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View Full Version : I found a BUG in BoB?



TAGERT.
03-03-2004, 11:31 AM
The BUG is in the ubi marketing dept...

Allow me to explain my POV...

When IL-2 first came out it filled several flight sim voids...

1st The RUSSIAN front and all the associated aircraft
2nd The ground attack/support aspect of WWII

These two things is what and why I think most people bought the sim in the first place..

Now.. was this planned or just luck?

a) Was Oleg a genius.. in that he did the research and *made* something that people wanted.
b) Was Oleg a guy who loves RUSSIAN aircraft and, like us, knew they did not get the respect they deserved thus made it
c) Was Oleg a typical engineer who made something he could make and just *hoped* people would buy it.

I use to belive it was "a" and "b".. but now.. with the next sim being BoB I think it is more of a "b" and "c".. In that *we* (the flight sim community) in the last few years had a BoB sim at our disposal to buy... Granted, this one will be better.. But.. Knowing what a small nitch the flight sim market is.. and watching the CYCLE over the last 10+ years I think another BoB at this time is a bad idea..

The way I see it.. the list of flight sims one could make are

WWI
WWII BoB
WWII Europe
WWII Pacific
WWII Russian Front
WWII North Africa
KOREA
NAM
MODERN

As for WWI: DO IT! We have not had a good WWI sim sense Red Baron II some 5+ years ago
As for WWII BoB: DON'T DO IT! We just had one released about 2 years ago
As for WWII Europe: DON'T DO IT! IL-2 is filling that void now
As for WWII Pacific: DO IT! We have not had a good WWII Pacific sim sense Pacific Air War PAW:1942 some 8+ years ago
As for WWII Russian Front: DON'T DO IT! IL-2 is filling that void now
As for WWII North Africa: DO IT! No one ever has.. (Dynamix tried) A real VOID that could address some Italian ac
As for KOREA: DO IT! We have not had a good KOREA sim sense MiG Alley some 5+ years ago
As for NAM: DO IT! A real void in light of STRIKE FIGHTERS falling flat on it's face
As for MODERN: DON'T DO IT! LOCK ON is filling that slot now

http://www.geocities.com/grantsenn/kickme.jpg
TAGERT

TAGERT.
03-03-2004, 11:31 AM
The BUG is in the ubi marketing dept...

Allow me to explain my POV...

When IL-2 first came out it filled several flight sim voids...

1st The RUSSIAN front and all the associated aircraft
2nd The ground attack/support aspect of WWII

These two things is what and why I think most people bought the sim in the first place..

Now.. was this planned or just luck?

a) Was Oleg a genius.. in that he did the research and *made* something that people wanted.
b) Was Oleg a guy who loves RUSSIAN aircraft and, like us, knew they did not get the respect they deserved thus made it
c) Was Oleg a typical engineer who made something he could make and just *hoped* people would buy it.

I use to belive it was "a" and "b".. but now.. with the next sim being BoB I think it is more of a "b" and "c".. In that *we* (the flight sim community) in the last few years had a BoB sim at our disposal to buy... Granted, this one will be better.. But.. Knowing what a small nitch the flight sim market is.. and watching the CYCLE over the last 10+ years I think another BoB at this time is a bad idea..

The way I see it.. the list of flight sims one could make are

WWI
WWII BoB
WWII Europe
WWII Pacific
WWII Russian Front
WWII North Africa
KOREA
NAM
MODERN

As for WWI: DO IT! We have not had a good WWI sim sense Red Baron II some 5+ years ago
As for WWII BoB: DON'T DO IT! We just had one released about 2 years ago
As for WWII Europe: DON'T DO IT! IL-2 is filling that void now
As for WWII Pacific: DO IT! We have not had a good WWII Pacific sim sense Pacific Air War PAW:1942 some 8+ years ago
As for WWII Russian Front: DON'T DO IT! IL-2 is filling that void now
As for WWII North Africa: DO IT! No one ever has.. (Dynamix tried) A real VOID that could address some Italian ac
As for KOREA: DO IT! We have not had a good KOREA sim sense MiG Alley some 5+ years ago
As for NAM: DO IT! A real void in light of STRIKE FIGHTERS falling flat on it's face
As for MODERN: DON'T DO IT! LOCK ON is filling that slot now

http://www.geocities.com/grantsenn/kickme.jpg
TAGERT

LuftKuhMist
03-03-2004, 12:51 PM
...

http://www.ifrance.com/boussourir/MOMS.gifhttp://www.ifrance.com/boussourir/grab0004.jpg

Pzyber
03-03-2004, 02:15 PM
BoB....BoB....BoB....Bob....Bob!!!!!
I can't wait for BoB!
But a WWI Flight sim would be great!!!

