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View Full Version : WTH? Cheat? "Player crashed/killed"



SithSpeeder
02-10-2004, 01:28 PM
Last night, a pilot in one of our rooms would get hammered--plane on fire and smoking, etc. Next we'd see a chat window message:
"<playername> crashed"
"<playername> killed"
This would be OK but apparently my squadmate who did the hammering was getting zero (0) credit--no kill was being registered. After this happened three times in a row, my squadmate got so frustrated he quit. My questions two:
1. How the heck was this guy doing this (robbing the points/kill)?
2. How can it be stopped or negated? Or worded in the game description?

Thanks.

* _54th_Speeder *

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SithSpeeder
02-10-2004, 01:28 PM
Last night, a pilot in one of our rooms would get hammered--plane on fire and smoking, etc. Next we'd see a chat window message:
"&lt;playername&gt; crashed"
"&lt;playername&gt; killed"
This would be OK but apparently my squadmate who did the hammering was getting zero (0) credit--no kill was being registered. After this happened three times in a row, my squadmate got so frustrated he quit. My questions two:
1. How the heck was this guy doing this (robbing the points/kill)?
2. How can it be stopped or negated? Or worded in the game description?

Thanks.

* _54th_Speeder *

http://members.cox.net/~ijhutch/_images/400x200sig.jpg

Fehler
02-10-2004, 01:39 PM
I know this may not satisfy your question but...

Sometimes the game records the first hits on a plane, sometimes, it records the last or most crucial hits. In other words, I have hit a guy with a good pass, starting him smoking. He is hit other times afterwards and crashes on landing. I have gotten the kill and points.

Other times, I have seen a plane engulfed in flames, headed to the ground (Myself doing the damage) to see another person buzz by and hit with a few rounds, and he got the kill.

I am not really sure what systematic events have to occur in the game to get credit for a kill. I think it's probably on the order of MOSS. To calculate, you have to have a SWAG tool. SWAG tools do not come with the game, and cant be downloaded, or purchased. I got my SWAG tool from years of military service.

I hope that answers your question.

Oh...

SWAG - Scientific Wild-@ss Guess
MOSS - Mystic Order of Secret Sh!t

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Fillmore
02-10-2004, 01:56 PM
Maybe the problem is with your squadmate rather than with the person he was shooting?

In my flying online I have sometimes not gotten points for a kill, sometime I hear someone whining about having flown for hours and made several kills and not gotten credit for any of them (I doubt it was the same person he killed every time), so I doubt it is anything as simple as a problem with one person or another or somethiong that can be caused intentionally.

In general the ingame scoring system is flaky at best, and the most sensible thing is to simply ignore it altogether.

VW-IceFire
02-10-2004, 02:01 PM
Pretty standard fare not to get credit for kills or get credited for the wrong thing...heck the other day I got credit for blasting a teammate when infact the only contact I had with that guy was seconds before he crashed and he quite obviously was already spinning towards the ground. Unless my MG151/20 had some magic homing ability, I didn't even shoot him...but I was penalized for the points anyways.

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SKULLS_LZ
02-10-2004, 02:02 PM
Did this happen on a "scripted" DF server? I believe this is a bug and I usually encounter this on JG27*slammin server. I get the message "foo has been destroyed by L-Z" in the chat bar, but no "Enemy Aircraft: Destroyed", and no points. Usually this happened when I put a bullet in pilot's head (PK) and victim hits refly before plane is destroyed, but not always. I destroyed at least 3 bombers last nite, a couple instantly turned into chaff with a salvo of RS-82s, and I did not get any points for any bombers killed. My solution is to keep a pencil and paper next to my PC and keep score manually http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_razz.gif I'm happy if I get the chat message, assuming that everyone else sees the same.

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CO_Eagle_31stFG
02-10-2004, 02:06 PM
another possibility. Because we do not understand exactly what kind of room you had running.
1 reason could also be he could have been shot down by an AA gun if you had aa firing during on your map.
another possibility could be if the pilot bailed out, sometimes if a pilot bails it does not register as a kill.

anagin this is just another possibility for what happened.

J30Vader
02-10-2004, 02:19 PM
Sometimes you get the "Enemy Aircraft Destroyed" and you still don't get the points.

It happens.

