some IMPORTANT things:

if you know, that the server registers EVERY death of you, you just dont fly so much aggressive anymore,

if you know a bomber-sniper-ai can anhilate your " steak " ( kills in a row without getting killed) you think twice before attacking a DB3 in a BF109F2 !

if you know " just one more kill and I gett the Ritterkreuz " you DO MAKE silly mistakes !

if you know that lag could kill you, you just dont get at point blank range behind a fighter anymore !

if you over enemy terretory, bailing means the END ! ( LOL, your rule , LOL )

if the evil enemy wants to kill you in the chute, you cant do NOTHING against it !!!

if you fly on these onlinewars, you'll barely meet noobs in the air

if you fly there, you have to fly the plane you got ! Even a Emil against Yak !

if you fly there, you have to fly the missiontype the briefing lists ! Groundattack against AAA !

Come on, if you ever flew VOW or VEF you'll admit, that these servers simulate the real Airwar best. And when you compare the victories you can achieve in such an Onlinewar against the ones you can achieve on a Server , you'll see what I'm talking about. Its a complete difference here.

I respect your afford concerning the onlinetracks ( good for beginners who wanna learn ) , but if you wanna earn respect ( you wanna, couse you posted your achievements ) then join an onlinewar.

Best Greetings,

Brotrob

HART_dreyer
07-06-2004, 04:27 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by RET2001:
If you want respect then get on GG or WC and make 200 kills without these girlscout rules, then you will have it mate.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

What you fail to realize is that I have still not had the need to take these rules into effect, as I've not been killed by these anomalies.

Man, the amount of stupidity I see here makes me sad and frustrated. Why are people bringing up topics I haven't even mentioned? Did I say I wanted respect? Did I say my method of play was the most realistic ever? I posted this for tracks so others could download and view (because I know I'd like to view other's tracks) and for my OWN enjoyment. If you have trouble with that then that's YOUR PROBLEM NOT MINE. Please put a sock in it.

Brotrob: I would like to see anyone bag 200 kills with my rules, if any "noob" can do it, then please, go ahead, show me. Since it's so damn easy, why don't we just make it 400. I'll have your tracks by 2-3 months? Great! Good luck.

Regards,
dreyer
the dreyer vs. this is a hoot game! (http://www.dreyermachine.com/il2/)
"Above us, there is nothing above but the stars... above us."

OldMan____
07-06-2004, 04:42 PM
What are these VOW or VEF ? Just wanna know, because I usually only can fly in WarClouds and BirdsofPray due to lag issues.


Anyway, even if many here dont find his feat interesting.. he is on his rights to find it interestind.. just as me. I watched some of his tracks and I think he his quite an EFFICIENT pilot.

If brute force does not solve your problem... you are not using enough!

tsisqua
07-06-2004, 05:12 PM
Well, let's all just piss on HART's accomplishment because we can't do it.

I am in awe, HART! http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/11.gif

Tsisqua

BTW, I just downloaded some tracks of your victories against the P-38. I am off to watch them now, and thanks for the opportunity to enjoy your exploits.
http://server5.uploadit.org/files/tsisqua-nedChristie.jpg
http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/784.gif Welcome To The Madness http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/784.gif

[This message was edited by tsisqua on Tue July 06 2004 at 04:26 PM.]

[This message was edited by tsisqua on Tue July 06 2004 at 04:29 PM.]

RET2001
07-06-2004, 05:41 PM
Hehe, you have to love the bailing over enemy territory not counting or stopping your climb to the 200 victory mark. I guess thats what ET means. LOL

This has much entertainment value, thanks.... http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

RET2001
07-06-2004, 05:45 PM
Stupidity? Hey mate, people are just questioning your claim to fame(starting a thread with "Reached the 200 victory mark... close to 100 online tracks available!" sounds like someone looking for fame to me), if you can't take that then you shouldn't come here.....Please continue though, its pretty funny.

BTW, when I made it to the 352 mark with women I quit counting, I wish I had tracks thoughhttp://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Curly_109
07-06-2004, 05:55 PM
Hey man.. just make sure that you choose some rookie-friendly servers and you maybe catch up with Hartmann.(if it really matters).

Good luck!

Cheers

Werg78
07-06-2004, 06:34 PM
hi dreyer.

ive just finished watching some of your tracks http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

nice work there and definatly an interesting idea.
i sometimes record dogfights online but mostly to watch the other pilots - my own performance is well not so glorious *fg*

only 2 kills with countless bailings and death on FR servers http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/cry.gif

HART_dreyer
07-06-2004, 06:53 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by RET2001:
Hehe, you have to love the bailing over enemy territory not counting or stopping your climb to the 200 victory mark. I guess thats what ET means. LOL

This has much entertainment value, thanks.... http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Of course it counts. It translate into 1600 negative points, which means I have to down 16 aircraft to make up for it. Negative score means game over.

