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View Full Version : how can a bf g10 outturn a la7?



raaaid
04-29-2004, 11:00 PM
it happened to me the other day with a la7 a g10 outturned me at sea level and im still wondering whether he cheated or theres something about turning a g10 that i dont know

raaaid
04-29-2004, 11:00 PM
it happened to me the other day with a la7 a g10 outturned me at sea level and im still wondering whether he cheated or theres something about turning a g10 that i dont know

S77th-brooks
04-29-2004, 11:20 PM
109 using cut back turns will easly out turn a bad or good la7 flyer

Achilles97
04-29-2004, 11:22 PM
What's a cut-back turn?

Fennec_P
04-29-2004, 11:24 PM
You need practice.

That's like getting knifed in CS.

ElfunkoI
04-29-2004, 11:27 PM
I think he's talking about a sliceback. It wont defeat sh1t if the La just does a high yo-yo becuase a sliceback although it will get you a new vector quick will also leave you lower than your original altitude and slower.

"A6?http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gifhttp://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gifhttp://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif Will be A6!"

Franzen
04-29-2004, 11:29 PM
There are so many possibilities. A few that immediately come to mind are online play(not always equal), pilot skill, and flaps. I would assume that if you were at sea level both speeds were reduced. When I'm in a low alt dfight I will use landing flaps and fly on the edge of a stall. You can turn pretty tight. But you probably just underestimated your enemies skill. They made lots of specs for planes but they don't make them for pilots http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

I'm no expert, but that's just my uneducated guess.

Fritz Franzen

jmmoric
04-29-2004, 11:41 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by raaaid:
it happened to me the other day with a la7 a g10 outturned me at sea level and im still wondering whether he cheated or theres something about turning a g10 that i dont know<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I bet a lot of good pilots sits at the bar in heaven, wondering the same. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/34.gif http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_frown.gif

rgds

glottis77
04-30-2004, 12:22 AM
how did you set fuel load? if he had 25% and you a 100%...

Dmitri9mm
04-30-2004, 01:47 AM
I find it easy to outfly the Spitfire in a bf 109 g2 in online play, so the g10 should still stand a chance against a la7.
I often use a "wing over" tactic that involves a climbing turn to make use of the superior climbing performance of the 109, followed by a sudden deployment of rudder to make the plane fall fast nose first, then a hard pull on the stick and voila: You're right on his six!

http://www.gotfuturama.com/Multimedia/FrameGrabs/3ACV19/Grabs/pic00929.jpg
"1947 can kiss my shiny metal..."
First Futurama episode to feature WWII fighters: "Roswell that ends well"

Stalker58
04-30-2004, 01:56 AM
Me 109 can sometimes turn incredibly tightly and if flown by experienced pilot who KNOWS exaclty when turn anyoe even in the La7 could be in a big trouble.Don't forget that G10 has excellent power/weight ratio (as good as La7) so don't be surprised to much http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Altitude, speed, manoeuvre and.... CRASH!

Skalgrim
04-30-2004, 04:17 AM
44 la-7 turntime is 20-21sec above 300km/h ias

g2/g6 turn same time, but with 270-280km/h ias,

that means g2/g6 turn inside la-7, because smaller radius

g10 with 1800ps can match g6-g2 sustain turntime, because much better powerloading

109 wing shape make very good lift for so little wing,

therefore have she probable better liftloading as la-7 and can turn inside she,


it seem too we have 45 la-7,


la-7 in fb match sealevel speed, climb and
turn time from the 45 la-7

44 la-7 all aspects weaker



.

[This message was edited by Skalgrim on Fri April 30 2004 at 04:20 AM.]

Dmitri9mm
04-30-2004, 04:27 AM
"It's the man, not the machine"
Just ask my girlfriend http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

http://www.gotfuturama.com/Multimedia/FrameGrabs/3ACV19/Grabs/pic00929.jpg
"1947 can kiss my shiny metal..."
First Futurama episode to feature WWII fighters: "Roswell that ends well"

SeaFireLIV
04-30-2004, 04:31 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Dmitri9mm:
"It's the man, not the machine"
Just ask my girlfriend http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Indeed. A good pilot can easily beat a less experienced guy even if he`s in a technically superior plane. The biggest mistake to make is to think, "I`m in a better plane, so I must beat him!"

http://img12.photobucket.com/albums/v31/SeaFireLIV/Old1.jpg

D-XXI
04-30-2004, 04:35 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Dmitri9mm:
"It's the man, not the machine"
Just ask my girlfriend http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

http://www.gotfuturama.com/Multimedia/FrameGrabs/3ACV19/Grabs/pic00929.jpg
"1947 can kiss my shiny metal..."
First Futurama episode to feature WWII fighters: "Roswell that ends well"<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I did but she said she goes for the money.

