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View Full Version : Fw-190s: Good news or bad?



XyZspineZyX
08-13-2003, 01:16 AM
They are no longer flying tanks. .50s do a job on them in short order.

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Regards,

SkyChimp

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XyZspineZyX
08-13-2003, 01:16 AM
They are no longer flying tanks. .50s do a job on them in short order.

http://members.cox.net/rowlandparks/kill1.jpg

http://members.cox.net/rowlandparks/kill2.jpg


Regards,

SkyChimp

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XyZspineZyX
08-13-2003, 01:24 AM
Originally posted in another thread. But this is my opinion.

It's new bird! Totally new, and I don't know if it's just me but there are some thing that don't feel right. The roll rate is amazing and it really stands out compared to the fighters in the opposition. At speeds above 1000km/h(TAS) the roll rate is still snappy, but it doesn't seem to be right. The cement stick is gone! Instead they made it just the opposite. It manouvers more like an F-16 at high speeds and it can best be compared to the Me262. My first reaction was, am I flying on 2X speed. That is how I felt it. It jingles and jangles with ease, and there is no fighter that can turn with it at high speeds. Speed loss in turns reminds me of the original IL2. So don't o any prolonged turning with it cause you'll be a sitting duck! I managed to maintain 612km/h TAS at sealevel using MW50 in the 1945 Dora. At 280km/h it has an average climbrate of 4200ft/m and above 4000m it outclimbs the La-7. In dives it's phenomenal and dive acceleration appears to be spot on compared to test reports! At 4200m speeds up to 1100km/h(860,IAS) are totally safe. At 3000m one shoul not exceed 1050km/h(910,IAS). As a comparison, the La-7 will blow up at speeds exceeding 1000km/h(710,IAS) at 6000m! The MG151 20mm guns are alot more effective and they will make swiss cheese out of most planes except the LaGG.

So, what am I saying? Alot of things have improved some rightfully so, but the highspeed rollrate and pitchrate can't be right, although I'd love to be proven otherwise!/i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif But now, I'm saying it's probably too good!

Now flame me!!/i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif



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XyZspineZyX
08-13-2003, 01:28 AM
Good news all around on the FW's...be it damage profiles or manuverability or its cannons punch. Seems to be much better.

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ZG77_Nagual
08-13-2003, 01:31 AM
190 was known to handle well at high speeds - and now she does - no longer aflying tank - but also no longer flies like a tank. She'll outmaneuver most other planes at higher speeds - which is right

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XyZspineZyX
08-13-2003, 01:34 AM
But a 3 second roll at 863 km/h is wrong. 3 seconds?

No way.

Regards,

SkyChimp

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XyZspineZyX
08-13-2003, 01:35 AM
That's good news. In reality no plane was as tough as Fw-190 were (or P-47 still is).


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XyZspineZyX
08-13-2003, 01:40 AM
SkyChimp wrote:
- But a 3 second roll at 863 km/h is wrong. 3
- seconds?
-
- No way.

I agree SkyChimp, it's not right! Perhaps the Fw got some of what was intended for the Jug?

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'When it comes to aircombat, I'd rather be lucky than good any day!'

XyZspineZyX
08-13-2003, 01:50 AM
robban75 wrote:

- I agree SkyChimp, it's not right! Perhaps the Fw got
- some of what was intended for the Jug?

No doubt. As borked as the P-47 roll rate is, its just as bad on the Fw-190, just at opposite extremes.

Regards,

SkyChimp

http://members.cox.net/rowlandparks/SkyChimp2.jpg

XyZspineZyX
08-13-2003, 01:58 AM
But don't forget, that the 190 stalls at all speeds now ... even at very high ones.

And as in real life the instantaneous turn rate is great, but the sustained turn rate sucks.

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XyZspineZyX
08-13-2003, 02:00 AM
Atzebrueck wrote:
- But don't forget, that the 190 stalls at all speeds
- now ... even at very high ones.
-
- And as in real life the instantaneous turn rate is
- great, but the sustained turn rate sucks.


Agreed. Stall is sudden in a sustained turn at all speeds just as in real life.

Regards,

SkyChimp

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adlabs6
08-13-2003, 02:45 AM
The 190 rollrate is wild. Leadspitter was illustrating this earlier tonight on HL, his 190 looked like a pinwheel it was spinning so fast.

I do like the new handling though in general. I don't always feel like I'm on the edge of a stall now.



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XyZspineZyX
08-13-2003, 03:17 AM
Overall the Fw 190's are much more realistic. The roll rate seems a bit too high at high speed but not by all that much. Add a second to it and then give that second less to the P-47 and it would be about right.

This is kinda OT but in my 1945 server earlier I was a little suprised to see the P-47D-27 as the main allied fighter. The axis mostly flew Fw 190A9's. The battle was very interesting. The P-47's put up a very good fight. Not many people got any kills. Mostly what happened is the Fw's would chew up a P-47 and it would RTB. Then a second P-47 would chew up the Fw and force it to RTB. An unusually small number of planes were lost in an hour of dogfighting with 14 players. Average score was about 10 when I shut down the server/i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif .

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ZG77_Nagual
08-13-2003, 03:49 AM
I'm extremely happy with the 190s - the yak3 and la7 both got a boost in e retention and climb from the beta patch

http://pws.chartermi.net/~cmorey/pics/p47janes.jpg

XyZspineZyX
08-13-2003, 03:50 AM
I love 190s look at my sig, but man the roll rate and controll of them makes cfs1 flight models look realistic, the dora makes the most unrealistic moves ive ever seen in any game, look in externals and see what the stick yankers are doing with the dora it has to be changed same with the mig 3u so far everything else seems pretty even cept the p47 needs a little more roll.

besides that and me loosing 20 fps in perfect and went down from 60 to 30-40 in excellent and having sound problems the patch is pretty damn good some servers are smooth other have the pauses and warps.


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XyZspineZyX
08-13-2003, 03:54 AM
Maj_Death wrote:
- At the start of WW2 the German army lacked
- experienced anti-aircraft gunners. The average
- gunner was so bad that the USSR decided to help them
- out. They did it by forcing some of their pilots to
- fly I-153 flak magnets. These planes were slow but
- very sturdy. This allowed German anti-aircraft
- gunners to get a large amount of target practice on
- a relatively small number of planes. Thanks to the
- Soviets help, by the end of the war the German
- anti-aircraft gunners were amoung the best in the
- world.



Your grammar and spelling are improving, but this still needs work.



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XyZspineZyX
08-13-2003, 03:57 AM
SkyChimp wrote:
- They are no longer flying tanks. .50s do a job on
- them in short order.


Yeah...but they're not going to fly straight and level at 250 kph for you on-line...lol

XyZspineZyX
08-13-2003, 04:01 AM
SkyChimp wrote:
- They are no longer flying tanks. .50s do a job on
- them in short order.

I was testing a coop I put together recently, which has P47's ground-pounding a train and vehicles in a large transport column. The 47's have some AI escort from P-51's.

The LW oppose with late 109's and FW 190A9's with mk 108 cannons in the wings.

I was surprised to see all the A9's survive the mission. I flew one of them, and can tell you those mk 108's make short work of P-47's, especially in close.

None of the 109's survived the mission.

One P-51 survived our of 4, and a pair of P-47's, out of 8.

I like co-op's. Oops, I think I've said that before.

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XyZspineZyX
08-13-2003, 04:06 AM
robban75 wrote:
- Originally posted in another thread. But this is my
- opinion.
-
- It's new bird! Totally new, and I don't know if it's
- just me but there are some thing that don't feel
- right. The roll rate is amazing and it really stands
- out compared to the fighters in the opposition. At
- speeds above 1000km/h(TAS) the roll rate is still
- snappy, but it doesn't seem to be right. The cement
- stick is gone! Instead they made it just the
- opposite. It manouvers more like an F-16 at high
- speeds and it can best be compared to the Me262. My
- first reaction was, am I flying on 2X speed.


I know what you mean by flying at 2X speed, I noticed also that the JU-87 in addition to the FW-190 takes off from a dead stop on the runway alot quicker, They seem to gain speed much quicker, I flew over 300 missions in the JU-87 & in Ver1.0 it took awhile to get moving (the same for the 190) & now VRROOOMMM they take off. Gotta try the HE-111 to be sure though.




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XyZspineZyX
08-13-2003, 04:08 AM
3 secs/120dps at over 800km/h TAS, is definately, and inexcusably wrong. I think that's even faster than theP-38L with boosted ailerons, which had the fastest roll rate among all conventional WW2 fighters.





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XyZspineZyX
08-15-2003, 01:59 AM
test ..sig

Chin up ..HUTCH

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XyZspineZyX
08-15-2003, 04:02 AM
I fly the 190 exclusively and I must admit the roll-rate may be a bit too fast. The P-47's need a little boost. The high speed handling seems spot on to me, the 190 was famous for having superb high speed handling (requiring significantly less stick pressure than most other planes, if not all). Low speed handling is still poor and is accurate IMO. I never go slow in my 190 so it doesn't matter to me. /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif As for the ridiculous maneuvers the 190 (or is it just the Dora?), I don't know what people are talking about and I don't want to know. I would never use a cheesy maneuver and I hope they can correct it without effecting the 190's high speed handling. Note that I mean the high-speed turn rate, it seems to me that the 190's roll-rate should decrease a little at higher speeds but it doesn't seem to right now.

I'm just worried that all these people b1tching about us finally having a good 190 after it was one of the worst planes in the game doesn't affect Oleg's thinking. To look at this board you would think that all you have to do is hop in the Focke-Wulf and your enemies will just fall out of the sky. I have flown the 190 a long time and it didn't improve enough to go from being a dog that nobody would fly to being some uber plane. Most people are not disciplined and patient enough to fly the 190 the right way anyway. I wish people would fly what they really like instead of being point *****s and just flying what they think is best. I suffered through some hard times with the 190 and online I did alot of fighter/bomber stuff and mostly attacked bombers and attack planes. Now I can finally take it to the enemy in air to air combat with some competence (and team-work & tactics) and I don't want some misinformed crybabys messing it up.

And to be fair I said a long time ago that the 190 was too tough, especially against machine guns as it would take an entire P-47 load to bring one down. I'm glad to see that changed. Now just lower the roll-rate a little and have high speed have some effect as well and the 190 will be spot on IMHO.


And Acme, when I did my top-speed tests the 190A (notice the "A") was the only plane that couldn't take off the runway just using the parking area, it wasn't even close. The 190D, La-5/7, 109, P-39, P-47, etc. all took of in time easily but the 190A lumbered down the runway and required me to taxi out onto the runway itself unlike the rest of the planes.

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Message Edited on 08/15/0303:07AM by kyrule2