Plenty of pilots have gotten shot down over ENemy Territory and gotten back home alive.

Werg78: Glad you enjoyed them http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Regards,
dreyer
the dreyer vs. this is a hoot game! (http://www.dreyermachine.com/il2/)
"Above us, there is nothing above but the stars... above us."

zjulik
07-06-2004, 07:10 PM
Well I guess this thread proves that this game can be whatever you think is most fun. Many out there rather fly aerobatics than combat. Some fly arcade, some not. With my personal taste, I would bore myself silly spending 100+ evenings flying by the rules being discussed here. For me, IL2 is about having fun. I have more fun being less of an "high altitude vulcher" (which is what you seem to be) and getting shot down once in a while, than playing in a "bleeker" (in my book) fashion just because of that 100 or 200 mark. Could you honestly say you`d not have enjoyed the game more if that was not your ultimate goal, influencing everything you do online?

Besides, if I had hit refly when being vulched, even ONCE, my squad would have frozen me out immediately. I wonder what Hartmann would have done in that situation.

HART_dreyer
07-06-2004, 07:19 PM
Yeah, it certainly is fun to fly under this premise. I loved it, because at times with P-51's on my tail I was actually sweating in fear and the adrenaline was pumping. I had a good reason to fear death, which made it more fun and actually increased my skill level by a lot. You see I hate getting shot down, I can actually get really mad if I do something stupid and end up being shot down. Mad at my self that is.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Besides, if I had hit refly when being vulched, even ONCE, my squad would have frozen me out immediately. I wonder what Hartmann would have done in that situation.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Died? =[

Regards,
dreyer
the dreyer vs. this is a hoot game! (http://www.dreyermachine.com/il2/)
"Above us, there is nothing above but the stars... above us."

WTE_Galway
07-06-2004, 08:52 PM
i played the dynamic campaign in IL2 as DoD restarting from scratch if I died

i managed to get a respectable number of missions up eventually with conservative play

Also .... I am not sure about VEF2, haven't played it, but the old VEF ranks also were based on a DoD system and some VEF players used to have very respectable kills since last death

Brotrob
07-07-2004, 12:51 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>
Originally posted by OldMan____:
What are these VOW or VEF ? Just wanna know, because I usually only can fly in WarClouds and BirdsofPray due to lag issues.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Join em ! You'll have double the fun like on a normal server ! Then they remain just for training !

VOW ( currently at a vacation, but coming soon again ):

http://www.vow-hq.com/

VEF:

http://www.vef2.net/site/main.htm

For me, I like VOW more, but thats just my opinion. You simply have to follow the instructions on this pages and play on HL, preferable with Teamspeak ( but not necessary)


Best Greetings,

Brotrob

Pentallion
07-07-2004, 12:57 AM
Been looking at those Greatergreen stats. Found this impressive pilot stats:

http://greatergreen.com/il2/stats/playerdetails.php?id=699

The next best I've found so far is this one:

http://greatergreen.com/il2/stats/playerdetails.php?id=487

http://www.simops.com/249th/sigs/Wildcard.jpg

JtD
07-07-2004, 03:46 AM
I don't get it. There is someone who, by his standards, made a 200 kills streak.

Why don't you just S! him and watch his tracks, if you care that much?

Are you envious?

What's so hard about congratulating someone on something he considers an achievement, even if you don't consider it one? Never heard of being nice? Bah!
From me:

S!, dreyer. I wouldn't have the patience. Also, I'm so dumb I frequently crash because I feel like opening the chat box on takeoff. ;-)

Good job!

Maple_Tiger
07-07-2004, 04:40 AM
I haven attemped to type while taking off. First time i died, but the second time i managed to survive.

I guess i never learned from the first mistake. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Capt. 361stMapleTiger.
http://img52.photobucket.com/albums/v158/Maple_Tiger/FBAA2.gif
Proud member of the FBAA and Nutty Philosohpy Club.

Zayets
07-07-2004, 04:52 AM
Definitely I would not have the patience to embark such a task.Besides,it will be boring to loiter somewhere above 3000 m. If I want to do this I can fly in FS9 with a DC-3. Besides, the cockpit is better http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif
BTW , got yesterday night my first 2 kills in GG flying an IL2 field mod http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif.Veeery,very interesting server!

