PDA

View Full Version : I think the next AC needs to take a few things from watch dogs!



flavorcountry19
11-12-2015, 08:34 PM
Mainly just in movement things! And I know a lot of you might think "watch dogs?! Ew that game sucked" but you have to admit it did somethings right!

I know people don't like QTE or animations where cool things play out but the player isn't doing it! But in my eyes they add smoothness and grace that you can't get from player controlls!

One plus I would say from WD is just walking/running animations! It was smooth as eggs, you had 3 modes of speed, and they all had transitioning animations from one to another. Which I feel AC has lacked and could help with just little details.

Next I would say is bring back the automatic parkour Windows or houses from AC3-BF. I frickin loved those! Watching the character barrel roll over a table or a bed and then launch out the window to keep running felt amazing! And WD had it a little too where if you were running at a fence with a wall next to it you would bounce off the wall and over the fence to keep your speed going! But these two things aren't really player controlled which made them able to take the time and animate them so they looked really cool and smooth!

I think they just need to animate a few of the parkour abilities to really keep the flow going and things like that! Do I know how they could do that? Not really! But I'm sure they do!

Just my thoughts! Care to add your own?!

Consus_E
11-12-2015, 10:03 PM
I think the scanning NPCs thing (the ability to see an NPCs name, age, and a quirk) that Watch Dogs had was a huge missed opportunity. It could be a cool feature if they improve social stealth. You could use it to identify different civilian archetypes in the crowds to figure out who to blend with.

For example: You examine an NPC and they belong to the "Nobility" category, and thus allow you to enter certain areas that are normally reserved for the more elite (maybe even using the new kidnap feature from Syndicate) Or someone could be a "thug" and shove you away if you try to blend in with them, but you can also pick a fight with them, or get them to fight another thug to cause a distraction.

ect.

cawatrooper9
11-12-2015, 10:16 PM
I think the scanning NPCs thing (the ability to see an NPCs name, age, and a quirk) that Watch Dogs had was a huge missed opportunity. It could be a cool feature if they improve social stealth. You could use it to identify different civilian archetypes in the crowds to figure out who to blend with.

For example: You examine an NPC and they belong to the "Nobility" category, and thus allow you to enter certain areas that are normally reserved for the more elite (maybe even using the new kidnap feature from Syndicate) Or someone could be a "thug" and shove you away if you try to blend in with them, but you can also pick a fight with them, or get them to fight another thug to cause a distraction.

ect.

That's actually a pretty cool idea. Hearkens back to the color coding of units in the original Assassins Creed, but sounds far more usable (I almost never used Eagle Vision in the first game, it was too big of a pain).

flavorcountry19
11-13-2015, 12:49 AM
yeah that would be a pretty dope addition! also just really stunk how few things we were able to blend with in this one! wish we had more crowds or like stands we could walk up to and blend with and that they implemented it more with the quests!

Consus_E
11-13-2015, 01:28 AM
That's actually a pretty cool idea. Hearkens back to the color coding of units in the original Assassins Creed, but sounds far more usable (I almost never used Eagle Vision in the first game, it was too big of a pain).

I've never understood why if Eagle vision is a "Sixth Sense" we have to activate it, surely the it should be something that comes naturally like seeing, hearing, tasting ect.

Here's how I see it

NPC Archetypes:
Each one has different advantages and disadvantages for the player.

The Poor


Interactions: "Donations" will earn you bits of information, the information given is context sensitive. IE if you're doing an Assassination mission the beggar can be asked about the target, if free roaming you get some small info about the setting, maybe even a small story that is added to the database, ect.
Hindrances: Like AC1 they beg for coins


The Common Folk


Interactions: Allow the player to blend with them. They tend to be less likely to react to commotion, and act as a large group of people too busy to notice the player's antics unless it more directly involves them. They try to keep their heads down and go about their business, too afraid to get involved in conflict, too oblivious to acknowledge the murderer standing beside them.
Hindrances: They tend to get in the way... Stay your blade from the flesh of the innocent!


The Nobility

Interactions: Can be blended with or kidnapped to allow entry into certain restricted areas, they would serve a similar function to scholars in AC1 but with the addition of kidnapping them to allow you to move more freely as opposed to a pre-determined path. Also because they are classified as innocent by the Creed, you have to knock them unconscious as opposed to simply murdering them.
Hindrances: Will actively call guards if they directly see you break the law, but again they are considered innocent so you have to find a non lethal method of neutralizing them. Obviously they can't be blended with if you're covered in the blood of the recently deceased... (don't let them see you kill anyone)


Carriers

Interactions: They carry fragile goods and must be gently pushed aside to avoid them dropping the item. The player can also startle carriers from a distance causing them to drop what their carrying as a simple distraction.
Hindrances: They carry fragile goods and must be gently pushed aside to avoid them dropping the item. If the player runs into them they drop whatever they are carrying and draw the attention of everyone.