Aaron_GT
03-03-2004, 02:27 PM
"As for WWII Pacific: DO IT! We have not had a good WWII Pacific sim sense Pacific Air War PAW:1942 some 8+ years ago"

I think you mean CFS2, about 4 years ago,
roughly the same time as Rowan's BoB came out.
All the WW2 theatres have been done to some
extent (although less so with regard to North
Africa) in the last 5 years or so.

Not much point in doing WW1 as a dedicated
WW1 Sim is due out this year already.

Fennec_P
03-03-2004, 02:30 PM
CFS2 doesn't count as a Pacific sim. A pox on you for even suggesting it.

Aaron_GT
03-03-2004, 02:47 PM
Why doesn't CFS2 count as a Pacific Sim. It's
a WW2 flight sim, set in the Pacific...

TAGERT.
03-03-2004, 02:50 PM
Originally posted by Aaron_GT:
I think you mean CFS2, about 4 years ago,
roughly the same time as Rowan's BoB came out.Note I said a *GOOD* WWII Pacific sim! ;) In that FOR ME to consider a Pacific sim as GOOD it MUST include CARRIERS to take off from and land on.. And CFS2 didnt have that... It was nice in some aspects.. but without Carriers.. Thanks but no tanks... On that subject.. What with LOCK ON's carrrier stuff.. I though for sure they would do a Pacific sim over another BoB.


Originally posted by Aaron_GT:
All the WW2 theatres have been done to some
extent (although less so with regard to North
Africa) in the last 5 years or so.True.. they *tend* to be the goto.. But IL-2 was the first to really focus on the ground attack and support of it all.. Prior WWII Euro sims seemed to focus on the high alt bomber escort and attack aspect.. Neat and all, but IL-2 was a breath of fresh air with the GROUND aspect.


Originally posted by Aaron_GT:
Not much point in doing WW1 as a dedicated
WW1 Sim is due out this year already.I hope so.. Seems that a few WWI sims over the last few years get started.. but never finished.. A real Duke Nukem aspect of WWI sims!

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TAGERT

TAGERT.
03-03-2004, 02:52 PM
Originally posted by Aaron_GT:
Why doesn't CFS2 count as a Pacific Sim. It's
a WW2 flight sim, set in the Pacific...No CARRIER's operations.. Granted, a great deal of the Pacific was from ground bases.. BUT without CARRIERS... You might as well do another Euro sim

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TAGERT

VW-IceFire
03-03-2004, 03:13 PM
I think BoB is a smart suggestion. I think Forgotten Battles has done much for the reputation of simulator games in-general...I think its beginning to be more popular. Furthermore, sales of Forgotten Battles and presumably BoB will be on a truly international scale that most games produced in the US don't get (lets face it, blockbuster hits like WarCraft III or Half Life 2 are generally North American first and other areas as almost an afterthought). Outside of Ubi you'll also see a Russian game market buying into it as well through 1C. So while many companies base their success on north american or even strictly US sales alone I don't think thats the case here.

BoB has a built in fanbase (right here) and with its possibilities to expand WWII combat across multiple theaters...I don't think there will be a problem.

I largely disagree that BoB will be coming out at the wrong time. I also wonder if it may cash in on the publicity surrounding the Battle of Britian when the Tom Cruise movie comes out in the same year.

http://home.cogeco.ca/~cczerneda/sigs/temp_sig1.jpg
RCAF 412 Falcon Squadron - "Swift to Avenge"

Aaron_GT
03-03-2004, 03:56 PM
"Note I said a *GOOD* WWII Pacific sim! ;) In that FOR ME to consider a Pacific sim as GOOD it MUST include CARRIERS to take off from and land on.."

Dunno which copy of CFS2 you have but mine
has carriers!

Aaron_GT
03-03-2004, 03:59 PM
"True.. they *tend* to be the goto.. But IL-2 was the first to really focus on the ground attack and support of it all.. Prior WWII Euro sims seemed to focus on the high alt bomber escort and attack aspect.. Neat and all, but IL-2 was a breath of fresh air with the GROUND aspect."

True for things like EAW, although Janes WW2F
really raised the bar for ground pounding, and
Oleg's namechecked it as an influence. The
Janes FM is table based and not as fine grained
as IL2 (although with the 3rd party hacks you
can at least get some spins and so on).

CFS1 also included ground pounding, but the
DMs and terrain modelling is pretty horrible
compared to what we have today!

Aaron_GT
03-03-2004, 04:02 PM
"I hope so.. Seems that a few WWI sims over the last few years get started.. but never finished.. "

There was the WW1 openplane project built on
SDOE which you can still get, there is Dawn
of Aces 2 and 3, and Target Flanders, and also
Birds of Prey (not sure of the status of this)
which is another SDOE derivative. But I don't
think we've seen a DEFINITIVE modern WW1 sim.
The last definitive WW1 sim was the venerable
Red Baron. So I think we are definitely due
a good WW1 sim. I got the impression Oleg was
holding off on the WW1 sim due to the Knights
of Whatever It's Called due out this year.