Zayets out

http://server5.uploadit.org/files/Zayets-sigIAR.jpg

ImpStarDuece
07-07-2004, 05:09 AM
S! http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/11.gif

Well done Dreyer!

I dont care how good/lame your rules are, i've just looked at a bunch or your tracks and can't do anything but tip my hat to you. Well done sir.

And as for all these naysayers: some seem to have channeled Shakespears 'green eyed monsteer' and a few seem to have got up on the wrong side of the bed this morning.

Again, very well done. An excellent accomplishment and a thoroughly entertaining bunch of tracks.

Flying Bullet Magnet... Catching Lead Since 2002

"There's no such thing as gravity, the earth sucks!"

"War is just an extension of politics carried out by other means" von Clauswitz.

spiffalski
07-07-2004, 05:21 AM
Nice one Dreyer, love the website. I last looked in when you had reached a 100.

I really do laugh at the several petty remarks made against you.
Why can't people understand you have made a set of rules and are playing by them?
I honestly believe you should take it as a complement as they are obviously hoarding some insane jealousy and are clearly fiercely competitive.

Dont be put off returning to the RPG in a few months! I for one will be rooting for you to reach 352+.

And I would change it back to "vs hartmann". You were clear on not comparing yourself to him on the website. It's just that people blinded by jealousy don't read too well.

LeadSpitter_
07-07-2004, 05:34 AM
pretty cool what name do you fly under in warclouds? I fly there daily and have never seen your forum name there. A few days ago someone exos and another guy had over 3000pts each flying the k4.

Some really good people in there are goodknight, 355 greeksquad, jv44 and alot of other really good players.

http://img14.photobucket.com/albums/v43/leadspitter/LSIG1.gif

Sturm_Williger
07-07-2004, 06:08 AM
Hi Dreyer - Just wanted to say that I'm impressed by your achievement and grateful for the opportunity to d/l some good tracks.

Ignore the criticism, it seems that a lot of people take issue without even reading your posts. Someone also called you a high altitude vulcher. Seems a bit harsh to me that the time honoured B&Z tactic should even be in the same room as the word "vulch" !

From watching some of your tracks, it seems obvious to me that you're flying LW planes according to LW doctrine and succeeding. Funny that, I seem to recall that the real LW pilots managed to do a similar thing.

Your rules seemed quite reasonable for the framework of the game you developed for your own fun ( this latter, a point many here seem to have missed ) and if you haven't actually needed most of them, then S!

PS: Change the name back - "vsHartmann" has a certain cachet.

DINGHAO
07-07-2004, 08:50 AM
S! For a job well done.

Keep in mind that the time frame in which Hartmann flew in would not be nearly as compressed as your simulated accomplishment. You definitely handle the 109 well.

I was wondering if you use TrackIR, or just the hat keys, as your SA seems to be above average.

Also, you seem to fire very short bursts (which I like to do), is that to counter the blinding gun flashes as well as conserve ammo?

Finally, what is your judgment as to the BEST overall ride.

Once again, great job, thanks for the tracks.

http://users.rcn.com/chao.enteract/pics/dinghaosig.jpg

fockerookie
07-07-2004, 08:52 AM
I see 11 Dreyerâ´s track. Good job.

Him is many names.

Tauren, wabbit, ryan -&gt; Virtualpilots server
Dreyer, ---ravr(ravr), echofish, dry, de_stroyed.

---Tra -&gt; www.flygflottilj16.se (http://www.flygflottilj16.se)

Much other names?

[This message was edited by fockerookie on Wed July 07 2004 at 08:10 AM.]

HART_dreyer
07-07-2004, 08:55 AM
Hey guys,

Thanks a lot for the positive feedback! I was getting rather frustrated with some of these gentlemen. Anyhow this has spurred my interested in doing something similar for the VVS/Allied aircraft. I've already begun my training; can hardly keep a 3:1 kill/death ratio so it will take a while before I'm ready to start doing a Kill Log.

I'll also need TrackIR and a Throttle (for prop pitch) before I can really start taking advantage of some of these aircraft.

Regards,
dreyer
the dreyer vs. this is a hoot game! (http://www.dreyermachine.com/il2/)
"Above us, there is nothing above but the stars... above us."

Dawg-of-death
07-07-2004, 09:15 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by HART_dreyer:
That's fine, you don't need to.