LW_lcarp
02-10-2004, 02:33 PM
Been getting that alot since the last patch dunno whats up with it

"If winning isnt everything why do they keep score"
Vince Lombardi

SithSpeeder
02-10-2004, 03:11 PM
Clarifications:

No, there was no AAA anywhere near.
This was not a scripted server--just a dogfight map.
No one else hit the guy.
There was no "Enemy Aircraft Destroyed" message. There was only:
"&lt;playername&gt; crashed"
"&lt;playername&gt; was killed"
It only happened on this guy (everyone else appeared to get "killed").

Overall, I agree that "playing for points" is not the true benchmark measure of skill, but it is an indication.

Perhaps hitting refly before the plane goes in does that. I dunno, perhaps need to experiment.

Or perhaps its just part of the game. Just curious if anyone else has seen this (like LW_lcarp).

* _54th_Speeder *

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[Gypsy]
02-10-2004, 04:30 PM
This all goes along with the message "&lt;Player&gt; ditches" after you bring your poor shotup, smoking AC back to your airfield and make a decent landing in the middle of the runway, taxi off and park near a hanger... go figure...

"Gypsy"

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CO 310th FS Bravo Wing

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BS87
02-10-2004, 04:40 PM
TO clarify, the *only* time you get points for a kill is when you get the "enemy aircraft destroyed" message.

p1ngu666
02-10-2004, 04:55 PM
u can get kills if u do a certain amount of damage too i think.
they land ok but then u get p1ngu666 has destoyed whoever.
i hate the bent prop= no/less points for u
sometimes the game pauses as someone spawns, and your on the brake... over u go http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-sad.gif
&lt;points&gt;oh goodbye http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-tongue.gif
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crazyivan1970
02-10-2004, 04:58 PM
also i noticed that if person that you killed leaves the game before you land, very often no points either.

V!
Regards,

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VFC*Crazyivan aka VFC*HOST

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Kozhedub: In combat potential, the Yak-3, La-7 and La-9 fighters were indisputably superior to the Bf-109s and Fw-190s. But, as they say, no matter how good the violin may be, much depends on the violinist. I always felt respect for an enemy pilot whose plane I failed to down.

Kasdeya
02-10-2004, 05:44 PM
I notice this also, that when you down a few planes but donot land, then you will not recieve points. When you do "refly' you will recieve you points. That might be what is this case, but maybe not. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif

Kas

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SlickStick
02-10-2004, 06:29 PM
From a thread back in November, 2003.

This has been my experience with the interesting scoring in FB.

When you see the message, "XXXX has been shot down by XXXX." with the same name, it's usually because the guy who did the damage to that person, has crashed or died and has hit refly already.

Then, the game doesn't have a name to assign to the kill, so it defaults to the main name when a pilot dies bailing..etc, after what would have been the killer has crashed or something. This happens to me sometimes if the other guy goes down while we are both bailing and I crash and die afterwards.

Also, I've found if you took damage to your plane, sometimes very slight and the guy or AAA that did the damage is still up, even if you land safely, you can get the killed message.

Or you'll get a safe landing message, but the guy still flying gets the "Enemy Aircraft Destroyed" message on the right of his screen.

I make it a point to bail on successful crash landings with damage for 70% of points. 50% for air bails. However, sometimes you can get screwed with 10% for landing with damage and not bailing.

There are two reasons for not getting points for a kill that I know of...one is when someone else hit the plane after you did or someone did more damage than you. I've seen where my wingman and I are damaging a plane and one will get the kill message in the chat, while the other guy gets the points message to the right.

The other reason is due to lag. If the downed pilot lags on impact or is temporarily disconnected for a short time, the server doesn't get the kill information and doesn't think there was a kill. Other times the server catches up and awards the kill a few seconds later.

Rule of thumb, if you don't see the "Enemy Aircraft Destroyed" message to the right, after downing a bird, you're not getting any points credit for that kill, as far as the server is concerned.

Sometimes you have to wait until the killee lands, too. Some pilots take a little damage and run for home to land, hoping to avoid a kill. It usually just results in a safe landing message and a points kill message to the right for the pilot who did the damage.http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

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hisfas
02-10-2004, 07:13 PM
I think the problem with slammin's room is the flyable B17. I always get points for shooting down a PE. Almost never for a B17.

Xnomad
02-11-2004, 04:32 AM
This happend a lot on Virtual Pilots 1 server on HL and occassionaly it still does. I used to get it with bombers, I would shoot down an IL2 and then an HE 111 land and get no points, which is annoying as they are risky planes to attack. I was the only one shooting and I saw the planes hit the deck and I saw the "Enemy aicraft destroyed" message on my hud. It's just a bug not a cheat. Lately I've had it with downing fighters as well. God I'm such a points ***** http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-wink.gif(but then again isn't everyone?)