Thugs

Interactions: Quick to violent behavior, thugs can be "coerced" into a street brawl with either the player or other thugs. During these fights the guards will not intervene, instead they wait until the victor is decided before stepping in and attempting to rouse the unconscious loser, giving the player a nice opportunity to slip away. Also defeating a thug in a brawl gives you a throwing knife.
Hindrances: Will shove the player away if they attempt to blend in with them, possibly into carriers or guards. Also cannot be kidnapped.


Stalkers

Interactions: Random muggers who attempt to ambush unsuspecting targets. (Think less Rogue and more Revelations) Their appearance is randomly generated (to make them more difficult to detect) and they follow prey through the crowds. They will either strike in the street, attempting to stab the player (like Revelations) or they will follow the player into alley ways and engage them in open conflict. If the player approaches the police they will lose interest and stop following the player. This can be done to prevent unnecessary commotion. They can also target NPCs, allowing the player to intervene.
Hindrances: They will kill you. If the player fails to counter they will be desynchronized instantly.



Some NPC "Quirks"
May apply to guards, civilians, or both


Acquisitive: Will be affected by coin throw



Syncope: Tends to faint under stress, can't be kidnapped
Cowardly: Will run away under stress
Calm: Will NOT run away under stress
Loner: Can't blend with, can still be kidnapped
Frugal: Can't be pick pocketed
Sleeper: Can't be roused from sleep
Paranoid: Will check hiding places even if unaltered
Dimwitted: Likes to stand close to hiding places, will regularly move between hiding places. Often away from fellow guards... hint hint
Skilled: Does more damage in combat.
Drunkard: Has a 15% chance to spawn inebriated. (This one is mostly just fun)

ze_topazio
11-13-2015, 01:41 AM
Would be cool if we could steal their clothes and use them as disguises to infiltrate places.

flavorcountry19
11-13-2015, 02:01 AM
I've never understood why if Eagle vision is a "Sixth Sense" we have to activate it, surely the it should be something that comes naturally like seeing, hearing, tasting ect.

Here's how I see it

NPC Archetypes:
Each one has different advantages and disadvantages for the player.

The Poor


Interactions: "Donations" will earn you bits of information, the information given is context sensitive. IE if you're doing an Assassination mission the beggar can be asked about the target, if free roaming you get some small info about the setting, maybe even a small story that is added to the database, ect.
Hindrances: Like AC1 they beg for coins


The Common Folk


Interactions: Allow the player to blend with them. They tend to be less likely to react to commotion, and act as a large group of people too busy to notice the player's antics unless it more directly involves them. They try to keep their heads down and go about their business, too afraid to get involved in conflict, too oblivious to acknowledge the murderer standing beside them.
Hindrances: They tend to get in the way... Stay your blade from the flesh of the innocent!


The Nobility

Interactions: Can be blended with or kidnapped to allow entry into certain restricted areas, they would serve a similar function to scholars in AC1 but with the addition of kidnapping them to allow you to move more freely as opposed to a pre-determined path. Also because they are classified as innocent by the Creed, you have to knock them unconscious as opposed to simply murdering them.
Hindrances: Will actively call guards if they directly see you break the law, but again they are considered innocent so you have to find a non lethal method of neutralizing them. Obviously they can't be blended with if you're covered in the blood of the recently deceased... (don't let them see you kill anyone)


Carriers

Interactions: They carry fragile goods and must be gently pushed aside to avoid them dropping the item. The player can also startle carriers from a distance causing them to drop what their carrying as a simple distraction.
Hindrances: They carry fragile goods and must be gently pushed aside to avoid them dropping the item. If the player runs into them they drop whatever they are carrying and draw the attention of everyone.


Thugs

Interactions: Quick to violent behavior, thugs can be "coerced" into a street brawl with either the player or other thugs. During these fights the guards will not intervene, instead they wait until the victor is decided before stepping in and attempting to rouse the unconscious loser, giving the player a nice opportunity to slip away. Also defeating a thug in a brawl gives you a throwing knife.
Hindrances: Will shove the player away if they attempt to blend in with them, possibly into carriers or guards. Also cannot be kidnapped.


Stalkers

Interactions: Random muggers who attempt to ambush unsuspecting targets. (Think less Rogue and more Revelations) Their appearance is randomly generated (to make them more difficult to detect) and they follow prey through the crowds. They will either strike in the street, attempting to stab the player (like Revelations) or they will follow the player into alley ways and engage them in open conflict. If the player approaches the police they will lose interest and stop following the player. This can be done to prevent unnecessary commotion. They can also target NPCs, allowing the player to intervene.
Hindrances: They will kill you. If the player fails to counter they will be desynchronized instantly.



