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View Full Version : Code issues and AI fixes needed!



KarstenBue
06-19-2016, 07:55 PM
TL: DR version: Fix the broken coding/programming. Improve the freakin AI!

I am not really sure whether the posts here are read by the developers, or the team behind homm7, allthough I hope that both fixes to this game and future homm's, will include serious fixes to the vast amount of errors present in homm7, that results in so many bugs and crashes (especially in online multiplayer). Furthermore it is my hope that more testing, and work, will be put into ensuring far, far better AI behaviour.
I do understand its not the same basic mechanics, as developing a digital chess game, but there is alot of "trial and error" testing, that (if it'd be done by willing players) could result in far better AI behaviour and strength.

To me the basic foundation of homm7 is good. Actually really good, from both a visual perspective, with beautiful design and scenery, as for the many qualities/mechanics from the previous homm's that worked (3, 5, and some 6), has both been refined and many improved.
With that said, it made me terribly annoyed and sad, to buy an unfinished beta-version at the release, simply because (a simple hunch) there was a desire for moneymakers behind the game, to profit. Who gives a damn about legacy anyway?

So please. Fix the bloody programming/coding errors (yes, do spend the extra hours, or hire more, and very capable programmers to do the freakin job), and for the good of all, fix, improve, and create AI's that can be a bloody challenge!
It almopst feels ridiculing to play through a scenario, set on hard+, with "heroic AI", and experience a 5 year old would do better after a few hrs of gameplay. With the X millions you can get from selling a game like HOMM, it should be valued far, far more to create a game where captivation, and challenge is key factors for an substantial amount of hours.

Just give us the bloody HOMM(7?), that can and will result in just as many hours of fun/play, as HOMM 3 did, and has resulted in both so many hundreds of maps made by players that loved the game, and even undergone a transmog-ification, etc.

And then enable 3-layer maps, multiplayer campaigns. And fix that damn AI.

RobvD84
06-19-2016, 10:14 PM
I believe that part of the problems with the coding lies with the engine they are using. This was the same problem as with H6. I firmly believe this engine is not suited for this genre/kind of games.
The other problem lies with that this team (Limbic) is inexperienced with making these kind of games (the only games they had made before they tried to fix H6 were mobile games. We've allready made fun of that.)

Other then this, they already said that the xpac will also bring the latest patch and will fix a lot of things and add some big changes.

And about most things you are asking for is probably impossible at this stage and at the level Limbic is (and in the state the game is). So i guess the only thing we can do is wait for the xpac and see how that will turn out. Altho we could use some more info. Like showing us some of the "big" changes.

mErEnEfErEee
06-20-2016, 09:59 AM
I believe that part of the problems with the coding lies with the engine they are using. This was the same problem as with H6. I firmly believe this engine is not suited for this genre/kind of games.
The other problem lies with that this team (Limbic) is inexperienced with making these kind of games (the only games they had made before they tried to fix H6 were mobile games. We've allready made fun of that.)

Other then this, they already said that the xpac will also bring the latest patch and will fix a lot of things and add some big changes.

And about most things you are asking for is probably impossible at this stage and at the level Limbic is (and in the state the game is). So i guess the only thing we can do is wait for the xpac and see how that will turn out. Altho we could use some more info. Like showing us some of the "big" changes.

If this is impossible, then they can put that expansion into trash because almost nobody will want this type of gameplay, in which stupidity and no challenge exists etc. What's the point to play at all, then? I do not agree with this type of approach.

Secondly, I do not understand how the game engine can influence bad AI programming? Even H6 had a better written AI. The engine has nothing to do with the bad AI but animations and performance.

I do not care who makes this game or whether Limbic is experienced or not. All I care if the game is good enough. UBIsoft spits on this franchise. Otherwise, they would hire a professional and experienced studio like they do with their other AAA games.

The AI is an offense to any customer who bought this. They ridicule us.