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Capt.LoneRanger
02-11-2004, 04:44 AM
AFAIK this is a problem WHAT you hit. If the plane was not critically damaged, he can land or crashland. If the major amount of damage is done during this belly landing, it's counted as a crash, sometimes.

Something similar can happen due to lag. I've seen this in a few head ons, that resulted in a crash. Both were destroyed, but the one not bailing is often counted as crashed and get's 10 pts for ramming you.


greets
Capt.LoneRanger

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AtomicRunt
02-11-2004, 11:32 AM
I agree Ranger, if you damage the enemy and he no longer has the ability to fight yet still has the ability to fly. They can simply crash-land just about anywhere(wheels-up)as long as their aircraft is intact when they bail, you won't receive any "points" or very little. Oddly enough, usually its the ones who worry about the point count who try this. I wish there was an option in this game to either use points or just kills, with the ability to share kills.

Salute!
AB AtomicRunt
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jung0l
02-11-2004, 01:21 PM
Yeah, ..."X was shot by Y, ssisted by Z". I think that would dilute the kill stealing to genuine teamwork.

LeadSpitter_
02-11-2004, 03:54 PM
I noticed in some scripted servers you can get 5 kills rtb unhit land fine no damage no propstrike or engine damage and it says you crashed and get 0 points, I dont get that.

Poeple said it happens to them but they think its from being hit once and the person is still flying who had a shot on you and they get the credit but shouldnt it say you got killed by them instead of saying you crashed.

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SlickStick
02-11-2004, 05:25 PM
The only time I would think it a bug, is if I see "Enemy Aircraft Destroyed" to the right and don't get points upon safe landing. If I get reduced points at anytime upon landing after I know what points I've just earned, then I must have received some sort of damage along the way.

Because we all know that FB scoring is 100 points per engine of enemy aircraft downed, 60 points AAA, 100 points smaller ships...etc, if you just shot 3 single-engined planes down and took a bullet hit or two, even if you can't see or detect it, the game did and upon landing without bailing you'll get 10% or 30 points. If you bail, you'll get 210 points or 70%.

I seem to recall something around here that said not every shell is modeled visually, but is still in the effect part of the code? I may be wrong or it has changed, but I thought it said that it helps FPS by reducing the actual shells rendered on screen, but the code still accounts for the entire ROF.http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/blink.gif

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crazyivan1970
02-11-2004, 05:32 PM
There is alot of inconsistences in scoring IMO. I don`t care about point too much... but two things are getting on my nerves

1) You bring back your wounded bird...all messed up and manage to land...but sometimes you come in too short and scrape ground with the prop trying to stop the plane. So prop bends, big deal... and what do you get? "VFC*Crazyivan crashed" ?? http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

2) You get couple of rounds up your 6, lose your persuer and come for landing... after safe return... what do you get? "VFC*Crazyivan was shot down by xxxxxxxxx"

There are others, but they not important. Also #2 awards enemy with the kill? what gives? If i`m not down, he didn`t get the kill.

Just a couple of things that bother me http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

V!
Regards,

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VFC*Crazyivan aka VFC*HOST

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Kozhedub: In combat potential, the Yak-3, La-7 and La-9 fighters were indisputably superior to the Bf-109s and Fw-190s. But, as they say, no matter how good the violin may be, much depends on the violinist. I always felt respect for an enemy pilot whose plane I failed to down.

Wing_Walker
02-11-2004, 05:59 PM
To understand the IL-2 FB point system you have to think in Russian and play chess...

At least that's what I've been told by an "expert". http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

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crazyivan1970
02-11-2004, 05:59 PM
I speak russian and play chess, no luck http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

V!
Regards,

http://blitzpigs.com/forum/images/smiles/smokin.gif

VFC*Crazyivan aka VFC*HOST

http://www.rmutt.netfirms.com/coop-ivan.jpg

Kozhedub: In combat potential, the Yak-3, La-7 and La-9 fighters were indisputably superior to the Bf-109s and Fw-190s. But, as they say, no matter how good the violin may be, much depends on the violinist. I always felt respect for an enemy pilot whose plane I failed to down.

Wing_Walker
02-11-2004, 06:05 PM
Well, if the truth be known I've lost many kill points due to server lag (most of the hosts don't have a clue how to maintain their systems...hello?), so I just chalk it up to playing a game.

The only people that seem to get upset are point-hoes.

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