Some NPC "Quirks"
May apply to guards, civilians, or both


Acquisitive: Will be affected by coin throw



Syncope: Tends to faint under stress, can't be kidnapped
Cowardly: Will run away under stress
Calm: Will NOT run away under stress
Loner: Can't blend with, can still be kidnapped
Frugal: Can't be pick pocketed
Sleeper: Can't be roused from sleep
Paranoid: Will check hiding places even if unaltered
Dimwitted: Likes to stand close to hiding places, will regularly move between hiding places. Often away from fellow guards... hint hint
Skilled: Does more damage in combat.
Drunkard: Has a 15% chance to spawn inebriated. (This one is mostly just fun)



really like this! although it would be kinda hard to make the distinction between all the different classes unless it is like thrown in your face!

Consus_E
11-13-2015, 02:52 AM
Would be cool if we could steal their clothes and use them as disguises to infiltrate places.

Too Hitman for me. Part of what I liked about AC is the idea that you can in theory blend in with everyone.


really like this! although it would be kinda hard to make the distinction between all the different classes unless it is like thrown in your face!

The archetypes appear on NPCs like the way information appears in Watchdogs. Otherwise certain visual cues could be used to identify archetypes IE thugs are more muscular, nobility dress more regally, poor people look more downtrodden possibly with different walking animations that highlight their demeanor.

cawatrooper9
11-13-2015, 06:26 PM
The Poor


Interactions: "Donations" will earn you bits of information, the information given is context sensitive. IE if you're doing an Assassination mission the beggar can be asked about the target, if free roaming you get some small info about the setting, maybe even a small story that is added to the database, ect.
Hindrances: Like AC1 they beg for coins





https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=31g0YE61PLQ

Haha, sorry, but never again. No way I want to have to deal with beggars/minstrels, they're so annoying!


Some NPC "Quirks"
May apply to guards, civilians, or both


Acquisitive: Will be affected by coin throw



Syncope: Tends to faint under stress, can't be kidnapped
Cowardly: Will run away under stress
Calm: Will NOT run away under stress
Loner: Can't blend with, can still be kidnapped
Frugal: Can't be pick pocketed
Sleeper: Can't be roused from sleep
Paranoid: Will check hiding places even if unaltered
Dimwitted: Likes to stand close to hiding places, will regularly move between hiding places. Often away from fellow guards... hint hint
Skilled: Does more damage in combat.
Drunkard: Has a 15% chance to spawn inebriated. (This one is mostly just fun)


That would be cool, a way that we can analyze each individual NPC for stregnths/weaknesses, kind of like in Shadow of Mordor.

dxsxhxcx
11-13-2015, 06:45 PM
Haha, sorry, but never again. No way I want to have to deal with beggars/minstrels, they're so annoying!


What means they've served their purpose well and should make a return.


Too Hitman for me. Part of what I liked about AC is the idea that you can in theory blend in with everyone.

Hitman does Social Stealth much better than AC exactly because of that (hell, even Metal Gear Solid does Social Stealth better than AC), if you are capable to blend in with a certain group of people is because you look like them enough to not attract attention to yourself, in AC our suspension of disbelief needs to play a part in order for it to work because people have grown too attached to the Assassin uniform.

The way we get our disguise in Hitman and Metal Gear also is much more immersive than in AC.

RVSage
11-13-2015, 06:48 PM
I've never understood why if Eagle vision is a "Sixth Sense" we have to activate it, surely the it should be something that comes naturally like seeing, hearing, tasting ect.

Here's how I see it

NPC Archetypes:
Each one has different advantages and disadvantages for the player.

The Poor


Interactions: "Donations" will earn you bits of information, the information given is context sensitive. IE if you're doing an Assassination mission the beggar can be asked about the target, if free roaming you get some small info about the setting, maybe even a small story that is added to the database, ect.
Hindrances: Like AC1 they beg for coins


The Common Folk


Interactions: Allow the player to blend with them. They tend to be less likely to react to commotion, and act as a large group of people too busy to notice the player's antics unless it more directly involves them. They try to keep their heads down and go about their business, too afraid to get involved in conflict, too oblivious to acknowledge the murderer standing beside them.
Hindrances: They tend to get in the way... Stay your blade from the flesh of the innocent!