Regards,
dreyer
_http://www.dreyermachine.com/il2/_
"Above us, there is nothing above but the stars... above us."<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


I beleave you. You are an Ace. RBJ once said "If he says he is an ace he probly is "

S~

Bad-MF(Mongrel Fighter) AKA .......Dawg-of-death

HART_dreyer
07-07-2004, 09:39 AM
DINGHAO:

Yes of course my friend! I would not be doing this if it would take me years to reach these numbers http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

I used to use the Hatswitch a long time ago but changed to the Keypad which is A LOT better and far faster. When using the Hatswitch on my joystick I would constantly simply "loose grip" and the view would be very hard to keep in one place for a long time, especially the rear views. I use the hatswitch for power up/down and some other functions now. I'm looking to purchase TrackIR and a throttle as soon as possible however. As it stands now I don't have enough hands available to use manual prop pitch efficiently.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Also, you seem to fire very short bursts (which I like to do), is that to counter the blinding gun flashes as well as conserve ammo?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Of course, primary reason is to conserve ammo, I'm normally not happy with less than 3 victories per sortie so you don't see me spraying half my ammo on one target. I try to never use more than a 0.5-1 second burst on any attack, ever. You can actually see some tracks where I do really just open fire for 2 or more seconds and I ALWAYS MISS completely! Even if it's an easy shot. So I've gotten mad at my self for doing that several times. I've found it to be key to keep your cool before you get in a firing position and carefully calculate when to fire and how long of a burst I'll probably need to hit my target. I normally don't fire when the deflection is just too large and the likelihood for hitting is very low. That is unless I'm in a desperate situation.

I've never been too worried about the Muzzle Flashes, even if they are blinding normally when I'm about to fire I already know where my target is so I don't need to actually see it. So I've never really been that bothered by them.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Finally, what is your judgment as to the BEST overall ride. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Ohh, hard question! First of all I must say that the BF-109 series are much better than the FW-190 series. I rarely fly these anymore due to a number of disadvantages I find difficult to cope with.

I don't really believe in best rides, it obviously depends on what I'm flying against. Packing a K4 versus 1941 VVS/Allied Aircraft would mean easy pickings, however when flying against aircraft in the same time period I'd say my favorite is the G6/AS. I can fit this bird with a 30mm for more energy tactics oriented combat or use the default 20mm if I'm looking to do some flying on the edge (turning to get on 6). It is very versatile.

There is a few match-ups I really do not like however, I no longer enjoy the 109-G2 because of it's horrible rear-view, I really need to be able to see my pursuer to judge his energy state and with such poor rear view it's very difficult. Same goes for the 109-G6 (the Late is fine though). Flying against a LA-5F however makes me very nervous; those things out-perform the 109-G6 in pretty much any situation.

Regards,
dreyer
the dreyer vs. Hartmann game! (http://www.dreyermachine.com/il2/)
"Above us, there is nothing above but the stars... above us."

tsisqua
07-07-2004, 10:08 AM
I've watched a bit of your flying, and even though you are in a 109 (which I rarely am), I have learned a bit about how guys like you are able to hand me my a$$ on a platter. If I flew the P-38 the way you fly the 109 I would be deadly.

The best part of these tracks (at least for my learning http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif ), is watching you RTB . . . You know how to use the cloud deck, Mate! You also are good at luring others into a sucker-fight.

Someone wanted to know what your online name was, and even though the tracks can give this away . . . I wouldn't post that here. I think that would cause you to be the object of ALOT of pilots' attention. Quite honestly, if I saw Oleg online I would have to try shooting him down, and you would be no different http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif .

Lastly, your attitude is one of a person whgo is just having fun. I have NEVER seen you bragging on yourself the way that RBJ used to: saying that you are an unbeatable ace. You have a good attitude about this project of yours, and I am enjoying your tracks.

Thanks, and good luck with the next 100 http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

Tsisqua

HART_dreyer
07-07-2004, 12:55 PM
Hehe http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Unfortunately no matter how skilled you are you won't be unbeatable.

Regards,
dreyer
the dreyer vs. Hartmann game! (http://www.dreyermachine.com/il2/)
"Above us, there is nothing above but the stars... above us."

t0n.
07-07-2004, 02:09 PM
Congrats Dreyer.That's a neat game you set for yourself and I'm glad its going well. Thanks for the tracks!

The plonkers... you should ignore and not dignify with a response.

t0n.

http://img78.photobucket.com/albums/v292/t0n2004/t0ns0108.jpg

Intruder_GP
07-07-2004, 02:52 PM
Dreyer... I appreciate your humbleness http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/11.gifwhen you say you are not good flying on the edge...However I would love to see how good you are and what do you mean by IRC and AIM.... MSN I know please send me an email with details to SPapali@hotmail.com http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Stachl
07-07-2004, 07:29 PM
Dreyer used to fly with IV/JG51 and I can certainly say that his kill/loss ratio was excellent by our standards. A 'smart' flyer for sure. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gifWell done Dreyer, salute!