Mirage_dragonet
06-20-2016, 11:34 AM
<< The AI is an offense to any customer who bought this. They ridicule us. >> Multiplayer is similar, the same trouble. ....
However, Rob rights.
Most of the problems started because - for the engine. And most of the problems are unlikely to be fixed. Anyway, so I was told programmers. They chose the engine to the editor . But no one needs the editor if the game itself does not work or is not interesting.

RobvD84
06-20-2016, 01:06 PM
If this is impossible, then they can put that expansion into trash because almost nobody will want this type of gameplay, in which stupidity and no challenge exists etc. What's the point to play at all, then? I do not agree with this type of approach.

Secondly, I do not understand how the game engine can influence bad AI programming? Even H6 had a better written AI. The engine has nothing to do with the bad AI but animations and performance.

I do not care who makes this game or whether Limbic is experienced or not. All I care if the game is good enough. UBIsoft spits on this franchise. Otherwise, they would hire a professional and experienced studio like they do with their other AAA games.

The AI is an offense to any customer who bought this. They ridicule us.

About AI, i think this lies with the inexperience with Limbic, cause i too don't see this as a problem caused by the engine.
Also i agree with what you are saying about Ubilols choosing Limbic for this job. I understand they wanted to cut bedget. But this is sort of an established franchise. WD and For Honor isn't and are even more risky than this franchise.

For me the expac is to show me how far they have come, what they have come up with and if this show promise for the future. Maybe they will eventually realise what needs to be done, and maybe even have a different person direct this whole process. I really think this franchise need some fresh ppl at the helm. Atleast that is what i hope will happen.

Antalyan
06-20-2016, 02:29 PM
They have already told us that whole AI development for such a huge game is done by 1 person. So no miracles can probably be expected. I do not think one person could change all the coding for the game like H7.

Btw. If somebody from devs team is still reading, please, notice that the things reviews do usually criticise ("usually" because it is impossible to satissfy everyone) are bugs and especially AI. Gameplay and the other aspects are often told to be very good. So I would really recommend you to focus on it much more than you do it now. Campaigns will never be amazing, even if all the other aspects are perfect, with weak armies.

KarstenBue
06-20-2016, 04:48 PM
They have already told us that whole AI development for such a huge game is done by 1 person.
I'm certainly quite surprised if that's the case, that there's only 1 person in charge of improving the AI. The sad thing is, that the current game really has some potential, but part of the team behind it, has lacked the necessary skill/insight/understanding, as to what has made HOMM great, and then executing accordingly.

As far as I'm concerned, it relies alot on getting the proper feedback, and putting a solid amount of manhours into ensuring that the AI works better, and understands many of the mechanics, that players are quick to cath up on and utilize (from attacking a "severe" group of melee mobs, if you have the proper utility spells as entangle on expert, as understanding of the various skill-trees, in combination with factions etc.). There are quite a few aspects to cover, as flawed as the AI is today, but I most certainly hope, that there will be some drastic improvements, allthough I can see I shouldn't hold my breath.

RobvD84
06-20-2016, 05:18 PM
Also keep in mind that Limbic is a small team. I don't remember how many ppl worked there, but not everyone over there works at H7. They probably have other projects too, and probably ppl that don't work on games but does other work (secretary maybe, don't know, just giving an example).

I am not trying to defend Limbic or Ubilols, but with what they choose to go with, i think it was too hard for them.

Antalyan
06-20-2016, 06:37 PM
I'm certainly quite surprised if that's the case, that there's only 1 person in charge of improving the AI. The sad thing is, that the current game really has some potential, but part of the team behind it, has lacked the necessary skill/insight/understanding, as to what has made HOMM great, and then executing accordingly.


This piece of information is a few months old (you can read this article for more info if you like: http://heroescommunity.com/viewthread.php3?TID=42430, so they might have already changed it and hire some more people to work on AI but I really do not expect it with the budget they have.

mErEnEfErEee
06-20-2016, 07:02 PM
That's how you destroy the game. This is a failed experiment.