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View Full Version : Fiat G.50. Oddies



lindyman
03-21-2004, 02:56 AM
This isn't exactly the norm, but its rather solemn dive made me curious so I made conducted a small experiment.

Enter QMB, 1 Fiat G.50, 5000m. Cut back throttle to 0 and enter a vertical dive. The plane accelerates very poorly. Shortly before it is high time to pull up, you reach a speed of a bit over 700km/h, perhaps 730 with some, but not severe, buffering. Lose an aileron and toast the engine. The plane is controllable, you can pull out and make an emergency landing.

Second try. Fiat G.50. 5000m. Cut back throttle to 0 and decrrease RPM to lowest possible. Enter vertical dive. The plane slowly accelerates to terminal veclocity of about 680km/h. Mild buffeting. Gentle pull out, no harm done.

The drag on that thing is enormous, is one thing one can easily conclude. What I don't understand is why lower speed is reached when I reduce RPM to a minimum. In both cases the engine is not pulling. In the first attempt, the prop is in fact windmilling so violently that the engine is toasted. Yet that huge airbrake makes the plane go faster in the dive. Weird thing.
_
/Bjorn.

lindyman
03-21-2004, 02:56 AM
This isn't exactly the norm, but its rather solemn dive made me curious so I made conducted a small experiment.

Enter QMB, 1 Fiat G.50, 5000m. Cut back throttle to 0 and enter a vertical dive. The plane accelerates very poorly. Shortly before it is high time to pull up, you reach a speed of a bit over 700km/h, perhaps 730 with some, but not severe, buffering. Lose an aileron and toast the engine. The plane is controllable, you can pull out and make an emergency landing.

Second try. Fiat G.50. 5000m. Cut back throttle to 0 and decrrease RPM to lowest possible. Enter vertical dive. The plane slowly accelerates to terminal veclocity of about 680km/h. Mild buffeting. Gentle pull out, no harm done.

The drag on that thing is enormous, is one thing one can easily conclude. What I don't understand is why lower speed is reached when I reduce RPM to a minimum. In both cases the engine is not pulling. In the first attempt, the prop is in fact windmilling so violently that the engine is toasted. Yet that huge airbrake makes the plane go faster in the dive. Weird thing.
_
/Bjorn.

CalleB
03-28-2004, 04:29 AM
This is not the way the real G50 did behave. If you put the plane in dive it accelerated very fast and the finnish test pilot, second leutnant Tapani Harmaja made a dive reaching a speed of indicated airspeed of 900-100 km/h in Italy in 1939. After calculations made by engineer Giuseppe Gabrielli the true airspeed was measured to 828 km/h, 90 km/h faster than the construction termal velocity. Harmaja wrote in his report that the acceleration was so fast that this should be pointed out to pilots not familiar to the type. 1/3th of the total lift came from the fuselage. This is something that should pe bointed out to Oleg for correction in next update.

Hawgdog
03-28-2004, 04:45 AM
I couldn't get over 610 no matter what I did in a dive from 10K

Enter the biplane fiat, I could get that in a dive only to 550 give or take. Never lost one piece in three dives from 10K

tough bird, eh?

http://img5.photobucket.com/albums/v22/HawgDog/sharkdog.gif
When you get to Hell, tell 'em HawgDog sent you!

p1ngu666
03-28-2004, 07:20 AM
isnt open cockpit + 828km/ph bad?:\
for like, the face
http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/88.gif

http://www.pingu666.modded.me.uk/mysig3.jpg
<123_GWood_JG123> NO SPAM!

mike_espo
03-28-2004, 08:24 AM
Hopefully, these issues will be fixed in the upcoming patch. Also, no fuel guage, DM is very simplistic, no mg damage at all. Other than that, I like the plane alot. Does well online in DF servers. Only got killed once, got about 7 kills with it.

"Fatte vede che ridemo!"http://www.flying-tigers.net/caccia%20WW%20II/g50.jpg

CalleB
03-28-2004, 10:44 AM
The face is behind the front windshield so it is no problem. In this case it was an old version with closed canopy which broke away during the dive. The G50 was the pilotÔ┬┤s aircraft. It was my fatherÔ┬┤s all time high favorite among flewn aircraft both military and civil. (He had 91 types) The technical personell had a lot of troubles with the aircraft in Finland caused by cold weather and ricine oil among other problems. But most problems were solved by skillful mechanics during the time.

Ugly_Kid
03-28-2004, 11:07 AM
A lesser thing in G.50 is the throttle. In AEP it works "wrong" way around in the cockpit graphics. Real throttle was increased by pulling.

Kannaksen_hanu
03-28-2004, 11:32 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Ugly_Kid:
A lesser thing in G.50 is the throttle. In AEP it works "wrong" way around in the cockpit graphics. Real throttle was increased by pulling.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Finns reversed it to normal setting. Just like Morane's throttle too. Thats why Oleg modeled lt like this.

mike_espo
03-28-2004, 12:02 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Ugly_Kid:
A lesser thing in G.50 is the throttle. In AEP it works "wrong" way around in the cockpit graphics. Real throttle was increased by pulling.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I know. I reversed the throttle axis to model the Regia Aeronautic variant. It was really confusing at first.....had full throttle on the ground while taxiing.....lots of fun!

"Fatte vede che ridemo!"http://www.flying-tigers.net/caccia%20WW%20II/g50.jpg

CalleB
03-28-2004, 04:21 PM
Contrary to info in some books, the G50 trottle was never changed in Finnish Air Force.
They did it in Moranes buy not in G50. This is a historic fact. There was some incidents at Kauhava Air Academy after the war where a student mixed it up with the trottle and had some damages on a G50.

AndyHigh
03-28-2004, 10:24 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>DM is very simplistic, no mg damage at all. Other than that, I like the plane alot. Does well online in DF servers. Only got killed once, got about 7 kills with it.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

What I found it surely gets easily damage from small mg's, you just can't see it visually. It felt like it's missing its seat armour when I tried it online. Otherwise it's very nice plane to fly. FAF lost only 3 Fiats to enemy fire while scoring 101 victories so I doubt it should be the weakest plane.

mike_espo
03-29-2004, 10:43 AM
Yes, I got peppered with 7.7mm from a I-153 and no vis damage!!! The only damage modelled with G.50 is severe aieleron damage...wants to roll to the left..

"Fatte vede che ridemo!"http://www.flying-tigers.net/caccia%20WW%20II/g50.jpg

CalleB
03-30-2004, 06:32 AM
The G50 did not have any armour seat, trials were made in Finland but they were too heavy. The wings had two wingspars that made the wings extremely strong. Good visibility made it impossible for enemy planes to sneak behind you.

AndyHigh
03-30-2004, 07:10 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by CalleB:
The G50 did not have any armour seat, trials <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Oh, I read somewhere that G.50bis had improved armor for the pilot. Most of the Finnish G.50s were of this type AFAIK.

mike_espo
03-30-2004, 07:51 AM
never read about an armoured seat for freccia. I would think at 2400kg loaded, and a powerplant at 840 max, that adding armour would hurt performance...

"Fatte vede che ridemo!"http://www.flying-tigers.net/caccia%20WW%20II/g50.jpg

horseback
03-30-2004, 08:00 AM
A big lasagna lunch before a flight could hurt your performance with that engine...

cheers

horseback

"Here's your new Mustangs, boys. You can learn to fly'em on the way to the target. Cheers!" -LTCOL Don Blakeslee, 4th FG CO, February 27th, 1944

CalleB
03-30-2004, 02:28 PM
The finnish planes were of 3 diffrent series of the normal G50, not the G50bis. No armour seats.