Stachl

HART_dreyer
07-07-2004, 09:10 PM
Wow, I'm honored to get a reply in my thread by a true ace such as Stachl! S!

Regards,
dreyer
the dreyer vs. Hartmann game! (http://www.dreyermachine.com/il2/)
"Above us, there is nothing above but the stars... above us."

PE_Valter
07-08-2004, 08:04 AM
Dryer, thanks a lot for your tracks, they have great learning value (how to fly and fight smart, bnz, deflection shooting,...) and you've helped me realized some of my errors.
Have you thought about making some tutorial tracks (those that have comments included), like why you did some move in that moment precisely, etc?
Take care, PE_Valter

HART_dreyer
07-08-2004, 09:11 AM
Valter: A few months down the road I will be creating an IL2 tactics/strategy website with tutorial tracks and more. I just need to increase my own skill a bit further before I feel I'm ready.

If anyone has any questions regarding a certain track and why I did what I did, please feel free to ask. I'd be more than happy to explain my own logics and reasoning (MIGHT BE FLAWED!).

Regards,
dreyer
the dreyer vs. Hartmann game! (http://www.dreyermachine.com/il2/)
"Above us, there is nothing above but the stars... above us."

karost
07-08-2004, 11:54 AM
hi,HART_dreyer
I was download your track over 50 track I saw your work , well... I can say it's very good work , your track files will benefit to a new 109 pilot for study.

but,HART_dreyer for your work compare to our friends in VEF,VWF with a valid system , I belive you will meet alot of new thing to learn.

If you can show us 200kills in VEF or VWF ... WOW ,your name will never fogot for this community

S!

310th Falcon
07-08-2004, 06:12 PM
S! Dreyer

I watch couple of your current tracks and I come away that you have done your homework on flying, you are very much like "Erich Hartmann". Or at least his tactics. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

From the book "The Blond Knight of Germany".
A very good read about Erich Hartmann.

-Quote from Erich Hartmann-

Erich avoided the dogfight in favor of the lethal efficiency of hit and run. The "See-Decide-Attack-Break" was a sequence never to be broken. Following it meant success, departing from it meant failure and even doom.

When I watch your tracks...you are always looking around very carefully staying high and picking your pray. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

You never turn fight even when I see you have the advantage...very smart indeed.

Very impress with your flying. Good luck on beating the 352 record.

Best Regards http://www.cup.com/kobayashi-dojo/english/aisatsu.gif


Falcon
http://members.optusnet.com.au/cailith/coolsoldier.gif

http://www2.freepichosting.com/Images/421522095/0.jpg

Mirtma
07-09-2004, 01:13 AM
Dreyer, S! I remember looking at your page earlier (beginning of the year), when you were around the 40 victories and then killed. And I've sad to myself: I'd like to see if he would continue. Well, you did! Congrats!

http://img20.photobucket.com/albums/v61/McMatt/sig_LP.jpg
---------------------------
Athlon XP 2000+
1024 Mb DDram
Sapphire Radeon 9600/256
Audigy2 ZS
Zalman Theatre 6 Headphones
Saitek Cyborg Evo
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TugZooey
07-09-2004, 06:30 AM
S!

Thanks for posting all of those tracks. Great stuff and good way to learn.

Grats too.

http://img73.photobucket.com/albums/v221/milank/grab0002.png

Dawg-of-death
07-09-2004, 07:31 AM
I do not like Zoom and Boom ...........I like dawg fighting,
To me it is not real dawg fighting .

Bad-MF(Mongrel Fighter) AKA .......Dawg-of-death

HART_dreyer
07-09-2004, 07:14 PM
http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif Thanks!

Regards,
dreyer
the dreyer vs. Hartmann game! (http://www.dreyermachine.com/il2/)
"Above us, there is nothing above but the stars... above us."

Longjocks
07-09-2004, 08:25 PM
Dreyer, I need to thank you. Not only for the tracks that I've been watching since you started (not just watching you, but the other pilots as well), but also for revealing to me, through this thread, who the complete arsewipes on this forum are. Even the small percentage that actually took the time to read your site and watch some tracks still couldn't put any valid argument together to make one point or another.

I like the 'game' you're playing and can't wait for you to get back to it. I'm DLing the most recent tracks now. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif (oh, and unlike some I don't mind the rules you play with)

Don't worry, some of us have moved out of our parent's place into the real world and have the social skills to understand and appreciate what you're doing at face value.

Anywho, cheers and WOBBLE!

http://users.tpg.com.au/mpdeans/misc/midgesign2.gif "Thanks for the inspiration to rise above you all."