The Nobility

Interactions: Can be blended with or kidnapped to allow entry into certain restricted areas, they would serve a similar function to scholars in AC1 but with the addition of kidnapping them to allow you to move more freely as opposed to a pre-determined path. Also because they are classified as innocent by the Creed, you have to knock them unconscious as opposed to simply murdering them.
Hindrances: Will actively call guards if they directly see you break the law, but again they are considered innocent so you have to find a non lethal method of neutralizing them. Obviously they can't be blended with if you're covered in the blood of the recently deceased... (don't let them see you kill anyone)


Carriers

Interactions: They carry fragile goods and must be gently pushed aside to avoid them dropping the item. The player can also startle carriers from a distance causing them to drop what their carrying as a simple distraction.
Hindrances: They carry fragile goods and must be gently pushed aside to avoid them dropping the item. If the player runs into them they drop whatever they are carrying and draw the attention of everyone.


Thugs

Interactions: Quick to violent behavior, thugs can be "coerced" into a street brawl with either the player or other thugs. During these fights the guards will not intervene, instead they wait until the victor is decided before stepping in and attempting to rouse the unconscious loser, giving the player a nice opportunity to slip away. Also defeating a thug in a brawl gives you a throwing knife.
Hindrances: Will shove the player away if they attempt to blend in with them, possibly into carriers or guards. Also cannot be kidnapped.


Stalkers

Interactions: Random muggers who attempt to ambush unsuspecting targets. (Think less Rogue and more Revelations) Their appearance is randomly generated (to make them more difficult to detect) and they follow prey through the crowds. They will either strike in the street, attempting to stab the player (like Revelations) or they will follow the player into alley ways and engage them in open conflict. If the player approaches the police they will lose interest and stop following the player. This can be done to prevent unnecessary commotion. They can also target NPCs, allowing the player to intervene.
Hindrances: They will kill you. If the player fails to counter they will be desynchronized instantly.



Some NPC "Quirks"
May apply to guards, civilians, or both


Acquisitive: Will be affected by coin throw



Syncope: Tends to faint under stress, can't be kidnapped
Cowardly: Will run away under stress
Calm: Will NOT run away under stress
Loner: Can't blend with, can still be kidnapped
Frugal: Can't be pick pocketed
Sleeper: Can't be roused from sleep
Paranoid: Will check hiding places even if unaltered
Dimwitted: Likes to stand close to hiding places, will regularly move between hiding places. Often away from fellow guards... hint hint
Skilled: Does more damage in combat.
Drunkard: Has a 15% chance to spawn inebriated. (This one is mostly just fun)


Fantastic ideas

cawatrooper9
11-13-2015, 06:52 PM
What means they've served their purpose well and should make a return.


I disagree. There's a difference between challenging and annoying.

I don't think I'm alone in not wanting to see their return.

dxsxhxcx
11-13-2015, 07:11 PM
I disagree. There's a difference between challenging and annoying.

I don't think I'm alone in not wanting to see their return.

I get that many people find them annoying, while playing AC1 sometimes I wished I could burn them alive as well (lol), but IMO that was exactly their purpose, that's one of the reasons why (IMO) that game was the most immersive AC we had (even with all its flaws), there were annoying people, we climbed buildings slowly, combat had more weight (I could feel Altair using his strenght to perform a heavy attack), the combat was more challenging than its successors', even the lore tried as much as it could to not rely on our suspension of disbelief for things to make sense, unfortunately, most of it is gone now to favor a more mainstream audience. AC has literally become a historical GTA (and I don't mean it in a good way).

Consus_E
11-13-2015, 07:12 PM
I disagree. There's a difference between challenging and annoying.

I don't think I'm alone in not wanting to see their return.

But the only reason they were really that annoying in AC1 was that they asked you for money and you had no option to give them any. AC2 more or less solved this problem with coin throw being added (or just punching/throwing/pickpocket them if you didn't mind the notoriety hit)

Also I forgot to mention in my original post that I would like the beggars to approach the player AND NPCs. This is mainly to cut down on the number of times they become a nuisance rather than some extra immersion.

cawatrooper9
11-13-2015, 08:39 PM
I get that many people find them annoying, while playing AC1 sometimes I wished I could burn them alive as well (lol), but IMO that was exactly their purpose, that's one of the reasons why (IMO) that game was the most immersive AC we had (even with all its flaws), there were annoying people...

No thanks. I prefer not to be constantly annoyed and frustrated. I guess I'm weird that way.



But the only reason they were really that annoying in AC1 was that they asked you for money and you had no option to give them any. AC2 more or less solved this problem with coin throw being added (or just punching/throwing/pickpocket them if you didn't mind the notoriety hit)

Also I forgot to mention in my original post that I would like the beggars to approach the player AND NPCs. This is mainly to cut down on the number of times they become a nuisance rather than some extra immersion.



Both good points. I'd much rather see this idea built on, rather than merely spearheading the obnoxious system in AC1.

Steelray25
11-15-2015, 06:09 AM
If I never hear, "Please, sir, I'm so hungry!" again, it'll be too soon.