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Franzen
06-14-2004, 06:39 AM
Hi all,

I've often wondered what the percentage of missing planes from WW2 is.

For example, almost 35,000 Bf109's were built. I was curious as to whether anyone knows how many have been found shotdown, taken as war trophies, or scrapped in relation to those that have never been found.

I have a feeling there are still many downed aircraft just waiting to be discovered in forests or even shallow water. Time is their only enemy now.

Fritz Franzen

Franzen
06-14-2004, 06:39 AM
Hi all,

I've often wondered what the percentage of missing planes from WW2 is.

For example, almost 35,000 Bf109's were built. I was curious as to whether anyone knows how many have been found shotdown, taken as war trophies, or scrapped in relation to those that have never been found.

I have a feeling there are still many downed aircraft just waiting to be discovered in forests or even shallow water. Time is their only enemy now.

Fritz Franzen

Hoarmurath
06-14-2004, 06:44 AM
Planes downed in france and yet undiscovered. If the pilot's corpse is still inside it, it is considered a grave and it is illegal to search it.

http://hoarmurath.free.fr/images/sighoar.jpg (http://hoarmurath.free.fr/)

Franzen
06-14-2004, 06:50 AM
What would actually happen if a person was walking through the forest one day and discovered a downed a/c including corpse? Would the crashsite be recognized as a grave? Would the a/c be removed and the pilot buried?

Fritz Franzen

hotspace
06-14-2004, 06:54 AM
By law if a Plane is under the ground or sea it's considered a War Grave, but if it's on the surface the a/c would be removed and the Pilot buried.

Hot Space

http://img11.photobucket.com/albums/v33/Hot_Space/queen3.jpg (http://www.il2skins.com/?planeidfilter=all&planefamilyfilter=all&screenshotfilter=allskins&countryidfilter=all&authoridfilter=Hot+Space&historicalidfilter=all&searchkey=&action=list&ts=1084560274)

Festung Europa Spitfire Campaign (http://www.netwings.org/library/Forgotten_Battles/Missions/index-14.html)

Franzen
06-14-2004, 07:00 AM
That sounds fair enough. When I retire I plan to spend a lot of time walking in areas where famous dfights took place. If after many years and many acres I'm lucky enough to find something, I'll be very satisfied. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

Fritz Franzen

1.JaVA_Razer
06-14-2004, 07:11 AM
gonna do same thing franzen,then hope there isn't a body inside(he bailed) and then gonna rent a truck,drag it home,renovate it/restorate and voila

fly it http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

------------------------------
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It sounds like a classic game of air-quake!?


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Kuikueg
06-14-2004, 08:11 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Hoarmurath:
Planes downed in france and yet undiscovered. If the pilot's corpse is still inside it, it is considered a grave and it is illegal to search it.

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

An archeologist was once asked when was a burial considered an archeologic place. He said "when the corpse doesn't smell anymore"

Kuikueg


http://server5.uploadit.org/files2/311203-Gaviota.jpg

hotspace
06-14-2004, 09:03 AM
http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

Hot Space

http://img11.photobucket.com/albums/v33/Hot_Space/queen3.jpg (http://www.il2skins.com/?planeidfilter=all&planefamilyfilter=all&screenshotfilter=allskins&countryidfilter=all&authoridfilter=Hot+Space&historicalidfilter=all&searchkey=&action=list&ts=1084560274)

Festung Europa Spitfire Campaign (http://www.netwings.org/library/Forgotten_Battles/Missions/index-14.html)

TugZooey
06-14-2004, 09:41 AM
Somewhat OT I guess, but I heard a story this past weekend of a P-38 extracted from a glacier not too long ago (5 or 10 yrs?). I don't recall if the pilots were in the birds or not.

Anyway, the P-38 is flying today and not too far from where I live.

mchaos
06-14-2004, 09:58 AM
Those P-38s landed on the glacier after running out of fuel.

No crashes.

The pilots were eventually rescued.

The planes became covered with snow and ice over the years. National Geographic has a video about their recovery.

RJNewly
06-14-2004, 11:01 AM
Man you need to find something better to do!

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Franzen:
That sounds fair enough. When I retire I plan to spend a lot of time walking in areas where famous dfights took place. If after many years and many acres I'm lucky enough to find something, I'll be very satisfied. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

Fritz Franzen<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

VF-17_Jolly
06-14-2004, 11:19 AM
http://www.coffeedrome.com/images/glacier1.jpg
Buried 268ft under the ice

http://www.coffeedrome.com/glacier.html

http://www.skyknights.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/jolly.jpg

BlitzPig_Ritter
06-14-2004, 11:23 AM
Imagine the number of naval aircraft sitting in the Pacific.

______________________________
Formerly Known as: Die_Ritterkreuz
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Now with 50+ skins and counting!

VF-17_Jolly
06-14-2004, 11:39 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by BlitzPig_Ritter:
Imagine the number of naval aircraft sitting in the Pacific.

______________________________
Formerly Known as: Die_Ritterkreuz
http://www.il2skins.com/?action=list&authoridfilter=Ritterkreuz&ts=1067024271&comefrom=credits
Now with 50+ skins and counting!<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

http://www.pacificwrecks.com/people/visitors/ording/truk/planes/jill_engine.jpg

http://www.pacificwrecks.com/people/visitors/ording/truk/planes/jill_cockpit.jpg

Too many............. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/51.gif

http://www.skyknights.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/jolly.jpg

Franzen
06-14-2004, 10:47 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by RJNewly:
Man you need to find something better to do!

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Franzen:
That sounds fair enough. When I retire I plan to spend a lot of time walking in areas where famous dfights took place. If after many years and many acres I'm lucky enough to find something, I'll be very satisfied. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

Fritz Franzen<HR></BLOCKQUOTE><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Like what? Play a WW2 flight sim? http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

There's more to it than what you might have thought. Imagine the amount of research. Imagine the possible finds, not just an aircraft. There's a lot of missing equipment. The only thing I don't want to find is a landmine, which I've heard still happens from time to time.

http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-wink.gifI can't think of something much better to do when I'm retired.

Fritz Franzen

wayno7777
06-14-2004, 11:02 PM
Hey Fritz, when I was stationed in Oahu, they found two or three Zeke wrecks not too far off shore near Kaneohe. I read of quite a few more.
You can always go fishing on your seach missions. Kill two birds with one stone. btw: it's quite muggy here in Eastern PA tonight. How's it there?

http://img74.photobucket.com/albums/v224/wayno77/Dux_Wreck.jpg
Any landing you can walk away from is a good one!

Franzen
06-15-2004, 02:59 AM
Hi Wayno,

It rarely gets muggy here since water shortage seems to be a problem, especially this year. Yesterday we had one of those famous sandstorms from the Gobi. The visibility was down to about 200m. The sky becomes yellow and flourescent light appear blue. Far from our worst though, Ive seen it at less than 50m visability. It's still nothing compared to the fog I've experienced during my time at sea. The summer temps sometimes go above 40 celsius but the government rarely admits it. You don't have to work when temps reach 40. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/10.gif

My uncle and his 109 are listed as MIA. In the future, if I can dig up any useful info (doubt it), I would like to see if I could find something. Maybe the chances are greater of winning the lotto (which I never play) but it would be interesting anyway.

In the past I had found a cannon ball ,a small bomb, old pocket watch, very old sawed-off double-barrelled 16 gauge, and some coins; nothing of any value though.

During the heat wave in Europe last year the water tables were low. I read reports and saw pics of equipment found in riverbeds and shallow lakes. I think with a metal detector, some research, and a lot of spare time one should be able to find some interesting things.

Fritz Franzen