Dmitri9mm
04-30-2004, 04:40 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by D-XXI:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Dmitri9mm:
"It's the man, not the machine"
Just ask my girlfriend http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I did but she said she goes for the money.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

That, AND my 10Mb connection!

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The n00b, the n00b, the n00b is on fire.
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TgD Thunderbolt56
04-30-2004, 05:58 AM
Skalgrim beat me to it. The turning radius of the La7 is VERY dependent on its airspeed. The elevator response on the G-10 gets stiff at high speeds as well, but not to the extent of the La. Also, the G-10 rolls better therefore is more effective in a scissors move.

Fly to its strengths and you'll be fine. The La is faster and accelerates more quickly. Oh...practice doesn't hurt either.



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maxim26
04-30-2004, 06:31 AM
Can anybody explain what is cut back or slice back turn and how to perform this turn.

LeadSpitter_
04-30-2004, 07:47 AM
people bind 3 keys to one, combat flaps 0 pitch o trottle, the whole 109 bf110 in manual pitch needs to be looked into how fast they are accelarating off the ground and in the air, you can out turn just about anything then by over reving the engines slighty to 3600rpms be back and the same speed you were at before doing the binded key quick turns.

Will it be fixed I doubt it oleg seems to listen to the luftwhiners most like with the uselessly weak b17 which require absolutely no tactics to shoot down 3 in a pass and the incredibly weak p47 damage model

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dieg777
04-30-2004, 08:29 AM
For info on manouvers and how to do them go to Tailspins Tales webpage its listed under Sturmovich essentials

F19_Ob
04-30-2004, 10:27 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by raaaid:
it happened to me the other day with a la7 a g10 outturned me at sea level and im still wondering whether he cheated or theres something about turning a g10 that i dont know<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>



It is absolutely possible. As an earlier poster mentioned ,there are so many variables.
If the pilots are somewhat equally skilled it depends mostly on inital positioning, as I see it.

When I meet an La7 in my 109 I know I probably cant get away or fight it if flying in fast speed. Normally I try high and lowhyoyos while scissoring ( vertical scissoring) and on top on maneuvers I know I can fly as slow as 150-110km/h without flipping, swinging my nose with the rudder to cut the turn or drawing deflection. It more often ends with the enemy flipping and crashing than he gets shot down, but it is not simple and it is quite easy to end up in the same manner.

Beating the La7 in 1 to 1 dogfight rarely happens and not at all if the enemy is an ace.

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crazyivan1970
04-30-2004, 10:30 AM
Oh boy... uberness of mighty La7 Just took a nose dive http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

g10 is UBER! Must be toned down ASAP! http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

V!
Regards,

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Kozhedub: In combat potential, the Yak-3, La-7 and La-9 fighters were indisputably superior to the Bf-109s and Fw-190s. But, as they say, no matter how good the violin may be, much depends on the violinist. I always felt respect for an enemy pilot whose plane I failed to down.

DuxCorvan
04-30-2004, 10:52 AM
Hey guys, stop toasting your brains. Answer is very simple.

Raaaid: you were too fast. He wasn't. Even a bad turning a/c can outturn a good one that flies much faster.

They call it inertia, and centrifugal force.

TnB is the kind of combat that tend to win the slower planes.

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Ten thousand years of Cantabrian skinning.

DuxCorvan
04-30-2004, 10:54 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Dmitri9mm:
"It's the man, not the machine"
Just ask my girlfriend<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

BTW, it's the machine. Ask mine. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

- Dux Corvan -
http://www.uploadit.org/DuxCorvan/Altamira2.jpg
Ten thousand years of Cantabrian skinning.

BBB_Hyperion
04-30-2004, 11:28 AM
Its obviously a bug a la7 shoot down how unrealistic http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Regards,
Hyperion

TheKetamineKid
04-30-2004, 01:49 PM
Turn auto-pitch off.

"Full real? How can you call it full real when you're still using auto-pitch on that 109...now get your coat and p**s off back to Crimson Skies!"

SlickStick
04-30-2004, 02:41 PM
"how can a bf g10 outturn a la7?"

It can't. At least not my LA7, lol. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/784.gif

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